Let's try boring football

This may be very obvious to some people, but it only dawned on me this evening.

I think the key to beating teams like WBA, Stoke, Hull, Villa, Everton () et al is to stop playing into their hands by attacking them for 90 minutes as we have been doing. We need to play patient possession football, with patient being the key term. We're actually playing to their strengths if we just run at them for the entire game; they're expecting that and train to combat that. We need to be boring and patient. That's how the chavs win their titles.

It's not the only way of course, Barca, Madrid, Citeh and possibly Bayern Munich (haven't watched them much) can attack you to death, but they also know how to play it cagey too, when needs be. And it does help to have a Messi, a Ronaldo, an Aguero, or a Mueller, in your side; you have to have kwality. But even so, if all your tactics ever amount to are batter the opposition by attacking them all the time, then its akin to the saying (in Psychology circles), if all you have is a hammer, all you are likely to see are nails.

We have to vary it up and not only adopt a change of personnel and formations but how we approach games too. I've seen very little of that with the Gaffer. I wouldn't dare to tell him how to go about his business, but I think it's time he started looking at how to approach each team we play from a blank slate. Fat Sam said it's easy to play against us because he knows what we'll do because we do it every single time we play. And he's absolutely right too. Yes we are playing poorly right now; but all the more reason to retain possession and coax the other team to open up. Right now we're forcing our passes and are too eager to get the ball forward. All that's happening is it's all breaking down way too often.

Great Liverpool sides of the 80s and 90s kept the ball and passed it around the pitch. That's death by football, not a gung ho you score 3 we'll score 6 attitude (Cardiff City 3 v 6 Liverpool, Stoke City 3 v 5 Liverpool and stuff).

So be boring, pass it sideways, pass it backwards and wait until they make a mistake. Because they will inevitably make that mistake. That's why these teams are always the same ones to struggle season after season; it's because they don't have top players who can play a good enough game for 90 minutes without letting you in the back door

I'd be happy to win games 1-0 and be boring but efficient.

No one would have suggested this so called Boring football, last season, when the side where scoring so many goals, almost at will. Although this season such a different scenario, I see your point.

We've been boring for most of the season.

Could of done with being F***ing boring last season against Chelsea!!

Don't care how we play as long as the lads look like they know what they're doing

Could of done with being F***ing boring last season against Chelsea!!

Pretty much

Could of done with being F***ing boring last season against Chelsea!!

Back then we were ripping teams apart by playing attacking football, if we had of sat back hoping for a draw, Chelsea would have come at us, and could have won anyway with our defence.
Going at them the right thing to do IMO, it was only very bad luck that prevented us getting at least a draw anyway.

Back on topic,  I think playing boring football would make it even harder for us to win.

To offense to the OP but I'd rather us just figure out how to win by playing entertaining football.

The problem with boring football is that it's....well.......boring.

Winning isn't boring. The only ones who claim it is are those not winning. Liverpool USED to get loads of "boring" wins back in the heyday. I'd take those all day long if it meant getting our hands back on the league trophy!

Back then we were ripping teams apart by playing attacking football, if we had of sat back hoping for a draw, Chelsea would have come at us, and could have won anyway with our defence.
Going at them the right thing to do IMO, it was only very bad luck that prevented us getting at least a draw anyway.

Back on topic,  I think playing boring football would make it even harder for us to win.

Don't agree we went at them, couldn't break them down and ran out of ideas, one idea might of been to drop back invite them onto us, open them up. Attacking footie was the problem against Chelsea, we only had to draw, not lose!!

Sometimes playing the way Chelsea have in last couple of weeks, wins you league titles.

That's how we did it back in our hey day ;-)

Don't agree we went at them, couldn't break them down and ran out of ideas, one idea might of been to drop back invite them onto us, open them up. Attacking footie was the problem against Chelsea, we only had to draw, not lose!!

Sometimes playing the way Chelsea have in last couple of weeks, wins you league titles.

That's how we did it back in our hey day ;-)

In fairness to Brendan, but for a Unfortunately slip, we would have gotten the draw.

