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      Q. LFC Man of the Match v Arsenal?

      Simon Mignolet
      4 (4.3%)
      Joe Gomez
      0 (0%)
      Ragnar Klavan
      3 (3.3%)
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      Andy Robertson
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      11 (12%)
      Roberto Firmino
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      0 (0%)
      Georginio Wijnaldum
      1 (1.1%)
      James Milner
      3 (3.3%)

      Total Members Voted: 91

      Voting closed: Dec 26, 2017 09:47:51 pm

      Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion

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      Roddenberry
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #540: Dec 25, 2017 05:33:55 pm
      not sure i follow all that jaga. We just need a better goalie. Simples.

      To be honest, I'm in no way shocked that you failed to comprehend something.
      stuey
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #541: Dec 25, 2017 05:53:20 pm
      Unfortunately it is not as black and white as you've tried to paint it, it's more Jekyll & Hyde. No team has conceded fewer goals at home than us and that, no matter how you try to spin it, is damn impressive in this league. As is the fact that no team has scored more than us away from home either. If we could marry these two together, hiding the Hyde so to speak, we would be a true force. The Hyde to our good doctor though is that only three teams in the top half have less goals than us and only two teams have conceded more away from howe.

      I wish the problem was as binary as you imply, it simply isn't.

      It is as simple a solution as implied, spend some real money on established players who can
      make a tangible difference to our midfield and defence.
      Roddenberry
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #542: Dec 25, 2017 06:17:43 pm
      It is as simple a solution as implied, spend some real money on established players who can
      make a tangible difference to our midfield and defence.


      The best home defence in the league.
      stuey
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #543: Dec 25, 2017 08:27:42 pm
      The best home defence in the league.

      Is that the reason we lead the trailing pack by twenty points??

      That misrepresentation above is akin to your trying to attach any kind of kudos to our current Premierrship standing.
      How many supporters I wonder would be as ecstatic about our defensive ills as you?

      One case in point - a goalkeeper who is guaranteed to strip away our goals for tally with every appearance.
      Somebody is obviously misrepresenting some stats when Mignolet gets to be first choice week after week.and continues to sabotage our best attempts for success.

      You continue with your perverse opinion for  whatever agenda whilst we remain an also ran.
      « Last Edit: Dec 25, 2017 09:46:13 pm by stuey »
      Roddenberry
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #544: Dec 25, 2017 10:13:36 pm
      Is that the reason we lead the trailing pack by twenty points??

      That misrepresentation above is akin to your trying to attach any kind of kudos to our current Premierrship standing.
      How many supporters I wonder would be as ecstatic about our defensive ills as you?

      One case in point - a goalkeeper who is guaranteed to strip away our goals for tally with every appearance.
      Somebody is obviously misrepresenting some stats when Mignolet gets to be first choice week after week.and continues to sabotage our best attempts for success.

      You continue with your perverse opinion for  whatever agenda whilst we remain an also ran.

      I'm not defending the keeper or our defence, I am saying they can defend, they can perform, as us having the best home defence record, and as a team we give up very few chances, in the league attests to that. I just don't think changing just the keeper changes a lot. Our lack of goals at home concerns me as much as our frailty in defence away from home.

      I think the situation is a lot more complicated than who is our number 1.
      stuey
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #545: Dec 25, 2017 10:56:31 pm
      I'm not defending the keeper or our defence, I am saying they can defend, they can perform, as us having the best home defence record, and as a team we give up very few chances, in the league attests to that. I just don't think changing just the keeper changes a lot. Our lack of goals at home concerns me as much as our frailty in defence away from home.

      I think the situation is a lot more complicated than who is our number 1.

      A case in point is De Gea; the mancs would be no higher than mid-table but for his efforts in covering a sh*te defence, same story last season.
      Just an example of a player qualified to cover the demands and challenges his role presents.
      Roddenberry
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #546: Dec 25, 2017 11:31:00 pm
      A case in point is De Gea; the mancs would be no higher than mid-table but for his efforts in covering a sh*te defence, same story last season.
      Just an example of a player qualified to cover the demands and challenges his role presents.

      But it wouldn't solve the lack of goal scoring at home. As I said, just the keeper is not the answer.  Finding a way to replicate our home defensive performances away and our away striking record at home would be more beneficial.
      stuey
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #547: Dec 26, 2017 02:11:28 am
      But it wouldn't solve the lack of goal scoring at home. As I said, just the keeper is not the answer.  Finding a way to replicate our home defensive performances away and our away striking record at home would be more beneficial.

