We need to talk about Henderson...

https://twitter.com/rajsinghchohan/status/933406860031545344

I get we might have rested Henderson for some 'easier' games but still an interesting stat.

The thing is though, its a regular occurrence, but some of you are just completely blinded by it.

I think it was KopiteLuke who said in the match thread that Henderson is the outfield version of Mignolet in that when you don't really need him, he's ok, his team mates can do the job for him....but when you need him most and when you rely on him and call upon him he's nowhere to be seen.

Couldn't have put it any better myself.

It was a truly abysmal performance from our 'captain' tonight. Beyond embarrassing for me.

Out of curiosity, can anybody name a game where Jordan Henderson has been our stand out performer? Head and shoulders above any other player on the pitch? I genuinely can't think of any.

It would be interesting to see how many times Henderson has won the motm poll on this forum. He signed in 2011 and I'd guess its less than 5.

... and he still carries the Captain's armband FFS.

I don't think he is good enough either, too many 6-10 performances, a few 7/10 and the occasional 8/10. You can apply that exact same thing to every single one of our CMs, they are hard working somewhat average players.

Despite having a lowish opinion of he lad I have to say the assassination of the player in here is a bit OTT for my liking. Just read some of it back.

He's not as bad as some make him out.

The definition of averageness is Henderson, so for a team looking to go places and win things he should be a squad player at best.

We have seen he can't play the DM role, he is more suited to the No 8 role but like Milner his first touch and ability to turn on the spin in tight spaces are non existent.

Exactly

Not sh*t and not top class, average/decent or a great squad player for a title challenging team.

I've been one of his biggest defenders since he arrived but this season it has become painfully obvious that injuries have ruined his box-to-box abilities.

He doesn't have the range of passing or tactical awareness to play deep like Stevie did. He is just a liability now. The fact that he remains first choice and captain is a sign of this club's ambition. If he's still a starter next season we have no chance.

I'm amazed that all the lazy pundits continue to moan about individual defenders rather than the complete abyss that is our midfield. An aging Lucas would be an immediate upgrade.

Not Henderson fault l blame mangers keep pick him people know on streets he sh*t

I'm amazed that all the lazy pundits continue to moan about individual defenders rather than the complete abyss that is our midfield. An aging Lucas would be an immediate upgrade.

It beggars belief Henderson still doesn't know when to push higher up and press or when to sit and anchor the midfield when we don't have the ball.

To me it suggests he cannot learn or he cannot adapt. He doesn't know what to do.

At one point in the game there was every Liverpool attacker in front of him, plus Milner, but he decides to run from his position to close down their defence. What the F**k? Leave it and drop back to stop their counter attack you numpty.

And don't get me started on his attacking play. I need to find the moment in the game where Moreno or Ox gives him the ball and he's in at least 15 metres of space but he just stands there, tries to find a pass sideways and then realises a couple seconds later he has space to move in to. How F***ing dim do you have to be to not have the spacial awareness that a Liverpool and England midfielder requires?

Can't wait for Keita and for the love of Fowler an actual no.6. I won't hold my breath, though.

For the time being I pray Emre gets the nod in that position. Not that he's the solution at all, but he adds some steel and tries to get the ball forward.

Gahhhhh.

Why was Hazard allowed to get a grip in midfield second half. Where was captain marvellous, and why wasn't he either delegating someone to climb all over hazard, or why wasn't he doing it himself.
FFS you wouldn't let a player of any quality boss a midfield in a sunday league match without someone shadowing him to at least lessen the threat. But we've got Hendo, who vanishes when someone a bit decent shows up.
 Mesut Ozil anyone ? he'd be a massive  plus going forward, but would his defensive duties be any better ?
Gotta be someone out there, and I fear when Keita comes on board, hendo will still be in the mix, because Can will be on the move.
Still need another D/M next season, or Jan even.

Why was Hazard allowed to get a grip in midfield second half. Where was captain marvellous, and why wasn't he either delegating someone to climb all over hazard, or why wasn't he doing it himself.
FFS you wouldn't let a player of any quality boss a midfield in a sunday league match without someone shadowing him to at least lessen the threat. But we've got Hendo, who vanishes when someone a bit decent shows up.
 Mesut Ozil anyone ? he'd be a massive  plus going forward, but would his defensive duties be any better ?
Gotta be someone out there, and I fear when Keita comes on board, hendo will still be in the mix, because Can will be on the move.
Still need another D/M next season, or Jan even.

