Cannabis

What is everyones thoughts on smoking Cannabis ?

The government are planning to upgrade  it from a catogory C to a catogory B drug which i think is pretty stupid.

I would say i smoke it about once a week or so and find it relaxing and an alternative to drinking alcohol which in many respects is much worse for you.

The main problem is mental health issues but its generally only a problem when smoking excessive amounts everyday for a long period of time.

I think its pretty hypocritical of people who drink alcohol....which most of us do, to condem cannibis when alcohol causes so many more problems apart from health issues such as anti social behaviour and the tendency for violence.

....by the way i would never touch any other drugs.

Your thoughts ?

I suppose its ok in moderation just like everything else, the long term side effects are only noticed on abusers of the drugs which differ from those that use it in moderation. I am not a big smoker and may take it every month or 6 weeks which is ok, I feel no addiction to it I find it good when I am under a lot of stress. I think personally alcohol is more of a problem for me as my social life at the moment is heavily revolved around drinking.

Only ever done it once. Find it rather boring. Prefer just drinking myself into oblivion than doing cannabis.

Obviously intoxicating your body in any way is gonna be bad, but IMO cannabis is much better than alcohol, not just in terms of health effects but also social issues. You don't really get any of the antisocial behaviour that you do with alcohol, and you don't get the hangovers either!

Much the same as other things that harm your body but we do em anyway. If I want to, I will and I think I should reserve a right to do it should I wish. I know the risks, I know the consequences but I make my own decision.

Well, this is an interesting topic. The government want to reclassified cannabis because in the last 5 to 10 years the substance itself has changed a lot.
Cannabis can be found in different forms: Hash, Grass or weed and finally the strongest form with sinsemilla, skunk.

The main thing been that there is more and more evidence between cannabis and mental health problems like schizophrenia, although for the pshychotic side of it is far less evident unless you have previous case in your family.

The thruth is, it's illegal and I wouldn't advice anyone to use it, especially with the kind of tricks that dealers use: for example, using hair spray to make it heavier more profitable, it will make it sticky but got little to do with quality. In fact the intensity of the smell of "skunk" for example,  appears to be no guide to the actual strength either.

I'm a project worker and work with drug addicts on a daily basis, if you do smoke it, be very careful, there are a lot of very very poor quality out there.

For good information about cannabis and other drugs there are plenty of good website out there, one of many very practical and bringing clear info is: http://www.talktofrank.com/home_html.aspx

People make their own decision, I don't touch it personally. Just for info, alcohol related disease kills around 40 000/year in the UK....

IMO alcohol is a much more damaging drug in terms of physical damage, emotional damage, violence, pressures on police etc.

Alcohol's legal because it can be taxed, as is smoking.  I'd be interested to hear of the number of deaths from cannabis per year - not much I'd bet.  Students have been smoking cannabis since the 60s I'd bet and I can safely walk down the street without being harrassed by schizophrenic pensioners.

The Government would much rather you were out getting smashed off your face - filling their coffers with your overpriced tax than sitting at home chatting sh*t and smoking an untaxable substance - this has nothing to do with the 'health concerns' and if you think it is then I'm afraid you really are soft in the head.

IMO alcohol is a much more damaging drug in terms of physical damage, emotional damage, violence, pressures on police etc.

Alcohol's legal because it can be taxed, as is smoking.  I'd be interested to hear of the number of deaths from cannabis per year - not much I'd bet.  Students have been smoking cannabis since the 60s I'd bet and I can safely walk down the street without being harrassed by schizophrenic pensioners.

The Government would much rather you were out getting smashed off your face - filling their coffers with your overpriced tax than sitting at home chatting sh*t and smoking an untaxable substance - this has nothing to do with the 'health concerns' and if you think it is then I'm afraid you really are soft in the head.

Excellent post mate i'm a regular smoker who enjoys the relaxing qualities of the drug,In my opinion alcohol does much more serious harm to peoples lives both from a physical and social standpoint, how many families do we all know of who's lives have been ruined by the governments drug of choice.
Prohibition of anything does'nt work just look at Chicago in the 1920's when the Volstead act was brought to fruition all it does is drive the substance underground and makes powerful millionaires out of dangerous sociopaths

Only done Cannabis a few times, doubt i will do it again though, i prefer to just have alcohol

I don't really know what all the fuss is about, probably what JD has said about the Government hyping up the bad side of things because they can't make tax money out of it. If it was so bad surely we'd hear about Ajax Amsterdam having the worst supporters in the world, no? Obviously people should only smoke when they're not going to drive/work etc, the same as alcohol, but until the day comes that you have to take a breath test before starting your car you should be trusted to be in full control of your capacities whether it be cannabis or alcohol.

Anyway, I have only smoked a few times since my university days, the last time being about 6-8 months ago. I don't drink to excess either like I did back then, but I do think I should have the right to do either if I want.... After all, you can't trust what the Government says, why should it be legal to destroy your body through smoking all the toxins in cigarettes or ingesting the sh*t they allow people to spray on their crops, the list is endless. Peace and liberty for all, dude. 

I can safely walk down the street without being harrassed by schizophrenic pensioners.

  That would be a funny image.

