The lack of creativity from our engine room.

I'd love you to explain it mate, please as I'm finding it difficult to understand.

Dug up an old post:

Highly attacking fullbacks (such as Glen Johnson) are vital to the success of the Liverpool system.  We don't have an out and out winger, wingers in general are becoming far less and less popular due to the fact that if they're not technically proficient enough to play a more central role when need be, than they are very limited in their contribution to the team.  He provides our width, crosses and wide passing options down the right flank (better than Kuyt does anyhow) and offers decent cover in defence.  When he surges forward, we have 1 or 2 defensive midfielders to ensure there isn't a quick counter against us if we're caught out.

The fullback is the only position on the pitch that generally has space in front of them at all times, so having one that can dribble, pass and cross very well is extraordinarily handy.  Now I know you're saying but he's a right back so his primary concern should be to defend.  Enter the defensive midfielder, surely midfielders are supposed to contribute to a little bit of attack and a little bit of defence?  Mascherano simply doesn't contribute to attack, because our fullbacks do.  Think of Mascherano as a defender and Glen Johnson as a midfielder.  I know that sounds stupid, but so did a lot of things before they became the norm.

edit: creativity comes from the wingbacks and 1 central player, the rest of the central players job is to hold the ball and do very little with it.

F**k me Kenny if Lucas knocked shot someone you'd blame the person for getting in the way of the bullet. He doesn't deserve any defence tonight he was F***ing abysmal as was Poulsen

Kenny talks out of his F***ing arse mate, anyone who says the creativity comes from the central play maker in a game when we did not play that system nor have one in the side, seriously needs to have a word with himself and stop making excuses for a terrible performance from a severely limited player.

He mentioned something about obsession, well using that defense of Lucas stating a central creative playmaker was there to provide the creativity, when there was not one even on the pitch shows clearly where the obsession lies.

What ? with Poulson and Lucas, I can't begin to think what you mean.

this obsession is getting really boring - what part of "the creativity comes from the full backs and the central playmaker" do you find so difficult to understand?

Please explain it to me. Because the way I see it is Lucas and Poulsen playing as central midfielders. Surely one of them has to be a central playmaker then?

And if we're relying on defenders to be our creative outlet then we are well and truly fu**ed.

Poulson and Lucas are a million miles away from a Mash and Alonso midfield.Our current engine room look like lost souls,as soon as they get the ball is kick it anywere,all they have to do is look up, look for players making runs its not happening.They are afraid to pass the ball.We need a creative midfielder in January,Meiralis might prove me wrong think he looks slow on the ball,hope he just needs time not replacing.Cause Lucas and Poulson need a reality check.

Why does Roy keep on persisting with the two defensive midfielders who can't create anything in the team? Rafa Benitez at least didn't have much choice, especially for the first few months because he had an injured Aquilani.

We would have been much more creative and threatening if Meireles had played centrally but no, he had to play out of position to accommodate the two of them.

Playing both of them in the centre affects the players surrounding them as a whole and why can't Roy FREAKING see that.

Lucas and Poulson are not good enough to play in midfield for Liverpool FC. The ball goes backwards, sideways or forwards to an opposition player whenever they have it.

I've noticed that instead of Pepe passing the ball forward he is now giving it to Poulsen (I suspect under orders) who is more often than not closed down and offloads it to someone else who is also being closed down putting us under all sorts of pressure at the back (see Bent in the Sunderland game).

Good players create their own space but Poulson is not a good player.  Be prepared for more under par performances whilst these two are on the pitch.  Poulsen will continue to be picked as Roy seeks the justify the outlay for a past it (if he ever had it) player.

In answer to the question what is Roy doing playing these two in Central Midfield the answer is very simple.  He doesn't know what he is doing.

YAWN....

joe cole useless, as was meireles and kuyt, with torres moping around like a pregnant schoolgirl.

but yeah, blame lucas again.

this obsession is getting really boring - what part of "the creativity comes from the full backs and the central playmaker" do you find so difficult to understand?

Blame Lucas again? He was hardly blamed. This thread is called, 'the lack of creativity from our engine room'. Engine room = central midfield. Lucas plays in that position, so he's going to be criticized.

Anyway, last season we saw alot of Lucas and Masch paired together, and that was awful. Now we are playing the same system, except now we replaced Masch with a far more inept player in Poulson. It's such a bad combination it's unreal. A central midfield pairing should have a player who is their to receive the ball from his partner, look up, and play a ball out to an over-lapping full back, or a winger etc. We just got two grafters in there, and that simply doesn't work, at any level of football.

Our current engine room is about as much use as a asthmatic robin reliant.

No matter who's been there this season, it's been poor - Gerrard to Poulsen.  All been shocking.  And if we muster attacks for 10 minutes at the end, it doesn't forgive that fact it has been sh*t the rest of the game, couple this with our attacking creativity on our flanks being even poorer than our centre mids and we have a problem.

As long as Roy considers Poulson and Lucas as formidable mid field players, We are well and truly bollocksed.  Niether are good enough for the prem, let alone L.F.C.  All that pairing suggeste to me is that Roy simply doesn't have a fecking clue. If this is his regular selection, which it seems it is going to be, the sooner he fecks off the better. It doesn't just screw up any prospect of creativity from center mid, it also reduces the effectiveness of Cole and Mereiles as they are played out of position. Jesus, as they are superior players, you would think he had the sense to play them in their stongest roles, and accomodate Lucas and Poulson if he had no other options. To play them as first choice C.M and fit other players around them, You'd think Roy was on Fergies pay roll. It's fecking suicide. 

We have the players to at least be competitive. Its about roy selecting them and putting out the right formation.
I for one still have faith in roy. But things have to improve in terms of points and performance very very soon.

