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      Inquest updates

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      stuey
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #69: Oct 01, 2014 06:12:40 pm
      HILLSBOROUGH TOP COP
      Man who opened gates admits mistakes yet continues to blame fans

      Roger Marshall the former superintendent in charge at Hillsborough claimed drunken and ticketless fans ''complicated'' matters at the Leppings lane turnstile. When asked by Christina Lambert QC, counsel to the inquests, ''do you consider, on reflection, that you made any mistakes at all in not taking further action before you climbed onto the parapet and got a good view of the situation''?

      Marshall replied ''of course I made mistakes' I was in the present not the future. I was doing my absolute utmost to manage an increasingly deteriorating situation''. 


      http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/hillsborough-officer-tells-inquests-of-7860124[/news]

      It does seem evident that there was a loss of control at that stage and the blame game began with Suptd Marshall.
      waltonl4
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #70: Oct 01, 2014 07:17:38 pm
      There is reference to ''two males about 60 obviously under the influence''.
      Drink, drugs, religious extremism??
      60 years old ffs.

      if they spotted "drunks" and did nothing about them then they are incompetent. I don't know how the families put up with all of this I really don't. I take my hat off to them
      stuey
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #71: Oct 01, 2014 11:23:37 pm
      Disaster fans 'had drunk too much'
      Ex superintendent Roger Marshall told the inquest that a ''substantial minority'' of fans ''had had to much to drink'' ahead of the 1989 Hillsborough disaster.
      The inquests in Warrington also heard how an initial crush developed outside the stadium before the kick off.   


      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-29445291

      The cu*ts are doing it again, quoting a police superintendent who freely admitted to making ''mistakes'' that were instrumental in the eventual lethal crush in the Leppings Lane stand, if you read the link his statement is vigorously challenged by the counsel for the families, to the point of it being discredited.
      Very surprised the corrupt representative of the corrupt S.Yorkshire Police Force made no mention of the dead being robbed, the BBC would have reported that of course if it were not libellous.
      Affected reporting is an understatement, blatantly reporting untruths and supposition is exactly what it is. 
      waltonl4
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #72: Oct 03, 2014 10:04:07 pm
      I fail to see how its relevant, any football match in the country would have a level of drunk fans . Isn't that why the Police where there to Police the crowd and makes sure they behaved themselves in accordance with public order laws.Everytime the Police open their collective mouths they end up looking stupid
      stuey
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #73: Oct 06, 2014 10:11:16 am
        ^          ^          ^
      Whoever herded all those people into the Leppings lane end was drunk or couldn't count.
      RedPuppy
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #74: Oct 10, 2014 11:51:06 am
      Last 2 days have been very interesting.

      I'm following David Conn and he is giving updates.

      David Conn @david_conn  ·  17m 17 minutes ago
      Hillsborough: Mark George, families QC, to Insp Sykes: "And that [disaster was foreseeable] is the real truth about Hillsborough?"  Yes sir.

      David Conn @david_conn  ·  22 mins 22 minutes ago
      Hillsborough Inquest: Insp Sykes has agreed that Sheff Weds, the FA & South Yorkshire Police were "playing Russian roulette" with fans lives
      finchie
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #75: Oct 10, 2014 07:27:26 pm
      David Conn @david_conn  ·  7h 7 hours ago
      Hillsborough: Insp Sykes has said he was wrong to tell Taylor Inquiry 2,000 Liverpool fans had no tickets.  "I don't know why I said that."

      What a disgraceful and shameful admission.
      MIRO
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #76: Oct 10, 2014 08:42:21 pm
      Michael Mansfield QC 

      Went on holiday a couple of years ago ....ma woman had bought me his book.
      "Memoirs Of A Radical Lawyer"

      Missed the first three days on the beach with the boys.

      Mansfield is the Top Banana . 
      Been called a champagne socialist.
      Achieved the result of Unlawful Killing in the Diana case.
      Was barrister in the Mc Libel case .
      Stephen Lawrence family    Bloody Sunday families      many others.

