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      Something Has To Change

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      ORCHARD RED
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #46: May 16, 2015 09:24:16 am
      From a fans pov something has to change but from the owners pov it doesn't. 

      I don't think they're unhappy with where we are, or with Brendan or with the recruitment.  The Club is where they want it to be for now and they're convinced that given time most of the players bought will be a success.  Either financially or playing wise.

      It will cost too much money, money we don't have yet, to take that final step into regular CL qualification and even more to be regular Title contenders.  There's some stats floating around the web relating to cost per point in terms of squad value for any PL team.  The first ÂŁ100m of added value, not spent, will get you up and around the European places (4th to 7th) but it takes a further ÂŁ150m of added value to get you regularly challenging for the Title and there's still no guarentee of dominating the League.

      We haven't even added the first ÂŁ100m yet we challenged for the Title last season and we should qualify for Europe this season so their plan of "doing things differently" appears to be working.  I believe for them it's too early to say it's not working and something needs to change.


      I honestly don't see any changes happening in the Summer. As you say FSG will be happy with the things are ticking along financially, why should the change something when it isn't broken.
      reddebs
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #47: May 16, 2015 09:37:29 am
      I honestly don't see any changes happening in the Summer. As you say FSG will be happy with the things are ticking along financially, why should the change something when it isn't broken.


      I can't see it but who the hell knows mate.
      5timesacharm
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #48: May 16, 2015 11:24:11 am
      It will cost too much money, money we don't have yet, to take that final step into regular CL qualification and even more to be regular Title contenders. 

      That is a smokescreen they have been very successful in peddling. The club chose to buy Lallana and Markovic rather than Fabregas but between them not only is the transfer fee more than Chelsea spent on him but their combined wages are more than he receives at Chelsea. From their perspective though, by hedging their bets, if one of the two is unsuccessful, they can move them on and reduce the wage bill by ÂŁ60K a week. We are able to compete with most of the teams in the Champions league but they refuse to do so on a single target, preferring to spread the risk over multiple targets. It's the wrong approach to football. The best players win you things, not the highest number of mediocre players.
      reddebs
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #49: May 16, 2015 11:42:58 am
      That is a smokescreen they have been very successful in peddling. The club chose to buy Lallana and Markovic rather than Fabregas but between them not only is the transfer fee more than Chelsea spent on him but their combined wages are more than he receives at Chelsea. From their perspective though, by hedging their bets, if one of the two is unsuccessful, they can move them on and reduce the wage bill by ÂŁ60K a week. We are able to compete with most of the teams in the Champions league but they refuse to do so on a single target, preferring to spread the risk over multiple targets. It's the wrong approach to football. The best players win you things, not the highest number of mediocre players.

      Of course it is because they don't want to play the same as every other Club, they want to prove it can be done differently.  They've said so since day one and the last 2 seasons won't have changed their minds that it's impossible.

      Those low risk assets we've invested in haven't had time to mature yet and they don't have enough knowledge of the game to realise most never will.
      reddebs
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #50: May 16, 2015 12:40:12 pm
      Can someone more tech smart than me post the new Hitler Reacts youtube video please, it's funny as.....

      Title is hitler reacts fsg's end of season review.
      MIRO
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #51: May 16, 2015 01:00:57 pm
      Can someone more tech smart than me post the new Hitler Reacts youtube video please, it's funny as.....

      Title is hitler reacts fsg's end of season review.


      Wetting myself Debs.

      Especially when FSG talk about the new stand and say ..

      "Speed it up. I'm beginning to see through our own bullshit now!
      reddebs
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #52: May 16, 2015 01:07:11 pm

      Wetting myself Debs.

      Especially when FSG talk about the new stand and say ..

      "Speed it up. I'm beginning to see through our own bullshit now!

      There's some crackers in there mate but yeah that's a classic!
      5timesacharm
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #53: May 16, 2015 01:07:47 pm
      Can someone more tech smart than me post the new Hitler Reacts youtube video please, it's funny as.....