I watched an interesting programme a few weeks back about this (wanna be) reporter going to Amsterdam and working in one of the infamous cafes there. She'd never smoked it before and after her first shift, she tries her first spliff. After being told to have one or two pulls and then put it out so she can take time to see how she feels, she just carried on smoking it as she wasn't feeling anything straight away. Que a big whitie! She felt sick, felt paranoid and had the shakes. I'm sure some of you's know what that feels like? Anyway, after she got over her ordeal, she carried on experimenting a day later, but in moderation!! So then you could see herself really getting to grips about why a lot of people enjoy the occasional smoke. She was very relaxed, quite giggly and in a very pleasant mood. Not to mention quite partial to something sweet to eat...

Of course, this documentary was on with the major intention to show people the bad side of things, but there was no hiding the good side of things to it either. It's all about moderation. I know a few people who can't live without it and it's practically taken over their lives. I know a lot more people who have it now and again and they are as vibrant as ever with no effect on their character.

Any drug isn't good for your health, but everyone knows that anyway. Alcohol in my opinion causes a lot more trouble and is just as bad or worse. But as it's already been mentioned, tax plays a major role. I've always thought it would be funny if the argument whether cannabis should be legalised should turn on it's head and instead have an argument that alcohol should be illegal. Wonder how that would turn out?

Keeping sort of on-topic - the government takes around £8 billion from UK smokers in tax each year.  Treatment of smoking related illnesses costs the NHS around £1.6 billion.

Now do you wonder why the Government hasn't banned cigarettes?

Government Duty Receipts

Beer - £3 billion
Wine - £3 billion
Spirits - £2.5 billion

Keeping sort of on-topic - the government takes around £8 billion from UK smokers in tax each year.  Treatment of smoking related illnesses costs the NHS around £1.6 billion.

And yet they want to try & withdraw certain treatments for smokers. As far as I'm concerned us smokers have paid enough to be at the front of the queue when we need medical attention

In Canada there is always the debate about trying to make it legal to have small amounts of it and it is pretty much done everywhere and there isn't much enforcement done on it because the police are after more of the hard stuff like Coke, Meth and over the counter pills.

I my-self smoke a bit of the green, once every weekend is good enough for me because when I was in uni I did a lot more and it made me really lazy. If I am bored and not out (which seems the case now a days) I will get the hot knifes going then play video games to the wee hours of the morning and no harm done. Out drinking I can be a bit of a wreck like anyone who has a few too many causing physical harm to my-self and potentially to other if something or someone rubs me the wrong way.

Like someone said above moderation is the best way to things but like anything else not everyone can do it and their in lies the problems which occur.

wooo love it!
problem about it in Brazil is that buying drugs make you give money for whats one of the biggest problems in my country: violence. organized crime lives from selling drugs (not only canabis but a lot of others too, since they are all illegal) and nowadays they are a huge social problem, so buying it from them may get you thinking about where is your money going to. im lucky cause i have friends who are planting it on their houses, so i only have to buy from them when i want it :p but i dont smoke it that much actually, last time was in march, if im not mistaken, i only do it on special occasions with some good mates

One of my favourite topics.

I've been a regular smoker for some 20 years now. I used to be a lot heavier in my earlier days...when I say heavier, I mean I smoked a lot more than I do know. Never touched any other drugs as they never interested me.

I still smoke regularly but only 1 paper joints...does the trick but not on work nights, mainly on the weekends but it's at the end of the night after I've tucked the kids in bed for the night and it's my wind down relaxation time....having a spliff then lying on the couch watching the box.

I love it....I know I'll never give it up and it has always been my LFC matchday ritual to have one just before game time. It soothes the nerves just a little bit before the boys run out onto the ground. So when I get over there I'm hoping one of you wonderful people can hook me up

Haha knew you were getting in there Aussie mate!

You're all a bunch of bad stoners.




Especially you Aussie. 

Haha knew you were getting in there Aussie mate!

good habits are hard to break especially when you're not willing too

You're all a bunch of bad stoners.




Especially you Aussie. 

 

Why thankyou Court

good habits are hard to break especially when you're not willing too

never a truer word spoken.

The stuff will addle your brains....

The stuff will addle your brains....

Disagree, I like to think I post some good stuff on here, and some of my best posts have come whilst I'm stoned out my nut. It may make me ramble a bit sometimes but it certainly gets the old creative juices going.

this is an old thread but I would like to revitalize it! word up to my fellow smokers! There were some very good points on both sides in this thread, so pardon me if I say something thats already been said- ill try to quote it but i cant promise I'll catch everything

the reason I am re-hashing (pun intended) this thread is because I am curious as to what the cannabis situation is in the UK and other countries (Australia and Brazil I see are represented in this thread)... I know I could look it up but 1) the rules/regulations dont always paint a good picture and 2) I'd rather hear it from people

