Jürgen Klopp - Liverpool FC Manager

Exactly, it's genuine human emotion.

Nothing contrived like the Mourinho bullshit, no narrative, just lay it on the line, take me as I am, genuineness. Exactly what I love about the bloke, he feels the pain and agony, he lives it and he isn't afraid to show it and fight for what he believes is right.

It appears, I, like Klopp, was in the minority for believing it really wasn't a penalty and never should have been given. So to say I understand where he's coming from, as should every football fan, agreeing with the decision or not, is an understatement. Anyone suggesting it was a rant, or losing his cool are so far wide of the mark it has me questioning why they would suggest such. He was angry at a decision which cost the ONLY team that came to play real football the points they deserved. It cost the ONLY team that came to entertain the paying fans the points they deserved.

If you get the man you would have expected nothing less than the interview he gave, nothing bizarre about it at all, just Jürgen being Jürgen and anyone who's got a problem with that then they have it at a personal level because that is just him and I personally love to see that reaction. Just as I liked when Kenny was frosty with these fuckers, he knows they're out to create narratives, he knows they're out to sensationalise everything and even with that knowledge he doesn't hide his disappointment or anger at the decision, he's upfront and honest about it, something we'd all feel happier doing in our own lives if we had the courage to bear our inner feelings now and again.

Well in Jürgen and well said.

I do agree with all of this but why is there so much focus on that penalty decision anyway? It shouldn't be that way.

We didn't drop two points because we got a penalty given against us that Jürgen didnt agree with.

We dropped two points because we didn't play very well and never caused Everton enough problems. 1-0 is a dangerous score line because anything can happen, as we saw.

He said he will take the blame when rotation doesn't work, but he hasn't accepted or admitted that he got the team selection wrong. And it was wrong. He was defending taking salah off saying he replaced him with a like for like replacement in firmino. Why not have both on the pitch though?

Me personally I'd have liked him to come out and said something along the lines of 'I picked the 11 players that I thought were best suited for this game but we didn't play as well as I hoped and that's a mistake on my part. As for the penalty then nah I think it's bollocks'.

I do agree with all of this but why is there so much focus on that penalty decision anyway? It shouldn't be that way.

We didn't drop two points because we got a penalty given against us that Jürgen didnt agree with.

We dropped two points because we didn't play very well and never caused Everton enough problems. 1-0 is a dangerous score line because anything can happen, as we saw.

He said he will take the blame when rotation doesn't work, but he hasn't accepted or admitted that he got the team selection wrong. And it was wrong. He was defending taking salah off saying he replaced him with a like for like replacement in firmino. Why not have both on the pitch though?

Me personally I'd have liked him to come out and said something along the lines of 'I picked the 11 players that I thought were best suited for this game but we didn't play as well as I hoped and that's a mistake on my part. As for the penalty then nah I think it's bollocks'.

Fair enough. This argument I can totally understand and see it completely from your perspective. Having watched us implode last Jan and Feb I can forgive Jürgen for being a little bit more cautious entering the heavy fixture list and some of our lads, especially in attack, have played a lot of minutes.

I used to be someone who didn't think rotation was necessary, I've since learned that it is absolutely necessary and expecting peak level performances day in, day out, is living in fantasy land. So Jürgen is learning and with that he may also be learning he needs a deeper squad, perhaps Solanke wasn't the right option, or leaving him on so long was quite possibly the wrong call but as said at the time, this is such an easy thing to say with the benefit of hindsight. Everton were creating nothing and had I been the manager I wouldn't have thought we needed a second, even though I thoroughly agree that 1-0 is always a dangerous lead, even more with our defence.

So yes, I totally see it from your perspective and I've no problem whatsoever with people levelling this criticism at Jürgen, as the result says, he got it wrong in the end but at 1-0 I can also completely understand the motivations behind each substitution. Maybe he'll learn from it, maybe it's just one of those things that is typical Liverpool, Fat Sam taking over just at the right time for them to sort their leaking defence, us just hitting enough minutes that players need to be protected a little and also a little bit of underestimating the opposition with the initial team selection.