      Title is hitler reacts fsg's end of season review.

      For some reason it won't embed but here's the link.

      ==http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKY3scPIMd8#ws]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKY3scPIMd8#ws==

      Just don't copy the ==
      TheRedMosquito
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #54: May 16, 2015 01:32:51 pm
      Can someone more tech smart than me post the new Hitler Reacts youtube video please, it's funny as.....

      Title is hitler reacts fsg's end of season review.

      Too bad it was made by that fat c**t who runs craptalk.

      I do love those Hitler reacts videos, though. Probably the best one I've seen as it relates to LFC is "Hitler is informed of Andy Carroll's transfer fee." I cried from laughing the first time I saw it.

      youtube   /watch?v=0l2QsNAgh68

      "I haven't been this angry since Benitez went behind my back and signed Andriy Voronin" :lmao:
      redkop63
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #55: May 17, 2015 02:57:16 pm
      Let's be honest with ourselves and I hope FSG would do the same and ask ourselves a question; "will the fair play rules comes into full force." The answer  is most probably no, it wont be and it will never be. FIFA thrives on CL and FIFA needs to create the excitement in the competition by having these creme a-la-creme dream teams in the competition to churn out the revenue.

      Would FIFA like to see a CL final between two lesser known clubs? What happened to Chelsea and Man City is just a slap on the wrist. So, if FSG thought in their very own naive way that the fair play ruling will come into full force, then they will have to continue to wait because that won't happen and we, the fans will continue to live with the illusion that it will, because FSG said so.
      MIRO
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #56: May 17, 2015 03:01:42 pm
      To Change :

      Inept Manager.

      Inept Transfer Committee.

      Mr Ayres.

      waltonl4
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #57: May 17, 2015 03:07:33 pm
      Can someone more tech smart than me post the new Hitler Reacts youtube video please, it's funny as.....

      Title is hitler reacts fsg's end of season review.

      "you don't get this sh*t with baseball". :lmao:
      waltonl4
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #58: May 17, 2015 03:14:39 pm
      what we can change is very little whilst Anfield sells out each game. Roy got the boot when the crowds fell. just changing the manager will not make too much difference whilst the current philosophy is in place.
      We could have really dented UTD by keeping them out of the CL and its a once in a lifetime chance gone.
      the signings have been a disaster the team looks clueless at times and the manager is at the centre of both problems .
      Bring in Klopp and four world class players and we will see but I just dont see that happening for many reasons.
      I see Rodgers being given until December before the axe falls and I think the players smell his vunerability hence the poor perfromances.
      What we need is a magic wand and go back to Athens 2007 and tell Hicks and Gillette to F**k off and stick with DIC.Must thank David Moores and Parry for that one.
      waltonl4
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #59: May 17, 2015 03:31:43 pm
      To Change :

      Inept Manager.

      Inept Transfer Committee.

      Mr Ayres.



      how many of our current squad would get into a chelsea or man city team or even Arsenal.
      Only one or two if I am being generous so how can we even expect to be challenging for the title next year there is absolutely no chance.
      At best we might challenge for top 4 but in reality anything from 8th to 5th will be the reality.
      The whole club is now average in everything it does.
      Brian78
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #60: May 19, 2015 06:14:34 pm
      Right looks like this is where we are at

      . Owners have to go
      . Manager has to go
      . Back room staff have to go
      . About a dozen players need to go
      . A load of fans need to go
      . Stevie G is going

      Hmmm not much of a club left after that roll on next season

      When you walk.....
      ORCHARD RED
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #61: May 19, 2015 06:22:58 pm
      Right looks like this is where we are at

      . Owners have to go
      . Manager has to go
      . Back room staff have to go
      . About a dozen players need to go
      . A load of fans need to go
      . Stevie G is going





      But as always, we'll still be here!   :kop5cf8koxp6:
      MIRO
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #62: May 19, 2015 08:48:20 pm
      This isnt a Manc attack  a Cockney critique or anything like it. No outsiders having a go.