Over here in the states it differs from state to state with the feds popping their heads in every once in a while (Federal vs state sovereignty being a whole different issue). In Nebraska it is decriminalized, basically meaning if you have less than an ounce on your person you get a ticket pretty much like a parking ticket. But if I go home to Iowa, which borders Nebraska for those who don't know (and I don't blame you, I would flunk an England geography test), it isn't decriminalized meaning if any weed is found on me I can be royally fu**ed... usually the first offense is probation but still. Just curious what the rules are where everyone else resides

as for my thoughts on smoking cannabis, and I'll try to keep this short but it probably won't be, I just don't understand whatsoever why it isn't legal in the states. Here are my points, and forgive me if this seems like a bit of a rant because I'm trying to avoid a huge paper I have to write, and also because it probably is Smiley

1) 0 recorded overdoses. Ever. That involves every major hospital in the US since they started recording stuff way back when. While those are great quantifiable records, there have also been zero recorded overdoses worldwide dating as far back as recorded cannabis use (China sometime way back in the day). people do die and have died from using cannabis and doing stupid things (such as driving), and that's why it needs to be regulated and just not let everybody run wild with it, but cannabis has never been the sole reason for a person's death (unlike alcohol, caffeine, pain pills, cocaine, government-created heroine...)

2. The reasons for outlawing cannabis use in the states were racist and based in greed, mostly from lumber/paper and tobacco companies. I can expand if someone wants but I won't get too much into it for now

3. as SuperSkrtel said, this prohibition just creates criminals. The "Gateway drug" theory has been disproved by a number of studies, and many point to the fact that marijuana users have to deal with the criminal underground in order to get their plant. As a result, there is increased exposure to other drugs such as cocaine, etc. Just because it can be smoked doesn't mean they're related, especially since cannabis is found in nature whereas crack and heroine are man-made. Was milk my gateway drug to alcohol?? I also think that legalizing pot, especially in California, would help the drug cartel situation in Mexico immensely. Marijuana is currently one of the cartel's biggest dealings, and may even be their biggest. The situation in Mexico is scary, but by cutting out their MJ clientele it could greatly help out.

4. Economic. The debt of the US is ridiculous. Legalizing, IMO, would help out greatly. You tax it and you make billions. It would create a whole industry full of jobs and merchandise.

5. the "lazy" thing. Yeah, it can make you unmotivated. But the thing is, there are lazy people who don't smoke pot. Lazy people are going to be lazy regardless, and there are plenty of people who use pot and function in society. Some previous posts have said as much, it alters your mindstate just like alcohol so it needs to be used wisely.

Lastly, the criminal system is insane. The costs associated with the war on marijuana is ridiculous when you add up police time and keeping "criminals" incarcerated for minor drug crimes. Eliminating this aspect of the judicial system would not only free up money from not having to keep people in prison and court costs, it would also free up the police to focus on crimes that actually hurt people. You know, rape and murder and stuff. Also, how many people you hear of getting high and going home and beating their wives or children? And alcohol? <- hopefully I dont stir up any bad feelings/memories for anyone on that very serious subject, definitely not my intention

Man that was a long post! sorry everybody!  but hey I like talking about weed Smiley i'm hoping to stir a good convo as this is a subject I am interested in! As for me, wakin and bakin for liverpool games is easily one of my favorite things to do.  cool-smiley-027 chongin spliff there's a reason so many potheads are pacifists (yours truly included) and I think the world can use a little more peace  Smiley one love!

Everything in moderation , i thoroughly enjoy a one paper spliff when i get home from work each day . On the weekends i'll smoke a little more . There is nothing better than smokin a spliff before ya walk into a fillum

I've smoked weed basically every day since the last year of school (2007) except a couple of overseas holidays where I had no choice but to sober up. It's a dangerously hard routine to get out of if all your friends do it and the house you congregate at most has weed cycling through it like oxygen. We've got a few boys from Norwich crashing at my mates this year actually, and they are all stoners so they've fit in quite well and it's been interesting hearing about their lifestyles around it. When they got here and saw we smoke bongs every day they were amazed/disgusted as apparently joints are seen far more over in England. And the price, well, here in Adelaide SA an oz for example you can get for $250 which apparently translates to around $350 converted from pounds.

My rolling skills have increased in the few months they've been here, I'm about to have this joint to try and wake up.

The high you get from drugs is incredible, it's educational, a room of people on acid can be the most entertaining time of your life. I think weed is a gateway drug because the high you experience, with drugs like acid and shrooms too, they're all similar; you can feel it if you've done these drugs enough, it's why you smoke weed while on acid. BUT I think the most important thing with recreational drugs is that you have to be the kind of human that knows what he or she wants out of their experience without going overboard to get the most out of it. I mean musicians that get so high they make outstanding records will probably keep getting higher and taint their reputation. That's the hard part, knowing when to stop, something a stoner isn't programmed to do!

My rolling skills have increased in the few months they've been here, I'm about to have this joint to try and wake up.

haha I am with you on that, I started with blunts so I can roll those but my joint-rolling skills, while improving, are still pretty terrible. not sure why they were so disgusted with the bongs tho, bong rips are quality!

but yes, moderation and self-control are important. no clue why it isn't legal tho, as alcohol and painkillers, and even caffeine! are all abused on a daily basis. They say the withdrawals from caffeine are far more severe than that from quitting the herb

Every single friend i have made here in Eugene does it. Every one of them are wonderful, great people. No problems at all.

