Spine of the Team

Here's the thing - I look at the facts and go from there.
Now the fact is that JWH has said he's going nowhere. If he's lying we'll find out in the next 3 weeks.
Another fact is that suarez has banned all press conference questions regarding his future. We'll find out what his future holds in the next 3 weeks as well.

I have absolutely zero interest in whether I am in the majority or the minority, if others want to follow either the minority or majority, that's their call, but jumping on bandwagons of either camp isn't something I am going to do.

Just explaining that for you as it's the 2nd time in as many days that you've said that to me, as if that's supposed to influence my thinking or something.

As for suarez and Sturridge, we'll see.

Of course your opinion is your prerogative, I'm just pointing out the fact, as you like them so much, that you're opinion is in the minority.

Personally I prefer to look at things how I see them rather than believe what our esteemed owner says.  That way I don't end up being let down.

Of course your opinion is your prerogative, I'm just pointing out the fact, as you like them so much, that you're opinion is in the minority.

Personally I prefer to look at things how I see them rather than believe what our esteemed owner says.  That way I don't end up being let down.

I don't necessarily believe what he says, but I haven't seen evidence to show he's lying about Suarez.
If someone can point me in the right direction, then great.

I'd also question whether my opinion is in the minority.
It might be in the minority on this forum but that's not indicative of what the majority of Liverpool fans believe. To suggest otherwise is at the very least somewhat narcissistic.

I see these opinions, and the "I belong to the majority" as nothing more than jumping on a bandwagon, and I will continue to do so until there is real evidence to support them.

It is a fact that both the owners and manager have made their positions very clear, as has Suarez himself.
All we can do is wait and see what happens.

I won't feel "let down" because for one thing I haven't been personally promised anything, for another I don't get into the player worship thing and finally I believe little of what I read apart from direct quotes.

And even direct quotes have to be tempered by the question asked.

And even direct quotes have to be tempered by the question asked.

Indeed.

I forgot to add about context.

But hey, why let anything get in the way of a good old fashioned witch hunt.

Here's the thing - I look at the facts and go from there.

Great..

So you believe that we have the funds to compete with anyone in football?

Or We are here to win

 

Great..

So you believe that we have the funds to compete with anyone in football?

Or We are here to win

 

When the debt is cleared, and the stadium is built, then yes I believe we can compete with nearly anyone in football.

Also being here to win doesn't mean instant success.

The sky generation thinks it does though.

When the debt is cleared, and the stadium is built, then yes I believe we can compete with nearly anyone in football.

Also being here to win doesn't mean instant success.

The sky generation thinks it does though.

Not sure if you lump me in with that statement but hey ho


Question though.. When do you think we will be able to compete with anyone in football then ( nearly anyone )

Because the longer the time frame is the longer we are away from the top table the more we become just a club with great history.. The more we become less attractive to the top players.. The tougher the way back to the top is..
The less likely it is to happen 

So another year? Two years? Five years?

This summer is proof we are becoming less attractive to top players..

It's not about slagging them off for no reason, it's not about saying that clearing debt or lowering the wage bill isn't a noble act..
But are we and can we be competitive like this?
Well that's becoming even harder in the modern game especially when you are doing or from a position of weakness in the eyes of the top players, or even the ones perceived as just below that level like Miki or Costa

Not sure if you lump me in with that statement but hey ho


Question though.. When do you think we will be able to compete with anyone in football then ( nearly anyone )

Because the longer the time frame is the longer we are away from the top table the more we become just a club with great history.. The more we become less attractive to the top players.. The tougher the way back to the top is..
The less likely it is to happen 

So another year? Two years? Five years?

This summer is proof we are becoming less attractive to top players..

It's not about slagging them off for no reason, it's not about saying that clearing debt or lowering the wage bill isn't a noble act..
But are we and can we be competitive like this?
Well that's becoming even harder in the modern game especially when you are doing or from a position of weakness in the eyes of the top players, or even the ones perceived as just below that level like Miki or Costs

The fact is that when Broughton was involved with selling us, he was quoted as saying it would take a minimum of 3 years to turn us around.

My thoughts were more like 5, but I hoped we could get it done more quickly.

Right now, we are not as competetive as we would like, and I know it's hard to swallow. I have a hard time with it myself: I get angry, I get frustrated, but at the same time I understand that some things take more time than I would like them to.

Unless we suddenly get sold to an oil sheikh, it's going to be another couple of seasons before we are back in the CL unless BR is a managerial genius, or we sign at least 2 quality players this window, in which case, if we get the right players I would expect us to be challenging for the top 4.
As you know, top 4 in itself becomes a huge plus when attracting the kind of players we as fans want to see.