      Gets results ... this kiddo does.

      The families are in good hands .


      JFT96
      MIRO
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #77: Oct 10, 2014 08:49:08 pm

      A South Yorkshire police inspector who was on duty at Hillsborough when 96 people died has admitted that two “nasty” allegations police made against Liverpool supporters, on which the Sun relied for its stories under the headline The Truth on 19 April 1989, were false.

      Gordon Sykes acknowledged at the new inquest into the disaster that in 1989 he had related stories that 10 dead supporters had been stripped of their possessions by other fans and that one dead supporter had “numerous wallets” on him. Police officers made those allegations to a local news agency, White’s, which led to the Sun reporting that fans were looting and picking the pockets of dead people at Hillsborough.

      Pushed by Michael Mansfield QC, representing 75 families whose relatives were killed in the crush at the FA Cup semi-final between Liverpool and Nottingham Forest at Sheffield Wednesday’s Hillsborough ground, Sykes expressed regret for the false stories. Mansfield said they became “long-term allegations” against Liverpool fans “remembered by generations of people”.

      Sykes, who policed outside Hillsborough’s Leppings Lane turnstiles, an area he has described as seriously unsafe and “a death trap” throughout the 1980s, also agreed that the disaster was foreseeable, and that Sheffield Wednesday, the Football Association and South Yorkshire police had played “Russian roulette” with supporters’ lives.

      Sykes repeatedly denied, however, that the stories about the supporters were originated, spread and confirmed by police officers to “besmirch” and “denigrate” Liverpool supporters because the police would not own up to their own failures that caused the deaths. He confirmed that the South Yorkshire police chief constable, Peter Wright, had concluded a Police Federation meeting four days after the deaths, on 19 April 1989, by saying: “If anybody should be blamed, it should be the drunken, ticketless individuals.”

      That was the case Wright wanted to “pull together” and present to the official inquiry by Lord Justice Taylor, Sykes confirmed. The jury was told that Taylor rejected it.

      Sykes said he maintains his belief that some supporters were drunk and continued to try to push into the ground outside, despite police instructions. However, he said he now has a more “balanced” view than in 1989, and agrees the disaster was also caused by the “deathtrap” layout of the Hillsborough ground, and “catastrophic” failures by senior officers, Ch Supt David Duckenfield, and Supts Roger Marshall and Bernard Murray, who were “simply not up to the job.”

      In October 1989, Sykes acknowledged, he attended another Police Federation meeting, alongside then chief inspector Norman Bettison and other officers, with the local Conservative MP Michael Shersby, which was aimed at rebutting Lord Justice Taylor’s official report. Published in August 1989, Taylor concluded that the principal cause of the disaster was that police lost control, and rejected the police’s allegations that drunk fans were a cause.

      At that Police Federation meeting, Sykes and other officers maintained the allegations of bad behaviour by supporters, including that 10 bodies had been stripped and that one dead supporter was found with “numerous” wallets.

      Challenged by Mansfield that the allegation of stripped bodies was “a bald-faced lie”, Sykes accepted that a police log from the night of the disaster showed all 10 people had possessions on them, including money. He also accepted, under questioning by Mark George QC, representing 22 bereaved families, that none of the 95 people who died had “numerous” wallets on them. One dead supporter had two wallets, George said, and the second wallet contained that supporter’s own bank card, which had his name on it.

      Mansfield asked Sykes whether “as a matter of conscience”, he was prepared to say he regretted his “mistake” maintaining those false stories.

      “You see, these little mistakes end up in print,” Mansfield said, adding that the stories became “long-term allegations” against Liverpool fans, “and are remembered by generations of people. Do you regret now what has happened here?”

      “Yes, I regret that,” Sykes replied.

      Sykes had already told the inquest in his previous full day in the witness box that he believed and repeatedly warned senior police officers throughout the 1980s that the approach to the Leppings Lane turnstiles was “a death trap”.