JD's post up above from a couple years back sums it up perfectly. The stuff is no worse than anything else, in fact its probably better than half the sh*t we are fed these days.

Do you find its still such a closed minded thing back in Adelaide, Del Boca? I always found in general most were much more closed minded - where here where im living in the US, i walked past someone having a toke right on the sidewalk at lunchtime, offered me some as well. Obviously illegal still, but its much more accepted by the general population.

As the man said moderation is the key not just with blow the same deal applies with everything -  booze,ciggies,coke.smack whatever over indulgence in any of these substances will do you in. With the emergence of the ultra strong synthetic super skunk variety of blow the word moderation is undermined to the extent that you cannot moderate this type of blow and the ironic thing is skunk is entirely man made as are the lethal substances mentioned earlier.
Man has mutated nature and transformed relatively harmless distractions into lethal forms of entertainment as is his masochistic want, on a personal level I smoked various types of weed all my life in varying strengths and decided to stop when the skunk took over being as it was ever more accessible and easy to aquire, gone were the days of a relaxed drink and ultra chilled sessions the days of off your head with one spliff beckoned, the gangster influence as organised crime took over, this was was also an affecting factor.

yeah stuey, IMO one of the strongest points of the anti-legalization thought process is the fact that it is so tough, perhaps impossible, to regulate the potency. If it were to be legalized there could possibly be a new underground market opened up with strains/varieties that wouldn't be sold in stores. I think that goes hand in hand with the gangster influence tho, with legalization you could stem those two things: sure if you wanted to go underground the risk would be there, but in the stores there would be regulated brand-names such as "OG Kush" that would be akin to a Pepsi or a Coca-Cola in the soda industry and that are cultivated with the same potency time and time again.

Impossible to legalise due to the fact you cannot control the strength ( as has been said ) plus it would be impossible to tax as you could grow it in your greenhouse.

Long term psychotic effects are just being realised at the moment as well, plus although as has been said you rarely see an angry person smoking weed, I have been to many a tragedy (deaths, accidents) when it could be argued cannabis was to blame.

Traditional forms of cannabis have been used for thousands of years with no record of psychological damage, there is a suggestion that the super strong varieties of skunk do have the capability of affecting relatively young users and there is ongoing research. As stated previously however the skunk form is synthetic and the natural herb is not the culprit.
 
 P.S. The only fatalities recorded with cannabis are people whose skill levels have been impaired consequently their ability to control possible fatal machinery for instance motors,airoplanes,any lunar vehicles has been clouded leading to accidents.

Traditional forms of cannabis have been used for thousands of years with no record of psychological damage, there is a suggestion that the super strong varieties of skunk do have the capability of affecting relatively young users and there is ongoing research. As stated previously however the skunk form is synthetic and the natural herb is not the culprit.

 
 P.S. The only fatalities recorded with cannabis are people whose skill levels have been impaired consequently their ability to control possible fatal machinery for instance motors,airoplanes,any lunar vehicles has been clouded leading to accidents.

Which adds to the argument, how could you set a drink drive limit for Cannabis? How do you police things like working with machinery? You can't.

If you die or kill someone else due to driving whilst stoned you have to blame the person and the drug. It not being legalised goes way beyond the immediate health effects IMO.

Impossible to legalise due to the fact you cannot control the strength ( as has been said ) plus it would be impossible to tax as you could grow it in your greenhouse.

Long term psychotic effects are just being realised at the moment as well, plus although as has been said you rarely see an angry person smoking weed, I have been to many a tragedy (deaths, accidents) when it could be argued cannabis was to blame.

people can brew moonshine in their basements, doesn't mean everybody does it. you wouldn't be able to grow the quality that is being sold in stores (unless you are a great botanist of course), and it would be tough to compete with being able to buy a perfect machine-rolled joint from your local convenience store. As for the tragedies, the same can be said for alcohol. Even more so to be quite honest, and that is a legal substance.

Traditional forms of cannabis have been used for thousands of years with no record of psychological damage, there is a suggestion that the super strong varieties of skunk do have the capability of affecting relatively young users and there is ongoing research. As stated previously however the skunk form is synthetic and the natural herb is not the culprit.

That synthetic stuff is under scrutiny currently over here, with a government crackdown starting up. and another interesting part of that is that pharmaceutical companies have been trying to imitate cannabis for years synthetically. drugs like Marinol try to duplicate the effects of marijuana through use of THC, but they can't seem to properly duplicate the results. Which is funny, considering cannabis is currently classified (unintentional alliteration there haha) as a schedule I drug- meaning it has "no medicinal value". then why are pharmaceutical companies trying to duplicate it? because they are trying to make money off it. I know someone who was prescribed Marinol, they said it didn't work anywhere near as well as pot and it cost a fortune

Which adds to the argument, how could you set a drink drive limit for Cannabis? How do you police things like working with machinery? You can't.

If you die or kill someone else due to driving whilst stoned you have to blame the person and the drug. It not being legalised goes way beyond the immediate health effects IMO.

There is equipment that can detect pot in the same way a breathalyser detects alcohol and there are appropriate penalties and rightfully so it is the same crime.
To reiterate there are no proven detrimental health effects in the strict sense of the word associated with traditional cannabis, the skunk variety is still being investigated but there is every possibility that some legislation will be called for.

