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      Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?

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      RC9
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #23: Jul 07, 2014 04:49:27 pm
      I know that you are not saying that the money talks, but I added it up to show how tough it was for us, to compete with Chelsea and City, two of the richest clubs in the world, capable of havin a stelar roster. We competed against them, like United competed with City a year ago.

      In fact, this season was one of the most competitive season lately. The difference between City and Arsenal(the fouth) was only 7 points. In 12/13, the difference stood in 16 points. In 2011/2012, stood in 20 points. Thats why I said that didn't lack competition just because United and Tottenham were s**tty.

      You're thinking purely in the premier league, as much as i want us to win the tittle, i would really like us to make a fight off the champions league too and for that we need to be stronger than last season.
      viniciusgama1
      • Forum Billy Liddell
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #24: Jul 07, 2014 04:58:48 pm
      Yes. We need to be stronger. The roster has some flaws, but it's not that much. Fullbacks, another CB, another world class player and, of course, someone to replace Suarez, if he ends up going to Barcelona.
      harrydunn08
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #25: Jul 07, 2014 05:03:52 pm
      I think Tottenham were more reliant on Bale to win them games than we are on Suarez.  Luis has been a brilliant player for us, but we have shown that we are capable of winning games without him as illustrated in the final few games after he bit Ivanovic and the first few games of last season.  Personally, I don't even think Luis has been the most important element in our rise to 2nd in the league this last season.  For me, Brendan Rodgers has been the most important element in turning us back into a domestic powerhouse.  His tactics and footballing philosophies have allowed us to be more attack minded and expansive in our play which has yielded more goals and more points as a byproduct.  As long as the owners back BR in the transfer market (which it seems they are doing this summer) and he is able to get the players that he wants (which it seems he has been and will continue to be able to for the most part) then I believe that this coming season will see us continue to improve on the form we have shown consistently over the last 18 months, even without Luis Suarez. 
      Frankly, Mr Shankly
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #26: Jul 07, 2014 05:27:36 pm
      No one is immune from 'doing a Tottenham' in the signing of players but we will avoid a Tottenham in that we weren't dependent on Suarez in the same way they were on Bale. Suarez complemented the form shown by others around him, and dare I say it but the form of others - Sturridge and Sterling in particular - were the most prominent in our 12 game winning streak. We have more empowered players than Tottenham had and Brendan is very conscious of the fact that the system supersedes the individual, something AVB could not apply at Spurs. The Brendan Rodgers factor and the style of play that is already at an advanced stage (to the point it nearly won us the title - at Spurs it only got them 5th place under AVB) makes me more than confident that these signings will slot in easily to the team unlike the cut and paste lumpy Spurs squad. The fact that two of them (and potentially three with Lovren) come from the same team might make things easier when integrating them in.
      5timesacharm
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #27: Jul 07, 2014 05:47:06 pm
      I know that you are not saying that the money talks, but I added it up to show how tough it was for us, to compete with Chelsea and City, two of the richest clubs in the world, capable of havin a stelar roster. We competed against them, like United competed with City a year ago.

      In fact, this season was one of the most competitive season lately. The difference between City and Arsenal(the fouth) was only 7 points. In 12/13, the difference stood in 16 points. In 2011/2012, stood in 20 points. Thats why I said that didn't lack competition just because United and Tottenham were s**tty.

      What I'm actually saying is that I agree with you in part. We need to spend money but it needs to be done wisely and with Spurs last year acting as a cautionary tale. I don't want to see us go out and spend £75 million (or whatever) on half a dozen players like Spurs did but I do want to see us go out and spend £75 million (or whatever) on one world class goal scorer with whatever is left being held in reserve for January or spent on fleshing out the squad. I picked out that part of your post because I believe we should not be complacent about what we (over)achieved last season and that we can't assume Sturridge will not be injured at some point next season; the alternatives are not main striker material so that money needs to be invested wisely and if it is, there's no reason why we should suffer a dramatic loss of form such as Spurs did last season.
      staffletop
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #28: Jul 07, 2014 06:10:50 pm
      Very good OP.

