U2 or Sex Pistols

Which is the band you like more?

For me it's ......The Pistols. One defining moment they made an album that I will always go back to, because it is always relevant.
It is a piece of art that transcends words and just makes you angry ..... and happy.

Now that's a totally random question/comparison. Why do you ask?

Anyway, for me... Sex Pistols, please, though I like both bands.

Now that's a totally random question/comparison. Why do you ask?

Anyway, for me... Sex Pistols, please, though I like both bands.

Have to agree that the Pistols are way better, now The Clash vs The Pistols is a better debate.

Now that's a totally random question/comparison. Why do you ask?

Anyway, for me... Sex Pistols, please, though I like both bands.

Actually to me its the same as the Pearl Jam / Nirvana debate. Same era , political etc but the contribution to the form of one is transcendent and the other makes some very listenable albums which wane with time. However U2 concerts are always packed out and Bono is omnipresent and I wonder what they have done to deserve such a place .... it's not like they wrote 'Never Mind The Bollocks'.

Sex Pistols by light years.
Innovative and raw as opposed to predictable and commercial. Did like U2 initially but it did seem like more of the same after a while.
The Pistols burnt themselves out like a supercharged illuminate while U2 melted into the pop culture.

Never really got the sex pistols.

Never really got the sex pistols.

Didn't worry about all that stuff, they were F***ing outrageous and you had no idea what was coming next with them.
Maybe there was nothing to get, they were anti everything and took the piss out of the establishment and authority.
Rather watch them even now than some of the sh*te foisted on us by the music industry.

One of the most bizare questions I've ever read. Both on opposite sides of the music scale. Not a fan of U2 really. Like a few if their songs but I am out off bands sometimes by their character. Find Bono very hypocritical. He asks everyone to dig into their pocket but will happily not pay tax in the south of Ireland because he earns a certain wage.

Sex Pistols, for me, are brilliant. Haven't listened to them enough of late but I will now.

For me, neither. Could just never get into either band. Few songs here and there of course, but as a whole, not for me.

Actually to me its the same as the Pearl Jam / Nirvana debate. Same era , political etc but the contribution to the form of one is transcendent and the other makes some very listenable albums which wane with time. However U2 concerts are always packed out and Bono is omnipresent and I wonder what they have done to deserve such a place .... it's not like they wrote 'Never Mind The Bollocks'.

Nah, sorry, but Pearl Jam vs Nirvana is an obvious comparison - they're both from the same grunge scene, as well as from the same city and time. It's natural to compare them.

Sex Pistols and U2 have totally different backgrounds, completely separate styles, one band has lasted for decades while the other only released a single album, and so on... it's a very weird comparison to be honest.

I think I lost my respect for the Sex Pistols when John Lydon started whoring himself about. Examples being going on I'm a Celebrity and doing an advert for butter.

Not a huge fan of U2 either. Bonno is a c**t.

U2
but I'm not sure why we're asking people whether they prefer one of the greatest pop rock bands
or an Iconic punk band.

No real comparisons between the two bands.

Have to agree that the Pistols are way better, now The Clash vs The Pistols is a better debate.

Would be The Clash for me everytime and let's face it don't come across as cu*ts as much as the Sex Pistols did.

Plus the work Mick Jones did for The Justice Band needs to be applauded.

Would be The Clash for me everytime and let's face it don't come across as cu*ts as much as the Sex Pistols did.

Plus the work Mick Jones did for The Justice Band needs to be applauded.

The Clash vs Sex Pistols would make a lot more sense as a comparison, but then it's a ridiculously easy choice: The Clash are heads and shoulders above the Pistols (and nearly every band in rock history, for that matter )

U2
but I'm not sure why we're asking people whether they prefer one of the greatest pop rock bands
or an Iconic punk band.

No real comparisons between the two bands.

Indeed. Strange comparison to make but it would be U2 for me if I had to choose.

One of the most bizare questions I've ever read.

Yep.

Next up Chalk or Cheese?

The Clash vs Sex Pistols would make a lot more sense as a comparison, but then it's a ridiculously easy choice: The Clash are heads and shoulders above the Pistols (and nearly every band in rock history, for that matter )

The Clash, by a F***ing mile.

Punk was never my thing so would have to be U2 for me.

Nah, sorry, but Pearl Jam vs Nirvana is an obvious comparison - they're both from the same grunge scene, as well as from the same city and time. It's natural to compare them.