Chavs won this year playing pretty functional stuff. They have some really good players, but the strength is in defense. They set the tone, and thought it was a boring enough season. Inevitably people will look at how they did it, and compare.
But plenty of sides win playing entertaining football. Would love to see us playing footy as entertaining as last season, and though will be hard to score as many goals, a bit more solidity at the back might mean we wouldn't have to.

when they brought in the back pass to the goal keeper rule , it was meant to stop games becoming boring because teams were constantly passing backwards.
to be boring nowadays you really need top quality players to keep the ball away from the oppossition . if it doesnt work though and you lose to counter attacks then whats the point . its philosophy football , far too complicated for such a simple game.

Just to clarify, I'm not saying we should always play cagey defensive football, only when we need to and in order to remove the bus some teams bring on the pitch.

Ironic that patient cagey football can be used to take the handbreak of the bus but there you go

Does anyone seriously believe that, at the time we were ripping teams to shreds, we should have just sat back against Chelsea and played for the draw?

Oh yes, it is easy in hindsight, but I can guarantee the shitstorm it would have created on this site if Liverpool lost and Rodgers had deviated from the tried and tested formula of previously and reverted to defensive mindset.

I find it laughable how some people on here say that Rodgers 'lost us' the title by playing the same style which, erm, got us in that exact position to fight for it.

As much as i hate Mourinho as a man, i have nothing but the utmost respect for him as a manager. He does what needs to be done and he gets the job done. He has the ability to adapt.

Next Season is going to be hard for us. Brendan has to learn to be more flexible with his philosophy and tactics. The changes made against Villa were more blind panic than controlled genius and he has displayed this on several occasions this year.

I agree with Rush that we do need to adapt our game when playing bus parkers, or at least have a variation in place to make us more tactically flexible in game.

There is a lot of work to do over the coming Summer, everyone is talking about rebuilding the Squad in the media. The fact that this is the case three years into his tenure really does highlight the need to F**k this transfer committee off.

I find boring football, a boring topic, maybe it is time to call topic locked !

Anyone remember the away game at Cardiff last season.... 6-3 we won I think..... what a cracking game that was to watch.  The backheel from Sturridge to Suarez....

oh man last season was amazing.

I find boring football, a boring topic, maybe it is time to call topic locked !

Or you know, you could just leave the topic and let other people continue to discuss it?

Or you know, you could just leave the topic and let other people continue to discuss it?

can you imagine if a topic could get locked if only one person didn't like it?

how many topics would there be left do you think?

Another topic started in the hope of defending Brendan and our current clueless gameplan.

Another topic started in the hope of defending Brendan and our current clueless gameplan.

Like the poster who wanted the thread locked - an off the map point of view and comment.

can you imagine if a topic could get locked if only one person didn't like it?

how many topics would there be left do you think?

Exactly.

I have nothing against some people not liking a certain topic (there's a load I don't venture into). But to suggest it get locked by 'one' individual because they don't like it, it smacks a little of arrogance for me.

Another topic started in the hope of defending Brendan and our current clueless gameplan.

George, this topic is all about 'how' we approach games and other teams. Substitute the name Rodgers for Klopp, or Ancelotti, or De Boer, anyone, and just breathe deeper

Just to clarify, I'm not saying we should always play cagey defensive football, only when we need to and in order to remove the bus some teams bring on the pitch.

Ironic that patient cagey football can be used to take the handbreak of the bus but there you go

Exactly Rush. Mourinho is a master at it. It's like coaxing a rabbit out of the hole.

Isn't playing slow, boring football also playing into the hands of the team that sits in?

All that time you aren't "playing into their hands" you are in fact drawing and getting closer to full time.

I didn't see anyone praising Chelsea's slow and boring football when they lost at Villa and Palace and at home to Sunderland last season. Or when they lost to Atletico last season after that embarrassing first leg performance.

Being successful is about having as many ways to score and win games as possible. Last season our score lines and style was informed by our personnel.

Chelsea won the league because they spread the goals out over their games, by being consistent and having good players. I'm not sure us copying their ability to play it cagey now and then, without the experience or players to do so helps us.