      I think we're in a much more stable situation than Spurs were last summer.  Brendan has been in situ for 2 seasons compared to AVB's 1 and we seem to be targeting players who give us better options off the bench, will strengthen the starting 11 and give us more goal threats from midfield.  We have an identity to our methods and systems and although Brendan may tweak things without Luis those methods and systems won't change.

      Spurs on the other hand bought players who were available regardless of how or if they would fit in, tried to play them all at once and as a result it was a mess which resulted in AVB getting sacked 3 months into the season.

      It's easy to look at what happened there with the fear that we could suffer the same fate but if you look at the facts and figures they didn't do that badly.  They finished on just 3 points less than the previous season and when you consider all the upheaval they went through that's not exactly a disaster.

      I think Debs hit the nail on the head here...BR has been here longer, the system is already in place, with the players already knowing what we are doing and any additions will be to strengthen the squad. We're not starting from scratch with wholesale changes like the Spuds were. I don't think we will do a Spurs.

      The players we have brought in so far improve the squad, I dont think any of them are better than what we already have. We finished 2nd last season, without CL football and with Suarez. I wait to see if we sign any players that will help us be better than last season.
      red_kaiser
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #29: Jul 07, 2014 08:56:17 pm
      Enough of Can's puns. Now we have entire threads on it  :f_tongueincheek:
      hobbes2702
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #30: Jul 07, 2014 09:41:49 pm
      One issue with Spurs is that they weren't great even with Bale. We were incredible with Luis. We also have a better manager and a ready made replacement for our star (Sturridge).
      yacster
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #31: Jul 07, 2014 10:41:23 pm
      We should only replace two of the back 4 (Moreno, Lovren) and start with 1 out of Lallana or a Suarez replacement in our initial starting 11. Soldado, Lamela, Chadli, Erikssen, Cheriches, Capoue, and Paulinho starting so early into the season meant a team of strangers playing together..

      Would be delighted with
      Mig
      Johnson/Flanagn, Lovren, Sakho, Moreno
      Henderson, Gerrard
      Sterling, Coutinho, Lallana
      Sturridge
      with players like Can, Skrtel, Markovic, Allen,and a lambert/mystery new striker waiting to make an impact..
      srslfc
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #32: Jul 08, 2014 12:36:21 am
      Firstly, apologies to anyone this may offend. I tend not to conform to that mindset of "if Brendan wants him then I hope he gets him for whatever price".

      I almost didn't click on this thread but eventually did.

      Stopped reading after this.

      I really don't get why people think it's more important that we sign the players they want than the one's the manager wants.

      Also is it still really too difficult to understand that FSG will only pay what they think a player is worth to us and therefore they don't see it as 'overpaying'?
      CoutinhoRed
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #33: Jul 08, 2014 08:58:37 am
      I almost didn't click on this thread but eventually did.

      Stopped reading after this.

      I really don't get why people think it's more important that we sign the players they want than the one's the manager wants.

      Also is it still really too difficult to understand that FSG will only pay what they think a player is worth to us and therefore they don't see it as 'overpaying'?

      Good for you. Another one who has missed the point. If say Brendan wanted Lallana for £30m, would you want him to go ahead with the transfer? It's a good example of what I am talking about.i wouldn't want him to sign player at whatever price simply because I wouldn't want to see him spend ridiculous amounts on someone who is deemed average. I've got no problem with him signing Lallana, just not at whatever price. We saw that with Downing and Carroll (and here come the excuses...)