Sex Pistols and U2 have totally different backgrounds, completely separate styles, one band has lasted for decades while the other only released a single album, and so on... it's a very weird comparison to be honest.

I suppose the underlying reason is this:

I love music, I mean really get drawn into it. A band like Nirvana or The Sex Pistols  or Bob Dylan can really draw a profound physio-chemical response in me to be exact. However I don't think this is the same for everyone. I think there is a lot of people probably a majority who don't really get into music in the same way. They therefore have very little preferences and buy whatever is 'popular' at the time. This explains 'Nickelback'. How do these bands get popular in the first place is the question. I can see how they take advantage of this popularity to grow. They put themselves everywhere , 'play the game'.

Back to U2 and The Pistols. Would you rather Bono in the UN or John Lydon, and remember 'Johhny' doesn't lie. Would you rather our bands influenced by a Mega band like U2 who give all the right answers or an evolutionary step like The Sex Pistols.  The question really is about this.

I suppose the underlying reason is this:

I love music, I mean really get drawn into it. A band like Nirvana or The Sex Pistols  or Bob Dylan can really draw a profound physio-chemical response in me to be exact. However I don't think this is the same for everyone. I think there is a lot of people probably a majority who don't really get into music in the same way. They therefore have very little preferences and buy whatever is 'popular' at the time. This explains 'Nickelback'. How do these bands get popular in the first place is the question. I can see how they take advantage of this popularity to grow. They put themselves everywhere , 'play the game'.

Back to U2 and The Pistols. Would you rather Bono in the UN or John Lydon, and remember 'Johhny' doesn't lie. Would you rather our bands influenced by a Mega band like U2 who give all the right answers or an evolutionary step like The Sex Pistols.  The question really is about this.

Never really pondered the chasms that split musical taste, when you consider the unqualified sh*te that occupies the hit lists for the most part, there are definitely profound inequalities in taste and the perception of quality.
Recognised and established genius is totally ignored by the majority and the only assumption must be an inability to appreciate and differentiate the genre from the commercial fodder churned out by a "popular music industry," who insist that it does what it says on the label.
   

Never been a fan of either but being 34, I wasn't around when Sex Pistols were in their prime. If I'd have been a teenager at the time, I'm sure I would have appreciated their antics far more.

If choosing between the two, I'd have to go with Sex Pistols anyway for the following reasons:

They were bold and looked to do something new.
They have massively influenced bands that I like now.
Although it seems cliched now, they dared to be anti-establishment and brought it to the mainstream.

U2 made nothing but "safe", commercially viable rock music.
Bono is the second most self-righteous, arrogant pr**k in music, behind Paul McCartney.

It all started with the Sex Pistols. I saw them twice in 1976 — two gigs weeks apart at the Lesser Free Trade Hall in Manchester — Bernard Sumner (our guitarist) and I went together with a couple of friends to the first gig, and at the second gig I bumped into Ian Curtis, who would become our lead singer. They were only on for half an hour, but when they finished, we filed out quietly with our minds blown, absolutely utterly speechless, and it just sort of dawned on me then — that was it. On the way home that night we decided to form a band — Joy Division.   from Peter Hook

So without Sex PIstols no Joy Division and without these two bands probably nothing decent would have come out of music in my living memory

Isnt the comparison a bit strange? Be like asking Oasis or wet wet wet

Isnt the comparison a bit strange? Be like asking Oasis or wet wet wet

Oasis is wet wet wet.

It all started with the Sex Pistols. I saw them twice in 1976 — two gigs weeks apart at the Lesser Free Trade Hall in Manchester — Bernard Sumner (our guitarist) and I went together with a couple of friends to the first gig, and at the second gig I bumped into Ian Curtis, who would become our lead singer. They were only on for half an hour, but when they finished, we filed out quietly with our minds blown, absolutely utterly speechless, and it just sort of dawned on me then — that was it. On the way home that night we decided to form a band — Joy Division.   from Peter Hook

So without Sex PIstols no Joy Division and without these two bands probably nothing decent would have come out of music in my living memory

The fact that Peter Hook states the Pistols were an inspiration to the iconic Ian Curtis and Joy Division, who were a totally unique concept musically, speaks volumes.
U2 struggle to muster at the best of times. 

Back to U2 and The Pistols. Would you rather Bono in the UN or John Lydon, and remember 'Johhny' doesn't lie. 