Name me five defensive midfielders that can do a better job than Hendo

Another spineless performance from our captain on Saturday, 2 or 3 games on the bounce now adding to the previous 10 or so this season.

Whats starting to annoy me is that some people are saying he needs to play further up the field as our 8. No. He isn't good enough. Look at all the players in the top sides  around Europe who play in that position and if you think Henderson is on par with them or has the potential to be then you're completely deluded. If you accept he isn't but want him there anyway then I question your ambition for our club.

Don't make excuses about his injuries either. He has always been a very limited and basic footballer and at this stage in his career he isn't going to drastically improve.

His one and only asset is his engine and ability to cover ground but it becomes irrelevant when he can't read the game or tackle properly.

I actually think we will start seeing better performances from him once lallana is back in the middle with him and I'm sure his fan boys will say how great he is once more but don't be fooled, this is just yet another case of other players carrying him.

I've never seen Henderson out perform anybody in our team. I've never seen a man of the match performance from him and for our own captain I think that's quite shocking to honest. Somebody feel free and correct me if I'm wrong and list all the games where he has been our best player.

For me, klopp has one more year. He should have been ruthless in the summer but wasn't and his trust in this Brendan Rodgers squad will ultimately cost him his job.

In the summer, he should be saying to the likes of Jordan Henderson that you're not good enough to be in my first 11, you're not good enough to captain my team, so it's bench for you or you're being sold - pick one.

I'd have him in the squad, I think he can fill in every now and then when Keita is injured or whatever, but he shouldn't be first choice and he definitely should be nowhere near that armband.

Your captain is the first name on your team sheet and Jordan Henderson is definitely not that.

Well said mate

Another spineless performance from our captain on Saturday, 2 or 3 games on the bounce now adding to the previous 10 or so this season.

Whats starting to annoy me is that some people are saying he needs to play further up the field as our 8. No. He isn't good enough. Look at all the players in the top sides  around Europe who play in that position and if you think Henderson is on par with them or has the potential to be then you're completely deluded. If you accept he isn't but want him there anyway then I question your ambition for our club.

Don't make excuses about his injuries either. He has always been a very limited and basic footballer and at this stage in his career he isn't going to drastically improve.

His one and only asset is his engine and ability to cover ground but it becomes irrelevant when he can't read the game or tackle properly.

I actually think we will start seeing better performances from him once lallana is back in the middle with him and I'm sure his fan boys will say how great he is once more but don't be fooled, this is just yet another case of other players carrying him.

I've never seen Henderson out perform anybody in our team. I've never seen a man of the match performance from him and for our own captain I think that's quite shocking to honest. Somebody feel free and correct me if I'm wrong and list all the games where he has been our best player.

For me, klopp has one more year. He should have been ruthless in the summer but wasn't and his trust in this Brendan Rodgers squad will ultimately cost him his job.

In the summer, he should be saying to the likes of Jordan Henderson that you're not good enough to be in my first 11, you're not good enough to captain my team, so it's bench for you or you're being sold - pick one.

I'd have him in the squad, I think he can fill in every now and then when Keita is injured or whatever, but he shouldn't be first choice and he definitely should be nowhere near that armband.

Your captain is the first name on your team sheet and Jordan Henderson is definitely not that.

This all day for me, but the only thing I would add is you could apply that to our whole midfield really and it becomes a case of where do you start.

We won’t be replacing them all in one summer but everyone of them could be upgraded upon quite easily imo.

Name me five defensive midfielders that can do a better job than Hendo

Kante, Wanyama, Drinkwater, Fernandinho, I'd even go for Clucas at Hull. They do their job, and just their job. Don't over do it, don't go missing in games, and protect their back line before anything else. Just what they're put out there for.
They might not cover the ground Hendo does, perhaps bar Kante, but they are effective in what they do. and they give the ball simple, but do lay attacking passes when the opportunity arises. You know, them passes that Hendo doesn't see !

It beggars belief Henderson still doesn't know when to push higher up and press or when to sit and anchor the midfield when we don't have the ball.

To me it suggests he cannot learn or he cannot adapt. He doesn't know what to do.

At one point in the game there was every Liverpool attacker in front of him, plus Milner, but he decides to run from his position to close down their defence. What the f**k? Leave it and drop back to stop their counter attack you numpty.

And don't get me started on his attacking play. I need to find the moment in the game where Moreno or Ox gives him the ball and he's in at least 15 metres of space but he just stands there, tries to find a pass sideways and then realises a couple seconds later he has space to move in to. How f**king dim do you have to be to not have the spacial awareness that a Liverpool and England midfielder requires?

