Liverpool FC vs Aston Villa: Post match grumblings

I swear, most of the people on this forum would leave a perfectly good day at the beach because they see one cloud in the sky.

This is no longer knee-jerking responses, we have some people in full blown mass hysteria. Everyone needs to calm down and take a realistic look at the math; JD mapped it out in an earlier response. We can lose two or three more games and still come out with more points from the games we didn't win last year. When we get our 20 million pound signing (Aquilani) on the field instead of Lucas, and the team has had some time to breathe and gel together instead of being crushed under the stress of seemingly every Red expecting a 38-0-0 season we will be fine. 

Tommy Smith, the professional LFC critic in the Echo.

(About Gerrard) In fact, the only area he caused trouble in was in his own when he gave away that penalty.

He is an attacking midfield player so what is he doing in the box making a tackle?

Where you watching the game Tommy? We had switched to 4-4-2 by then with Lucas subbed off.  Villa attacking. Should Gerrard have been on the half way line playing with himself?

In midfield, we were crowded out and couldn’t do anything expect pass sideways or backwards. Lucas was standing there dong nothing most of the time – I’ve got two bad legs so I could do that!

No offence Tommy but I'll stick with Lucas if that's allright.

I felt for Gerrard as he hasnt played in that position for some time and his challenge was a bit late. I think most people and pundits agree that the gap between the front two and midfield is too big. The difference may be that Xabi could still pick people out from back there a bit like a quarter back were as Lucas and Masch simply dont have his vision or range of passing. I think poor old Lucas couldnt think his luck could get any worse until that goal went in.I also think we suffer when we dont have naturally wide player. I know some people dont rate Riera but for me he hugs that touchline and keeps our width whereas Kuyt and Benayoun come inside far to much leaving overlapping fullbacks facing two defenders. Apart from the above I still think there is something not quite right with the players attitudes. I think Rafa has a big enough job to do without having to constantly dodge bullets from the Yanks as they continue to treat him very poorly.

I think Mascherano was very protected by Alonso.  Mascherano didn't need to do the pretty stuff because Alonso did it for him.  We all know Lucas isn't Alonso - hence the reason Real Madrid didn't want to buy Lucas for £30M, but we need Mascherano to step up to the plate a bit more - because the amount of pressure Lucas is under to seamlessly replace a £30M galactico is immense.

We missed someone like Agger against Aston Villa, somebody who would drive forward with the ball and pull their defence and midfield all over the place - freeing up Gerrard and Torres.

I agree if you put Agger,Aurelio,Aqualini and Riera into the side it does look so much better. I think such is the negativity surrounding Lucas the lad will never make it here despite doing well until the own goal when his heart must have sunk.

I hope I've provided critical analysis of 14 pages of this thread on the site

http://www.anfield-online.co.uk/editorial/2009/welcome-to-anfield-home-of-the-knee-jerk/

Good article JD really putting the result in to perspective, the season cannot be over we could win all our games till the end you never know.

Tw*t of a result but the season is extremely young.

Watched it in a bar in Malta and needless to say, I was disappointed. We need to up our game if we're going to anywhere near the title this season.

We can go on and on and on, but the final responsibility stops at the gaffer. Start playing aggressive and imaginative football, no more long, side and back passes. More rehearsal and training on players' positioning and movement to break down the opposition defence is needed immediately. Close down the opposition quick is also a must. Be more direct in our approach by passing the ball into the opposition box, stroking the ball outside the box will not do any harm to the opposition. Do a combo of the scums/arse/chelsi tactics and we're there. Looking forward to the next match.

Well our 2 losses in 3 matches shows that the midfield isn't as good as it once was or we think it is.

Knee jerk anybody?

(By the way I am going to mention the name 'Xabi Alonso' in the following post, do not be alarmed because I'm not going to go on about missing him )

We've lost Xabi and whilst I think we will come out of the situation a better team it is going to take some time to readjust. Alberto is injured and Lucas and Masch are having to play together for a prolonged period of time, something they haven't done before so maybe neither of them are at 100% as they are having to adjust a bit.

Also I didn't hear that kind of comment after the Stoke match because we won. And even Monday night had nothing to do with the midfield. We had 24 shots (I'm sure around 10 were clear chances) and we only scored once, that comes down to poor play from the attacking players not our midfield. And it also fucks up the opinion of "we lack creativity" because in truth had Torres, Kuyt and Gerrard taken their chances we would have won that game 5-3.

Just because we lost Xabi and we lost two out of three games doesn't make our midfield sh*t again.

Knee jerk anybody?

We had 24 shots (I'm sure around 10 were clear chances) and we only scored once, that comes down to poor play from the attacking players not our midfield.

Lets put to bed this Myth about our chances...

1 attempt on target was scored

by your reckoning that leaves 9 attempts to score from

3 attempts came in one attack from confusion in the box

that leaves 6 attempts to score from

now to win the game 4-3 from the remaining chances we would have had to have a conversion rate of 1 in every 2 shots............ How often do you see that happen in a premiership game ?

Had our midfield been passing the ball forwards with more urgency rather than simple 5 yard sideways or backwards passes, hypothetically it would have resulted in more attempts on goal more attempts on target and more goals

The simple thing that highlights how slow our midfield were at moving the ball forward is how many times Gerrard and Torres had to come deep to pick up the ball.

Clear chances should be scored, so it's nothing to do with our midfield.

Lets put to bed this Myth about our chances...