Correct. But ultimately, Chelsea won the league because Mourhino knows how to stifle teams. That's death by football. Sure they have the kwality to hurt teams, but that kwality has to fit a certain style of football that Mourhino espouses.

As I said, I'm not saying we turn into a cagey defensive hit n' run outfit, I'm saying we turn into a cagey defensive hit n' run outfit when we have to .

As Hardcoresoldier put it, it's about coaxing the rabbit out of the hole.

It's my opinion that when you have a team going "gung ho" at you for 90 minutes, you have made  the opposition's choices easier:

(1) Play open and get creamed (possibly)
(2) Play it cagey/defensive and come away with not losing

For some games we need to be sly old dogs and poke the animal instead of smashing it over the head with a sledge. We need to be patient and look for openings due to mistakes and stop trying to force the issue with relentless pressure.

George, this topic is all about 'how' we approach games and other teams. Substitute the name Rodgers for Klopp, or Ancelotti, or De Boer, anyone, and just breathe deeper

You could also win the league playing entertaining football, see how City's won it and even Chelsea in the past years. It's not impossible to play nice football and win trophies also, boring football can be used in certain games but not as a constant thing in our playing style.

You could also win the league playing entertaining football, see how City's won it and even Chelsea in the past years. It's not impossible to play nice football and win trophies also, boring football can be used in certain games but not as a constant thing in our playing style.

And if you read all my posts above George, you'll see that's EXACTLY what I have been saying.

That we need to adopt a more cage cautious style of play now and again against certain teams. Because up to now, all I've seen under the Gaffer is us forcing the issue and trying to batter teams into submission.

EDIT: Perhaps because of how we tend to play, that is why other managers have sussed us out (as the media like to say). Perhaps it's not so much us playing a diamond, or a 3 at the back formation. Perhaps it's easy to nullify us because we always go at them with the same attack minded philosophy. Perhaps not, but either way I think the Gaffer needs to consider adding another string to his bow.

And if you read all my posts above George, you'll see that's EXACTLY what I have been saying.

That we need to adopt a more cage cautious style of play now and again against certain teams. Because up to now, all I've seen under the Gaffer is us forcing the issue and trying to batter teams into submission.

You're right, my mistake because i didn't read all what you've said and jumped quickly to a wrong conclusion.

You're right, my mistake because i didn't read all what you've said and jumped quickly to a wrong conclusion.

No harm no foul

No harm no foul

Not true as we found out earlier this season when Markovic got sent off against Basel.   

Does anyone seriously believe that, at the time we were ripping teams to shreds, we should have just sat back against Chelsea and played for the draw?

Oh yes, it is easy in hindsight, but I can guarantee the shitstorm it would have created on this site if Liverpool lost and Rodgers had deviated from the tried and tested formula of previously and reverted to defensive mindset.

I find it laughable how some people on here say that Rodgers 'lost us' the title by playing the same style which, erm, got us in that exact position to fight for it.

Goals against column for last season tells you all you need to know.

Does anyone seriously believe that, at the time we were ripping teams to shreds, we should have just sat back against Chelsea and played for the draw?

Oh yes, it is easy in hindsight, but I can guarantee the shitstorm it would have created on this site if Liverpool lost and Rodgers had deviated from the tried and tested formula of previously and reverted to defensive mindset.

I find it laughable how some people on here say that Rodgers 'lost us' the title by playing the same style which, erm, got us in that exact position to fight for it.

Good point, and the pre-match thread from last year makes for some interesting reading: http://www.lfcreds.com/reds/index.php/topic,46055.0.html

Basically, everyone acknowledges Chelsea was going to come in and sit deep. But, and I just browsed it over quickly, it doesn't look like anyone suggested we do the same. Most were confident our attack was simply too good to not score.

You forgot to mention about Mourinho in the transfer market. Last season they had an amazing defence but crap strikers. Still they almost won the league (like we almost did).

He rectified the issue by buying Costa and Fabregas, exactly what they needed to go that extra step. And they have been top of the table since the start of the season. The best teams are built from the back, and Chelsea have always had a very good defence. And our manager needs to realise that first

You forgot to mention about Mourinho in the transfer market. Last season they had an amazing defence but crap strikers. Still they almost won the league (like we almost did).