      Moving on, have been browsing forums of opposing clubs. The general thought seems to be that we are buying in quantity and not quality. Even with the players rumoured, we are perceived as a club who is increasing their squad depth but not the strength of the first XI. I suppose that is accurate somewhat. Sanchez would have been our ready made star signing, but seems he is going to le arse.
      srslfc
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #34: Jul 08, 2014 09:02:01 am
      Good for you. Another one who has missed the point. If say Brendan wanted Lallana for £30m, would you want him to go ahead with the transfer?

      Yes I would. I thought I've made that pretty clear over the summer so far.

      I haven't missed any point.

      FSG won't over pay and I want Brendan to get the players he wants not the ones I, in my amateur opinion, think he should be going for.

      Now if I have to explain that again, and I don't think I can put it any simpler, then there is not much point debating the issue with you.
      HScRed1
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #35: Jul 08, 2014 09:03:41 am
      Good for you. Another one who has missed the point. If say Brendan wanted Lallana for £30m, would you want him to go ahead with the transfer? It's a good example of what I am talking about.i wouldn't want him to sign player at whatever price simply because I wouldn't want to see him spend ridiculous amounts on someone who is deemed average. I've got no problem with him signing Lallana, just not at whatever price. We saw that with Downing and Carroll (and here come the excuses...)

      Moving on, have been browsing forums of opposing clubs. The general thought seems to be that we are buying in quantity and not quality. Even with the players rumoured, we are perceived as a club who is increasing their squad depth but not the strength of the first XI. I suppose that is accurate somewhat. Sanchez would have been our ready made star signing, but seems he is going to le arse.

      Spurs signed plenty of so called quality and look where that got them. Its down to the manager and what style he wants to play, he will bring in players to fit that style. Superstars are not always essential in making a successful team as much as us supporters get turned on by the idea.
      CoutinhoRed
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #36: Jul 08, 2014 09:04:21 am
      Yes I would. I thought I've made that pretty clear over the summer so far.

      I haven't missed any point.

      FSG won't over pay and I want Brendan to get the players he wants not the ones I, in my amateur opinion, think he should be going for.

      Now if I have to explain that again, and I don't think I can put it any simpler, then there is not much point debating the issue with you.

      You clearly did, and if you are here to moan about ones post then I think you should kindly f**k off. Either engage in the conversation or do one, sunshine.

      I understand though, it's difficult for guys like you who are too scared to have an opinion..
      CoutinhoRed
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #37: Jul 08, 2014 09:08:18 am
      Spurs signed plenty of so called quality and look where that got them. Its down to the manager and what style he wants to play, he will bring in players to fit that style. Superstars are not always essential in making a successful team as much as us supporters get turned on by the idea.

      Who were deemed quality? Paulinho was a decent signing and still is. Soldado flopped as did Lamela. I am not surprise Soldado flopped given his lack of pace. Really thought Lamela would pull it off though. Eriksen has also done a decent job. But can you see the point being made? They signed good, decent players but they already had good, decent players. They did not progress to that next level.
      mcarz
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #38: Jul 08, 2014 09:30:07 am
      The problem with the players that Spurs signed is that it was the owner who signed them and half of them didn't fit the manager's style of play. That is how these two situations differ so yes we can avoid doing a Spurs because technically we are doing.

      In the right set up Soldado and Lamela would be really good players, managers these days don't have the time though.
      Beerbelly
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #39: Jul 08, 2014 09:34:14 am
      Good for you. Another one who has missed the point. If say Brendan wanted Lallana for £30m, would you want him to go ahead with the transfer? It's a good example of what I am talking about.i wouldn't want him to sign player at whatever price simply because I wouldn't want to see him spend ridiculous amounts on someone who is deemed average. I've got no problem with him signing Lallana, just not at whatever price. We saw that with Downing and Carroll (and here come the excuses...)

      Moving on, have been browsing forums of opposing clubs. The general thought seems to be that we are buying in quantity and not quality. Even with the players rumoured, we are perceived as a club who is increasing their squad depth but not the strength of the first XI. I suppose that is accurate somewhat. Sanchez would have been our ready made star signing, but seems he is going to le arse.