To be fair though, Johnny comes across as a southern, posh, pretentious pr**k!

To be fair though, Johnny comes across as a southern, posh, pretentious pr**k!

Read his book mate it could change your mind.

Sex Pistols were more of an image than anything to do with music in my opinion.

U2 I just find utterly outstanding in every way. I really don't care what Bono says or does away from the stage and I care even less of the people who find him annoying but that man is a beautiful lyricist and an outstanding singer and performer. The claim that they are mere safe commercial sell outs just because they are probably only one of a few bands that can fill out 80,000 seater stadiums is a lazy claim and clearly they've never listened to Achtung Baby, The Unforgettable Fire or Zooropa. Their post punk emergence was raw and brilliant but for me they are all about the era from The Unforgettable Fire in 1984 through to Zooropa in 1993. They could do no wrong in that period. I especially love their transition from The Joshua Tree (along with The Queen Is Dead - the best album of the 80s IMO) to the more European influenced, dark and greasy Achtung Baby. The soundscapes on their albums are just outstanding, serving as a precursor to Radiohead and Sigur Ros I really believe. The Edge's guitar work - I can only describe as galactic. Adam Clayton and Larry Mullins tight rhythm just outstanding with their own starring turns (that bass line in New Year's Day! Those drums on A Sort of Homecoming!)

I think it was David Bowie who said in the early 90s that U2 were the only band around contemplating and hinting at a world beyond into the 21st Century. Too right David. Since 2000 they've followed a more commercial format with their music but they deserve it and in my opinion post 2000 U2 is the sound of a band comfortable and satisfied with their massive contribution to music around the world. And yet it still hasn't stopped them from churning out some incredible tunes. City of Blinding Lights and particularly Moment of Surrender are two of the very best U2 songs, both produced within the last 8 years. Can't wait until they release album number 13. Oh yeah and they revolutionised live music as it is. Zoo TV Live is the Sgt Pepper of rock concert tours! 4 of the most innovative and hard working men in music. The fact all 4 are still going strong is testament to what a true band they really are.


Lemon U2


Probably my favourite U2 song of all time.

I know F**k all about the Sex Pistols other than I think it was Two Fingers towards the establishment, probably wrong.

Now U2..... Love the band and they filled a void in my music after the death of Freddie Mercury once Queen were no more.

I know f**k all about the Sex Pistols other than I think it was Two Fingers towards the establishment, probably wrong.

Now U2..... Love the band and they filled a void in my music after the death of Freddie Mercury once Queen were no more.

You see that I like. Freddy Mercury was an unbelievable performer and it seems honest to what he wanted. Queen sacrificed the american market by releasing 'I want to break free' and that is excellent. They wrote truly creative songs based on this integrity.
I somehow feel U2 rode vein after vein of safe ground .. like Irish fervour in New York.. on their way to global domination. I think this is reflected in their art. THe Sex Pistols were basically over two years after they started but left a musical legacy that cannot be understated (same with Joy Division).

You see that I like. Freddy Mercury was an unbelievable performer and it seems honest to what he wanted. Queen sacrificed the american market by releasing 'I want to break free' and that is excellent. They wrote truly creative songs based on this integrity.
I somehow feel U2 rode vein after vein of safe ground .. like Irish fervour in New York.. on their way to global domination. I think this is reflected in their art. THe Sex Pistols were basically over two years after they started but left a musical legacy that cannot be understated (same with Joy Division).

U2 safe? It's one of the biggest myths in music. They recreated themselves time and time again. I think some people allow the fact of selling near to 200 million records worldwide clouds people's perceptions of them. Achtung Baby remains one of the most stark and successful re inventions in rock music and is a level of musical talent, vision and nous that few bands have shown. Queen, despite Freddie Mercury being THE greatest rock n roll performer of all time, never stood up in the way U2 did.

U2 safe? It's one of the biggest myths in music. They recreated themselves time and time again. I think some people allow the fact of selling near to 200 million records worldwide clouds people's perceptions of them. Achtung Baby remains one of the most stark and successful re inventions in rock music and is a level of musical talent, vision and nous that few bands have shown. Queen, despite Freddie Mercury being THE greatest rock n roll performer of all time, never stood up in the way U2 did.

What is the legacy though. What would you say apart from record sales is their defining contribution?