He rectified the issue by buying Costa and Fabregas, exactly what they needed to go that extra step. And they have been top of the table since the start of the season. The best teams are built from the back, and Chelsea have always had a very good defence. And our manager needs to realise that first

Don’t forget Nemanja Matić, he was bought only 6 months before... 3 world class players in 3 positions where they lacked.

RESULT: Premier League Champions.

Never before has the phrase "Quality over Quantity" been so right

It seems these days boring football brings results

Brings victories
Brings points
Brings championships
Brings recognision
Brings top talent
Brings Sponsership

BRINGS MONEY

Sad truth is attacking football is dangerous.

Give me 70 games of boring tripe for 5 trophies a season and I'll bite your F***ing hand off.

We've been boring for the majority of this season and it hasn't worked out too well.

Back then we were ripping teams apart by playing attacking football, if we had of sat back hoping for a draw, Chelsea would have come at us, and could have won anyway with our defence.

Or we could have scored about 5 on the counter?

Winning football will do for now .

We've been boring for the majority of this season and it hasn't worked out too well.

Things is, we weren't so much boring as we were just poor.

Whilst the plastics are boring (aside from the first half of the season) they very efficient. I think that's the way to win league titles in the long run. George Graham did it too. Boring boring Arsenal but a few titles to show for it. For all Utd's titles over the last 25 years, they were ruthlessly efficient too, and ground out results as much as they were hammering Spurs 3-5 away after being 3-0 down half time. As we know, they also had some of the best youths in the country coming through at the right time too. 

We are in stark contrast to that. We had one of the best strike-forces in Europe last season, but still lost out in defence as we shipped 51 goals - in the league alone.

For me (and again I hate saying this), ferguson was right when he said "Strikers win you matches but defences win you titles."

I'm all for free scoring exciting football, but we simply have to sort out our defence first. Else we're just another Newcastle Utd from the 90s. Pretty to watch, entertaining, but ultimately not good enough to win the title.

Can you imagine if we'd had a half tidy defence? But the perhaps our attacking policy might have changed as a result. Who knows.

I'm all for free scoring exciting football, but we simply have to sort out our defence first. Else we're just another Newcastle Utd from the 90s. Pretty to watch, entertaining, but ultimately not good enough to win the title anything

Fixed that for you

It seems these days boring football brings results

Brings victories
Brings points
Brings championships
Brings recognision
Brings top talent
Brings Sponsership

BRINGS MONEY

Sad truth is attacking football is dangerous.

Give me 70 games of boring tripe for 5 trophies a season and I'll bite your f**king hand off.

Yeah, just look at Barcelona, Real or Bayern, truly boring football.

Things is, we weren't so much boring as we were just poor.

Nah mate. I agree with JD.

We've been boring as hell for the most part this season and you could probably count on one hand the amount of game where we were good to watch this season.

Last season was almost the exact opposite.

Nah mate. I agree with JD.

We've been boring as hell for the most part this season and you could probably count on one hand the amount of game where we were good to watch this season.

Last season was almost the exact opposite.

I'd say we've been boring and dire. Difficult to tell the difference because both make me feel like screaming in frustration.

How about, let's try fast paced and exciting football?

For me (and again I hate saying this), ferguson was right when he said "Strikers win you matches but defences win you titles."

I'm all for free scoring exciting football, but we simply have to sort out our defence first.

Can you imagine if we'd had a half tidy defence? But the perhaps our attacking policy might have changed as a result. Who knows.

Taking advice from that OAP these days, are we? I remember how his replacement got on with trying it. I remember how it worked for Chelsea last year too.

We've conceded 5 goals away from home since Christmas, so the defence has tightened up without changing our approach. We conceded 5 goals in the last 2 away games last season alone.

Brendan said on last year's DVD that his philosophy is "Start Fast, Finish Strong". He won't change, so you just have to like it or live with it.

Alternatively, we can go back to the boring days of controlling the game. But what it won't bring us is League Championships.

Nah mate. I agree with JD.

