Joe Hart - should Liverpool go for him?

The usual crowd.
The ones that you never hear from unless we lose or get a bad result.
The ones who call our players cu*ts, wankers, useless etc.

It's there in the match thread, and it's there in the player thread.


Opinions are great, but opinions dressed up as facts are bollocks.

We've got a young bloke, playing his first few games for us in a new league, in a new country, with new teammates, and some are ready to write the lad off after barely a dozen games.

'Keeper is the most visible position, and the fact is that all 'keepers make mistakes, make bad judgement calls and make errors and because of how visible they are, mistakes etc get highlighted much more than a misplaced pass from an outfield player.

He may, or may not be the answer, but anyone who pretends to know after so few games is talking out of their arse.

Time, and only that, will tell us, not some kneejerking f**k knuckle who got his opinion from a Neville brother.

And just for the record if you want to talk about veiled digs try looking at your own posts. Could quite easily have been referring to me as I've spoke about the GK situation. But it was veiled so I wouldn't know.

No, people. Not just you. There are people on other forums and social media besides you.

Most cantankerous person I've never met. Get over yourself.

Don't start banging on like you F***ing know me fella.

Fact is, your nose was out of joint because you thought I was talking about you.
Out of a forum of hundreds.

And I'm the one who needs to get over myself? 

This thread is a F***ing joke, and that's the truth.
Barely a dozen games and the knives are coming out.

Like I said earlier; most knowledgeable supporters in the world my arse.
It might have been true once, but not these days, with sh*te like this thread being promoted as a serious subject.

Never in all my days have I come across a group of so called LFC supporters who are so relentlessly negative, to the point where a win thread has a dozen pages, and a loss thread has 20-40.

Don't start banging on like you f**king know me fella.

What?

Most cantankerous person I've never met. Get over yourself.

I'm going to leave it there. All the best.

I think it is very hard to fathom winning a league with a young premier league rookie such as Karius. If you asked us before the season started would we be happy where we are now in the table most would say YES.

That being said with the great start and the idea of winning the league being where it was/is the past month rookie mistakes and nerves can make some supporters wonder why we did not go out and get a ready-made #1 instead of purchasing another "project"

It's a totally valid argument but I would say the manager does not look at things on a 3 week/3 month type basis and might be of been a bit surprised as we were that a few weeks ago we were sitting at #1.

The squad is going to have to learn how to win, the keeper is going to have to learn his place and this team is going to have ups/downs as it learns how to be a real winner and getting Joe Hart would be nothing more than a short term fix for a long term problem.

I trust the manager knows what he is doing and any decision he makes will be the right one.

If you bin off Karius now to the bench or the ressies you might as well just sell him because his confidence at this club will be gone for good.

I think whether or not Joe Hart is the solution probably isn't the question as I'm pretty sure we won't be buying him. The question short term is do we stick with Karius, and if we do where will we be come January? If he and we carry on in the sort of form which has seen us pick up one point from a trip to Bournemouth and a home game with West Ham combined, with the greatest respect it won't make any difference who we sign because by then we'll be going for a top four slot at best.

As far as Karius is concerned I think the next game is absolutely crucial. If he plays well there I'd stick with him, but any sort of f*** up and I'd be reluctant to see him line up at Goodison as he'll get destroyed by their fans. I do take peoples point when they say Mignolet is no better (I personally think he is by a small margin but anyway) but at least Mignolet is used to the scrutiny, used to being called sh!te if you like so maybe in a better position to deal with it. Unfortunately for Karius his ill advised decision to debate with pundits in a public forum has put him under even greater scrutiny and pressure, and his form looks to me to be in danger of completely unraveling. I understand some posters wish to be loyal to Jürgen and his signings, but I've never been one for pretending the sky is a different colour to what I ccan see with my own eyes. If it looks like a duck, waddles like a duck and quacks like a duck then there seems little point to me in pretending it's a swan. Karius at the moment is the muckiest and ugliest of ducks and he is giving us a real issue.

