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      Klopp or the players?

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      Brian78
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      Klopp or the players?
      Jan 21, 2017 03:19:00 pm
      I once defended Brendan Rodgers on here after a bad result. When most were knifing away at him I said the players let him down. Once they cross the line its up to them to perform.

      Most replies stated that he picked the players and they played as he instructed ( tactically not bad on purpose).

      So now I ask who is to blame for our terrible form this month? Players or klopp? Players letting manager down or he picks the team and tactics?

      Answer is a choice of 2 don't hide your answer by introducing owners, directors  kitmam, coach driver or the building company that threw up the new stand!!
      « Last Edit: Jan 21, 2017 07:24:40 pm by JD »
      Beerbelly
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #1: Jan 21, 2017 03:28:32 pm
      Klopp.
      bigmick
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #2: Jan 21, 2017 03:32:34 pm
      Neither. The players are doing their absolute best, and Jürgen has performed a miracle to have this squad right up there challenging for as long as he has.

      Unfortunately we are running out of gas, inspiration and able bodies. I suppose you could argue that in that case it's Klopps fault for not strengthening the squad but I think that's a separate argument. As it stands, the players we do have and the manager deserve credit IMHO for having a right good go at it so far. My fear is that there is a real chance that we are about to witness the wheels coming off a bit, the only positive about that if it does happen is that we'll know next time (hopefully).
      ruthcity
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #3: Jan 21, 2017 03:45:00 pm
      Both. This club is not made up of one moving part.
      Brian78
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #4: Jan 21, 2017 03:47:17 pm
      Both. This club is not made up of one moving part.

      When it suits the agendas perhaps?
      TheleftpegofRayKennedy
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #5: Jan 21, 2017 03:47:30 pm

      I get the impression that Klopp has wilted a bit lately.  He seems to have a bit less fizz about him, and spends more time seated than in 2016.  My impression (might be way off the mark of course) is that he's finding it hard to keep the lads' heads up, and that one or two have lost confidence in his system.   He also seems bloody stubborn in sticking to his game plan in the face of all evidence that it isn't succeeding.  We've seen that a few times.  Subs on too late, not changing the attacking gameplan, sticking with players who aren't contributing. 
      HScRed1
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #6: Jan 21, 2017 03:53:39 pm
      Got to be Klopp we and he should know the attritional rate of the way he wants to play so too not bring in reinforcements when the money is there available, I cant really get my head around that approach.
      And players are always available, eg all we heard was Dahoud in the summer - whats happened now when he is still available?

      Its good to have belief in your players but a bit of realism goes a long way that our squad is weak and thin.
      ruthcity
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #7: Jan 21, 2017 03:55:00 pm
      When it suits the agendas perhaps?

      I bet some of us will swing it depending on each person's agenda. I'd take a more balanced stance with the truth somewhere in between. Each has some blame to take as they are not mutually exclusive to the match outcome.
      reddebs
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #8: Jan 21, 2017 04:02:12 pm
      We're just a sh*t, nothing club with no future.  No point having players or a manager.

      Just get shut of them all.
      Frankly, Mr Shankly
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #9: Jan 21, 2017 04:06:21 pm
      Klopp had a bad day and his obsessions with Can is now inexplicable. The only player to start all three in the week - someone's taking the piss.

      TheleftpegofRayKennedy
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #10: Jan 21, 2017 04:10:42 pm
      Your sentiments are noble, Debs, and I'm with you - its too easy to knee-jerk when we lose.  (That's if I'm right in reading your comments as sarcasm!).

      Too many of us are scattergunning blame, for sure, but I'm always on the psoitive side of the street and even I can see signs its going wobbly.
      ruthcity
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #11: Jan 21, 2017 04:12:14 pm
      We're just a sh*t, nothing club with no future.  No point having players or a manager.

      Just get shut of them all.

      Don't give up. That's the last thing we need now. When you walk through a storm hold your head up high. At the end of the storm, is a golden sky. You'll never walk alone. We walk with you.
      Magillionare
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #12: Jan 21, 2017 04:13:56 pm
      Klopp isn't putting out the best team we have.
      The players aren't performing as well as they can.
      The fans in the crowd aren't singing as loud as they should be.
      The people on here (including me) aren't being as positive about what overall has been a good season so far
      Referees and linesmen can't do their jobs.
      It's too bloody cold and I have a slight hangover still.

      F**k. Sake.
      reddebs
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #13: Jan 21, 2017 04:14:40 pm
      Don't give up. That's the last thing we need now. When you walk through a storm hold your head up high. At the end of the storm, is a golden sky. You'll never walk alone. We walk with you.