1 attempt on target was scored

by your reckoning that leaves 9 attempts to score from

3 attempts came in one attack from confusion in the box

that leaves 6 attempts to score from

now to win the game 4-3 from the remaining chances we would have had to have a conversion rate of 1 in every 2 shots............

Sorry I don't do all this conversion business. To put it simply, we should have scored from the confusion in the box, Kuyt should have scored from that corner where he hit the post, Torres should have scored that free header and Gerrard probably should have scored one of a few efforts we had in and around the box.

Now that's 4 very decent chances to score. Even if we only put in the two easy headers we still would have got a draw.

Had our midfield been passing the ball forwards with more urgency rather than simple 5 yard sideways or backwards passes, hypothetically it would have resulted in more attempts on goal more attempts on target and more goals

The simple thing that highlights how slow our midfield were at moving the ball forward is how many times Gerrard and Torres had to come deep to pick up the ball.

Disagree. It would have resulted in losing the ball more times. When you have to break down a team sometimes you need to take your time and wait for the opening. And the reason Masch and Lucas were only "passing sideways" was simply because Kuyt and Yossi were offering to width whatsoever. And since Villa went 4-5-1 passes down the middle were getting intercepted. If Yossi and Kuyt kept their width then there would have been more options to pass to the wings and also more space in the central areas to feed Torres and Gerrard.

I maintain my opinion that the midfield isn't the problem. Of course it will get stronger once Alberto returns and settles in but the reason for the poor start, for me at least, has had more to do with poor finishing and poor wing play than our central midfielders.

Now I'm going to contradict myself against Stoke we had 13 shots on target and won 4-0 so thats a conversion rate of just over 1 in every 2 attempts, the difference is we dominated stoke in the midfield and played the ball up to our forwards at the earliest opportunity.

Clear chances should be scored, so it's nothing to do with our midfield.

I do not disagree clear cut chances should be scored , but the more clear cut chances we create the better chance we have of scoring, and it is the midfields responsibility to help create these chances no ?

Now i'm going to contradict myself against Stoke we had 13 sots on target and won 4-0 so thats a conversion rate of just over 1 in every 2 attempts, the difference is we dominated stoke in the midfield and played the ball up to our forwards at the earliest opportunity.

I do not disagree clear cut chances should be scored , but the more clear cut chances we create the better chance we have of scoring, and it is the midfields responsibility to help create these chances no ?

I'd say the midfield was pretty F***ing good if it was helping to create 24 shots on goal, with 10 clear-cut chances.

Name me one team that has that statistic so far. Go for it.

And that's without Aquilani, remember. As this is an Aquilani thread.

Arsenal vs everton, 18 shots, 9 on target , 6 goals scored.................. .......... bearing in mind Everton were woeful and did not turn up at all

Arsenal vs everton, 18 shots, 9 on target , 6 goals scored.................. .......... bearing in mind Everton were woeful and did not turn up at all

Yes, and Villa did turn up. We had 24 shots on - which is more than Arsenal's 9. We had 10 clear-cut chances, which is also more than Arsenal's shots on.

So what does that tell you? That it's our bloody forward line not finishing the chances.

Yes, and Villa did turn up. We had 24 shots on - which is more than Arsenal's 9. We had 10 clear-cut chances, which is also more than Arsenal's shots on.

So what does that tell you? That it's our bloody forward line not finishing the chances.

It tells me we had the harder game where chances were not as clear cut as they were for Arsenal, Had Villa not truned up we too could have won the game by a massive scoreline..but that was not the case Villa turned up and we did not create enough chances to put them to bed as we did with Stoke as they did not really turn up either for vast majority's of that game.

Had we put the header from Yossi after 40 seconds and the confusion in the box in to the back of the net, we would be 2-0 up after 15 minutes and it would be a whole different game. Villa probably wouldn't have scored 3.

What I'm trying to say is we need to convert the early chances we get.

And this is so off topic!

It tells me we had the harder game where chances were not as clear cut as they were for Arsenal, Had Villa not truned up we too could have won the game by a massive scoreline..but that was not the case Villa turned up and we did not create enough chances to put them to bed as we did with Stoke as they did not really turn up either for vast majority's of that game.

No, no, no, no, no. We created more chances against a performing Villa than Arsenal did against a lacklustre Everton, and if you take into account that Arsenal have a very creative midfield in Fabregas, Denilson, Arshavin, Song and Diaby then that is pretty hard to do, but we did it with ease.

The problem is finishing, I really cannot see how you don't understand that.

No, no, no, no, no. We created more chances against a performing Villa than Arsenal did against a lacklustre Everton, and if you take into account that Arsenal have a very creative midfield in Fabregas, Denilson, Arshavin, Song and Diaby then that is pretty hard to do, but we did it with ease.

The problem is finishing, I really cannot see how you don't understand that.

I agree.

Players need to take their chances.

I do understand  and accept our finishing was not up standard, but I also accept when your finishing is sh*te and your forwards are dropping deep to pick up the ball there is also something missing from the midfield a supply line ?

Taking into consideration our finishing was sh*te and the forwards were dropping deep to receive the ball, had the ball been played forward more often with out the forwards coming deep to get it, hypothetically it would have led to more chances with a better chance of scoring and winning the game.

The problem is finishing, I really cannot see how you don't understand that.

Liverpool 1-3 Aston Villa
Everton 1-6 Arsenal

Comparison of Liverpool's shots and Arsenal's shots. Very similar - the key difference was that Arsenal were clinical, Liverpool were wasteful.  
(Blue = On Target, Red = Off Target, White = Goals, Grey = Blocks)