Longer term if Karius doesn't work out, I've seen enough of Mignolet to know he isn't the answer either. I'm no goalkeeping expert, but quite why we always seem to end up with one of the worst three or four goalkeepers in the league I'm unsure. Why don't we just go and buy someone who we KNOW is pretty good? Frazer Forster, Jack Butland, Joe Hart, the fella from Burnley, someone of that ilk? Then there's the keepers abroad, we played a German team last season (not Dortmund) and their keeper was excellent. Jürgen said he was one of the best keepers in their league, why not look at him?

I don't know why we always seem to make it difficult, but with successive managers and teams we always seem to have a goalie who gives the opposition half a goal start before we kick off.   

Agree . The keeper from Augsberg impressed me at Anfield . Confident, decisive and looked the part. Seen him in a few more games and he was the same , had a cool head when they were under a lot of pressure. I'd go for Hart but it's not gona happen.

The fact that we have a thread asking if we should buy Joe f**king Hart, the perennial f**k up merchant, and shampoo aficionado speaks volumes.

Hasn't stopped you Swabbering all over the thread though has it? Your making a right c**t out of yourself. I mean that in the nicest , possible way .

Isn't it curious how when an individual posts an opinion that is contrary to the view of some posters, they respond with a barrage of swear words and abuse to put down said opinion?

Any chance of growing up a little and allowing others the opportunity to voice an opinion?

We all get a bit passionate here, but seriously...

He struggled the last couple seasons at City, he's struggled for England and he's struggling at Torino.

What's the point in another sideways step?...

I'm sure if Klopp wanted Joe he would have gone in for him...

Karius is our number one with the support of Klopp, I don't think for a minute Klopp will drop Karius... No chance..

Give the lad a chance... 11 games in recovering from a broken hand too..

11 games... Jeez.

This thread is incredible.

Joe Hart 

Those of us saying we're prepared to give Karius a chance are going to have our opinions examined closely though if he f***s up at Middlesboro as well. Next game after that is Everton away, and if he goes there still vulnerable, still involved in a slanging match with the media we are a goal adrift before we even start.

In many ways it's admirable to say "give him time", "don't judge too early" and all that, but Karius is in my eyes very lucky that it's Migs who is the back-up. If we had even a bog standard but pretty reliable back up to consider then he'd be under huge pressure, from me as much as anyone else. As it is, whatever f*** ups he's making (and there are a few) I couldn't hand on heart say with any certainty that Migs wouldn't have f***** it up just the same, so we may as well stick with that we've got.

Up till now in his Liverpool career though he has looked IMHO very marginally better than Migs, but in the last couple of games significantly worse. Unless he improves quite a lot and straight away, Jürgen is going to have to make a very tough call. It's easy leaving players out who somebody else spunked money on, but when it's your own call it's significantly harder. If we have serious aspirations of IMHO even a top four slot, we need a goalie who is performing significantly better than Karius has in the last two games. Hopefully he can be that goalie, if not even Migs up to his usual tricks is a better bet.     

I think Joe Hart could be a decent option in January, all he needs is to regain his confidence, the ability is still there which I honestly can't say about our 2 clowns.

Beyond the obvious goalkeeping issues there is something very wrong with the team at the moment, it seems that early confidence and energy has left them. Henderson has regressed to the backwards passing player of last season and Firminio has become very poor.

West Ham was always going to be a very Tough game. Have said that two points I would like to make Joe Hart is still a Quality goal keeper who we should buy...

My second point is sometime I have touch on before Klopp has set up his team (attack wise that is) to be at it's best when we are playing Firmino,Coutinho, Mane and Lallana on the pitch at the same time. When we don't have that we find life hard.... We need players that can step in and fill those rolls, and at present we lack that

If Joe Hart was as good as some make him out to be on here he still would be in between the sticks at City.

A little like Stones he's English a "lion" so he must automatically be very good.

You mean in the way Mata was no good enough for Mourinho at Chelsea, but is one of his best players at man Utd??

Bringing in an almost 30 year old, average goalkeeper who is on more than £100.000 a week isn't the answer. I think there's no chance we will get a new goalkeeper in January. Even if Klopp would want to bring in someone else, who in their right mind would let their first choice goalkeeper go in the middle of the season? Karius should get the season to show his worth. Klopp might look for a new one in the summer, but who do we bring in then?