Can't wait for Keita and for the love of Fowler an actual no.6. I won't hold my breath, though.

For the time being I pray Emre gets the nod in that position. Not that he's the solution at all, but he adds some steel and tries to get the ball forward.

Gahhhhh.

Brilliant Post .

It beggars belief Henderson still doesn't know when to push higher up and press or when to sit and anchor the midfield when we don't have the ball.

To me it suggests he cannot learn or he cannot adapt. He doesn't know what to do.

At one point in the game there was every Liverpool attacker in front of him, plus Milner, but he decides to run from his position to close down their defence. What the f**k? Leave it and drop back to stop their counter attack you numpty.

And don't get me started on his attacking play. I need to find the moment in the game where Moreno or Ox gives him the ball and he's in at least 15 metres of space but he just stands there, tries to find a pass sideways and then realises a couple seconds later he has space to move in to. How f**king dim do you have to be to not have the spacial awareness that a Liverpool and England midfielder requires?

Can't wait for Keita and for the love of Fowler an actual no.6. I won't hold my breath, though.

For the time being I pray Emre gets the nod in that position. Not that he's the solution at all, but he adds some steel and tries to get the ball forward.

Gahhhhh.

^ This for me.

To me this is simple. Can he get into City, Scum, Plastics, Spuds, Arse's teams? No chance and therefore he should not be playing for us.

Saw Jürgen was speaking about this again today.
Guess you could argue, well, what else is he going to say about it in public to journos.
But still think Hendo's doing what Jürgen wants him to and don't think the manager has anyone else in mind to take his place as captain - not from current squad.
In saying that his form has gone down a bit, so could be doing with a good performance on Sunday.

Jürgen quotes:
"I live in this city and I get it a little bit sometimes how people are talking about it," said Klopp.
"I want everyone to respect that Jordan Henderson is our skipper because he deserved it and he is the right man for the job. That doesn't mean he can play all the games.
"Sorry. He is such an important player for us - I don't get why I have to say that."
"I only spoke about it because I knew people would say, 'Oh yes, fantastic game (against Spartak). Jordan didn't play so make a sh** story of it'.
They are sh** stories. Actually it is no story apart from in England and especially in Liverpool it is a story. Now I have said a little bit about it, the story is done."

Brain is flippin mush after the work Xmas party last night.  Didn't thro up today which is a plus.

Saw Jürgen was speaking about this again today.
Guess you could argue, well, what else is he going to say about it in public to journos.
But still think Hendo's doing what Jürgen wants him to and don't think the manager has anyone else in mind to take his place as captain - not from current squad.
In saying that his form has gone down a bit, so could be doing with a good performance on Sunday.

Jürgen quotes:
"I live in this city and I get it a little bit sometimes how people are talking about it," said Klopp.
"I want everyone to respect that Jordan Henderson is our skipper because he deserved it and he is the right man for the job. That doesn't mean he can play all the games.
"Sorry. He is such an important player for us - I don't get why I have to say that."
"I only spoke about it because I knew people would say, 'Oh yes, fantastic game (against Spartak). Jordan didn't play so make a sh** story of it'.
They are sh** stories. Actually it is no story apart from in England and especially in Liverpool it is a story. Now I have said a little bit about it, the story is done."

Brain is flippin mush after the work Xmas party last night.  Didn't thro up today which is a plus.

When you see hendo play were in a 4-3-3 with him staying back and covering with the two CB's while the RB/LB are usually bombing on....you watch when Can plays back there we play a 4-4-2 or a 4-3-3 with 2 deep and 1 forward in the mid, or a 4-4-2 both formation will have a partner back there with him.

Henderson must wonder why he never get's a partner to work with and help cover.

Tells me the manager trusts him by himself...everybody else needs a partner.

^ This for me.

To me this is simple. Can he get into City, Scum, Plastics, Spuds, Arse's teams? No chance and therefore he should not be playing for us.

Well the Scum...United you mean, they played Carrick for years and he has a worse goal scoring record than Henderson and Fergie once said they were tempted to bid for Henderson before Kenny bought him.

I say he could get into United, Arsenal, Spurs, Plastics squad. I see him as an important player, more than worth his place in the midfield squad. People who constantly knock Hendo keep expecting him to do stuff that he isn't capable of. Klopp knows what he gets from Henderson. He knows...and he'll play him in his position and he knows what he gets.