The equipment you say can detect the presence of cannabis but they cannot give a level like alcohol. Plus unlike alcohol cannabis can be detected for up to two months if you are a regular user. No doubt with lots of money thrown into it they may be able to find someway but would be very costly.

Wonder how many people if they didn't smoke cannabis would smoke! I mean not only have you got the possible health problems from cannabis but you have tobacco as well.

Wonder how many people if they didn't smoke cannabis would smoke! I mean not only have you got the possible health problems from cannabis but you have tobacco as well.

I have to admit I don't quite understand what you're trying to say in the bold, probably because its a bit late haha. But as far as the health problems go- the only health problems associated with cannabis are because during the act of smoking something (not just cannabis) you inhale carcinogens and other stuff (because think about it... you are lighting something on fire and bringing it into your body). However a bong greatly reduces these carcinogens, and a vaporizer effectively eliminates them. If you smoke the resin or tar then yeah thats gonna mess you up, or as stuey mentioned that synthetic crap, but thats a different decision. Smoking cigs is much more volatile to your body, as cannabis is one plant but cigs have all that other crap (formaldahyde, etc.) and tobacco itself is more dangerous than cannabis.

The equipment you say can detect the presence of cannabis but they cannot give a level like alcohol. Plus unlike alcohol cannabis can be detected for up to two months if you are a regular user. No doubt with lots of money thrown into it they may be able to find someway but would be very costly.

Wonder how many people if they didn't smoke cannabis would smoke! I mean not only have you got the possible health problems from cannabis but you have tobacco as well.

Any immediate trace of cannabis while in charge of a motor vehicle for instance should be a criminal offence, the fact that it can be traced after two months is entirely inconsequential, to suppose that cannabis can have a discernable effect on one's actions weeks after such a period is laughable. If that were so after 30+years of smoking pot and having not smoked it for some 4 years by that reasoning I should still be showing some wacky backy tendencies!
In reality in spite of whatever physical evidence the actual psychological effects of cannabis regarding concentratation and the ability to perform complex intellectual tasks seems to indicate that there is little in the way of of any deterioration in this area.
To make a simple comparison if somebody went to the pub on a Sunday afternoon and had the usual 4 or 5 pints before dinner by the same reasoning they should still be slightly pissed two months later!!! Bollocks springs to mind.

Any immediate trace of cannabis while in charge of a motor vehicle for instance should be a criminal offence, the fact that it can be traced after two months is entirely inconsequential, to suppose that cannabis can have a discernable effect on one's actions weeks after such a period is laughable.

I think what he meant is that as of right now, at least to my knowledge, there isn't a way to determine whether the trace of cannabis is a month (ive never heard of it lasting 2 months myself, just 30 days) or an hour old. The blood/urine tests they use can detect the traces but cant place a definitive "when". While there are certainly other signs that officers of the law can use- smell, presence of MJ, dude being obviously stoned - to determine if they are under the influence, those things wouldn't be capable of proving the person was intoxicated (in court anyways). I am pretty confident, however, that they could develop such technology as a weed equivalent for a breathalyzer

From what I understand cannabis use can be detected in a similar way as a breathalyser and further tests can trace it over longer periods.

Yeah, here in Holland the police already use those breathalysers for cannabis testing at road checks etc.

I've shared my mind on this subject in the alcoholism thread we had not too long ago, which kind of evolved into a drugs/addiction discussion.

Think everyone knows I'm all for legalising, won't surprise anyone seeing as I live in Amsterdam. Just have to make a comment however on the psychological effects of cannabis. It has recently been proven that about 25% of all people carry a certain gene which combined with the use of cannabis gives them a much higher chance of becoming schizophrenic than when they wouldn't use it.

From what I understand cannabis use can be detected in a similar way as a breathalyser and further tests can trace it over longer periods.

Yeah, here in Holland the police already use those breathalysers for cannabis testing at road checks etc.

Nice! I was under the impression that wasn't currently do-able.

Think everyone knows I'm all for legalising, won't surprise anyone seeing as I live in Amsterdam. Just have to make a comment however on the psychological effects of cannabis. It has recently been proven that about 25% of all people carry a certain gene which combined with the use of cannabis gives them a much higher chance of becoming schizophrenic than when they wouldn't use it.

I was under the impression that the studies say it increases the likelihood of people who have a family history/or are already susceptible to the disease, never heard the 25% figure myself... an interesting and troubling stat if true. Also read somewhere that this increased likelihood happens mostly if people begin smoking heavily before the age of 25.... whoops 

It's a recent studies done by a Dutch university. I only know of it because a researcher was talking about it on tv last week.

I am wrong about the breathalyser for cannabis though. In my 9 years that I've had my license I've actually never been tested for alcohol or cannabis myself. But mates have been tested for alcohol and cannabis, and I kind of assumed it was done the same way. I shouldn't have because it's in fact tested through saliva, but it is an instant test.

I live in California, where there was a ballot measure in the last election to legalize cannabis. This was essentially marketed as a way to earn tax revenue on a billion dollar industry. It was shot down pretty heavily.