      Its from our very own.

      The Anfield Index.

      http://anfieldindex.com/14256/broken-wounded-next-liverpool.html

      BROKEN OR WOUNDED


      As grief compounds the world of most Liverpool supporters; the melancholic sense of a worthless season hangs in the rear-view mirror; only heightened by the departure of the one dependable thing Liverpool had left in Steven Gerrard.
      Gerrard symbolised everything Liverpool stood for; even in the toughest of adversity, even when everything looked bleak, he was the spark.
      He was the one to depend on.
      Without him, Liverpool look a shell, a discombobulated mess incapable of putting on a show like they did last season.

      Liverpool Football Club is stuck in limbo.

      The memories of last season; so fresh in those eager, smiling faces littered throughout the Kop when Brendan’s men walked out against Southampton on the first match-day of the season are now torn with the same anguish and bleakness that was felt when the side were left in tatters are the behest of Roy Hodgson; the same side that included Christian Poulsen, Paul Konchesky and Joe Cole.

      Readers may say exaggeration is rife in this scenario. It isn’t.


      In 2011, despite Kenny Dalglish’s slight resurgence towards the latter stages of the season, Liverpool finished 6th with 58 points. They were 22 points adrift of title winners Manchester United, and 10 points away from the final Champions League place; occupied at the time by Arsenal.

      Four years on in 2015, despite numerous individual chances to narrow the gap between Liverpool and the four richer clubs above them, Liverpool sit 5th with one game to go.
      If results go as expected, Manchester United will sit 9 points above their closest Champions League rivals in fourth spot. Chelsea will sit 25 points adrift at the top of the table.


      What’s worse is the points tally.

      Brendan Rodgers’s side; one which had £120 million pounds injected into it in the summer, currently sit only four points better off than the Liverpool side which lost Javier Mascherano and Fernando Torres, and was classed as “not being too big for relegation” from its own mediocre manager.

      Four points.
      One really has to wonder what the progress is ?

      So without attempting to draw readers into a pit of despair; to which the only light is vanishing as it drifts towards Los Angeles, where exactly do Liverpool go next? How can the side that finished 2nd last season reinvigorate themselves?

      To many, the most realistically necessary option is to sack Brendan Rodgers.
      Put plain and simple; there are much, much better options out there.

      No matter your opinion, the fact is that Brendan’s weaknesses have been exemplified and exploited this season.
      Despite the positives on show for all to see last season; brought about by the mercurial magician that was Luis Suarez, certain trends are telling of Rodgers’ tenure as manager.

      Though the manager holds the key to unlocking success from a side, there are multiple factors which offset a season. Circumstances, injuries, and more importantly; individual moments that occur throughout the season. Football is not played on paper; it is played throughout a series of ninety minute intervals, all of which require acute preparation and in-game manoeuvring. Affecting these ninety-minute intervals is what matters; changing the variables, stacking the odds, increasing your chances, that’s how football works.

      So with that in mind, the real question to be asked, as the reflection of this tattered season hovers in the background and the prospect of accepting a “par” Liverpool team lingers in the foreground, is what’s next?
      How can Liverpool change? More importantly, how can they fix a broken machine?

      Statistical anomalies are hard to predict, and even harder to create.
      Yet last season was the perfect example of a statistical anomaly; “The perfect storm”, if you will.

      One season later, it’s as if the events of 2013/14 didn’t happen; as the same flawed back line continually leaks goals; only without the firepower to carry them along. Gone is the need to rely on Suarez and Sturridge; not because of the lack of need, but rather the opposite.
      The need has only gotten greater, but the solutions have vanished amidst a flurry of injuries and a dream move to Barcelona, and Liverpool have been left relying on a twenty-year old asking for more money than he knows what to do with and a Brazilian puppeteer without any strings.