However, with regards that last point, had Mane's chance been a goal then all this is moot and the bigger culprits out there who didn't fulfil their roles, or do enough with their chances, in my opinion, were Henderson and Milner. Henderson has got to the point with me where I'd rather see anyone but him, I'd even rather Karius in midfield I'm that sick of seeing his dire form at the moment. When that pass got squared to him by Coutinho, even accepting Henderson was in a better position, I doubt there was a person in the crowd who didn't know where that ball was ending up and frankly, given the time, the situation and opposition that shot summed him up in an instant. If the best you produce as captain, in the last minute of a Derby with a clear sight of goal, no real defender closing you down, is that embarrassment of a shot then I'm sorry the light bulb has to be going off in Jürgen's head that it's time to change because that lad simply crumbles under any weight of expectation. In horse racing terms he's a flat track bully, put him against sub standard opposition and he can hide, against quality, or with pressure he is not good enough.

Thought the peno was a bit soft, but it was clumsy by Lovren, had his hand on the guys back and also made contact. For me if his hand isn't at the guys back it's not a peno - but when ref sees it in realtime, looks like a push in the back.
No need for Lovren to be so rash, the guy is going away from goal, just shepherd him further away. Typical misjudged challenge from Dejan.
Thought he did well in the game apart from that, but like Moreno and Migs, they will make these mistakes.

Can though see why Jürgen would want the conversation to be about whether it or not it was a peno,  rather than it being about his CB putting his foot in it yet again.

It's really unbelievable with the Klopp moaning on here. Yes I can understand some criticism of him for today's game but some criticism are not really justified especially the way we have been playing in the past 10 games so far. People tend to forget that we are not a finished team yet, nor we are good enough to challenge for the title. We are close to Christmas right now but we are still 5 points away from 2nd and look good in the table despite our setback at the beginning of the season. We are in an unbeaten run of 10 games and in those 10 games we have scored more than any other team in the league, even Man City. We also conceded less than Man City, Man Utd, Chelsea, Arsenal & Tottenham, so please we are doing far better defensively than we have done in the past and we are scoring loads of goals. I would never would have thought that our defense would up their game so well, despite Lovren's stupidty today he's been solid in other games, Joe Gomez looks phenomenal, Moreno improved & Klavan solid too. Our CB pairing is not perfect, but credit where credit is due, they've been solid so far and it shows.

So what's to moan about? because Klopp decided to rotate? he did that before and it worked, this time it was working but individual errors and small details in the game cost us. Sh*t happens, so you learn from them and move on to the next game. Look at our schedule, we have to rest players or else we risk injuring our best players, so I would rather we rest some players rather than having them injured for a long time.

Of course it's frustrating not to beat the bitters, I was as angry as you guys and really angry at not closing the game sooner today, but let's calm down, take a deep breath and think rationally for a minute. Let's look at how we are doing at the moment. Games like these will happen again, but what's important is that we keep our good run of form going and see ourselves in January. I don't think Klopp did much wrong with his lineup today, it worked before against other teams so why shouldn't work again? He thought the lineup he had today is enough to beat the bitters and I think he was right, so hopefully we have an energized team in the 2nd half of the season and we can go a little bit more with our run and keep the consistency we have been showing so far.

Don't deny it, we've improved massively since August.

It's not a matter of being the finished article... If you for get about the CL or Europa League the four must important or must win games of the season for us, the supporters are 

(1) Home to (Man Utd. to me at least, I live in Tottenham) Everton

(2) Home to Man Utd (Everton to me)

(3) Away to Man Utd

(4) Away to Everton

And in these games I believe that the supporters want(expect) to see the strongest starting 11 barring injuries and Klopp did not do this, hence the frustration

Going to be honest I was pissed at Klopp until I saw his interview and saw him ragging the F**k out of that Sky commentator and I could tell he was just as pissed off as the rest of us.