But because we rightly demand a lot from everybody at the club Henderson will have to live with constant criticism...no real harm in that, goes with the territory.

Willing to weigh in on this one, considering there are so many spouting vile obsecenties about Henderson - if he's not the right man to do it, well who is?

Admittedly he has not been in his best run of form, but was Gerrard always magic? If you search yourself the answer will reveal that our former skipper also came with his rough patches too, albeit being incredibly gifted as a footballer.

Henderson is a solid midfielder, I'm a fan of his tidying up and little touches that will go over the heads of the anti-hendo clan. Let me go in to the day of the Southampton game - there I was anticipating kick off stood around many other Kopites checking their accumulators and taking a big bite out of their pies. When suddenly I hear "Jordan Henderson is not fit to lace Souness' boots." To a couple of this fellas mates, they were all in agreement.

So what does that mean exactly? In truth, he probably should have said he's not fit to lace Gerrard's. But are we too ahead of oursevles in what we expect in the here and now compared to the days gone by?

What I heard infuriated me and this is the biggest problem amongst our fans (except privileged little fucks with smartphones on twitter who believe they have a validated opinion from watching 2 minute clips) we are simply setting the bar too high, too soon. We must work with what we have, and right now our best leaders aren't house-hold names, Jordan Henderson, James Milner, Adam Lallana. We have had the privilege through the years of some of our best players, as our best leaders. The Hansens, the Dalishes, the Gerrard's, the Souness'. Now the gauntlet falls to an established player within our first team, who is clearly the most equipped for the job. Has been his whole career.

If you're looking for a house-hold name, maybe Coutinho should be your captain, but would he bring leadership? Maybe by example - but is his heart in it? So, so.

So do we bring in another player who could lead? Van Dijk? A future upcoming academy player who knows deep down to his make-up what it is to be a red?

Henderson is fine. We're looking for someone to blame constantly for not being where we want to be, and because the pressure of being Liverpool captain brings, it really is one of the toughest jobs in world football.

What he does to respond to this wide spanning criticism will define Hendo's season, infact - Liverpool career going forward. I'm not always sure he's fully fit to play, and that is the only factor that makes me believe, yes one day it will be someone else. But who?

Answers on a postcard. Gone are the days of Carra, Gerrard, the leaders of this generation gone by, the dawn of the new - possible transition period of our next leaders begins.

Will it be Henderson in 2 seasons time? Maybe. Time will tell. He's going to have to let the results and his future performances be the deciding factor in this.

Jordan Henderson is an important player for us, we should support him, not discourage. That's not who we are. This is not the Liverpool way.

He's a dedicated professional no doubt. He'll be our Achilles heel when it really matters, in those finals. It could be construed as nastiness people taking digs at him, it's fans who know what he's like and have seen enough.

He'll probably have a good game against Everton.

The problem is, he's too dim. That's what it boils down to, so are Migs and Lovren. Need some intelligence on the pitch, some sophistication and finesse to play with the big boys. He's too clumsy to be the brute enforcer.

All he does is panic when he gets the ball these days.
 

Willing to weigh in on this one, considering there are so many spouting vile obsecenties about Henderson - if he's not the right man to do it, well who is?

Admittedly he has not been in his best run of form, but was Gerrard always magic? If you search yourself the answer will reveal that our former skipper also came with his rough patches too, albeit being incredibly gifted as a footballer.

Henderson is a solid midfielder, I'm a fan of his tidying up and little touches that will go over the heads of the anti-hendo clan. Let me go in to the day of the Southampton game - there I was anticipating kick off stood around many other Kopites checking their accumulators and taking a big bite out of their pies. When suddenly I hear "Jordan Henderson is not fit to lace Souness' boots." To a couple of this fellas mates, they were all in agreement.

So what does that mean exactly? In truth, he probably should have said he's not fit to lace Gerrard's. But are we too ahead of oursevles in what we expect in the here and now compared to the days gone by?

What I heard infuriated me and this is the biggest problem amongst our fans (except privileged little fucks with smartphones on twitter who believe they have a validated opinion from watching 2 minute clips) we are simply setting the bar too high, too soon. We must work with what we have, and right now our best leaders aren't house-hold names, Jordan Henderson, James Milner, Adam Lallana. We have had the privilege through the years of some of our best players, as our best leaders. The Hansens, the Dalishes, the Gerrard's, the Souness'. Now the gauntlet falls to an established player within our first team, who is clearly the most equipped for the job. Has been his whole career.