I just don't think there are any shortcuts.
We know there is money to spend on the right players, otherwise what did we use to bid for the unpronounceable east european bloke, but there's also no point in spending for the sake of it.

Until the window ends and we see the players in, or lack of them, all this is pretty much moot anyway.
As things stand, I think BR can get us punching above our current weight, but doing it over 38 games and finishing in the top 4 is an awful lot to ask. 

The fact is that when Broughton was involved with selling us, he was quoted as saying it would take a minimum of 3 years to turn us around.

My thoughts were more like 5, but I hoped we could get it done more quickly.

Right now, we are not as competetive as we would like, and I know it's hard to swallow. I have a hard time with it myself: I get angry, I get frustrated, but at the same time I understand that some things take more time than I would like them to.

Unless we suddenly get sold to an oil sheikh, it's going to be another couple of seasons before we are back in the CL unless BR is a managerial genius, or we sign at least 2 quality players this window, in which case, if we get the right players I would expect us to be challenging for the top 4.
As you know, top 4 in itself becomes a huge plus when attracting the kind of players we as fans want to see.

I just don't think there are any shortcuts.
We know there is money to spend on the right players, otherwise what did we use to bid for the unpronounceable east european bloke, but there's also no point in spending for the sake of it.

Until the window ends and we see the players in, or lack of them, all this is pretty much moot anyway.
As things stand, I think BR can get us punching above our current weight, but doing it over 38 games and finishing in the top 4 is an awful lot to ask. 

Totally agree, spot on. I feel we are still mopping up the mess caused by Hicks and Gillett's reign of terror.

The fact is that when Broughton was involved with selling us, he was quoted as saying it would take a minimum of 3 years to turn us around.

My thoughts were more like 5, but I hoped we could get it done more quickly.

Right now, we are not as competetive as we would like, and I know it's hard to swallow. I have a hard time with it myself: I get angry, I get frustrated, but at the same time I understand that some things take more time than I would like them to.

Unless we suddenly get sold to an oil sheikh, it's going to be another couple of seasons before we are back in the CL unless BR is a managerial genius, or we sign at least 2 quality players this window, in which case, if we get the right players I would expect us to be challenging for the top 4.
As you know, top 4 in itself becomes a huge plus when attracting the kind of players we as fans want to see.

I just don't think there are any shortcuts.
We know there is money to spend on the right players, otherwise what did we use to bid for the unpronounceable east european bloke, but there's also no point in spending for the sake of it.

Until the window ends and we see the players in, or lack of them, all this is pretty much moot anyway.
As things stand, I think BR can get us punching above our current weight, but doing it over 38 games and finishing in the top 4 is an awful lot to ask.

Martin Broughton isn't a football man, so to be honest I took anything he said with a pinch of salt.. But I don't think there was a timescale to get us back as there were more than one way to do it as there is with anything in life, so to say that it would take 3 years or 5 years depends fully on how you do it.

Im not really angry, im past that, again though things only take as long as they take depending how you approach the problem.. Lets say you have an issue with your short game at golf, and you simply decide to work on it yourself and go once a week to the range to work on it, yes you are doing something about it and it may well take you 2 years to improve, however you probably don't have the expertise to diagnose your faults or the best way to sort them and be creating yourself more issues.. Yet had you gone for lessons with a pro and then go 4 times a week to the range to work on it then it may take you 3 months to improve your short game..
Different timescales depending on your way of dealing with the issue or faults at hand.

You say "unless we get an oil sheikh" and then in the same sentence "or sign 2 quality players this window"... Does the second one mean we need the first?

The problem isn't signing 2 quality players or apparently having the cash to do so but seemingly convincing those players we have the ambition to get back to the top4 and again that maybe from a more neutral position that we need more than 2 players you suggest.

If we take another 2-3 years to be in a position to get back there then aren't the current top 4 going to have 2-3 years of spending and development to pull away from us further or at least keep us at arms length like an adult holding a kids head while he tries to punch them..

Doing things the way we are trying to do them as I say is noble but I fear doomed to fail.. While we steady the ship we fall further behind and become less likely to attract the "two top players"

As you say its fairly moot but I personally don't see us pulling any rabbits out of the hat in the next fortnight.

Martin Broughton isn't a football man, so to be honest I took anything he said with a pinch of salt.. But I don't think there was a timescale to get us back as there were more than one way to do it as there is with anything in life, so to say that it would take 3 years or 5 years depends fully on how you do it.