He'll know he fu**ed up and in one of the worst possible matches. There's no reason he'd act like that otherwise.

Lesson learnt, hopefully.

Going to be honest I was pissed at Klopp until I saw his interview and saw him ragging the f**k out of that Sky commentator and I could tell he was just as pissed off as the rest of us.

He'll know he fu**ed up and in one of the worst possible matches. There's no reason he'd act like that otherwise.

Lesson learnt, hopefully.

How did Klopp f**k up?  We pummeled them.  Had Mane squared the ball, no one would be complaining.  Had Lovren headed clear or not gotten handsy, no one would be complaining.  Klopp didn't f**k up -- 2 of his players fu**ed up.  I'm sure he will have had a word with both in private, as it should be done. 

How did Klopp f**k up?  We pummeled them.  Had Mane squared the ball, no one would be complaining.  Had Lovren headed clear or not gotten handsy, no one would be complaining.  Klopp didn't f**k up -- 2 of his players fu**ed up.  I'm sure he will have had a word with both in private, as it should be done. 

This!

How did Klopp f**k up?  We pummeled them.  Had Mane squared the ball, no one would be complaining.  Had Lovren headed clear or not gotten handsy, no one would be complaining.  Klopp didn't f**k up -- 2 of his players fu**ed up.  I'm sure he will have had a word with both in private, as it should be done. 

Because the game ended 1-1 and he'll know there was more in the squad available that could have potentially got the win.

Nothing wrong with constructive criticism, chill guys. Didn't say he was solely to blame did I?

Fair enough. This argument I can totally understand and see it completely from your perspective. Having watched us implode last Jan and Feb I can forgive Jürgen for being a little bit more cautious entering the heavy fixture list and some of our lads, especially in attack, have played a lot of minutes.

I used to be someone who didn't think rotation was necessary, I've since learned that it is absolutely necessary and expecting peak level performances day in, day out, is living in fantasy land. So Jürgen is learning and with that he may also be learning he needs a deeper squad, perhaps Solanke wasn't the right option, or leaving him on so long was quite possibly the wrong call but as said at the time, this is such an easy thing to say with the benefit of hindsight. Everton were creating nothing and had I been the manager I wouldn't have thought we needed a second, even though I thoroughly agree that 1-0 is always a dangerous lead, even more with our defence.

So yes, I totally see it from your perspective and I've no problem whatsoever with people levelling this criticism at Jürgen, as the result says, he got it wrong in the end but at 1-0 I can also completely understand the motivations behind each substitution. Maybe he'll learn from it, maybe it's just one of those things that is typical Liverpool, Fat Sam taking over just at the right time for them to sort their leaking defence, us just hitting enough minutes that players need to be protected a little and also a little bit of underestimating the opposition with the initial team selection.

However, with regards that last point, had Mane's chance been a goal then all this is moot and the bigger culprits out there who didn't fulfil their roles, or do enough with their chances, in my opinion, were Henderson and Milner. Henderson has got to the point with me where I'd rather see anyone but him, I'd even rather Karius in midfield I'm that sick of seeing his dire form at the moment. When that pass got squared to him by Coutinho, even accepting Henderson was in a better position, I doubt there was a person in the crowd who didn't know where that ball was ending up and frankly, given the time, the situation and opposition that shot summed him up in an instant. If the best you produce as captain, in the last minute of a Derby with a clear sight of goal, no real defender closing you down, is that embarrassment of a shot then I'm sorry the light bulb has to be going off in Jürgen's head that it's time to change because that lad simply crumbles under any weight of expectation. In horse racing terms he's a flat track bully, put him against sub standard opposition and he can hide, against quality, or with pressure he is not good enough.