      Definitely shifting the goalposts there.
      It does appear however that you agree with the premise that 8 years of false economies continue to show our deficiencies.
      redkop63
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #548: Dec 26, 2017 05:58:30 am
      If we can't defend a 2 or 3 goal lead i would suggest we put 11 players inside our box until Klopp finds a way to fix the problem. Is there a rule against that?
      Roddenberry
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #549: Dec 26, 2017 09:02:54 am
      Definitely shifting the goalposts there.
      It does appear however that you agree with the premise that 8 years of false economies continue to show our deficiencies.

      No, I'm saying exactly what I said first time, maybe just in terms you could comprehend this time. As for false economies, I can't agree as it's been just as much a case of who and when as much as what and our economic level is a much lower one than the two Manchester clubs.
      stuey
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #550: Dec 26, 2017 09:32:13 am
      No, I'm saying exactly what I said first time, maybe just in terms you could comprehend this time.
      I fully understand and see the obvious diversionary attempt from the original premise, in an attempt to save a few million our present owners waffle and f**king lie continuously about giving us strength in depth while score lines such as this show what bollox  It all is.

      The frauds will not invest, the frauds will bullshit and be quite content with a reasonable return on their investment.

      Quote
      As for false economies, I can't agree as it's been just as much a case of who and when as much as what and our economic level is a much lower one than the two Manchester clubs.

      Yet more diversion.
      Roddenberry
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #551: Dec 26, 2017 09:41:26 am
      I fully understand and see the obvious diversionary attempt from the original premise, in an attempt to save a few million our present owners waffle and f**king lie continuously about giving us strength in depth while score lines such as this show what bollox  It all is.

      The frauds will not invest, the frauds will bullshit and be quite content with a reasonable return on their investment.

      Yet more diversion.


      Waffle to avoid the point being made.  Not surprised any more, lest not forget that you muddied the waters by bringing in owner talk in a discussion about our defensive and offensive plusses and minuses. It can't be fraud when they said they wouldn't invest their own money, I'm not saying it's a good thing, just pointing out the lie you are trying to spread.

      My original point still stands, not knocked over by you trying to evade the point,  just changing the keeper isn't the issue. The scoring issue at home isn't altered one iota by that. It's a hard truth to swallow, our defence, at home, has proven to be more than good enough, our heralded strike force hasn't been as effective at home. If we can marry our away strike record with our home defensive record, that would be a sight.
      stuey
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #552: Dec 26, 2017 12:47:07 pm
      Waffle to avoid the point being made.  Not surprised any more, lest not forget that you muddied the waters by bringing in owner talk in a discussion about our defensive and offensive plusses and minuses. It can't be fraud when they said they wouldn't invest their own money, I'm not saying it's a good thing, just pointing out the lie you are trying to spread.

      My original point still stands, not knocked over by you trying to evade the point,  just changing the keeper isn't the issue. The scoring issue at home isn't altered one iota by that. It's a hard truth to swallow, our defence, at home, has proven to be more than good enough, our heralded strike force hasn't been as effective at home. If we can marry our away strike record with our home defensive record, that would be a sight.

      Are you sure we are talking about the same team.
      Roddenberry
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #553: Dec 26, 2017 01:31:59 pm
      Are you sure we are talking about the same team.

      I'm talking about the premier league team with the best defensive home record and also the best atacking record away from home. Who are you talking about?
      stuey
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #554: Dec 27, 2017 09:31:45 am
      I'm talking about the premier league team with the best defensive home record and also the best atacking record away from home. Who are you talking about?

      I'm talking about LFC who currently lie 20 pts off the mark in spite of your very selective stats.
      Pippen
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #555: Dec 27, 2017 11:30:09 am
      Who else voted for Mig? I did it to p*ss off some here, but I am wondering what my three fellas thought. Misclicks?
      LondonRed83
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #556: Dec 27, 2017 11:41:20 am
      Who else voted for Mig? I did it to p*ss off some here, but I am wondering what my three fellas thought. Misclicks?

      What?
      Roddenberry
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #557: Dec 27, 2017 12:49:42 pm
      I'm talking about LFC who currently lie 20 pts off the mark in spite of your very selective stats.

      They aren't selective they're just true. That they don't fit in with your narrative  is what I think you find most upsetting.

      If you're talking about selective stats, the abnormality that is Man City's points total could certainly fall into that category.
      stuey
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #558: Dec 27, 2017 01:23:58 pm
      They aren't selective they're just true. That they don't fit in with your narrative  is what I think you find most upsetting.

      If you're talking about selective stats, the abnormality that is Man City's points total could certainly fall into that category.