I for one have only smoked a few times in my life, and won't do it again. Nothing bad, just not a big drug/drinker type guy. I have no problem with it being legalized. I think legalization would reduce crime rates, and would reallocate law enforcement resources to more meaningful searches (i.e. Cocaine, which is a big problem where I am, right on the US-Mexico border). Also, the United States could stand to make a little extra money regulating an industry that is doing just fine without it.

The only problem, as a few people have already mentioned here, is classification and determination of quality. This would be one hell of an undertaking, and the FDA is a bi*ch over here. I'll always vote to legalize, though. It's really no worse than alcohol, and is a waste of narcotics officers' time.

I live in California, where there was a ballot measure in the last election to legalize cannabis. This was essentially marketed as a way to earn tax revenue on a billion dollar industry. It was shot down pretty heavily.

I'm not sure 54-46 is really "heavily", especially after a similar vote in the 60s or 70s was something like 63-27. On a related side note, I saw the county-by-county voting stats and San Fran was something like about 60% yes

I think legalization would reduce crime rates, and would reallocate law enforcement resources to more meaningful searches (i.e. Cocaine, which is a big problem where I am, right on the US-Mexico border). Also, the United States could stand to make a little extra money regulating an industry that is doing just fine without it.

The only problem, as a few people have already mentioned here, is classification and determination of quality. This would be one hell of an undertaking, and the FDA is a bi*ch over here. I'll always vote to legalize, though. It's really no worse than alcohol, and is a waste of narcotics officers' time.

+ + +

I'd post a constructive argument for the benefits I have found from using Cannabis, but I can't seem to concentrate long enough to do so.

I remember a few years back I chose to do 'should Cannabis be used as a medicinal drug?' for Science coursework and I came to the conclusion that it should.

But I don't know about legalizing it entirely because then there's the issue that other drugs should be too. It would obviously have benefits like stopping the drug trade but controlling the strength is also a big issue.

I suppose in some ways it's no worse than alcohol, on it's own that is, but overtime smoking it can lead to other problems such as harder drugs, alcoholism etc.

So to sum up I'm on the fence! Because I suppose it's a bit contradictory of me to say legalize it as a medicine because I'm sure that sort of system would just get abused.

Yeah, here in Holland the police already use those breathalysers for cannabis testing at road checks etc.

I've shared my mind on this subject in the alcoholism thread we had not too long ago, which kind of evolved into a drugs/addiction discussion.

Think everyone knows I'm all for legalising, won't surprise anyone seeing as I live in Amsterdam. Just have to make a comment however on the psychological effects of cannabis. It has recently been proven that about 25% of all people carry a certain gene which combined with the use of cannabis gives them a much higher chance of becoming schizophrenic than when they wouldn't use it.

Any info on how accurate the tests are Dexter?  I've always understood that it's difficult for tests to prove how long since it was used.  I mean, it remains in your system differently to alcohol.

To Gazza, I've known lots of people who smoke weed but never touch cigs.

I remember a few years back I chose to do 'should Cannabis be used as a medicinal drug?' for Science coursework and I came to the conclusion that it should.

But I don't know about legalizing it entirely because then there's the issue that other drugs should be too. It would obviously have benefits like stopping the drug trade but controlling the strength is also a big issue.

I suppose in some ways it's no worse than alcohol, on it's own that is, but overtime smoking it can lead to other problems such as harder drugs, alcoholism etc.

So to sum up I'm on the fence! Because I suppose it's a bit contradictory of me to say legalize it as a medicine because I'm sure that sort of system would just get abused.

hopefully we can bring you to the good side! 

Contrary to popular legend, numerous studies have proven that the gateway drug theory isn't true. Smoking MJ doesn't have any discernible link with moving on to harder drugs. In fact, as Dex said somewheres (here or on that other thread I cant remember), the hard drugs usage rate in the Netherlands is one of, if not the, lowest in Europe. Portugal experienced a rapid decline in hard drug use when they greatly loosened the penalties on Marijuana. A big reason people may think its a gateway drug is by making cannabis illegal it forces otherwise non-criminal people to deal with criminals. In many cases, those dealers try to push the other drugs they are selling on their customers.

As for the medical system being abused... it certainly is here in the U.S. (not sure about other places) I also did a piece on legalization and a pharmacist told me of these mercenary doctors that travel from state to state where it is legal medically and have big, secret conferences where they hand out bogus medical mj cards. I'm not sure how that relates to being legalized in terms of personal use, but many opponents of medical use point (and they probably have a point) to this abuse.

I'd post a constructive argument for the benefits I have found from using Cannabis, but I can't seem to concentrate long enough to do so.

hahaha been there mate... too much cool stuff to be looking at 

Protoje - Wrong Side of The Law

I don't need to say anything else!

Women love it too!!

Protoje - No Lipstick

hopefully we can bring you to the good side! 

Ha! Well, if it stays illegal or becomes legal I still won't smoke it, it's just a choice of mine to not smoke anything. I've seen what smoking has done to a couple members of my family, particularly one of my Grandads, and it's not pleasant. I don't judge people who do though, it's a personal choice, and, because I drink alcohol (in moderation- most of the time ) and that obviously has its effects too.