Good post

How did Klopp f**k up?  We pummeled them.  Had Mane squared the ball, no one would be complaining.  Had Lovren headed clear or not gotten handsy, no one would be complaining.  Klopp didn't f**k up -- 2 of his players fu**ed up.  I'm sure he will have had a word with both in private, as it should be done.

Unless of course, he fielded the strongest side he had at his disposal, and regardless of the Mane non pass, and the awful peno decision, if we were 3 or 4 goals to the good, then neither would have mattered would they.
But would we have been 3 or 4 goals ahead ? Well the truth is we'll never know will we. But with the current form of both teams, the likelihood is, that we probably, or even possibly, would have been. By breaking up a formation which was on fire for the last 4 or 5 matches, you simply reduce the strike rate.
As sure as eggs are eggs, we would have caused them more problems with a full strength strike force.
And before we go into the iffs and buts, Henderson and Solanke do not offer the same impact or contribution in a game as, Coutinho and Firmino. Simple. 
So yes, Jürgen did F**k up.

With the much maligned Goalie & CB's the boss sure done a job to get us where he has..

Credit him for that..

Unless of course, he fielded the strongest side he had at his disposal, and regardless of the Mane non pass, and the awful peno decision, if we were 3 or 4 goals to the good, then neither would have mattered would they.
But would we have been 3 or 4 goals ahead ? Well the truth is we'll never know will we. But with the current form of both teams, the likelihood is, that we probably, or even possibly, would have been. By breaking up a formation which was on fire for the last 4 or 5 matches, you simply reduce the strike rate.
As sure as eggs are eggs, we would have caused them more problems with a full strength strike force.
And before we go into the iffs and buts, Henderson and Solanke do not offer the same impact or contribution in a game as, Coutinho and Firmino. Simple. 
So yes, Jürgen did f**k up.

He can't play the same 11 players 50x a season.  Klopp has to rotate to keep players fresh. 

Was it technically our strongest 11?  No.  However, prior to this match Bobby had played more minutes than any other LFC player this season -- he needed a break.  Coutinho had a knock, and it was decided not to risk him from the start. 

Klopp's "decisions" (ignoring the fact that they were kind of necessary) didn't cost us the 2 points.  The 11 players he sent out had more than enough quality to win the match, and should have done so.  It was only down to 2 moments of poor judgement (Mane and Lovren) along with a harsh referee's decision that cost us the 2 points. 

Klopp isn't infallible -- I've criticised him plenty at times -- but he isn't to blame this time.  That's only my opinion of course.  You've got every right to voice your opinion on the forum.  I just disagree. 

Cheers mate 😎

With the much maligned Goalie & CB's the boss sure done a job to get us where he has..

Credit him for that..

You're talking like he's been cursed with them and has no choice but to play them.. he had plenty of time to do a 'chemo' on them

Any criticism of Klopp has to be tempered with the individual errors by Lovren, Moreno, Migs and others to a lesser extent.

But regardless of the score V Everton I would say It was wrong leaving out Bob. Think Klopp was thinking this Derby thing is..." an English thing" He mentioned something about having English players in the team. But if that influenced his decision then that was nonsense. The local Derby might mean I bit more to Carra and other Liverpool born players but it should not influence any managers decisions on team selection.

I thought we played very well and showed we have enough to break down teams who sit deep with numbers. That was very telling for me. I have seen us stutter and scrap about getting nowhere fast against packed defenses, but this squad can find a way.

But will Klopp pick the right combination game in game out, if he gets it 80% or better right then we should do well...any less and it will be a tightrope walk again.

Any criticism of Klopp has to be tempered with the individual errors by Lovren, Moreno, Migs and others to a lesser extent.

But regardless of the score V Everton I would say It was wrong leaving out Bob. Think Klopp was thinking this Derby thing is..." an English thing" He mentioned something about having English players in the team. But if that influenced his decision then that was nonsense. The local Derby might mean I bit more to Carra and other Liverpool born players but it should not influence any managers decisions on team selection.

