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      Accepting Mediocrity

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      leeboy30
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      Re: Accepting Mediocrity
      Reply #299: Dec 28, 2012 12:01:06 am
      We won 2 trophies in 6 years under Rafa - it's not "consistent" success.

      Yes winning the CL in 2005 was a fantastic success but getting to a final isn't unless you win.

      Being close isn't good enough

      The last 22 years we have had 1 challenge at the title - Blackburn have had more - Villa also had one challenge as well - even Newcastle have had more than that - in the league we have floundered away behind a lot of teams.

      It all started a long time ago our downfall.

      If Being close isn't good enough then being 10th is absolute failure

      We were second 3 years ago also under houllier not 20 years ago. We failed because of bad owners and owners who couldn't invest before that. Cue tumbleweed..

      If financial austerity is how you measure success than congrats we,re champions
      Muzzman1969
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      Re: Accepting Mediocrity
      Reply #300: Dec 28, 2012 12:02:15 am
      The last 22 years we have had 1 challenge at the title - Blackburn have had more - Villa also had one challenge as well - even Newcastle have had more than that - in the league we have floundered away behind a lot of teams.

      It all started a long time ago our downfall.

      I have to agree - this is not a recent problem of being an average team.  I remember the first couple of barren years, and thinking we would be back, but just getting further away.  Our problems seemed to start with the sudden increase in the amount of money in the game, and we never got to grips with it.
      George Lucas
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      • JFT96
      Re: Accepting Mediocrity
      Reply #301: Dec 28, 2012 12:04:11 am
      If Being close isn't good enough then being 10th is absolute failure

      We were second 3 years ago also under houllier not 20 years ago. We failed because of bad owners and owners who couldn't invest before that. Cue tumbleweed..

      If financial austerity is how you measure success than congrats we,re champions

      We have failed for 22 years now - this isn't a recent thing.

      Houllier was ten years ago and whilst we were second we were miles behind and never challenged for the title.

      leeboy30
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      Re: Accepting Mediocrity
      Reply #302: Dec 28, 2012 12:12:30 am
      We have failed for 22 years now - this isn't a recent thing.

      Houllier was ten years ago and whilst we were second we were miles behind and never challenged for the title.



      Eh we beat them away with the title on the line, lost twice all season and finished with 86 points our highest total ever. Please don't downplay it's an insult to rafa,the team that year ad the fans.

      Only thing I can promise you is nesv sell to buy policy wont get us any closer to that title just further away
      George Lucas
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      • JFT96
      Re: Accepting Mediocrity
      Reply #303: Dec 28, 2012 12:18:31 am
      Eh we beat them away with the title on the line, lost twice all season and finished with 86 points our highest total ever. Please don't downplay it's an insult to rafa,the team that year ad the fans.

      Only thing I can promise you is nesv sell to buy policy wont get us any closer to that title just further away

      Yes we did with Rafa - that was our "one" title challenge in 22 years

      You mentioned Houllier coming second and I said that whilst we came second with him we never challenged that year as we were miles behind.

      Please read the posts.

      This problem hasn't been created by FSG.
      AZPatriot
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      Re: Accepting Mediocrity
      Reply #304: Dec 28, 2012 02:29:08 am
      Yes we did with Rafa - that was our "one" title challenge in 22 years

      You mentioned Houllier coming second and I said that whilst we came second with him we never challenged that year as we were miles behind.

      Please read the posts.

      This problem hasn't been created by FSG.

      And in honesty George it probably won't be resolved by them either.

      FSG are not going to ruin LFC or get them relegated, anybody that says they are is a fear mongering shitebag that is looking to scare people for kicks.

      Conversely speaking however unless FFP is fully implemented and enforced FSG will find it hard to compete as the entire idea of owning and operating this club is based off of that happening.

      Groundwork is being laid now that if FFP does come to fruition LFC will be one of the clubs to take the biggest advantage.

      If FFP never comes or a half arse version of it is implemented instead then this ownership in the end will fail.

      Very very simple.
      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Accepting Mediocrity
      Reply #305: Dec 28, 2012 02:50:37 am
      1. Spend our money considerably better - look at our squad currently and most were bought during the Rafa era plus Suarez - we have spent a lot of money in 2 years and have one player to show for it - if we work within a self sufficient model we need to use our money far better

      2. Sort out our scouting - currently it's beyond awful - Segura I understand was responsible for players like Suarez yet has left. Plenty of clubs are buying quality players for decent fees - there are lots of quality players out there - we pay our scouts millions - time for them to earn it

      3. Increase our commercial income - sort out the expansion of the stadium to increase our match day revenue.

      4. The one thing out of our control is FFP - we need that to work and also it seems the prem are going to do the same thing - that could put us in a strong position

      5. Get someone in to work above BR - I don't care what he wants - he doesn't have the track record or experience to run our club and needs someone to look after the off the field stuff whilst he manages the squad.



      Sorry didn't get back to you earlier, family visits etc you know what it's like at Christmas!

      Agree with most points, although there was a reason why Rafa was able to bring those bigger names in, his name plus the addition of playing in the Champions League. Unfortunately Brendan hasn't got the Champions League or the name to attract the biggest names available. It's why Kenny went for the players he did last season, we never had the Champions League to attract those players that could make a difference. Currently it's like were making do with what we can get and I'm sure Suarez was sold on the idea of getting us into the competition.

      Agree about the scouting, we all know Rafa had his own scouts all over the globe, so it was never a problem identifying these players, when he left we at least had Segura and to some extent Macia at the club who still identified targets. Couldn't name any of our current scouts, especially the two we got after the transfer deadline in August.

      The one area where we seemed to improve when Ayre came in was commercial expansion, now isn't it some yank over in Boston in charge of this now, rather than Ayre, who is now MD and doesn't seem to have the same gravitas as people previously in that position including Parry. As for the stadium, that's been a problem since the late 90's/early 2000's when it should of been sorted then instead of being allowed to drag on, think of the commercial income we'd of got from a bigger ground circa 2005-2009, when we had sell-outs every week and tickets hard to come by!

      FFP gives me a headache just thinking about it!!

      I can't see anyone being brought in above Brendan, he didn't like the idea of a DOF, so we can definitely conclude that he won't want anyone above him trying to guide him. He's got his own ideas, I just think he needs the players for it to work and we don't have the players right now, some senior players are too set in their ways and what I've noticed especially the last few weeks watching us, it's most of the younger players who have adapted more quickly to his ideas, plus he seems to work best with the younger players, always dishing out advice to them etc, never see him do it a lot with the senior players, that could just be his style though.

      We won 2 trophies in 6 years under Rafa - it's not "consistent" success.

      Yes winning the CL in 2005 was a fantastic success but getting to a final isn't unless you win.

      Being close isn't good enough

      The thing is though at that point we were getting there, we were a threat and everyone knew, every team in Europe feared coming to Anfield and feared drawing us in the Champions League, that's were we want to be after all. In the league, I still say we were two players away from cracking it in 2009 and then the raping of the club took effect, Rafa had to make do with doing business with Roma and Pompey, cos they owed us money and we were fu**ed, a couple of years of making do and no champions league money on top of that means we've been  buying not just second-rate players but lower than that and we're still seeing it today, because until we can get into the top four, we'll just keep having to make do!!

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