U2 safe? It's one of the biggest myths in music. They recreated themselves time and time again. I think some people allow the fact of selling near to 200 million records worldwide clouds people's perceptions of them. Achtung Baby remains one of the most stark and successful re inventions in rock music and is a level of musical talent, vision and nous that few bands have shown. Queen, despite Freddie Mercury being THE greatest rock n roll performer of all time, never stood up in the way U2 did.

To be honest the predictable muzak by U2 and Queen is nothing short of tedious.

I don't look at what bands did when they had billions and the mega production resources befitting a mega band, I think anyone could make saleable music with this behind them. It usually ends up sounding like the producer anyway Wasn't U2's great change due to Brian Eno?

No I look at bands when they came out and caught the ear. How did they change the form or contribute to it.

I don't look at what bands did when they had billions and the mega production resources befitting a mega band, I think anyone could make saleable music with this behind them. It usually ends up sounding like the producer anyway Wasn't U2's great change due to Brian Eno?

No I look at bands when they came out and caught the ear. How did they change the form or contribute to it.

As stated U2 on their conception were a vibrant and creative concept but fell into the trap of complacency when the model was accepted.
Complacency or the entire rejection of the mindset was instrumental in the fragmenting and eventual break up of the Sex Pistols. 

I don't look at what bands did when they had billions and the mega production resources befitting a mega band, I think anyone could make saleable music with this behind them. It usually ends up sounding like the producer anyway Wasn't U2's great change due to Brian Eno?

No I look at bands when they came out and caught the ear. How did they change the form or contribute to it.

Well U2 hired Brian Eno when they were really only starting to make their mark after War and to say it was only him who changed U2 is kind of rubbish considering they must have gone through three changes at least under him. It's very difficult to define what Brian Eno sounds like in the first place considering the vast and brilliant array of work he has done. If you look at bands today, particularly Sigur Ros (who were influenced by them) that legacy in sound stands up more than The Sex Pistols who, besides, were not a patch on the real icons and influences of that time The Clash. If anyone has any doubts about their talents then listen to their first three albums. Boy, October and War which are an outstanding trio of albums. I do think people confuse image with musical worth and I think that's the way with The Sex Pistols.

Likewise with Frankly Mr Shankly I think Sex Pistols were more of an image than anything else. For those growing up in that era it signifies a lot for them, but for those born well after, the whole anti-establishment image of them seems rather tame these days, given the fact that it has been diluted to such an extent that it's no longer shocking. For example, I don't really have an opinion on The Royal Family - I can see why people hate them and I can see why people like them, for me I personally couldn't care if they were to continue or not. Besides, I always thought Morrissey was much more witty and sophisticated without being a complete yob like the Pistols in his hardcore stance against them.

These days, I find John Lydon kinda likeable at times but the guy has a terrible voice, and the musicianship of the Pistols had a lot to be desired. I do think they are perhaps the most overrated band of all time, and punk has to be one of the most overrated movements of all time. It seemed to start a fashion in music for bands to have no musical or vocal ability - The Sex Pistols therefore being right at the forefront.

U2 are a far far better band. What seemed like an endless stream of great album after great album in the 80s and 90s produced some of the most interesting music that the mainstream these days is crying out for. Musically, far superior to the Pistols and Bono can actually sing. Those who know nothing will say they only ever produced one great album - The Joshua Tree. A great album, but not one that stands out amongst all their other great albums - War, Unforgettable Fire, Achtung Baby are actually all better albums. Bono is also a great lyricist and The Edge is one of the most original and interesting guitarists of all time. In terms of musical progression, they make Radiohead look like luddites. The stark contrast from their post-punk era to the Brian Eno ambient soundscapes to the 90s electronica is phenomenal. No other band since has ever consistently reinvented themselves.

Personally, the hate for them is rooted in a sad and narrow minded conclusion - they are uncool and Bono's a dick. Very sorry to break the cliched rock band bubble, but why does 'cool' have to be essential to great music? I'm sure Beethoven and Mozart were the outspoken musicians of their day, just like the Gallagher brothers, or had radical and controversial views ala the Pistols or Morrissey. Imagine hipsters back in the latter half of the 1700s - they're sh*t because they're inoffensive and so mainstream.

I can see why Bono is annoying to people but can you name one rockstar who couldn't possibly be seen as a dickhead? And if we're going by personality, didn't Sid Vicious murder his wife in a drug crazed haze? Also, this is another thing with another quintessential 'cool' band The Who. I know he wasn't charged but Pete Townshend is still not a guy I would ever leave kids alone with. But in the music world never mind murder or paedophilia, Bono's charge of hypocrisy and apparent love of himself ranks as the biggest crime in music history. I would much rather have the Bono-who-loves-himself rather than possible-murderer-or-peadophile-Bono. It's a strange attitude the music world has.