      Talk sense man, how is me stating we are 20 pts off the lead "a narrative"?
      A statement of fact to counter your somewhat whimsical notion of a cast-iron defence which is just laughable.
      Roddenberry
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #559: Dec 27, 2017 03:48:01 pm
      Talk sense man, how is me stating we are 20 pts off the lead "a narrative"?
      A statement of fact to counter your somewhat whimsical notion of a cast-iron defence which is just laughable.


      If you can't understand how this current points tally is an abnormality, I now understand why the rest of this conversation has been out of your grasp.
      The Real Donavan Ried
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #560: Dec 27, 2017 04:38:10 pm
      The best home defence in the league.
      Means very little if you ship goals away from home...
      Roddenberry
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #561: Dec 27, 2017 08:55:55 pm
      Means very little if you ship goals away from home...

      Which is what I've been discussing, the discrepancy of our home and away defensive AND attacking record and how just replacing Mignolet will not rectify it. Didn't seem too complicated to me, but it clearly is.

      Yesterday went some to improve the goal scoring on the home front, but it's still something that needs sorting. For me, it doesn't help, on the home side, that the stadium feels like a museum inside, when it should a shrine for our current players and the weight of history detracts from trying to create more.
      tezmac
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #562: Dec 27, 2017 08:59:41 pm
      Certainly missing the Twelth man in the first half. ( sorry thought it was the Swansea thread)
      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #563: Dec 28, 2017 05:29:22 pm
      It’s fans like you that are holding the club back

      Always making excuses for failures. People keep saying we have world beaters up top

      Yet we are not fighting for the top?

      Why? Because the manager is wenger Mark 2. Someone who refuses to do the obvious, he’s had the summer window and failed in fixing our issues

      If you want to continue to accept failure, that’s fine. I dont judge anyone, but yes it is infuriating when the managers errors in the transfer market has cost us

      Again

      And Don’t you dare celebrate getting to the knockout stages, this isn’t spurs



      Don't you feel just a tad bit of a bellend coming out with all that sh*te lad?

      F**k sakes we're not at the slashing of wrists point yet!!
      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #564: Dec 28, 2017 05:31:08 pm
      Certainly missing the Twelth man in the first half. ( sorry thought it was the Swansea thread)

      Swansea on a Boxing Day!! The Twelfth Man was still sobering the f**k up :laugh:
      lfc across the water
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      Re: Arsenal 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #565: Jan 03, 2018 07:49:01 am
      What I wrote at the time

      ..........

      Quote from 5timesacharm
      There are ways of shutting up shop that send the ball in a forwards direction. Or a sideways direction and we all know we have a master of the sideways pass in the team. They have no need to throw themselves forward in a wave of attacks, they can keep possession of the ball for ten minutes and let things calm down before building up to attack again. As I've said before, when under the cosh they don't have to always attempt a counter attack, they can launch the ball into their corner, have one of the forwards keep it there while the defence reorganises itself in preparation for the next attack from which we're then in a much better position to counter attack. The dark arts are missing in our team. Players can start crumpling under the lightest of challenges and disrupt the opposition's rhythm - it's done often enough to us. Just because a sloppy ball played back results in a goal because our keeper has arms made of smoke doesn't mean we can't shut up shop, we simply have to learn how to do it properly.

      Klopp has said he would rather resign than do all that. Guardiola says the same. So that's what we play, 100mph all the time. Traditional British football style really, just with better players nowadays.

      We have tried to close games down before though. Sometimes it's worked, sometimes it hasn't. I can't say I like it very much because it's a gamble, it's not our natural game, it breaks our momentum, and when it's lost, it stays lost. And if the opposition take advantage of it as they have in the past, he gets stick for that also. Our game is designed to be 100mph football all the time. That's what we wanted from him, that's what he promised we would have, and this is it in action. And the table shows it works more often than it doesn't. At 50 quid a pop, it's full value for money.

      We know Migs isn't good enough, Klopp knows he's not good enough, he signed Karius to get rid of him after all, he has tried Bogdan, Ward, and Karius to replace him but none of them have been up to the job. However, if all these opponents are better than us, why aren't they beating us? Why aren't they ahead of us? Because every one of them has their own faults. As for City, they rarely keep a clean sheet. So let's stop eulogising about the scumbag that got Sadio Mane sent off. He's no Gordon Banks.

      Going into the game, most of us would have taken a point, and a point is what we got. It's now 13 games unbeaten, and it keeps us in the top 4 at halfway. They are the facts that matter. Stay there after another 19 games and it's job done, see you next season.

      Back to normal for the next game, playing against a side that won't move out of their own half. I'll be there for it, so please God we'll get the job done. It's about time we won at home again.

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