      He agreed with George that the disaster was “entirely foreseeable” and could have happened to Tottenham Hotspur supporters who were given the Leppings Lane end for the 1981 FA Cup semi-final at Hillsborough, and Leeds United fans allocated it in 1987. A picture of Tottenham supporters escaping a crush on the Leppings Lane terrace in 1981 was shown to the jury, and Sykes agreed it was “horribly similar” to the scenes of Liverpool supporters in 1989 when 96 people died and hundreds were injured.

      “Isn’t it the case that Sheffield Wednesday, the Football Association – who selected Hillsborough as being suitable for a capacity match – and South Yorkshire police, whose job it was to police the match, were in effect playing Russian roulette with fans’ lives?” George asked Sykes. “If they did know about the problems, then they were playing Russian roulette because on your evidence this was a disaster that was going to happen sometime, and the only question was when and which geographical part of the country the bereaved families would be coming from?”

      Sykes, watched by approximately 100 people in the courtroom whose relatives were killed at Hillsborough, most of them parents who lost their children, replied: “Yes.”

      “Was it a scandal that situation was allowed to continued unheeded all that time?” George said.

      “Yes,” Sykes replied.

      “Was it a disgrace that it took the death of 96 people before the authorities finally took notice of what people had been saying for years?” George asked “Yes,” he said.

      “And that is the real truth about Hillsborough: that this was eminently foreseeable and could easily have been prevented?”

      “Yes sir,” Sykes agreed.

      Jonathan Laidlaw QC, for the Football Association, and Andrew Waters, representing Sheffield Wednesday, both challenged Sykes, pointing out that he had never informed either organisation of his view that the ground was a “deathtrap.” Nor did he use the word “deathtrap” in any previous statements or evidence, until February this year, when he was interviewed for this new inquest.

      Sykes maintained, however, that both the FA and Sheffield Wednesday must have known of the crushing problems at Hillsborough, based on “the number of near misses we have had.”

      “Do you think you were a little unwise to have lent yourself this morning to [Mark George QC’s] proposition?” Laidlaw asked him.

      “No,” Sykes replied.

      The inquest continues.

      waltonl4
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #78: Oct 16, 2014 02:03:18 pm
      I often wonder where this will eventually end and if it does will it be justice?. After all these years a lot of people have had good lives and enjoyed their freedom when they should have been behind bars. Dukinfield springs to mind I know I get very angry so how the families manage to maintain their dignity in all of this is beyond me.
      RedPuppy
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #79: Oct 22, 2014 05:43:30 pm
      Hillsborough: Roger Marshall sorry for 'misleading' inquests
      A former superintendent who served at Hillsborough has apologised after discovering part of the evidence he gave to the inquests was incorrect.

      Roger Marshall testified on 2 and 8 October that he policed 27,500 fans at a rugby league match at the ground on 26 December 1989 with 12 officers.

      The court was told he was not at the tie and it was not held in Sheffield.

      In a statement read to the jury, Mr Marshall offered "an unreserved apology for misleading the court".

      Ninety-six fans died following a crush at the FA Cup semi-final between Liverpool and Nottingham Forest at the Sheffield ground on 15 April 1989.

      Giving evidence on 2 October, the jury heard Mr Marshall explain he was match commander for a rugby league match between Wigan and St Helens on Boxing Day 1989, which he said was held at Hillsborough.

      Mr Marshall compared that match with the FA Cup semi-final, in which 801 police officer were on duty - 38% of the force's manpower at the time.

      "It might interest you to know that on Boxing Day the same year Wigan and St Helens played at Hillsborough [and] 27,500 people came to that game," he said.

      "Do you know, I policed that game, I policed it with 12 policemen."

      'Erroneous evidence'
      On 8 October, he was asked how he had policed that game with only 12 officers with "no public order problems".

      The former superintendent said: "It is a family game, family people, no problem."

      He also remarked how "it can't be said of rugby league that it is some upper middle-class dilettante sport" and that "just as with some football supporters" those who go to watch rugby league "like a beer as well".