      Where Liverpool has been left too reliant upon an ageing Steven Gerrard to create the spark – that same spark he’s been creating for his entire career – they should be planning for a time when they no longer have to rely on statistical anomalies or legends of the game carrying the team. They should be attempting to implement a squad capable of challenging the big guns; and more importantly, capitalising on their failings.

      This very season was the perfect time to take advantage of a sub-par Manchester United team in transition, yet the inability to show up on the big games has cost Brendan Rodgers, and cost him dearly.
      Considering how poor the form has been on the side of Liverpool; Manchester United’s was easily worth capitalising on. The fact that there was an opportunity for Liverpool; who were the team in form at that point in time, to take the edge in the race for Top Four is emblematic of the state of the Premier League at this point in time.
      Yet it was the inability to take advantage of the shocking state of the league which has lead Liverpool to this point.

      Dig deeper; and the pre-requisites of a squad worthy of challenging the “Big Four” are there. All it takes is the right business, the right philosophy, and the right manager to make it all click together.

      The likes of Phil Coutinho and Raheem Sterling (well if he’s still around) simply need a front-man capable enough to feed off of their service and combine with them as Luis did. Mauro Icardi, Alexandre Lacazette and Luciano Vietto all come to mind when considering a realistic talisman to target.

      Lazar Markovic and Jordan Ibe are two immense talents that simply need nurturing and grooming to flourish. Being played out of position on a consistent basis is stifling the development of what could be an explosive young attack; complemented by one more attacker to fill the ranks should Raheem Sterling seek pastures anew. Pierre-Emerick Aubameyang. Felipe Anderson. Roberto Firmino. These names aren’t being pulled out of a fantasy hat; they’re ripe for the taking, and have been linked to Liverpool in the last month or two.

      Finding a replacement for Steven Gerrard is impossible, but ensuring that Liverpool have a mobile midfield capable of overrunning the Premier League is not as arduous as one might think; after all, the ingredients are already there. Jordan Henderson and Emre Can have been the life of this Liverpool side for most of the season; and complemented with the immense talent of Mateo Kovacic, Granit Xhaka or Geoffrey Kondogbia, they can be tasked with being the engine of a Liverpool side filled with the quick movement and blistering pace.

      Meanwhile, most people seem to be forgetting the balance Liverpool possessed earlier in the season on the flanks. The Spanish duo of Javier Manquillo and Alberto Moreno fit each other perfectly; balancing out defensive solidity on the right with marauding flair on the left. Add the stable presence of Mamadou Sakho and experience of Martin Skrtel, and suddenly the prospect of defending: especially with a defensive midfielder to provide solidity (see Victor Wanyama, Maxime Gonalons or the aforementioned Geoffrey Kondogbia as potential candidates for the role) is fraught with much less danger.

      All of this, however, is postulating and pondering over hypotheticals.
      What is real is the 62 points we’ve amassed so far this season.
      What’s real are the three points dropped at home, supposedly in form, to a Manchester United team that was ready for the taking.
      What’s real are the 8 points out of 9 dropped against West Bromwich Albion, Hull City and Crystal Palace in the last month.

      This season will undoubtedly be remembered as a defining moment of Liverpool Football Club’s recent history; not necessarily regarding their choice of manager come the summer-time, but regarding how they fix a broken machine. The parts – as I hope to have illustrated in this article – are there, they just need putting together, coupled with a few new additions.

      It is obviously more complicated than has been made out in this article; questions of financial status, a competitive market and whether or not Liverpool currently possesses the correct system are all important factors.

      But take a step back, and maybe it is as simple as putting the parts together and seeing what happens. Football’s not won on paper, after all.

      How does this post make you feel?