Sex Pistols. Johnny and Bono are both cockends though.

As has been mentioned, The Clash blow both of them out of the water and into smithereens.

Sex Pistols. Johnny and Bono are both cockends though.

As has been mentioned, The Clash blow both of them out of the water and into smithereens.

The Clash had nothing on The Smiths though....

The Clash had nothing on The Smiths though....

Agree.

The Smiths are untouchable for me.

Agree with a lot of what has been said about U2 particularly from yourself and Son of a Gun.

I understand that people can't stand them and Bono in particular but as you guys have said they are far from a band who churn out the same old stuff over their career.

I also understand how much of a phenomenon the Sex Pistols were and how influential they were, especially to bands I really love like Joy Division and New Order, but it really is hard to compare the two.

The Clash had nothing on The Smiths though....

I F***ing nearly choked there man. What the F**k? 

The Smiths are untouchable for me.

Untouchable like a manic-depressive, scabby fanny, dripping in discharge Si? 

This thread started off as one of the F***ing daftest I've ever read and now this sacrilege: are you all on crystal Meth or what? Nutters the F***ing lot of you? 

 

I f**king nearly choked there man. What the f**k? 

Untouchable like a manic-depressive, scabby fanny, dripping in discharge Si? 

This thread started off as one of the f**king daftest I've ever read and now this sacrilege: are you all on crystal Meth or what? Nutters the f**king lot of you? 

 

I think i may have triggered it off as usual by mentioning Queen.

I F***ing nearly choked there man. What the F**k? 

Untouchable like a manic-depressive, scabby fanny, dripping in discharge Si? 

This thread started off as one of the F***ing daftest I've ever read and now this sacrilege: are you all on crystal Meth or what? Nutters the F***ing lot of you? 

 

A very picturesque response mate, graphic if nothing else but one I can only agree with. The Smiths are quaintly amusing at best and a grotesque caricature at the other end of the scale, their musical qualities are questionable. Nevertheless they are highly entertaining.
It is rather fitting they are included in this dubious comparison of dissimilar musical taste.   

Untouchable like a manic-depressive, scabby fanny, dripping in discharge Si? 

 

I'll put you in the 'Not really a Smiths Fan' group then Mouse.

The Smiths are quaintly amusing at best and a grotesque caricature at the other end of the scale, their musical qualities are questionable.

Now that's fighting talk Stuey.

Morrissey is a lyrical genius and Marr is one of the greatest ever to pick up a guitar but it just shows why music is really down to personal taste.

I'll put you in the 'Not really a Smiths Fan' group then Mouse.

The Smiths would give Prozac depression. 

Punk was never my thing so would have to be U2 for me.

With you on that.

Much rather listen to U2 although I can respect the contributions of the Pistols  (or moreso the Clash).

Saw Johnny Marr two weeks ago. He is one cool man. The best guitarist of the last 30 years and Morrissey the best lyricist in British pop music....ever.

Saw Johnny Marr two weeks ago. He is one cool man. The best guitarist of the last 30 years and Morrissey the best lyricist in British pop music....ever.

And together - perfection.

I never tire of listening to The Smiths, and I'm not even a manic depressive!

Saw Johnny Marr two weeks ago. He is one cool man. The best guitarist of the last 30 years and Morrissey the best lyricist in British pop music....ever.

Some major claims being made right there hah. I don't consider Morrissey a better lyricist than Ray Davies, for example.

I always think the Smiths are a good band like the cure but they fed off Joy Division who for their brief existence were truly great.

THe Sex Pistols are the same but for fu*ks sake ...GO AND LISTEN TO NEVER MIND THE BOLLOCKS AGAIN. It is one of the greats no mistake

I always think the Smiths are a good band like the cure but they fed off Joy Division who for their brief existence were truly great.

THe Sex Pistols are the same but for fu*ks sake ...GO AND LISTEN TO NEVER MIND THE BOLLOCKS AGAIN. It is one of the greats no mistake

Not even on a par with Pink Floyd's "Fearless" No Kop on it for a start!!

Not even on a par with Pink Floyd's "Fearless" No Kop on it for a start!!