I don't need to say anything else!

Women love it too!!

thanks for the link mate, I've heard this guy is good but I forgot to give him a listen... gonna do so with a nice bowl when I get out of this class

as long as we're on the vids...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K66gw3KFGaA

No need to smoke it. You could make a nice cake. Or take it in yogurt.

Any info on how accurate the tests are Dexter?  I've always understood that it's difficult for tests to prove how long since it was used.  I mean, it remains in your system differently to alcohol.

To Gazza, I've known lots of people who smoke weed but never touch cigs.

They are saliva tests, so it really only gets you if you have done it recently. It won't pick it up if you haven't done it that day, and recently, i understand. We have had it in Australia for a few years now.

And yes, almost every person i know here smokes some weed. Only a couple of them smoke cigs.

It really is no worse than alcohol. If you wanna argue psychological damage due to over-use, then that same argument applies to alcohol. People who abuse alcohol will end up the same. You just need to keep it in check. Cigarettes directly cause deaths on a massive scale, so trying to justify not legalizing weed on any health basis is pretty hypocritical IMO.

thanks for the link mate, I've heard this guy is good but I forgot to give him a listen... gonna do so with a nice bowl when I get out of this class

as long as we're on the vids...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K66gw3KFGaA

Love that movie!

I still think Friday (the first one) is still the funniest film to watch went getting stoned.

"aint't nothin wrong with smoking weed!"

I still think Friday (the first one) is still the funniest film to watch went getting stoned.

"aint't nothin wrong with smoking weed!"

haha a classic for sure, has to be in the top 5 for my stoner movies.
My personal fave: How High

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxdmVdruANc


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KHuNqgsuQw&feature=related

I'm not sure 54-46 is really "heavily", especially after a similar vote in the 60s or 70s was something like 63-27. On a related side note, I saw the county-by-county voting stats and San Fran was something like about 60% yes

+ + +

Yeah, well in a state this F***ing size that is a pretty massive margin. To be fair, I did think it was a bigger margin than 8%.  I'm of course in one of the awesome counties that voted it down! It was voted pretty much exclusively along party lines, although I'm sure older Democrats and younger Republicans skewed it a bit.
Johnny drama Weed is a gateway drug

Crazy Leg's Dance - Don't Be a Menace

Dont be a menace Complilation

Ha! Well, if it stays illegal or becomes legal I still won't smoke it, it's just a choice of mine to not smoke anything. I've seen what smoking has done to a couple members of my family, particularly one of my Grandads, and it's not pleasant. I don't judge people who do though, it's a personal choice, and, because I drink alcohol (in moderation- most of the time ) and that obviously has its effects too.

I think that is an admirable stance to take, open mindedness. Sorry to hear about your grandfather, I'm not going to deny MJ has and will continue to give people problems and it seems you had to live through that. I don't think any smoker will begrudge you for not smoking (and it is cool that you likewise don't judge those who choose to smoke), it is a choice that you are perfectly entitled to make and it sounds like you are fairly educated in your reasoning. To each his/her own, I love that phrase.

Yeah, well in a state this F***ing size that is a pretty massive margin.

very good point. 8 percent of Cali is probably the population of Nebraska

well in with the dont be a menace shout!!

I don't want to wage in on the debate hugely, just note that cannabis (when I had access to it) ,was by far the best medication I've used for my back problems, less side effects, never really smoked more than 2-3 spliffs a week.  It's a shame that all the people I used to buy from are locked up or don't touch the stuff any more and I've never made any new connections.

Styles P - Good Times ( I Get High)

Too much over analysis in this thread, I'm off to torch a spliff. 

Was in a pub that got raided for drugs last night, everyone got searched but before they did they locked us in a room. Was dying to go to the loo so relieved myself in an empty lager can.

Just my luck got charged for being in possession of a can of piss.

Still baffles me how it's illegal while cigarettes and alcohol aren't.

Just my luck got charged for being in possession of a can of piss.

I don't want to get involved in any argument except to say that I have personally seen the effects of sustained use (abuse) of cannabis and how it can change a person's mental and physical state and it's not pleasent. You can throw any stats and research results you like at me but I've watched people change over time. That said, even though I have never smoked cigarettes, I will smoke weed on the rare occasions a friend has it.
As with most things, it's absolutely fine in moderation, in my opinion.

I don't want to get involved in any argument except to say that I have personally seen the effects of sustained use (abuse) of cannabis and how it can change a person's mental and physical state and it's not pleasent. You can throw any stats and research results you like at me but I've watched people change over time. That said, even though I have never smoked cigarettes, I will smoke weed on the rare occasions a friend has it.
As with most things, it's absolutely fine in moderation, in my opinion.

Ive seen the effects myself mate, it definitely isn't pleasant.

But like you said, moderation - absolutely fine in my opinion. I mean we all know that sustained use of cigarettes will lead to cancer eventually, but they are legal. Sustained use of alcohol at a heavy level will also lead to damage. Sustained over-use of sugar can F**k you up, i have had to cut down myself on sugar due to being told it was at dangerous levels in myself, and im 23.

There is no reason for cannabis to be illegal apart from the government being cu*ts. Thats it.

