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      Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?

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      CoutinhoRed
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      Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      May 06, 2014 01:07:37 am
      As the season comes to a close, with 49 goals conceded this campaign with one game remaining, it is in doubt whether Skrtel and Sakho will ever form a good partnership. We always hear about that solid "defensive partnership" which is apparent amongst many top teams in Europe.

      Once upon a time we had a rock in Henchoz and Hyypia. Barcelona had a decent defensive pairing in Pique and Puyol for a few seasons. At present, we are witnessing the resilience that Ramos and Pepe offer to Real Madrid. In their prime Ferdinand and Vidic were a defensive rock. Or what about John Terry and Ricardo Carvalho?

      It's abundantly clear that a good defensive pairing is of great importance. The statistics for the Skrtel-Sakho partnership are pretty dire:

      Premier League games: 18
      Wins: 10
      Draws: 3
      Losses: 5
      Goals against: 29
      Source: Opta

      This is either valid evidence that the two are not compatible in defence or instead it is just a massive coincidence.
      hardcoresoldier
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #1: May 06, 2014 02:27:01 am
      As the season comes to a close, with 49 goals conceded this campaign with one game remaining, it is in doubt whether Skrtel and Sakho will ever form a good partnership. We always hear about that solid "defensive partnership" which is apparent amongst many top teams in Europe.

      Once upon a time we had a rock in Henchoz and Hyypia. Barcelona had a decent defensive pairing in Pique and Puyol for a few seasons. At present, we are witnessing the resilience that Ramos and Pepe offer to Real Madrid. In their prime Ferdinand and Vidic were a defensive rock. Or what about John Terry and Ricardo Carvalho?

      It's abundantly clear that a good defensive pairing is of great importance. The statistics for the Skrtel-Sakho partnership are pretty dire:

      Premier League games: 18
      Wins: 10
      Draws: 3
      Losses: 5
      Goals against: 29
      Source: Opta

      This is either valid evidence that the two are not compatible in defence or instead it is just a massive coincidence.

      Massive coincidence.  :f_tongueincheek:

      Just joking. For some reason Brendan doesn't trust Agger anymore, he sees more than we do so there must be a good reason for it.
      Kharhaz
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #2: May 06, 2014 02:44:24 am
      The thing for me is the fullbacks also.

      Luis Enrique - Always Injured
      Daniel Agger - Always Injured.

      We need a consistent defence. As much as I admire Agger and Enrique, we need to move on to a more reliable pairing.
      PurpleMonkey
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #3: May 06, 2014 02:59:11 am
      The thing is, they are very good defenders, however, I believe what they lack is a vocal defensive leader, someone to bark orders, organize and motivate at the back. We had it in Reina and Carra, before that, Hyypia etc.

      I honestly believe Skrtel and Sahko partnership would work with Reina. Hopefully, we'll have him back for next season as our #1 and If that doesn't happen, maybe we need to look for a new vocal center back.
      hobbes2702
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #4: May 06, 2014 04:46:05 am
      The thing is, they are very good defenders, however, I believe what they lack is a vocal defensive leader, someone to bark orders, organize and motivate at the back. We had it in Reina and Carra, before that, Hyypia etc.

      I honestly believe Skrtel and Sahko partnership would work with Reina. Hopefully, we'll have him back for next season as our #1 and If that doesn't happen, maybe we need to look for a new vocal center back.



      I'm sorry and I'm not trying to call you out but everyone needs to get off this ridiculous idea that Pepe would add anything to our defense. He was incredibly poor the past two seasons and hasn't exactly been stellar at Napoli this season. What we need for our defense to be better is players that are consistently healthy and better full backs. We haven't had a consistent back four at all this season and our full backs are not great. GJ has been awful this season when healthy and Flanno has been good but can certainly be improved upon.
      AussieRed
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #5: May 06, 2014 07:57:41 am
      I miss Sami Hyypia.
      falkirk_bairn
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #6: May 06, 2014 07:58:53 am
      No, as much as everyone seems to love Skrtel he is to much of a hit or a miss.
      CoutinhoRed
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #7: May 06, 2014 08:31:13 am
      I just don't think we have any leaders in and around the defence. As for Stevie, he leads by example. He has never been he most vocal lad in the team. As for the Sakho skrtel partnership - I just cannot see it working out.