If you're looking for a house-hold name, maybe Coutinho should be your captain, but would he bring leadership? Maybe by example - but is his heart in it? So, so.

So do we bring in another player who could lead? Van Dijk? A future upcoming academy player who knows deep down to his make-up what it is to be a red?

Henderson is fine. We're looking for someone to blame constantly for not being where we want to be, and because the pressure of being Liverpool captain brings, it really is one of the toughest jobs in world football.

What he does to respond to this wide spanning criticism will define Hendo's season, infact - Liverpool career going forward. I'm not always sure he's fully fit to play, and that is the only factor that makes me believe, yes one day it will be someone else. But who?

Answers on a postcard. Gone are the days of Carra, Gerrard, the leaders of this generation gone by, the dawn of the new - possible transition period of our next leaders begins.

Will it be Henderson in 2 seasons time? Maybe. Time will tell. He's going to have to let the results and his future performances be the deciding factor in this.

Jordan Henderson is an important player for us, we should support him, not discourage. That's not who we are. This is not the Liverpool way.

Simple fact is he's not consistent enough, a fine performance one week followed by going awol the next, I've said this before I'm going to say it again Jordan Henderson is a good player and has been a top professional for Lfc,
However, that is at a level where we were content to finish behind Mancs, Chelsea, Arsenal Citeh, etc,
Where reaching a top 4 spot was deemed a good season and in some eyes a achievement, but id like to think we have moved up a level where we can compete with the top most clubs in the Epl for the title each and every season and obviously the CL , Henderson has imo reached his peak both in terms of ability and leadership, same as your Lovren's your Mignolet's, they are not good enough to take us forward, we need players of a higher class that will take us up another level again,
Building a winning side takes years we are in that process with Jürgen, he is building a winning side but along the way he has to work with player's that will be jettisoned to make way for better players,

Henderson is just a part of that process, a good player but simply put no longer good enough to where we are heading.


YNWA

Willing to weigh in on this one, considering there are so many spouting vile obsecenties about Henderson - if he's not the right man to do it, well who is?

Admittedly he has not been in his best run of form, but was Gerrard always magic? If you search yourself the answer will reveal that our former skipper also came with his rough patches too, albeit being incredibly gifted as a footballer.

Henderson is a solid midfielder, I'm a fan of his tidying up and little touches that will go over the heads of the anti-hendo clan. Let me go in to the day of the Southampton game - there I was anticipating kick off stood around many other Kopites checking their accumulators and taking a big bite out of their pies. When suddenly I hear "Jordan Henderson is not fit to lace Souness' boots." To a couple of this fellas mates, they were all in agreement.

So what does that mean exactly? In truth, he probably should have said he's not fit to lace Gerrard's. But are we too ahead of oursevles in what we expect in the here and now compared to the days gone by?

What I heard infuriated me and this is the biggest problem amongst our fans (except privileged little fucks with smartphones on twitter who believe they have a validated opinion from watching 2 minute clips) we are simply setting the bar too high, too soon. We must work with what we have, and right now our best leaders aren't house-hold names, Jordan Henderson, James Milner, Adam Lallana. We have had the privilege through the years of some of our best players, as our best leaders. The Hansens, the Dalishes, the Gerrard's, the Souness'. Now the gauntlet falls to an established player within our first team, who is clearly the most equipped for the job. Has been his whole career.

If you're looking for a house-hold name, maybe Coutinho should be your captain, but would he bring leadership? Maybe by example - but is his heart in it? So, so.

So do we bring in another player who could lead? Van Dijk? A future upcoming academy player who knows deep down to his make-up what it is to be a red?

Henderson is fine. We're looking for someone to blame constantly for not being where we want to be, and because the pressure of being Liverpool captain brings, it really is one of the toughest jobs in world football.

What he does to respond to this wide spanning criticism will define Hendo's season, infact - Liverpool career going forward. I'm not always sure he's fully fit to play, and that is the only factor that makes me believe, yes one day it will be someone else. But who?

Answers on a postcard. Gone are the days of Carra, Gerrard, the leaders of this generation gone by, the dawn of the new - possible transition period of our next leaders begins.

Will it be Henderson in 2 seasons time? Maybe. Time will tell. He's going to have to let the results and his future performances be the deciding factor in this.

Jordan Henderson is an important player for us, we should support him, not discourage. That's not who we are. This is not the Liverpool way.