Just my luck got charged for being in possession of a can of piss.

 

There is no reason for cannabis to be illegal apart from the government being cu*ts. Thats it.

+

Bigv is famous for cutting through the bullshit mate.

+

Ive seen the effects myself mate, it definitely isn't pleasant.

But like you said, moderation - absolutely fine in my opinion. I mean we all know that sustained use of cigarettes will lead to cancer eventually, but they are legal. Sustained use of alcohol at a heavy level will also lead to damage. Sustained over-use of sugar can f**k you up, I have had to cut down myself on sugar due to being told it was at dangerous levels in myself, and im 23.

There is no reason for cannabis to be illegal apart from the government being cu*ts. Thats it.

Precisely, this is the ultimate argument for the legalisation of cannabis. The key is moderation. Any substance that someone abuses to the point of addiction is going to F**k them up. Drink too much coffee and you'll have a lovely caffeine addiction to deal with, too much sugar and you'll have diabeties later on.

Cannabis can be abused, very easily. If it becomes your life, and it can (just the same as any relaxant), then you'll start to see negative effects, namely the motivation to do F**k all.

I usually treat it as a reward for after a work day, coming home to a post-work spliff is my "going down the pub", if you like. That's actually an analogy I used when I was stopped and searched by the police a few weeks ago.

Unfortunately the majority of the public hold some kind of stigma over cannabis, for reasons they probably can't even explain beyond "it's bad..", or spouting nonsense research linking cannabis to long term mental damage. I believe this is because of the huge anti-weed propaganda campaign that has been running all through the 1900's. Here's one of my personal favourites.

Reefer Madness

....or spouting nonsense research linking cannabis to long term mental damage.

I don't think it's nonsense, the evidence is there for all to see (some of my mates are prime examples, ). The point is you generally have to abuse it for these things to happen.

I don't think it's nonsense, the evidence is there for all to see (some of my mates are prime examples, ). The point is you generally have to abuse it for these things to happen.

My ex girlfriends mum is a F***ing loon because of the stuff But she smokes all day, every day, starting in the morning. Thats where you'll go wrong, if you abuse it like that. A post work "going to the pub" spliff is perfectly fine IMO, in fact probably more healthy than going down the pub for a few pints. Though i aint no expert

As I've said previously I did use pot almost daily for 25+ years and then stopped for a variety of reasons... 1/ the stuff available changed format from the moderate hash or bush to the more volatile man made skunk which I found too strong 2/ I was diagnosed with blood pressure and advised that pot might not be the best thing to indulge in 3/my family situation no longer fitted the pot smoking ideal and I had less time to toke.
The point being that after a considerable time using cannabis and I haven't even scraped the surface of the tale, I was able to stop more or less overnight no such luck with ciggies tho. 

I'm sitting here on the left hand side, why has no one passed the dutchie?

It's illegal in America because the prisons are privatized and they get thousands of cannabis related arrest every year. 

It's illegal in America because the prisons are privatized and they get thousands of cannabis related arrest every year.  

a very good addition to the post... forgot about that part. Not the only reason of course, and not how it started being illegal, but definitely plays a role now in keeping it illegal.

Unfortunately the majority of the public hold some kind of stigma over cannabis, for reasons they probably can't even explain beyond "it's bad..", or spouting nonsense research linking cannabis to long term mental damage. I believe this is because of the huge anti-weed propaganda campaign that has been running all through the 1900's. Here's one of my personal favourites.

Reefer Madness

this is exactly right, the propaganda started back in the early 1900s like you said, for a variety of reasons, and the government basically came out and said Black people and mexicans smoke weed and it turns them evil  

then Nixon and Reagan launched their own drug wars in their respective terms and kept it going. I personally was one person who had that stigma due to years of anti-drug groups coming to schools... which to be fair I think is a decent thing to try and keep children from doing drugs. It worked on me, but the moment I became actually educated about MJ I realized that its not anywhere near as bad as they think it is. I think if they put the age minimum on it like Cigs or Alcohol you could properly educate youth, get rid of all the BS and let them make their own decision when they are old enough to do so.

That's what it's all about mate - enlightenment.

The thread deserves a tune from SIR bob marley.

Very appropiate i would say.


Bob Marley Easy Skangking

Excuse me while I light my spliff

Good GOD I gotta take a lift

From reality I just can't drift

That's why I am staying with this riff

so true

My ex girlfriends mum is a f**king loon because of the stuff But she smokes all day, every day, starting in the morning. Thats where you'll go wrong, if you abuse it like that.

Yeah, and I hate when people use that sort of situation to back up there supposed 'evidence'. Of course someone who smokes all day every day will not function. Why? Cause your f***in' high all the time.

I'm sure all those who do smoke know most of the time when high you're wanting to do as little as possible, so if you're high from when you wake till when you sleep, you just won't get anything done!

     ^     ^     ^
That's why you pick the moment, the chilled intervals when a spliff and maybe a few wee drinks are condusive.

Don't want to condemn it, as i've never experienced it or know people who have experienced it. Having said that, i can't imagine a situation in which i would be tempted to give it a go. Same goes with alcohol and cigarettes.