The top keepers are all settled at their respective top clubs and I doubt they'll leave for us. The only top class GK that we could maybe get is Jan Oblak. Atletico are struggling and Simeone hasn't extended his contract. Maybe some of the players want out when he's gone? But, even he would be a gamble as he is used to playing with a low defensive line, not a high line like we do.

Then there's the bracket below that. There are three options:

1. We massively overpay for an other average English goalkeeper like Forster, Heaton, ... All of which won't suit our style of play and won't be an improvement on what we already have.

2. We bring in an other young, promising goalkeeper from one of the other top leagues, who will take time to adapt to the league and our style of play. (I have been thinking about some experienced GK's (27-30) in the other leagues, but struggling to think of anyone who would be an immediate improvement.) That would put us into a similar situation that we find ourselves in at the moment. I can't think of many young, foreign goalkeepers that have come into the Premier League and hit the ground running.

Just for fun I'll throw in a few names of goalkeepers I like: Sergio Rico (Sevilla), Mattia Perin (Genoa), Oliver Baumann (Hoffenheim)

3. I know that this could potentially cost us a title this season. We give Karius some credit, hope he comes good and lives up to all the praise he got in Germany where he played well consistently over three seasons. He was highly rated by journalists, fellow players and fans. He was voted 2nd best behind Neuer in a poll amongst the Bundesliga players and he was voted 3rd, level with Horn (Cologne), in another big poll. All his statistics were good too. So what's wrong with him? That's something that's been bothering me a bit lately. Is it the pressure of playing for a big club like Liverpool? Is he still worried about his hand injury? Is he trying too hard to impress and making the wrong decisions because of that? I just hope he gets his head sorted soon.

I'm not really sure what side I'm on with regards to taking him out. There are good arguments to take him out of the spotlight for a bit, but also to let him stay in goal. Anyway, Klopp has supposedly already come out and said he won't be dropping him, so that's that.

After reading some other post here I realize that there is another upside to buying Joe Hart... Most here will admit that he is an improvement on what we have. Well Even if he is slightly better he will help raise the standards of Karius and migs will he not?...

After reading some other post here I realize that there is another upside to buying Joe Hart... Most here will admit that he is an improvement on what we have. Well Even if he is slightly better he will help raise the standards of Karius and migs will he not?...

Is that really what we should aim for though? Even if we have to look beyond Karius should we not look for something beyond
Slightly better?

It's like going for lunch and a colleague says to you

What you brought for lunch today?
Oh a 3 month out of date sandwich
I've got a 6 week out of date one here if you'd rather have that

I agree that Hart is probably an improvement on what we have, but I'm not very keen on this one. He's not very good with his feet (indeed he was one of the worst I've ever seen with his kicks at the Maracanã a few years ago) and very possibly past his best.

I like to believe that Karius will improve, and really hope that will be the case.

However, if we're talking about experienced keepers, I'd much rather consider Diego Alves ahead of Hart. Valencia have been poor for a while now, don't think it should be extremely difficult to get him.

This thread is incredible.

Joe Hart 

Ticks a majority box for some he plays for Innngerrrlund!!!

Never mind he's bang average.

This is happening a lot I reckon. There are people saying that anyone who is criticising the goalie situation are getting their material from Sky now.

Seems to be the new trend in here at the moment.

I have to question whether the knee-jerking is actually coming from those who are getting so hot under the collar at the first sign of criticism of our shaky keeper?

Regardless of what Carra or any other bugger in the media has had to say (and I haven't read or listened t any of their opinions because I was so grumpy after the match yesterday).