      I can't help but feel that if Agger did not get injured, he would still be ahead of Sakho and thus we would win the league
      HScRed1
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #8: May 06, 2014 08:37:00 am
      Our CB partnership which at times has been culpable for individual errors is not solely responsible for all the goals conceded. Like many have said we should be defending better as a TEAM. I can remember countless times throughout the season where our CB's have been left horribly exposed like last night either from the flanks (usually Glens side) or opposition teams just waltzing straight through the middle.
      AussieRed
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #9: May 06, 2014 08:40:42 am
      I just don't think we have any leaders in and around the defence. As for Stevie, he leads by example. He has never been he most vocal lad in the team. As for the Sakho skrtel partnership - I just cannot see it working out.

      I can't help but feel that if Agger did not get injured, he would still be ahead of Sakho and thus we would win the league

      Got that same feeling mate. Skrtel and Ager were doing fine, Agger got injured and Sakho and Skrtel were doing wel but then it started unravelling.
      LFCexiled
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #10: May 06, 2014 08:52:45 am
      Sakho activates 'giraffe mode' too often, if you've got a player who a ball comes to and his legs start flying in random directions then it's bound to have an effect. It's like watching a kid on kinect sometimes.

      Sakho will be back up next season, Agger will be gone, our defence will be solid next season.

      Hear me FSG? Get the cheque book out.
      srslfc
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #11: May 06, 2014 08:57:58 am
      For some reason Brendan doesn't trust Agger anymore, he sees more than we do so there must be a good reason for it.

      I think it's more a case of Brendan trusts the man in possession of the shirt and tends to only chcnge thorugh injury or an really obvious drop in form or bad game.

      Sakho only got back in when Danny got injured again and I think if that didn't happen we would have seen Agger finish the season.

      Would that have seen us any 'better' defensively?

      I'm not sure it would have made much difference.
      CoutinhoRed
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #12: May 06, 2014 09:22:15 am
      I think it's more a case of Brendan trusts the man in possession of the shirt and tends to only chcnge thorugh injury or an really obvious drop in form or bad game.

      Sakho only got back in when Danny got injured again and I think if that didn't happen we would have seen Agger finish the season.

      Would that have seen us any 'better' defensively?

      I'm not sure it would have made much difference.

      I'm pretty confident it would have. That statistics do not lie. Skrtel and Agger form a better defence.
      MarkMitt
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #13: May 06, 2014 09:28:33 am
      Easy to single out players. Fact is too many players not pulling their weight defensively.  Instead of hassling to get the ball back,  too often see players lose it, then casually jog back at a canter. Coutihno was horrendously guilty of this last night for example. Defending Is down to the TEAM.
      CoutinhoRed
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #14: May 06, 2014 09:32:05 am
      Something else we lack is the ability to time waste. By no means do I condone time wasting, but that is something we needed once the 2nd Palace goal went in. Feign an injury, lie on the turf for 5 minutes, continue to time waste with set pieces...

      That said, I'd hate to see us resort to that sort of play.
      Scottbot
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #15: May 06, 2014 09:33:53 am
      It was pretty shocking to hear we have kept just ONE clean sheet in 17 games with Skrtel and Sakho as a partnership. The stats don't tell a great story do they. We play a very open game so I think we would concede goals no matter who is at the back but I think it's clear we may be in need of an upgrade back there.

      A lot of posters bang on about Steve Clarke and how great we were defensively with him coaching the back four but we played a much deeper line with the full-backs more defensively minded and more protection from then midfield so it isn't as simple as that.

      I would love to see Carra back at the club in a part-time coaching role to work with our defenders. He knows his football, he's been there and done it and he has learned from one of the best defensive coaches in the game in Rafa.
      Court LFC
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #16: May 06, 2014 10:38:47 am
      Carra was stressed last night on the defensive analysis on MNF.

