Which players are actually good enough for LFC

The fact that I haven't seen one post that I can agree with alongside the fact that it's a debate probably says it all really.

u wot, not mine?

My opinion, Coutinho is the only player I rate. May be light weighted but still has skills and an eye for passes and space. His contribution is easily more noticeable alongside better players around him.

Sturridge is another but he just is always wrapped in bubble wrap.

I honestly don't believe this squad (without Sturridge) is good enough to qualify for the CL consistently.  I do think that one of the problems we have had over the last few years has been we have tried to run before we can walk and then when we fall down, we throw the plan out the window and have to start again.

I think our ambitions have been too high for the players we have had and maybe that's why we are now on our 4th manager in 5 years, or is it 5 managers in 6 years ( I'm starting to lose count!). We win three games and Klopp is then asked are we going to win the league, expectation is just too high, while the reality of the problems we have to overcome just get brushed aside. 

Think this is a fair assessment mate, it was like the "can we dream thread" our expectations get carried away far too quickly.

In terms of who is good enough from our squad, if I'm going to be brutally honest:

Good enough:

Sturridge
Coutinho
Sakho

They'd be the only 3 that I'd be happy to build the squad around, I know people will point to Sakho's last game which was easily his worst ever but I have seen enough over his time with us to see if you put a proper leader alongside him he could easily be up to standard. Clearly it's a massive issue when 2 of those 3 are also the most injury prone players we have.

Squad players good enough to rotate into the first XI:

Henderson - Massively over-rated by our fanbase
Lucas - Stamina issues, on his day he's the best in the league but his low drops far too low to maintain a first team place
Clyne - Doesn't offer enough going forward to be an absolute cert for first XI place but he's not too far away
Moreno - I like him but there are certainly better
Skrtel - Always underwhelms, another that is over-rated by our fans
Milner - Again, his time out of the side made him a better player again, a decent squad option
Lallana - Started the year brightly but has fallen back to the level of last year and this year there can be no excuses for him
Lovren - Improved this season but more because the emphasis wasn't on him than him actually becoming commanding

Not good enough:

Benteke - Probably the one most will disagree with and there's a chance he could improve with training.
Origi - He did well in a couple of games, looks better out wide, but again if we're honest he really isn't up to it
Allen - We're in such a terrible situation that I'm thinking he should start, that's when we know we're desperate
Mignolet - Diabolical, it's a travesty he's been our number 1 for this long
Bogdan - Still think he could be better than Migs, but that doesn't make him good enough, not even close
Toure - I like Kolo but his time to move on has come
Enrique - Strange to find himself here, but with as long out as he has there must be convincing reasons for that

Jury still out:

Firmino - Can't believe he's been as poor as he has, judged on only his time with us he should be on his bike but there's more there
Teixeira - Should be given his chance, he deserves it
Can - Squad player at worst, think he could develop into a first team player but he's being asked sooner than is probably right
Ibe - Signs he could make a first team player but if he doesn't make it, then I don't think a squad option is right, but our only winger
Gomez - Loved the look of this lad, gutted about his injury
Sinclair - Probably moving on anyway
Ings - Biggest loss to us in my opinion, would have change our entire dynamic

Overall massive work to be done and I honestly believe to get us close to "title contenders" we need 4 solid top class players and that would hopefully drag a few of the squad players levels up. That doesn't mean they then become first team choices though and should be looked to be improved upon in the future. As it stands I'd rather watch kids developing than watching the usual suspects fail.

Sturridge gets listed as quality yet he can't get a run of 3 games in a row. Odd.

I think we have a lot of players that are good enough only problem being too many of them are complimentary and rely on working with other stronger players. We don't have ANY players that will hoist the team on their back and drag them to get a result. That's where we really hurt and that's why the degradation of skill and subsequent exit of Steven Gerrard has hurt so much, couple that with Suarez leaving and we are in a really tough spot right now for true, quality leadership.

The one player that has performed on a rather consistent basis has been Sturridge with the downside being the fact that he cannot remain fit.

This thread is a summation of just how poorly the previous manager did on the market.

The rest are squad members, or players that could be a good fit with better talent surrounding them as almost all of them lack the consistency needed for any of them to be considered top players at current moment in time.