For me (and it's an opinion I've held from pretty much the minute he arrived)

- He looks too small to be an EPL keeper, I think he is 6 "2 but he plays MUCH MUCH smaller.
- also, I would expect a shorter keeper to be more aggressive when the ball is in the air (because they have to be)
- He doesn't claim crosses, I'm not sure that he ever will tbh, he looks like a rabbit in headlights when the ball is played in to a crowded box
- He doesn't seem particularly vocal
- Given the way Klopps's teams set up and the relative shakiness of our defence for several years we desperately need a keeper who can give confidence to our back four. So far Karius isn't it.
- He has been indecisive so far, rooted to his line on a good few occasions
- He looks very comfortable on the ball, a definite upgrade on Migs in this respect but I can't help but think "so what" because I want him to be able to do all the other stuff first before I even look at his passing ability.
- As for shot stopping ability, I haven't seen anything to suggest he is as good as Mignolet in this respect although it's quite a short sample of games to get a good grasp on this


As for the thread title and Joe Hart. I'd love it but if Klopp wanted him I'm sure he would gone for him in the summer when he became available. In the mean-time fingers crossed Karius can string together a few solid games and rebuild some confidence in his game. Personally I'd give the gloves back to Mignolet.

As a so called "fan" you are an absolute embarrassment, who does little except whine and whinge about our players, so I have no desire whatsoever to interact with you.

I trust that clears things up for you.

OK superfan, how's the non interaction working out for you?

I'm sure if Klopp wanted Joe he would have gone in for him...

Karius is our number one with the support of Klopp, I don't think for a minute Klopp will drop Karius... No chance..

Give the lad a chance... 11 games in recovering from a broken hand too..

11 games... Jeez.

If he's "recovering" still then maybe he shouldn't be playing but rehabbing. Otherwise if you are playing (starting) you better be up to the task.

Ticks a majority box for some he plays for Innngerrrlund!!!

Never mind he's bang average.

Bang average is right about Hart.
Not a bad 'keeper, but not great either.

I just can't believe that so many people are saying get rid or replace after so few games for Karius.

He's made some good saves/stops, and he's had a few cock ups.
Every 'keeper does.

Give him time to prove his worth, one way or the other, instead of spanking it to sly sports bullshit (not you, just in general)

Seems to be the new trend in here at the moment.

I have to question whether the knee-jerking is actually coming from those who are getting so hot under the collar at the first sign of criticism of our shaky keeper?

Regardless of what Carra or any other bugger in the media has had to say (and I haven't read or listened t any of their opinions because I was so grumpy after the match yesterday).

For me (and it's an opinion I've held from pretty much the minute he arrived)

- He looks too small to be an EPL keeper, I think he is 6 "2 but he plays MUCH MUCH smaller.
- also, I would expect a shorter keeper to be more aggressive when the ball is in the air (because they have to be)
- He doesn't claim crosses, I'm not sure that he ever will tbh, he looks like a rabbit in headlights when the ball is played in to a crowded box
- He doesn't seem particularly vocal
- Given the way Klopps's teams set up and the relative shakiness of our defence for several years we desperately need a keeper who can give confidence to our back four. So far Karius isn't it.
- He has been indecisive so far, rooted to his line on a good few occasions
- He looks very comfortable on the ball, a definite upgrade on Migs in this respect but I can't help but think "so what" because I want him to be able to do all the other stuff first before I even look at his passing ability.
- As for shot stopping ability, I haven't seen anything to suggest he is as good as Mignolet in this respect although it's quite a short sample of games to get a good grasp on this


As for the thread title and Joe Hart. I'd love it but if Klopp wanted him I'm sure he would gone for him in the summer when he became available. In the mean-time fingers crossed Karius can string together a few solid games and rebuild some confidence in his game. Personally I'd give the gloves back to Mignolet.

Quite right.

You don't need to listen to a chuckle brother or watch any 'analysis' from Sky to realise that Karius has cost us important points over the last two games.

The desperation of some to smear fellow Reds and pigeon hole them into a Neville/Sky umbrella to justify their superfanism is typical of some of the f**king bells on here.

FWIW, I think Karius should be dropped (using my own eyes, not any other persons opinion). Just like if any other outfield players form had dropped, I'd call for somebody to replace him. Moreno anyone!

I think he needs taking out and saving from himself for future development. Klopp may not think so, fine. I can live with that. But surely one is allowed to express their own opinion on a forum with out certain posters losing their sh*t over it.

Heaven forbid Gary f**king Neville thinks Gerrard was a good player, we'd all be in agreement with him. Feeling dirty now. Doesn't change my opinion of Gerrard though.