Carragher's hoofing. Will it affect us this season?

I've read many posts on here on quite a number of threads which comment about Carragher's hoofing and how it may affect us for the coming season so I thought it'd be worthwhile to create a thread so we can have a intellectual discussion about it. 

I believe there isn't a debate about whether or not he hoofs; because he does. He hoofs it when we have no pressure with possession and he does it when its of vital importance and saves our asses, like he's done many times over the years. There are times where hoofing is the right thing to do, but Carragher does it when there's absolutely no need too.  

Will he ever change his ways? I don't think so, he's 34 and he's played this hoofing style for quite some time; it's just natural in his game now and I don't think we can ever take it out of his game. 

I can't be sure why he hoofs it as much as he does. I think it must be his mindset; get the ball forwards quickly and a long ball gives us that. Also he must feel uneasy and nervy when a player comes charging at him and his instant reaction must be to just hit it long. Doesn't think about any other potential option, just looks for the long ball. I do think that now we have Carroll, a "target man" so to speak who should challenge and win a large number of headers, he hoofs it more times thinking he'll win the header or get a flick on or win a free kick. He did the same thing when Crouch was here and it frustrated the hell out of me, and I'm sure other people too. It is the "easy" and "safe" ball unlike a short ball on the ground or a run forwards because if you lose the ball, your more then likely to give your opponent a chance of attacking. 

I do think his hoofing as came at the demise when we've been without a true commanding midfielder, someone who demands the ball and always looks to set up an attack with pin point passing or who joins the attack together. Adam could be that man, jury is still out on him for the moment. 

I do have a slight concern that the youngsters who admire Jamie and watching him week in, week out on the pitch and training, pick up his bad habit; of hoofing it when there is absolutely no need too. This is nothing against Jamie, because he is a world class defender when it comes to defending, but his distributing with the ball is poor to say the least. 

Some people have suggested that we should look for a new centre back so we can use Carragher in a more, utility role. I do think that is something we should be considering, Carragher would make an awesome back up centre back and a great player to have from the bench late into a game where we're hanging on to a lead. 

He is still a top defender and a leader of men, but I do see his hoofing becoming a problem this season. Its like giving the ball away when we hoof it when nothing comes from it, which happens more times then not.

What are other people's thoughts on it? Will he affect our season with his hoofing? Is his hoofing not a problem?

I think the hoofing, or long pass as Jamie would probably like us to call it, is a problem as it gives away possession easily at times. If he found a player in space with a bit of time it would be less of a problem but there are too many times when our midfielders are showing for the ball and it just sails over them.

I also feel it is a problem with the midfield last season as no one and Lucas in particular seem confident enough to demand the ball from Carra, and he also seems oblivious to the simple ball at times.

It's a combination of both I feel and you could guarantee that if Gerrard was the deepest midfielder and demanded the ball from Carra it would not be going long as much as it usually does.

It's a basic reqirement for a player who was never swift, but is now even slower. Safety first ! I see Carra as a good positional defender. A good organiser and a solid tackler who gives it 100% every game. Comfortable on the ball he aint. Under pressure with the ball at his feet, panic mode. He needs a player along side him, or ahead of him who he can lay a simple pass to. If there's nobody available instantly, he hoofs it. The way he probably see's it is, he may give possesion away, but it's not on the edge of his own box. He probably won't change until he has the calming influence of a player like Stevie ahead of him. Lucas and Adam are just not influential enough on the park just now, so don't seem like a good option to pass too. The same has to be said of our other available center midfield options as well. There isn't an individual constantly dominating in there without Stevie. Decent players yes, but they just don't boss the center of the park like they should.

I think he is now more tempted with Carroll in the side.

He's a great reader of the game. Great when it comes to defending but hoofing is not necessary at times. Maybe when a shot was just blocked by Reina or it has come off the post, then by all means, play it safe by kicking it as far as possible.

If it's a random pass back and a player is coming towards him, just play it back to Reina and find open space, receive the ball and pass it to a midfielder!

Think it is not only him that hoofs the ball, Agger sometimes tends to do the same when under pressure or no one is making options, i think we need to have a bit more patience in our play. Kenny needs to take it out of Carragher and Agger and to instruct them to play the ball on the ground when under pressure or try to keep the ball on the floor, because it frustrates not only the fans when the ball is lumped forward, but Carroll and the rest of the team also.

Think it is not only him that hoofs the ball, Agger sometimes tends to do the same when under pressure or no one is making options, I think we need to have a bit more patience in our play. Kenny needs to take it out of Carragher and Agger and to instruct them to play the ball on the ground when under pressure or try to keep the ball on the floor, because it frustrates not only the fans when the ball is lumped forward, but Carroll and the rest of the team also.

I'm not sure I agree with you about Agger.  He seems to play it along the ground a lot more often than he does hoof it but I do agree with you that it frustrates anyone who has to witness it, no doubt.