It was backmasked though. If you play 'ANarchy in the UK' backwards it says "You'll Never Walk Alone" it then says "John is dead and The Mancs are f*cked".

I'll put you in the 'Not really a Smiths Fan' group then Mouse.

Better chuck me in there as well, mate before I go on a rant and get into an argument with Smiths fans... again. 

It was backmasked though. If you play 'ANarchy in the UK' backwards it says "You'll Never Walk Alone" it then says "John is dead and The Mancs are f*cked".

John Lydon had an affinity with Liverpool in his days with the pistols, his parents being of Irish stock as they were.

Some major claims being made right there hah. I don't consider Morrissey a better lyricist than Ray Davies, for example.

Never mind Ray Davies brilliant as he was, what about John Winston Lennon? A comparison with Morrissey on any level in both situations is ridiculous.

If you play 'ANarchy in the UK' backwards it says "You'll Never Walk Alone" it then says "John is dead and The Mancs are f*cked".

If you play any song backwards, you're a bit of a fool and a wrecker of good vinyl!!

A joke nicked from the comedian god Bill Hicks

If you play any song backwards, you're a bit of a fool and a wrecker of good vinyl!!

A joke nicked from the comedian god Bill Hicks

Suck satan's cock.

Suck satan's cock.

And ruiner of good stereo's!!

BOSS

Bill Hicks I Want My Rock Stars Dead

And ruiner of good stereo's!!

BOSS

Bill Hicks I Want My Rock Stars Dead

So the answer to the topic question was:

Hendrix or Cobain.

John Lydon had an affinity with Liverpool in his days with the pistols, his parents being of Irish stock as they were.


Never mind Ray Davies brilliant as he was, what about John Winston Lennon? A comparison with Morrissey on any level in both situations is ridiculous.

Was in Durness recently (far North of Scotland), one of John Lennon's most cherished places where he holidayed as a kid and where he later took Yoko and Julian in the middle of recording Abbey Road. Saw the memorial garden named in his honor complete with lyrics from In My Life inscribed in stone. Was awesome being in a place so small and remote yet where his presence was and continue to be so keenly felt.

Was in Durness recently (far North of Scotland), one of John Lennon's most cherished places where he holidayed as a kid and where he later took Yoko and Julian in the middle of recording Abbey Road. Saw the memorial garden named in his honor complete with lyrics from In My Life inscribed in stone. Was awesome being in a place so small and remote yet where his presence was and continue to be so keenly felt.

Thanks for that intriguing insight mate, used to visit Inverness and further North in the past if I had known about Durness and the Lennon connection we'd have got there for sure.

I always think the Smiths are a good band like the cure but they fed off Joy Division who for their brief existence were truly great.

THe Sex Pistols are the same but for fu*ks sake ...GO AND LISTEN TO NEVER MIND THE BOLLOCKS AGAIN. It is one of the greats no mistake

The Smiths sound nothing like Joy Division. Plus Johnny Marr could do stuff that nobody in Joy Division could ever do. Pardon the pun, but Marr and Morrissey fitted together like hand in glove - the greatest songwriting partnership of all time (yes even better than Lennon/McCartney - who were better as individuals. The best Beatles songs are ones that were written individually by Lennon or McCartney).

The Smiths sound nothing like Joy Division. Plus Johnny Marr could do stuff that nobody in Joy Division could ever do. Pardon the pun, but Marr and Morrissey fitted together like hand in glove - the greatest songwriting partnership of all time (yes even better than Lennon/McCartney - who were better as individuals. The best Beatles songs are ones that were written individually by Lennon or McCartney).

Finally another sensible poster on the subject of the Smiths.

Never been struck by Joy Divison. Don't ever believe the musicianship, vocal and lyrical level was anywhere near to what The Smiths achieved.

The Smiths sound nothing like Joy Division. Plus Johnny Marr could do stuff that nobody in Joy Division could ever do. Pardon the pun, but Marr and Morrissey fitted together like hand in glove - the greatest songwriting partnership of all time (yes even better than Lennon/McCartney - who were better as individuals. The best Beatles songs are ones that were written individually by Lennon or McCartney).

Joy Division sound nothing like the Sex Pistols but they were inspired by them. The kind of lyrics Ian Curtis was writing and music Joy Division created was creating a movement and therefore an audience for bands like the Smiths. Same way the artists who inspired Nirvana also created an audience for them.