Last season we didnt have a striker. Plus an increasingly lame duck, direction-less manager, who we also started this season with.

I'm not saying we have a fantastic squad, we don't. But its nowhere near as bad as the doom-mongers on here saying. There are people on here literally saying we should clear out the entire squad except for 2 players. If thats not knee-jerking, what is?

We've got a manager who's just come in and is experimenting with different line-ups as he gets to know his players and his new league. He is also having to deal with a lot of injuries. Its not that surprising its been up and down. But it is worth remembering there have been ups as well as downs.

There have been promising signs as well as set-backs. We need to give the manager a bit of time to see what he can do with these players, rather than calling for the heads of 90% of the squad

The problem is that we have too many average players in the side. Too many 6 or 7 out of 10 players. There's no 8s or 9s, beyond Sturridge and he's made of crisps. Let's turn the question on its head and ask which players would get in City's or Arsenal's team and realistically, quite a few. Henderson, Coutinho, Sakho, Milner, Clyne, Lallana. There's six first teamers right there. Add in a decent left back and Centre back, a World Class Goalkeeper, Midfielder that can score, and a prolific Striker, and we've got a team as good as Arsenal.  Better than United.

Then add Benteke in to the mix, who should be used as a super-sub impact player, and Can, Ibe and Origi who are all still learning their trade, with Ings and Gomez still to come back, and we've probably got a stronger bench than anyone other than City. All we need to do is get five top players in and we're capable of winning the league, especially if we keep Sturridge fit.

We still binning 3/4 of the squad after beating the league leaders then?

As stated before, we have lots of great players capable of beating any team in the league. We are adjusting to a new style of play, the high intensity of which is going to affect form for the considerable future.

Suggesting to 'bin the lot' and that only 2 are 'good enough' after a few bad games is knee jerking to the nth degree which needs to stop.

We still binning 3/4 of the squad after beating the league leaders then?

As stated before, we have lots of great players capable of beating any team in the league. We are adjusting to a new style of play, the high intensity of which is going to affect form for the considerable future.

Suggesting to 'bin the lot' and that only 2 are 'good enough' after a few bad games is knee jerking to the nth degree which needs to stop.

I think you've struck a chord there. We're all being a little knee jerk since Klopp's come in. We beat Chelsea and City and suddenly Klopp has got an apparently 'average' team playing better, and then poor results against Newcastle and a woeful performance against Watford and we need to ship the majority out.

I think the vast majority of the squad should stay and I have absolute trust that Klopp will identify where improvements need to be made between now and the summer (don't think we'll see too much action in January personally) and I reckon he'll be pretty ruthless in shipping out any that become surplus to requirements.

I know this is a forum and the whole point is for us to share our opinions, but I'm perfectly content in the fact we've got a brilliant manager who is working with these guys every day, and I trust his opinion completely so I've stopped worrying about who might or might not be good enough. I am looking forward to seeing what happens in the summer though!

It is a tricky one this. I'll start with simply not good enough...

Allen
Kolo
Randall (has looked out of his depth in every game I've seen him)
Mignolet

Everyone else is a decent squad member, minus Couts and Studge, who are our best 2.

I feel next season with Ings, Gomez and Flanagan fit we will see a more balanced squad too.

I am surprised so many have not mentioned Flanagan, we have missed him big time.

His desire is second to none.

Can't wait til he's back..

The one player that has performed on a rather consistent basis has been Sturridge

I would suggest consistent isn't really the best word to use here. That would imply he hadn't been laid up for 85% of the season.

Done well when he HAS played for us though, mate.

Those who are not good enough Allen, Lallana(no end product).

Other than that, it's clear we lack quality in the squad. Clyne, Moreno, Can, Lucas are very good players to have, they do the job well but they rarely boss a game(except Lucas).

We need leaders but Coutinho and Hendo are not yet. Firmino and Benteke have confidence issues, they are clearly good enough for us.
Can can become an excellent player but who is his mentor here? Hendo? Lucas?  We lack experience and creativity in midfield. Our squad is not average, but it lacks some great players.

Those who are not good enough Allen, Lallana(no end product).