I'm not sure I agree with you about Agger.  He seems to play it along the ground a lot more often than he does hoof it but I do agree with you that it frustrates anyone who has to witness it, no doubt.

In the second half against Sunderland, i was shocked at how many times, Agger attempted the long ball, normally i feel he tries to get forward or play his game on the floor but against Sunderland for me he tended to use the long ball option, quite a bit.

Oh no! Carra's problem is spreading

Oh no! Carra's problem is spreading

Its infectious

It is a massive massive problem and whether Kenny can replace Jamie with a topclass before the close of the transfer window could define our season.  If Jamie plays with Carroll regularly prepare yourself for long ball football

 Of course it will have an effect on our season if we concede posession of the football needlessly too often. This applies whether it is Carragher "hoofing" or anybody else. As is the case with most things in football though, there is a cause and effect situation playing out and often you aren't actually seeing what you first think you are.

 If we accept as a given that we would like the defenders to hit it long and early less often, then we have to look at why they do it. Mostly, the reason IMHO is that the central midfielders/wide midfielders don't show for it early enough or often enough, and in some cases barely at all. On Saturday Adam showed in a bit, Lucas did a lot first half, buit second half both central midfielders stopped showing in. Henderson had a bit of the rabbit in the headlights about him and was glued to the touchline, while Downing seemed to run out of puff and ideas as well.

 At that point, loh and behold we started to hit it too long too early. My contention is that it's a team problem not a "Carragher" one, and until our midfield quartet sort themselves out we are barking up the wrong tree blaming the defenders.

Your sadly mistaken if you think it is not a Carragher problem mick unless of course your saying kenny is telling him to hit long ball at every opportunity

 There is no problem with a defender hitting a long ball as long as the ball finishes up with one of our players,their is only a problem when the defender kicks at the ball wildly and has no idea where it will finish up.

Kenny has bought passing player's, so it has to affect us if the ball is bypassing the midfield.
It is totally the opposite of Kenny's pass and move philosophy, and defeats the purpose of having these type of players.

How our midfielders pass and move when they don't even get the ball because the ball is always flying past over them!

I'm well aware of Carra's hoofing, although admittedly he wasn't that bad at the weekend.

Where he seems poor at it is when he pumps it down the right hand side of the pitch trying to find the winger.

It's not just Carra, a good few of our players were guilty of it during the last 20 minutes of the Sunderland game, Agger and Pepe especially. In the first half we generally played through the midfield but once they equalised the lads were hitting the ball into areas and into space rather than into feet. I suspect Kenny wants to see the ball go into feet so the onus is on him to cut down the long balls and i'm sure he'll do that.

He has unfortunately always been the same you see him look up and you know its coming and then off it goes straight to the opposition.Its the only thing about his game that hasnt changed over the years as her developed into a very fine CB.

He has always been poor on the ball, throughout his career. As a footballer he is very basic and at times poor in all honesty, as a defender though he is brilliant.

Personally hate it when he plays full back. Doesnt cross the half way line and offers nothing with the ball.

Id have him every time at centre half though. He is more consistent and definately a better defender than skrtel or sotis.

I dont blame him for hoofing as much as it annoys and frustrates me, because as stated he is not a footballer and never will be, its up to our centre mids to go and get the ball from him and we have had nobody in the side do it since alonso was here.

I didn't think he was that bad at the weekend.  I distinctly remember one situation where he was in space, deep in our half and he looked like he was going to launch it and I swear he stopped and thought 'no', and passed it short to Flanno.

Maybe we are looking out for it too much now and perceive it as being worse than it is.  Should we do a 'hoof' count in the next few matches?  Or perhaps more specifically, count 'unnecessary' hoofing.

Sometimes it works, sometimes it's necessary, but generally, when you can keep it on the deck.  I don't see it being an issue as Kenny will have a word if it is.  Long ball is not something we associate with Kenny.

Think it is not only him that hoofs the ball, Agger sometimes tends to do the same when under pressure

No bother with a centre half hoofing it when theres a chance he could be clsoed down and lose the ball which might lead to us conceding a goal, however with Jamie he might have no opponent within 20 feet of him he'd still hoof it. If we want to progress we need to be keeping the ball and Jamies tactic means we far too often will give the ball back to the opposition

Kenny has bought passing player's, so it has to affect us if the ball is bypassing the midfield.
It is totally the opposite of Kenny's pass and move philosophy, and defeats the purpose of having these type of players.

I agree with this. My only problem right now is that Carra might consider his hoof a pass towards Carroll. Also, I'm afraid that this safety measure of his is already a common thing. So as the back pass to Reina.

Just thought I would add a bit of balance to the debate and say over the years we have scored a lot of goals from Carra whacking it up the pitch