So your defence of him is that he's solid, is the best of a bad bunch and you don't even know if he'll be captain in two years?

Would Gerrard be left out of a Champions League game for rotation purposes with qualification on the line? Would ANY other club leave their captain out in such a big game?

Willing to weigh in on this one, considering there are so many spouting vile obsecenties about Henderson - if he's not the right man to do it, well who is?

Admittedly he has not been in his best run of form, but was Gerrard always magic? If you search yourself the answer will reveal that our former skipper also came with his rough patches too, albeit being incredibly gifted as a footballer.

Henderson is a solid midfielder, I'm a fan of his tidying up and little touches that will go over the heads of the anti-hendo clan. Let me go in to the day of the Southampton game - there I was anticipating kick off stood around many other Kopites checking their accumulators and taking a big bite out of their pies. When suddenly I hear "Jordan Henderson is not fit to lace Souness' boots." To a couple of this fellas mates, they were all in agreement.

So what does that mean exactly? In truth, he probably should have said he's not fit to lace Gerrard's. But are we too ahead of oursevles in what we expect in the here and now compared to the days gone by?

What I heard infuriated me and this is the biggest problem amongst our fans (except privileged little fucks with smartphones on twitter who believe they have a validated opinion from watching 2 minute clips) we are simply setting the bar too high, too soon. We must work with what we have, and right now our best leaders aren't house-hold names, Jordan Henderson, James Milner, Adam Lallana. We have had the privilege through the years of some of our best players, as our best leaders. The Hansens, the Dalishes, the Gerrard's, the Souness'. Now the gauntlet falls to an established player within our first team, who is clearly the most equipped for the job. Has been his whole career.

If you're looking for a house-hold name, maybe Coutinho should be your captain, but would he bring leadership? Maybe by example - but is his heart in it? So, so.

So do we bring in another player who could lead? Van Dijk? A future upcoming academy player who knows deep down to his make-up what it is to be a red?

Henderson is fine. We're looking for someone to blame constantly for not being where we want to be, and because the pressure of being Liverpool captain brings, it really is one of the toughest jobs in world football.

What he does to respond to this wide spanning criticism will define Hendo's season, infact - Liverpool career going forward. I'm not always sure he's fully fit to play, and that is the only factor that makes me believe, yes one day it will be someone else. But who?

Answers on a postcard. Gone are the days of Carra, Gerrard, the leaders of this generation gone by, the dawn of the new - possible transition period of our next leaders begins.

Will it be Henderson in 2 seasons time? Maybe. Time will tell. He's going to have to let the results and his future performances be the deciding factor in this.

Jordan Henderson is an important player for us, we should support him, not discourage. That's not who we are. This is not the Liverpool way.

This is just drivel to honest.

Regardless of whether there are no other candidates for the armband or not (in your opinion) that doesn't justify Jordan Henderson having it or being a starting player for us.

We set the standard too high as fans you say? That is part of the problem and one of the reasons why we don't win trophies any more.

We who set the standards 'too high' aren't a problem. It's fans such as yourself who have now accepted mediocrity and believe that the likes of Jordan Henderson are 'important players' for us.

We aren't Stoke City or Everton FFS. We are Liverpool. We should always demand the best. We are a huge, huge club and there is no reason why we shouldn't.

Of course Stevie had a bad game from time to time but they were rare during his prime years so don't make out he often went through bad runs of form because he didn't. He constantly carried us throughout his career. Jordan Henderson is human and we all expect him to have an off game every now and then but it's far too often. His good games aren't enough for a club like Liverpool either.

It is unfair to compare Henderson to Gerrard because Stevie was undoubtfully the best of his generation but to play for Liverpool you need to consistently perform well and that's something Jordan doesn't  do. We need 7, 8, 9 out of 10 performances from him week in week out.

I suppose it boils down to opinion but I see 5/6 performances from Henderson each week. In his 7 seasons here he has probably given us a few 7s, a couple of 8s, I don't think I've ever seen a 9 out of him and I definitely haven't seen him deliver a 10. Let's not forget the occasional 2s and 3s he puts in too which occur much more than the 7s.

None of our rivals would have him if they were given the choice. No European giant are going to swarm in and bid 50m for him in January. If we wanted to sell him it would be the likes of Newcastle and Swansea coming in for him because guess what? That's the standard he is at.

Any red who wants Jordan Henderson to be a big part of our future and to remain captain then I personally question your ambition for the club. He isn't good enough and anybody who thinks he is are just kidding themselves.