      The 1989 Boxing Day game between Wigan and St Helens actually took place in Greater Manchester - at Wigan's then home ground, Central Park.

      In a statement read to the court on Tuesday, Mr Marshall said: "It has been brought to my attention that... I gave erroneous evidence in that: 1. I did not police the Wigan-St Helens game on 26 December 1989 and 2. That game was not played at Hillsborough.

      "I offer my unreserved apology for misleading the court. I am embarrassed and distressed that I made this mistake."

      The inquests, being held in Warrington, have now adjourned until 3 November.
      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-29723819

      Seriously WTF?

      Oath:

      I swear by [substitute Almighty God/Name of God (such as Allah) or the name of the holy scripture] that the evidence I shall give shall be the truth, made up, the whole truth wholly made up, and nothing but the truth made up.


      You could not make this up.
      stuey
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #80: Nov 06, 2014 10:43:37 am
      Hillsborough fan 'dumbfounded' at chaos
      A Liverpool fan has told the inquest he was ''dumbfounded'' at the lack of an efficient emergency response and help given to supporters as the disaster unfolded.
      Anthony O'Keefe, a London firefighter left his seat and helped the injured on the pitch.
      Mr O'Keefe also helped at the Kings Cross Tube disaster, he described the situation at Hillsborough that day as ''really frustrating''.


      full story:
      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-29921127


      The very idea that 10 or 12 appliances were parked outside the stadium until the ''rioting Liverpool supporters'' were calmed down is another corruption of the truth to be added to the 25 years of lies by the police, football authorities, civil servants and government representatives at the highest level.
      « Last Edit: Nov 06, 2014 10:59:19 am by stuey »
      stuey
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #81: Nov 08, 2014 09:38:39 am
      Police at Hillsborough 'overwhelmed'
      It would be unfair to blame an ''overwhelmed'' police force for losing control of fans outside Hillsborough, a retired officer has told the inquest, Graham McKay said to do so would be like blaming King Cnut for failing to control the tides.

      He said there was ''frustration leading to anger'' amongst the large crowd of Liverpool fans who had gathered outside the Leppings Lane turnstiles.


      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-29951813

      stuey
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #82: Nov 12, 2014 09:57:02 am
      'Lemming' fans claim was offensive
      Comparing LFC fans to lemmings ''shows a lot about the mindset'' of the man who initially investigated the disaster, the new inquests have heard.
      Former Det. Supt. Graham McKay said fans who went down a tunnel leading to the terraces were ''like lemmings''.
      Peter Wilcox QC, who represents the families who lost their loved ones, said the comment was offensive.


       http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-29997958
      « Last Edit: Nov 12, 2014 10:36:30 am by stuey »
      MIRO
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #83: Nov 14, 2014 09:20:29 pm
      Hillsborough: Roger Marshall sorry for 'misleading' inquests
      A former superintendent who served at Hillsborough has apologised after discovering part of the evidence he gave to the inquests was incorrect.

      Roger Marshall testified on 2 and 8 October that he policed 27,500 fans at a rugby league match at the ground on 26 December 1989 with 12 officers.

      The court was told he was not at the tie and it was not held in Sheffield.

      In a statement read to the jury, Mr Marshall offered "an unreserved apology for misleading the court".

      Ninety-six fans died following a crush at the FA Cup semi-final between Liverpool and Nottingham Forest at the Sheffield ground on 15 April 1989.

      Giving evidence on 2 October, the jury heard Mr Marshall explain he was match commander for a rugby league match between Wigan and St Helens on Boxing Day 1989, which he said was held at Hillsborough.

      Mr Marshall compared that match with the FA Cup semi-final, in which 801 police officer were on duty - 38% of the force's manpower at the time.

      "It might interest you to know that on Boxing Day the same year Wigan and St Helens played at Hillsborough [and] 27,500 people came to that game," he said.

      "Do you know, I policed that game, I policed it with 12 policemen."

      'Erroneous evidence'
      On 8 October, he was asked how he had policed that game with only 12 officers with "no public order problems".