These statistics are from the premier league, not including Europa league.

Steven Gerrard

6 games 3 goals 0 assists.

Lucas Leiva

4 games 0 goals 0 assists

Christian Poulsen

4 games 0 goals 0 assists

Raul Meireles

3 games 0 goals 0 assists

Joe Cole

3 Games 0 goals 0 assists

Dirk Kuyt

4 games 1 goal 1 assist

Milan Jovanovic

5 games 0 goals 0 assists

Maxi Rodriguez

4 games 0 goals 0 assists

Ryan Babel

2 games 0 goals 0 assists


Makes interesting reading, we have 4 goals and 1 assist from our collective midfield in 6 games.

I can see where this poulsen-lucas criticism is coming from... the role i would play poulsen is put him on the bench and bring him on 30 minutes from time if we're in the lead. not a bad idea eh...?

lucas is not as bad as people make out but maybe a loan spell in france or germany would do him good, i don't think he'll want to leave liverpool for another couple of years. personally i don't think his style of play suits the rest of the squad...

Meireles and Gerrard and Cole are quality players. Those three, should be our starting midfield central 3, with Cole in the hole. I feel all three have been played out of position, meireles playing Attacking Mid when he should be playing Centre Mid and going box-to-box (so far he's been playing just behind Torres but drifting off to the right), Gerrard played a little too deep, Cole never really in the 'hole' just yet. Meireles is the player I feel who could provide creativity, with Cole and Gerrard pushing further forward. 

Our two most creative central midfielders are Gerrard and Meireles. So, use them to their potential!

I just can't stand the fact that Roy keeps playing Lucas and Poulsen but never Gerrard and Meireles. The pairing of Lucas + Poulsen or Lucas/Poulsen + Meireles/Gerrard isn't as bad but it isn't ideal as well. Give Gerrard + Meireles a go and let's see how they fare!

In the 4-5-1 formation, it's simple. Cole in the hole. He's shown he's highly dangerous from that position. That leaves Gerrard in the centre and Meireles is much more effective in the centre than he is at the right so it basically means a Gerrard-Meireles pairing.

In the 4-4-2 formation, we have no choice but to play Cole on the left. And without having too many 'puzzles', it's once again a Gerrard-Meireles pairing.

Cole is very creative and he's able to spot passes. He does it very well from the centre as we have seen for Babel's goal against Trabzonspor and for that penalty against Man United.

Gerrard, is a great player and he's capable of doing anything. Attacking, defending, sliding tackles, heading, set pieces, passes, long distance shots. Also has vision and a passing range which Alonso is equal to 

Meireles, well, probably played central his whole life and that's why he tends to drift inside from the right. He can play one touch and also spot runs and space on both sides.

And finally, in my opinion, the Gerrard-Meireles pairing is more capable of controlling and dominating the centre of the park, which is essential for a team of Liverpool's calibre and for games to be won.

Danny Murphy hit the nail on the head when he was guest presenting on ITV 4 the other night. Apart from gerrard we have no playmakers at the club. Which was why the decision to let Aquliani go to Juventus was barmy. Which brings me onto the point that Hodgson should try bring Danny back in January, because he is one man who certainly is a playmaker, and could have a Mcallister affect on the club if he ever returned IMO

Dug up an old post:

Highly attacking fullbacks (such as Glen Johnson) are vital to the success of the Liverpool system.  We don't have an out and out winger, wingers in general are becoming far less and less popular due to the fact that if they're not technically proficient enough to play a more central role when need be, than they are very limited in their contribution to the team.  He provides our width, crosses and wide passing options down the right flank (better than Kuyt does anyhow) and offers decent cover in defence.  When he surges forward, we have 1 or 2 defensive midfielders to ensure there isn't a quick counter against us if we're caught out.

The fullback is the only position on the pitch that generally has space in front of them at all times, so having one that can dribble, pass and cross very well is extraordinarily handy.  Now I know you're saying but he's a right back so his primary concern should be to defend.  Enter the defensive midfielder, surely midfielders are supposed to contribute to a little bit of attack and a little bit of defence?  Mascherano simply doesn't contribute to attack, because our fullbacks do.  Think of Mascherano as a defender and Glen Johnson as a midfielder.  I know that sounds stupid, but so did a lot of things before they became the norm.

edit: creativity comes from the wingbacks and 1 central player, the rest of the central players job is to hold the ball and do very little with it.

I understand the theory mate my question was where/who is our creative playmaker from midfield.

If we are going to play that system it only works when we use the midfield as well as wingbacks.  There's no point having a good midfield if Roy's tactics are to completely bypass it by hoofing the ball from defense to their keeper.

The commentators on Thursday were praising Nando for coming deep to win the ball back but nobody else goes past him to receive the ball off him to create an attacking opportunity.  Look at Rooney, when he does that you've got Nani, Evra, Berba, Scholes, Giggs etc all ahead of him s an outlet.  

Our players have forgotten the art of anticipation, making runs off the ball to create space for themselves or others.  They are so static at times it's like they've got superglue on their boots.

I understand the theory mate my question was where/who is our creative playmaker from midfield.

One potential option is playing at right wing for no good reason and the other is at Juventus.  Failing that, the responsibility falls back on Gerrard who will be back next week

Bump.

Self evident again today as it has been throughout the season.

Meireles was piss poor today. Lucas should of stayed in bed and young Jay was not at the races at all either.Not one midfielder today ventured across the half way line.

It is beyond a joke can't believe some people can't see it, we had two lads in midfield today that dunno the meaning of the word creativity

We got to many who just offer graft, not enough technically players who can create something.

We really need 2 top wingers and a physical central midfielder.

it was appalling today. where do we start in rebuilding this team.