      Cheers mate, I know  :gt-happyup:
      bigmick
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #14: Jan 21, 2017 04:14:50 pm
      The reality I think in football is that the difference between great performances and poor ones is never quite as much as it appears. It can be passing delivered a fraction of a second earlier with perhaps one less touch, more fizz on it as you're confident the receiver will control it, a more penetrating runner as he's confident he'll be seen etc. We haven't gone from being a good side to a bad one overnight, but it's vital that we rediscover our mojo and soon because if we don't, the season could be over in 3/4 weeks. 
      Brian78
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #15: Jan 21, 2017 04:19:41 pm
      We're just a sh*t, nothing club with no future.  No point having players or a manager.

      Just get shut of them all.

      First part I agree with to some degree. Thankfully well never be a nothing club. And if you get rid of everyone then we can't fulfil fixtures...

      Now id be interested in your answer to the actual question
      heimdall
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #16: Jan 21, 2017 04:21:03 pm
      Klopp for picking Can all the bloody time, having no plan B, not strengthening squad and being to arrogant and complacent against "weaker"  opposition. Let's just hope we can win on Wednesday against mighty Southampton, I wonder if the players will show some passion and skill.
      Brian78
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #17: Jan 21, 2017 04:21:22 pm
      The reality I think in football is that the difference between great performances and poor ones is never quite as much as it appears. It can be passing delivered a fraction of a second earlier with perhaps one less touch, more fizz on it as you're confident the receiver will control it, a more penetrating runner as he's confident he'll be seen etc. We haven't gone from being a good side to a bad one overnight, but it's vital that we rediscover our mojo and soon because if we don't, the season could be over in 3/4 weeks. 

      We've changed nothing in that time though mick tactically or system wise. So who takes the wrap? Manager or players?
      reddebs
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #18: Jan 21, 2017 04:24:05 pm
      First part I agree with to some degree. Thankfully well never be a nothing club. And if you get rid of everyone then we can't fulfil fixtures...

      Now id be interested in your answer to the actual question

      No sensible answers from me today Brian, I'm on the negative trail after that shower of sh*t.

      I'll say it now, we'll win F**k all again this season, be complaining at the lack of spending in the summer, raise our game then finish with F**k all again in 2018.

      It's the way of the world now and there's F**k all we can do but accept our lot which is waaaaaaaaaaaaay behind everyone else.
      bigmick
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #19: Jan 21, 2017 04:24:08 pm
      We've changed nothing in that time though mick tactically or system wise. So who takes the wrap? Manager or players?

      Neither mate as I've said, we've just gone off the boil. I don't think it's anyone's "fault", except it helps if you have credible replacements for players who have dropped out of form. Bobby Firmino is a great example, he was really poor for half a dozen games or so and now he's coming back into form. It would have been better if we didn't have to play him regardless, similarly Can and Origi and Clyne as of now. No players play well every single game, neither does any team. It's nobodies fault, just one of those things.
      what-a-hit-son
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #20: Jan 21, 2017 04:24:49 pm
      Answer is a choice of 2 don't hide your answer by introducing owners, directors  kitmam, coach driver or the building company that threw up the new stand!!

      What?

      How can it be one?

      It's clearly both. Just like it has clearly been both for the last 95% of the season when we've been playing very well.



      HScRed1
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #21: Jan 21, 2017 04:28:00 pm
      Neither mate as I've said, we've just gone off the boil. I don't think it's anyone's "fault", except it helps if you have credible replacements for players who have dropped out of form. Bobby Firmino is a great example, he was really poor for half a dozen games or so and now he's coming back into form. It would have been better if we didn't have to play him regardless, similarly Can and Origi and Clyne as of now. No players play well every single game, neither does any team. It's nobodies fault, just one of those things.

      Agree with that Mick and I think the frustration of posters is that they thought start of the season our squad lacked quality and indeed numbers and that has become even more evident during this window, however there does not seem to be anything done about it.

      Which suggests at a minimum poor planning and at worst negligent or maybe its something in between as I believe Klopp does have a bit too much faith in players who we as fans have regularly let us down for too long.

      On a positive note we are still well placed for CL just need to get through this blip of form.
      what-a-hit-son
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      Re: klopp or the players?
      Reply #22: Jan 21, 2017 04:29:18 pm
      Knee jerk thread if ever I've seen one.

      Anybody would think we've been sh*te all season and aren't in a position to get top four.

      Fickle as F**k. A few bad weeks at the office and everyone is completely on one as if we are F***ing doomed.

      God help us when we go out of all of the cups and aren't anywhere near the top 4.

      Which hasn't happened yet by the way.

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