         
         
      FL Red
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #63: May 19, 2015 08:55:50 pm
      Long article is really long.
      RedWilly
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #64: May 19, 2015 09:16:51 pm
      The owners aren't going anytime soon, so for me they either have to change their policy on transfers/wages (or even just relax it in some instances) OR if they aren't going to change their policy then they have to employ the absolute best possible staff around to work on the transfer committee and as manager.

      The policy effectively ties one hand behind the back of the manager, so to maximise our chances of winning it stands to reason that those involved with the committee must be absolutely brilliant at what they do in order to offset that, and a manager who is going to extract the absolute maximum from the players. Based on the evidence since the committee has been in place I'd that has quite obviously not the case in terms of them being anything close to 'brilliant'.

      Secondly, we all know FSG aren't going to go out there and get the best scouts in the world (aren't ours all from Blackburn?) or the best manager in the world, because that would cost them a considerable sum of money, although I'd say it's less risky from their perspective then the alternative.

      The alternative is changing the policy, allow the manager greater freedom in the market to get the players he wants and also go above and beyond at times what we define to be the 'value' of a player for the sake of getting in a quality player that the manager wants. I'd also say the incentivised contracts that we apparently offer need to stop and fall back in line with the market, based on the last 2 years or so where we seem to be in negotiations forever and a day, before inevitably losing out on the player. We'd be able to once again attract quality players, whilst the name of Liverpool still has some pull, before we slip too far away. Another advantage here is that it also gives increased accountability, which from our fans perspective would make everything a lot easier, but we don't know the internal workings of the club, so that accountability may already exist internally.

      Bottom line is, FSG have spent the last 5 years cutting costs, but now there's nothing left to cut, they need to start spending and spending big.
      bigmick
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #65: May 19, 2015 09:22:41 pm
      How about another thing which needs to change is the way we support our club as well? In the ground it's like a f*cking morgue, every single set of away fans that visit Anfield outsing us. On the forums as soon as we lose a game we berate the manager like screaming bitches, lambasting him for so-called tactical misdemeanours that we in our wisdom are aware of but which have totally missed his notice. Players who suffer a dip in form during the match suffer howls of derision, you can visibly see them retreating into their shell under the pressure of the whole thing. We have been caught and overtaken i the boardroom, caught and overtaken in the financial steaks, caught and overtaken in league titles won, caught and overtaken on the pitch, caught and overtaken in spending, and caught and overtaken on the terraces and in the way we show support for our team.

      We cannot control any of the above other than the last one, and if we are fifth best in the league come the end of the season it is a safe bet that the players are outperforming the fans in terms of where we sit. 
      MIRO
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #66: May 19, 2015 11:04:57 pm
      ..... caught and overtaken in the financial steaks .....

      "Have you been to a Harvester before Mick "?

       ;D

       ;)
      igor zidane
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #67: May 19, 2015 11:18:49 pm
      How about another thing which needs to change is the way we support our club as well? In the ground it's like a f*cking morgue, every single set of away fans that visit Anfield outsing us. On the forums as soon as we lose a game we berate the manager like screaming bitches, lambasting him for so-called tactical misdemeanours that we in our wisdom are aware of but which have totally missed his notice. Players who suffer a dip in form during the match suffer howls of derision, you can visibly see them retreating into their shell under the pressure of the whole thing. We have been caught and overtaken i the boardroom, caught and overtaken in the financial steaks, caught and overtaken in league titles won, caught and overtaken on the pitch, caught and overtaken in spending, and caught and overtaken on the terraces and in the way we show support for our team.

      We cannot control any of the above other than the last one, and if we are fifth best in the league come the end of the season it is a safe bet that the players are outperforming the fans in terms of where we sit.

      Think we should F**k it off Michael and start again , make a new club . Its not ours anymore mate .
      zanwalk
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      Re: Something Has To Change
      Reply #68: May 26, 2015 08:21:16 pm
      "Have you been to a Harvester before Mick "?

       ;D


       ;)


      All the right letters, not necessarily in the right order.

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