      We miss our organiser.
      Brian78
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #17: May 06, 2014 01:07:02 pm
      Rther then blame individuals or partnerships I think our method of defending on teh whole needs looking at. We always back off players running at us instead of closing them down and making them think, and we afford way way too much space, last night showed that up, it was criminal

      Arab Scouse
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #18: May 06, 2014 01:15:45 pm

      Ditto!!!

      how excellent would Sami Hyypia be in Rodger's system? Hyypia was dominant, liked to pass, pushed up and 98% won aerial duels. We kind of need a Hyypia type of defender in our team. We all thought Sakho is, but he isn't, I don't think he is dominant enough for me, but definitely an excellent ball playing defender.

      IMO, we need to look for a good partner for Sakho, I don't think Skrtel is the answer, he still is error prone (even if had a good 2nd half of the season, doesn't mean he will carry that form). Plus, you need fullbacks who can actually close down wingers and stopping crosses, Johnson yesterday failed in every attempt to mark the winger tighter and close him down, he is horrible at it.
      Arab Scouse
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #19: May 06, 2014 01:17:37 pm
      It was pretty shocking to hear we have kept just ONE clean sheet in 17 games with Skrtel and Sakho as a partnership. The stats don't tell a great story do they. We play a very open game so I think we would concede goals no matter who is at the back but I think it's clear we may be in need of an upgrade back there.

      A lot of posters bang on about Steve Clarke and how great we were defensively with him coaching the back four but we played a much deeper line with the full-backs more defensively minded and more protection from then midfield so it isn't as simple as that.

      I would love to see Carra back at the club in a part-time coaching role to work with our defenders. He knows his football, he's been there and done it and he has learned from one of the best defensive coaches in the game in Rafa.

      Mate, I don't think it's all about the way we play. It's not a coincidence that when Agger was in the starting lineup we actually had more clean sheets and we looked a lot tighter at the back. When Agger got injured we started conceding again. It has to do with ability of some of the individual players.
      Thaddeus
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #20: May 06, 2014 01:52:59 pm
      Yes, is the short answer.

      I honestly believe that the our poor defense is due to less than stellar defensive contributions of other players (mentioning no names, but in particular a player who's name rhymes with Bren Juanson)
      Beerbelly
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #21: May 06, 2014 02:01:41 pm
      I'm not convinced our defensive deficiencies all point to the Skertel-Sahko partnership. Although the stats tell us we concede less with Agger-Skertel in the team, we should remember that at the same time those stats concerning Skertel-Sahko are IMO misleading too. Take last Sunday for e.g. how does their partnership stat alter the fact Gerrard slipped, that has no bearing on them as a partnership, the second goal too was the team's mindset to throw players forward for a corner, just like one of the goals last night that smacked us on the counter - hardly the fault of a CD partnership.

      They don't look anything like a Henchoz-Hyypia partnership that's for sure (and maybe Carra is right about the lack of leadership at the back?), but IMO our defensive issues stem from the way we play as a team, it's a team 'thing' for me, more so than a central defensive partnership. I mean, we could stick Henchoz and Hyypia in this side today and I'd hedge my bets we'd still concede a fair few more than most teams in the top 6.

      For me it's a collection and a combination of things:

      1) Mignolet's lack of commanding presence and ability to collect in his box (a big issue)
      2) Johnson & Flanagan either pushed too far up and out of position
      3) Johnson & Flanagan are both guilty (especially Johnson) of switching off, ball watching and not closing down enough crosses.
      4) Recently: Henderson missing, the loss of his energy and team ethic which support his FB and team mates no end. (big miss)
      5) Midfield (key point) more often than not this fluid attacking movement from midfield leaves us exposed to a counter attack, sometimes we're three in midfield. Not as tight 'in-play' like (extreme example) Chelsea are, our expansive play going forward in numbers leaves us vulnerable at the back. Throw in point 2 to that mix and there's a recipe for danger.

      Granted, Skertel and Sahko aren't no Hansen-Lawrenson but I think there is enough in the above to deal with which would save us a sizable amount of goals conceded.
      JD
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      Re: Does the Skrtel-Sakho partnership work?
      Reply #22: May 06, 2014 02:06:24 pm
      Think it's exceptionally harsh to lay the blame full square on Sakho and Skrtel.

      Can the right back defend?

      Is the keeper a strong verbal, physical and confident presence?

      For a new signing, who has also suffered an injury, I think Sakho has done remarkably well in his first season.  In fact he'd be my pick of all of our signings over the last 12 months.

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