      I understand perfectly well what you're saying other people can't handle this perspective for some reason.
      reddebs
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #40: Jul 08, 2014 09:35:24 am
      You clearly did, and if you are here to moan about ones post then I think you should kindly f**k off. Either engage in the conversation or do one, sunshine.

      I understand though, it's difficult for guys like you who are too scared to have an opinion..

      Wtf.  He's given his opinion, just because he doesn't share your opinion doesn't mean it's any less valid.  If you only want people to post in your topics if they have the same opinion as yours maybe you should put a disclaimer in the thread title.

      Deary me there's some precious  babies on this forum these days!
      Paisleydalglish
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #41: Jul 08, 2014 09:47:53 am
      Mmmm let me think?

      Can we avoid becoming a non entity sh*te mid ranging looking up at others little man complex dick of a club


      Yes I'm confident we can
      reddebs
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #42: Jul 08, 2014 09:50:23 am
      Moving on, have been browsing forums of opposing clubs. The general thought seems to be that we are buying in quantity and not quality. Even with the players rumoured, we are perceived as a club who is increasing their squad depth but not the strength of the first XI. I suppose that is accurate somewhat. Sanchez would have been our ready made star signing, but seems he is going to le arse.

      Yet we needed to fill out the squad for next season as every other clubs fans kept tellin us last season.  We haven't spent Luis transfer yet as these signings were coming regardless of his sale and we're only 8 days into a two month transfer window with a World Cup still in progress. 

      None of us know who else we might sign at this stage but we didn't buy any big names last summer yet challenged for the title till the 37th game of the season by the manager improving the players he had.

      I guess none of our players will improve again or Brendan might have a total brain fart, change his philosophy and start parking the bus now we've lost our one and only quality player.
      djb447
      • Forum Michael Robinson
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #43: Jul 08, 2014 09:52:00 am
      Losing Suarez ain't that bad, even though he's my favorite player. Statistics show that Liverpool won a greater percentage of games without Suarez than with him.

      With Suarez gone  statistically we should be doing better.
      Beefing up the squad now can only improve us.

      Best of luck to Suarez to wherever he plays next season!
      Semple
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #44: Jul 08, 2014 10:08:09 am
      I have more confidence in BR than I would with AVB. As said before, he has been here longer and knows the players he currently has. It is very important that we are smart and buy well.
      bad boy bubby
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      Re: Can we avoid doing a Tottenham?
      Reply #45: Jul 08, 2014 10:17:14 am
      If say Brendan wanted Lallana for £30m, would you want him to go ahead with the transfer? It's a good example of what I am talking about.i wouldn't want him to sign player at whatever price simply because I wouldn't want to see him spend ridiculous amounts on someone who is deemed average.
      That's the point C_R... "deemed average" by you - not Brendan.

      You say that you are concerned at us 'doing a Spurs' yet you totally ignore one of the most important things in Spurs failure to improve - their manager not having a say in the players he wanted.

      The weird thing is; there are hypocritical, dip-shits (not you btw), who have, in the past, professed undying support for Brendan (and have turned on others for daring to questioning him) AND who say they "FSG are right not to overpay" yet... have the audacity to question Brendan's ability in the transfer market and don't trust FSG not to overpay - they're the simpletons I have issue with but I digress...

      Genuine question mate: did you start this thread because you were genuinely concerned and looking for 'answers' or had you another agenda?  [the agenda being - the quality of players Brendan has signed/we are linked with].

      What I want to discuss is our current transfer signings and targets.
      It appears to me that, dress it up as you may, you are actually less concerned about us doing a Spurs than you are Brendan's ability in the transfer market. See I have no problem with that or debating it (and may even agree) but I'm just not sure this thread is the right place.

      For that reason I'm out of here but good luck in your quest mate... 8)



      « Last Edit: Jul 08, 2014 10:36:53 am by bad boy bubby »

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