Other than that, it's clear we lack quality in the squad. Clyne, Moreno, Can, Lucas are very good players to have, they do the job well but they rarely boss a game(except Lucas).

We need leaders but Coutinho and Hendo are not yet. Firmino and Benteke have confidence issues, they are clearly good enough for us.
Can can become an excellent player but who is his mentor here? Hendo? Lucas?  We lack experience and creativity in midfield. Our squad is not average, but it lacks some great players.

I wouldn't expect fullbacks to 'boss a game'. I actually think Moreno and certainly Clyne can and will play at the highest level.

I'm surprised to see Clyne mentioned as good enough, he is solid but I'm not sure that's enough for a fullback at a top side now.

For modern title challenging team (not to mention European elite teams) you generally expect a lot more from one or both fullbacks then gets up and down and can defend. He doesn't really have much guile to his play near their area.

He's no Zabaleta, Cole, Evra, Kolarov etc

I suppose you could say Azpilicueta but we're not looking to play that way.

For me is he is one of the best fullbacks in the league this season but I understand criticism. It really is such a subjective position based on one's footballing tastes.
It is worth noting that nearly every fan hates atleast of their own team's fullbacks though (with a few notable exceptions - Bayern Munich - or any other team which dominates a league so much that they never expect to get attacked) and rates their rivals' fullbacks. They either are attacking and thus get blamed for almost every goal (red arrow tw*ts abound here), or they defensively minded and don't contribute enough.

I honestly don't know what the perfect balance is but, like the position of goalkeeper, unless they are genuinely world class, they are never quite good enough. Its only after they are gone we can really judge clearly what we had. 

Much depends on the type of team you're trying to build. All the Chelsea lot in here really rate Clyne, no doubt the Arsenal fans would prefer Moureno.

Much depends on the type of team you're trying to build. All the Chelsea lot in here really rate Clyne, no doubt the Arsenal fans would prefer Moureno.

Exactly.

Imagine if you will an evil genie;
"I grant your wish of playing for the team you have supported since a little boy, but you will have to play fullback."
Wish corrupted 

All the Chelsea lot in here really rate Clyne, no doubt the Arsenal fans would prefer Moureno.

if there is an award for the most inappropriate weird comment on this forum this would win it hands down WTF is this all about.

if there is an award for the most inappropriate weird comment on this forum this would win it hands down WTF is this all about.

His post made sense in context with my post. Ie - full backs are underrated by their own fans and overrated by oppositions. He particularly was making reference to team styles.

I feel answering this topic will change from week to week.😉

Much depends on the type of team you're trying to build. All the Chelsea lot in here really rate Clyne, no doubt the Arsenal fans would prefer Moureno.

I know what you're on about Mick.
It would be the same down the road at the Prince mate .... but they do change their teams like they change their underpants or have times changed ?

if there is an award for the most inappropriate weird comment on this forum this would win it hands down WTF is this all about.

Hmmm. You see, Chelsea play quite a defensive style and normally their fullbacks don't get over the half-way line. Because of that, most Chelsea fans crave fullbacks who are good defenders. Hence, most of the Chelsea supporters I speak to have Clyne down as one of the best right backs in the league.

Now. Arsenal on the other hand play a more expansive style. For their fans (I don't know as many of those) it wouldn't surprise me if they hanker after Moreno. You see, teams which play to a certain style hanker after players which fit into that style. Many apologies I thought it was pretty obvious what my point was, obviously not .

No problem though, I'm always happy to provide an explanation if someone doesn't understand something.

I know what you're on about Mick.
It would be the same down the road at the Prince mate .... but they do change their teams like they change their underpants or have times changed ?

No mate most of the fans of the various clubs we get in here and pretty die hard, but also pretty sensible too. We're quite lucky in that while we have a Chelsea following which is the biggest of all, we get many Liverpool fans in, Arsenal, Tottenham, Wimbledon, the odd stray random (Blackburn, Derby, Norwich etc). Even most of our Manc fans (and there are a few) are fairly decent people, up for a bit of banter etc. We also have one Southampton fan who's pretty dedicated, and a few Everton. All good fun though in the most part, it's not exactly the mean streets in SW19 as you know yourself mate.