I cannot say I am right about whose better only state who I like and why. BUT C'MON JOY DIVISION AND THE SEX PISTOLS. Everybody at that concert would form a band. Those two bands take you to a different state, it's not just about quiet reflection for me. Listen to 'Disorder' or 'Bodies'

I understand your point and I love the Sex Pistols, but I still think you're overestimating them. The Ramones were a far better band, much more significant as well, and they started it all with the Punk movement.

There would be no Sex Pistols without the Ramones. So if you're going to dismiss The Smiths because of Joy Division, you can also do the same with the Pistols in comparing them to the Ramones. And yes, you could do it to every single band on earth

And while I do agree that some bands are more significant than others, and that the Smiths have been influenced by Joy Division, The Smiths have also influenced a LOT of bands that came after and much of the "indie" rock of the 90's.

Bands are influenced and bands influence others - some more, some less - and The Smiths and The Cure, to speak of two mentioned in this thread, were also highly influential.

I understand your point and I love the Sex Pistols, but I still think you're overestimating them. The Ramones were a far better band, much more significant as well, and they started it all with the Punk movement.

There would be no Sex Pistols without the Ramones. So if you're going to dismiss The Smiths because of Joy Division, you can also do the same with the Pistols in comparing them to the Ramones. And yes, you could do it to every single band on earth

And while I do agree that some bands are more significant than others, and that the Smiths have been influenced by Joy Division, The Smiths have also influenced a LOT of bands that came after and much of the "indie" rock of the 90's.

Bands are influenced and bands influence others - some more, some less - and The Smiths and The Cure, to speak of two mentioned in this thread, were also highly influential.

The inspiring is one thing but joy division and the pistols throw you out of your seat. The ramone  to me are like the replacements every song is basically the same . Punk is not just chord progression or rhythm it is an art like free jazz albeit less cerebral more primal. Joy division and the pistols to me are just incomparable as avant garde artists not the style of guitar or singin. It was the songs they created. These songs were unbelievably listenable almost pop tracks with a very powerful but not cheesy message on
Y nirvana has managed that since

The inspiring is one thing but joy division and the pistols throw you out of your seat. The ramone  to me are like the replacements every song is basically the same . Punk is not just chord progression or rhythm it is an art like free jazz albeit less cerebral more primal. Joy division and the pistols to me are just incomparable as avant garde artists not the style of guitar or singin. It was the songs they created. These songs were unbelievably listenable almost pop tracks with a very powerful but not cheesy message on
Y nirvana has managed that since

Fair enough. But you're then mixing personal opinions/feelings with a bigger discussion about influence and significance.

Joy Division never threw me out of my seat. The Ramones did. And they created one of the most active musical scenes ever, and that includes the Sex Pistols.

Saw the Sex Pistols live, and they were sh*t, couldn't even play, never mind sing! U2 all the way for me, outstanding live band.

Fair enough. But you're then mixing personal opinions/feelings with a bigger discussion about influence and significance.

Joy Division never threw me out of my seat. The Ramones did. And they created one of the most active musical scenes ever, and that includes the Sex Pistols.

Personal opinions are what this is about. In terms of influence, it's difficult. What did the Sex Pistols/ Joy Division achieve. Were they really seminal in the field? Did they rip half of it off? Did the Ramones rip their style off/ Was it a great innovation. What I really think about is the quailty of the songs they created. Their lyrics, music, the point of themeverything. I think these two bands were excellent for this reason. And as for musician ship or live presentation. They weren't Beethoven and that is exactly the point.

Saw the Sex Pistols live, and they were sh*t, couldn't even play, never mind sing! U2 all the way for me, outstanding live band.

Friend of mine saw Bon Jovi Live, he said they could really sing and play and he wishes they hadn't

Friend of mine saw Bon Jovi Live, he said they could really sing and play and he wishes they hadn't

Very good.

I F***ing hate Bon Jovi.

Friend of mine saw Bon Jovi Live, he said they could really sing and play and he wishes they hadn't

A lot of people can sing and play live but not all can perform or either have the music to back up their singing and playing talents. U2 do. I don't think it takes much to act like a fool on stage and not know how to play your instruments (Sex Pistols). Never seen the attraction of that and never will. Will always see the attraction of the ability to perform as a unit backed up by the ability to sing and play. Oh and the ability to write timeless tunes...like below! Got to say only bought the concert below on dvd, put it on one afternoon and my mind was blown. Changed my opinion of live music and U2 for ever.