I thought we played very well and showed we have enough to break down teams who sit deep with numbers. That was very telling for me. I have seen us stutter and scrap about getting nowhere fast against packed defenses, but this squad can find a way.

But will Klopp pick the right combination game in game out, if he gets it 80% or better right then we should do well...any less and it will be a tightrope walk again.

Moreno didn't play and Migs didn't make any mistakes at all, come on play fair now ;-)

How did Klopp f**k up?  We pummeled them.  Had Mane squared the ball, no one would be complaining.  Had Lovren headed clear or not gotten handsy, no one would be complaining.  Klopp didn't f**k up -- 2 of his players fu**ed up.  I'm sure he will have had a word with both in private, as it should be done. 

Because Mane's pass  didn't happen. (I hope to God that he was given the bollocking of all bollockings) And Fart Brain had a brain fart. Jürgen  picked the players who f****d up.

I would have thought it was quite obvious that Jürgen fu**ed up on Sunday - his reaction towards the Sky fella interviewing him didn’t stem from a poor ref decision, he was clearly angry with himself for choosing the wrong team and making poor substitutions.

It’s fine it happens - I’ll bet my house that he’ll learn his lesson and go full strength in the Cup game.

Because Mane's pass  didn't happen. (I hope to God that he was given the bollocking of all bollockings) And Fart Brain had a brain fart. Jürgen  picked the players who f****d up.

He picked the players that played well too (like Salah) so I'm not sure your point really makes much sense.

Thing that bothers me is by now Klopp knows we can't defend a 1-0 lead so why take off the only striker who was on form

Thing that bothers me is by now Klopp knows we can't defend a 1-0 lead so why take off the only striker who was on form

Resting Salah a bit before tomorrow?

Or should he just run all of our players into the ground and have them injured come time for Champion's League?

Moreno didn't play and Migs didn't make any mistakes at all, come on play fair now ;-)

I was referring to mistakes they make from time to time, for example Moreno made almost the same mistake as Lovren when he shuvved a Seville player in the back, in the box, giving away a very similar penalty. Sorry if you thought I meant in the Everton game.

Interesting comments from Klopp in today's presser about all of this. He too, reminded about how badly we were affected by two key injuries last January and February, and also pointed out Mo was feeling something in his hamstring before being subbed off.

I also am glad he is not apologizing for his interview, noting "I am not an actor" and that at five minutes after the match, emotions were running high.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2017/dec/12/mohamed-salah-liverpool-rotation-policy-Jürgen-klopp

Resting Salah a bit before tomorrow?

Or should he just run all of our players into the ground and have them injured come time for Champion's League?

Neither. Klopp took a look at Everton's League position, looked at a few matches and decided they were sh*t, had no pace and judging them to be nothing more than a mid-table team, the substitutions were predetermined prior to the match. What should have happened is a double substitution involving Coutinho for Milner (who was playing sh*te) and Firmino for Solanke (who was ineffectual), allowing himself one final substitution to take off Salah once we'd scored that all important second goal.

What he does instead is take off our best goal scorer and biggest threat to Everton at 1-0, handing them a massive boost and blunting our attack in one fell swoop, whilst also substituting an attacking midfielder who was having a reasonable game, and, hardly having featured for us since signing, was the last player in need of a rest, whilst leaving on a defensive one who was playing crap against a team that had no interest in attacking us and therefore posed no threat to our midfield.

Rotation isn't the issue, it's when and where to rotate and it was the mid-week game against West Brom, the relegation threatened side not the side playing us in a Derby, one of the most anticipated and important games in any season, a game that you simply do not under any circumstances whatsoever, loose to the other side. By doing so, by underestimating the importance of the match, by removing our goal threat, he not only cost us the match but resulted in our dropping outside the top four, albeit with a game in hand, rather than capitalising on the weekend's results and moving to third in the table, three points behind United and putting huge pressure on their next game.

Klopp fu**ed up, no ifs, no buts, no two ways about it.