Im not really angry, im past that, again though things only take as long as they take depending how you approach the problem.. Lets say you have an issue with your short game at golf, and you simply decide to work on it yourself and go once a week to the range to work on it, yes you are doing something about it and it may well take you 2 years to improve, however you probably don't have the expertise to diagnose your faults or the best way to sort them and be creating yourself more issues.. Yet had you gone for lessons with a pro and then go 4 times a week to the range to work on it then it may take you 3 months to improve your short game..
Different timescales depending on your way of dealing with the issue or faults at hand.

You say "unless we get an oil sheikh" and then in the same sentence "or sign 2 quality players this window"... Does the second one mean we need the first?

The problem isn't signing 2 quality players or apparently having the cash to do so but seemingly convincing those players we have the ambition to get back to the top4 and again that maybe from a more neutral position that we need more than 2 players you suggest.

If we take another 2-3 years to be in a position to get back there then aren't the current top 4 going to have 2-3 years of spending and development to pull away from us further or at least keep us at arms length like an adult holding a kids head while he tries to punch them..

Doing things the way we are trying to do them as I say is noble but I fear doomed to fail.. While we steady the ship we fall further behind and become less likely to attract the "two top players"

As you say its fairly moot but I personally don't see us pulling any rabbits out of the hat in the next fortnight.

Broughton may not be a football man, but he IS a finance man and that's where our biggest problems were.

And no, signing 2 players isn't dependant on getting an oil sheikh, but winning the title within the next 2 years probably is.

Broughton may not be a football man, but he IS a finance man and that's where our biggest problems were.

And no, signing 2 players isn't dependant on getting an oil sheikh, but winning the title within the next 2 years probably is.

And do finance men know enough about football? Or just how to balance the books?

I think that's our problem in a nutshell so I won't take on Broughtons timescales myself.

As I tried to explain above there are many ways to do the same thing.. All with different timescales

And do finance men know enough about football? Or just how to balance the books?

I think that's our problem in a nutshell so I won't take on Broughtons timescales myself.

As I tried to explain above there are many ways to do the same thing.. All with different timescales

When the problems are financial, then yes, it matters, it takes time to get back on a sound financial footing.
Have any opinion you like, but that's the truth of the matter, because football revolves around money.

You've over simplified things to a huge extent regarding timescales, but I really can't be arsed getting into it again, because I've posted about it before on more than one occasion.

When the problems are financial, then yes, it matters, it takes time to get back on a sound financial footing.
Have any opinion you like, but that's the truth of the matter, because football revolves around money.

You've over simplified things to a huge extent regarding timescales, but I really can't be arsed getting into it again, because I've posted about it before on more than one occasion.

My opinion

Your opinion

All opinions..

Everyone's opinion is valid, I'm not saying mine is right but don't be pompous enough to think yours is either.
We can try to convince ourselves that its all financial and this is the only way that we can move forward if you like

You don't have to get into anything but don't be a tit eh..

My opinion

Your opinion

All opinions..

Everyone's opinion is valid, I'm not saying mine is right but don't be pompous enough to think yours is either.
We can try to convince ourselves that its all financial and this is the only way that we can move forward if you like

You don't have to get into anything but don't be a tit eh..

I'm basing my opinion on experience of turning a company around though.
The financial bloke I hired didn't know jackshit about building, but he knew how to turn the company around, so I'd say my point about Broughton is pretty much on the money.

I'm basing my opinion on experience of turning a company around though.
The financial bloke I hired didn't know jackshit about building, but he knew how to turn the company around, so I'd say my point about Broughton is pretty much on the money.

I work on a 95million pound a year contract mate, I didn't come down with the last sprinkling of snow in terms of major business.

I think it's fair to say that football is unlike any other business in the world.. To compare it to any other business clouds the argument for me

I work on a 95million pound a year contract mate, I didn't come down with the last sprinkling of snow in terms of major business.

I think it's fair to say that football is unlike any other business in the world.. To compare it to any other business clouds the argument for me

It may very well be, but the principles remain exactly the same when dealing with a financial mess of that magnitude, unless someone can come in and immediately clear the books, which was never going to happen.

so I'd say my point about Broughton is pretty much on the money.

What that he's a horrible tory, chelsea loving c**t, who will be one of the first against the wall when the revolution happens.

And Purlsow was definitely his fag in the boardroom!!

who will be one of the first against the wall when the revolution happens.

Love that!!

I work on a 95million pound a year contract mate, I didn't come down with the last sprinkling of snow in terms of major business.

I think it's fair to say that football is unlike any other business in the world.. To compare it to any other business clouds the argument for me

Spot on mate its sport its emotion its everything business isn't... it matters. Its risky its a gamble its totally nonsensical and if you applied any due diligence to a football club before buying you would run a million miles away from it.