      The former superintendent said: "It is a family game, family people, no problem."

      He also remarked how "it can't be said of rugby league that it is some upper middle-class dilettante sport" and that "just as with some football supporters" those who go to watch rugby league "like a beer as well".

      The 1989 Boxing Day game between Wigan and St Helens actually took place in Greater Manchester - at Wigan's then home ground, Central Park.

      In a statement read to the court on Tuesday, Mr Marshall said: "It has been brought to my attention that... I gave erroneous evidence in that: 1. I did not police the Wigan-St Helens game on 26 December 1989 and 2. That game was not played at Hillsborough.

      "I offer my unreserved apology for misleading the court. I am embarrassed and distressed that I made this mistake."

      The inquests, being held in Warrington, have now adjourned until 3 November.
      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-29723819

      Seriously WTF?

      Oath:

      I swear by [substitute Almighty God/Name of God (such as Allah) or the name of the holy scripture] that the evidence I shall give shall be the truth, made up, the whole truth wholly made up, and nothing but the truth made up.


      You could not make this up.


      Quote

      You could not make this up


      ...... but he did. 
      stuey
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #84: Nov 25, 2014 06:56:19 pm
      Note's deletion 'stinks of cover-up'
      The 'deletion' of a note about a radio conversation heard in the control box at Hillsborough showed someone there was ''trying to cover things up'' a former sergeant has told the inquests.
      The jury heard the discussion about closing the Leppings Lane tunnel gates ''disappears'' from later versions of  CCTV operator PC Trevor Bichard's log.
      Michael Goddard who was present in the control box agreed the deletion ''stinks of a cover up''.
      He added he did not hear the exchange.


      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-30194971
      RedPuppy
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #85: Nov 28, 2014 08:57:23 am
      Yesterday's report actually made me cry.

      I just can't imagine how bad it must have been.
      stuey
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #86: Dec 02, 2014 06:53:17 am
      Lawyers Hillsborough evidence query
      A South Yorkshire Police lawyer suggested four inspectors ''review'' the evidence they gave at a public enquiry into Hillsborough, the inquests have heard.
      Paul Metcalf wrote to the deputy chief constable to ask the officers to consider who was ''responsible'' for monitoring pens at the 1989 disaster.
      He drafted a statement suggesting the officers gave a ''misleading'' picture and they should only sign it if it was considered on reflection to be an accurate description of events that day.
      The officers did not change their statements, the hearing was told.
         
      http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/police-officers-asked-review-evidence-8208824
      « Last Edit: Dec 02, 2014 07:14:08 am by stuey »
      RedPuppy
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #87: Dec 17, 2014 03:26:26 pm
      Anyone following today's proceedings? 
      JD
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #88: Dec 17, 2014 03:28:40 pm
      Anyone following today's proceedings? 

      Caught a bit yes. 

      RedPuppy
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #89: Dec 17, 2014 03:31:31 pm
      Exactly.

      A street kid gets arrested, gonna do some time
      He got out three years from now just to commit more crime
      A businessman is caught with 24 kilos
      He’s out on bail and out of jail
      And that’s the way it goes
      « Last Edit: Dec 17, 2014 03:45:28 pm by RedPuppy »
      stuey
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #90: Dec 17, 2014 03:50:21 pm
      Ambulances 'carried bolt croppers'
      Ambulances carried ''industrial bolt croppers'' that could have cut through the fences on the Hillsborough terraces, a medic has told the inquests.
      Peter Lister who helped save lives in the 1989 tragedy, was continuing to give evidence at the inquests.
      He said the bolt croppers could have ''very easily'' cut through the fences at the Leppings Lane end.
      But a lawyer for the ambulance service said other medics believed they were not ''industrial sized'', the jury has heard.

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-30501893
      stuey
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      Re: Inquest updates
      Reply #91: Dec 17, 2014 04:17:54 pm
      Officer at Hillsborough says he would have refused to sign his statement had he known that his evidence had been changed.


      http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/hillsborough-pc-said-would-refused-8299536

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