U2 - Running To Stand Still & Where The Streets Have No Name (Zoo TV Live From Sydney)


U2 - Until The End Of The World & New Year's Day (ZOO TV Live From Sydney)(HIGH QUALITY)


If there's one moment in music history I could take a time machine to it would most definitely be Zoo TV Sydney 1993!

Sex Pistols At Randy's Rodeo-New York-Sid Hits Guy With Bass.

Sex Pistols - Roadrunner

I am not disputing U2 but many years and countless dosh to put on a show only makes it less accessible and obfuscates what your really trying to say. WHich is I am out of ideas so I'll make a really big show

I was a huge U2 fan but when Rattle and Hum and Achtung Baby came out and Bono became "The Fly"....I lost interest. Bono turned into a douche and they completely got away from what made them a great band.

I never liked the Pistols, I listened to Punk and Hardcore but hated the Pistols. I liked The Exploited and Cockney Rejects and GBH but could not get into the Pistols and I dont know why.

I was a huge U2 fan but when Rattle and Hum and Achtung Baby came out and Bono became "The Fly"....I lost interest. Bono turned into a douche and they completely got away from what made them a great band.

I never liked the Pistols, I listened to Punk and Hardcore but hated the Pistols. I liked The Exploited and Cockney Rejects and GBH but could not get into the Pistols and I dont know why.

I have recently came back to them. It is the strength of the songs they made that gets me.

Sex Pistols At Randy's Rodeo-New York-Sid Hits Guy With Bass.

Sex Pistols - Roadrunner

I am not disputing U2 but many years and countless dosh to put on a show only makes it less accessible and obfuscates what your really trying to say. WHich is I am out of ideas so I'll make a really big show

Not saying anything about Zoo TV other than looking back on it, the tour was a culturally sophisticated piece of brilliant satire that mocked the televisual obsession of the early 90s.  Nothing to do with 'we've run out of ideas so we'll play to big audiences'. U2 were already playing to massive audiences before Zoo TV only this time they made a statement with it. Quite frankly it was a case of 'been there, done that' with regards to playing to small audiences with U2, clearly evident in their early period.

Not saying anything about Zoo TV other than looking back on it, the tour was a culturally sophisticated piece of brilliant satire that mocked the televisual obsession of the early 90s.  Nothing to do with 'we've run out of ideas so we'll play to big audiences'. U2 were already playing to massive audiences before Zoo TV only this time they made a statement with it. Quite frankly it was a case of 'been there, done that' with regards to playing to small audiences with U2, clearly evident in their early period.

I saw the Zoo TV tour in NY at Yankee Stadium and it was a HUGE production but when Bono was doing "The Fly" and it was all tongue in cheek he overplayed it and actually started to become that guy.

I know bands grow and change etc,etc... but, for me I cant listen to anything after Joshua Tree.  For me, U2 will be that band that played Red Rocks when Bono came out during Sunday Bloody Sunday and planted the flag in the crowd. That was an iconic rock moment. That was U2.

I saw the Zoo TV tour in NY at Yankee Stadium and it was a HUGE production but when Bono was doing "The Fly" and it was all tongue in cheek he overplayed it and actually started to become that guy.

I know bands grow and change etc,etc... but, for me I cant listen to anything after Joshua Tree.  For me, U2 will be that band that played Red Rocks when Bono came out during Sunday Bloody Sunday and planted the flag in the crowd. That was an iconic rock moment. That was U2.

Granted that it's hard to distinguish between The Fly and the Bono of today (!) and I too absolutely love that performance from Red Rocks but for me it just shows how diverse, creative and progressive a band they became. It's hard to believe Zoo TV was the same band 10 years on but I really think it was a mark of how great a band they are at the same time. If U2 had ended after War then they would be cited as one of the best post punk bands of the era, on that record alone. The annoying thing is that very few of those bands had the guts or the nous to take a completely different approach to things and radically transform themselves. U2 did though and the end product was a band that is vastly different from the one that performed at Red Rocks and despite all the years and the records that have come and gone, still a band that can hold intrigue and interest within the contemporary era without having to fall back on decades old songs. There still very much a band of the present era and that's a big testament to them.

Seems the talent of a band / artist is measured in the size of their UK audiences and fan base nowadays.
All hail Westlife.

Pistols 100%.Only one album but what an album,all the reformed stuff nah,u2 commercial pap.