We've been boring as hell for the most part this season and you could probably count on one hand the amount of game where we were good to watch this season.

Last season was almost the exact opposite.

Agree completely.

It's a myth we play attractive football at the moment due to the fact that we did while we had Suarez. Our tempo is slow and if either of Balotelli or Lambert are playing it's even slower.

We have a one trick pony in Raheem who currently is lucky to beat his man 1 in 5, Lallana who does more turns than a spinning top but essentially stays in the same place. Behind them the great technicians of Allen and Henderson are sure as hell running their arses off but attractive football is not their forte.

The one player who is conducive to playing attractive high tempo football is Coutinho and that lad must be frustrated as hell out there. When we bring in Ings and Benteke though that's really quench his thirst for playing some of the good stuff, unfortunately that'll be because he'll be playing it somewhere abroad.

The style of football has to suit the players you have at your disposal whether that's to play attractively or to win. We have been putting square pegs in round holes all season, forget attractive football I'd just love to see us select an XI where all the players are in their natural positions.

Taking advice from that OAP these days, are we?

Who said we're taking his advice? It's a solid philosophy on how to win games - do with it whatever you want. Besides, good advice is good advice and where it comes from is irrelevant. Ignore it if you think you should - but it doesn't change the fact that a sound defence is critical when after league titles.

I remember how his replacement got on with trying it. I remember how it worked for Chelsea last year too.

Moyes changed things and did it his way; perhaps he's just wasn't as good a manager. Mourhino needed a few replacement players - and then when he got them, he went on to win the league on the back of a solid defence and cagey footballing style. So I'm not entirely sure your point is a valid one.

We've conceded 5 goals away from home since Christmas, so the defence has tightened up without changing our approach. We conceded 5 goals in the last 2 away games last season alone.

Perhaps if he had played it more cagey against certain teams, we'd have won a few more games. An efficient defence helps to do that but isn't the main point here; which is, we need to adapt how we approach certain teams.

Brendan said on last year's DVD that his philosophy is "Start Fast, Finish Strong". He won't change, so you just have to like it or live with it.

Or, as I read that "Hit them so fast so hard they won't have enough time to score enough goals to beat you so don't worry if you concede 51 goals a season". This season we've conceded 38 goals with 3 games to go, and we are 5th with the worst goals conceded tally in the top 5. You can do the maths

As for your last point, you don't know he won't change. Managers tend to evolve and Rodgers tends to learn from his mistakes so who is to say he won't adopt a more defensive strategy in future?

Alternatively, we can go back to the boring days of controlling the game. But what it won't bring us is League Championships.

During the 30 years of our dominance we played cagey defensive football which on times wasn't pretty to watch; we adapted against teams we happened to be playing at any given moment. To take a Paisley phrase "It isn't about the long ball or the short ball it's about the right ball" (or something very similar to that). Meaning, we'll do whatever we have to do (i.e. we'll play any way) to win football matches. It wasn't all sexy attacking football back then, we'd also stifle games by nullifying and stifling teams in order to secure the points we needed. 

When we were successful it was because we adapted when we played certain teams. We are not doing that now and it's my opinion we should be.

Just give me 30 dull 1-0 league wins every season.  Thanks. 

Brendan said on last year's DVD that his philosophy is "Start Fast, Finish Strong". He won't change, so you just have to like it or live with it.

Alternatively, we can go back to the boring days of controlling the game. But what it won't bring us is League Championships.

What happened to finishing strong then? From Man U at home onwards we've been anything but strong.

Would rather control a game and win, rather than win the stats and lose!!

What happened to finishing strong then? From Man U at home onwards we've been anything but strong.

Would rather control a game and win, rather than win the stats and lose!!

The collapse after the semi final and sheer lack of desire from all involved in the following week has been the most disappointing aspect of this season.

The collapse after the semi final and sheer lack of desire from all involved in the following week has been the most disappointing aspect of this season.

At a time when it could have made our season (either through winning a cup, or qualifying for CL), but as per usual, this team bottled it when the pressure was on.

I really struggle to word how much I dislike the mentality I've seen on the pitch this season, no fight whatsoever.