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      The huge Anfield problem

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      JD
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      The huge Anfield problem
      Nov 03, 2008 12:52:54 am
      I've mentioned it in a couple of posts recently but I continue to be extremely disappointed with some of the gobshites - who I now believe to be in the majority Season Ticket holders - who fail to generate a decent atmosphere at Anfield for Premiership games.

      I was expecting Portsmouth at home (when we were topping the table) to be a decent atmosphere.  It was grim.

      European games allow more tickets to go to non-season ticket holders - there is a greater scramble for tickets and the atmosphere is usually much better because fans who are determined to take their chance to support their club get a chance to attend.

      Not so for Premiership games.  A large proportion of our season ticket holders are miserable cu*ts - too terrified to lose their priviliges but not overwhelmingly enamoured to 'get behind the team'.  Thanks to some season ticket holder 'shirking' his ticket for Pompey I landed myself there in an ST block in the Kop (104 in case you're one of the guilty).  I was embarrassed to say that I was a solitary voice on my row singing YNWA.

      I'd like to quote the great philosopher of our times, Mr Jamie Carragher, circa August 2008.


      Quote
      Go to Anfield on a Saturday at 3pm when we're playing Wigan or Aston Villa , then go back three days later to watch us play Barcelona or Chelsea. It's like a different venue. The fans are up for it much more, the noise level is astounding, and the intensity generates a vibe that rarely fails to inspire us to play to our fullest potential......

      If most English sides had to endure the Anfield European atmosphere, we'd probably blow them away.

      Some of our sorry excuses for Season Ticket holders need to ask themselves - Do you want to win the league?  Are you prepared to help it happen? If not - hand in your season ticket and let a deserving Liverpool supporter take it off your hands.
      paulrobbo
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #1: Nov 03, 2008 01:07:39 am
      Agree entirely. I was sat in the main stand against Pompey. All the atmosphere generated from there was about 20 of us singing 'Steve Gerrard, Gerrard...', 'Ohhh Sami Sami...' and 'Fields of Anfield Road'. Some knob head just kept shouting 'F**k off Pompey, F**k off Pompey'.
      dunlop liddell shankly
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #2: Nov 03, 2008 01:13:03 am
      JD, I've got to be honest with you here, but the club on the whole sees more satisfaction in Europe. Benitez' future lay on the outcome of qualfying from the group stages last season, some of Benitez' selections have been to save players for Europe, the fans get up for Europe. It's that simple. The club on the whole sees more prestige and more coverage from Europe. Our interests are European based and that's why the atmosphere isn't there for pretty much all Premiership home games. Even the United game was quiet by usual standards.

      I think it's much easier to get up for Barce than Wigan, that's the answer.
      JD
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #3: Nov 03, 2008 01:20:40 am
      Much easier?

      The club sees more prestige?

      What's it got to do with the club what atmosphere the fans generate?

      The vast majority of Liverpool fans I speak to have seen us win the Champions League.  Yawn.  We want to win the title. Do you want United to match our 18 league titles?

      Absolutely no excuse for some of the hopeless excuses for fans we have at our ground.  Interesting that both me and PaulRobbo experienced the same disappointment against Pompey.  Neither of us are Season Ticket holders - but I'm sure we both would love to be - but no, because some useless mute cu*ts have got them instead.

      Tell you what I'd do?

      Rip up everyone's season ticket at the end of the season and put them on sale from Christmas Day at 4am in the morning from the windows at the Anfield ticket office.
      dunlop liddell shankly
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #4: Nov 03, 2008 01:29:09 am
      Yes most Liverpool fans have seen us win the Champions League but it still gives more prestige (or at least some think it does). They don't want to sing because they see it as only the Premiership. Like I said, United at home was a muted affair. Had that been United in the Champions League, it'd be rocking. I know that's the point you're making but it's because those fans who go to both sets of games see more glory in Europe. Unfortunately that's the case for Liverpool fans nowadays.

      There's also taking into account the amount of day trippers (not season ticket holders) who attend league matches. They are there for a day out and with any luck a picture of Gerrard. They are what I used to call the "cat walk models" because they wear their shirts like it's a fashion statement rather than because it means something within them.

      I don't go along with season ticket holders, because many of those probably attend the European nights as well. I know I certainly did when I held a season ticket and me dad did for years before that. But with current prices of season tickets and the rest of things money goes on, we can't afford it. That's the same with plenty of other fans as well mate. Regular season ticket holders having to miss out on a season ticket now because of the prices and can only attend the odd match here and there. And what would you rather go and see...Wigan or Barcelona? So again, there's many factors contributing to Anfield seeming like a morgue in Premiership games and I don't think it can all be blamed on season ticket holders.
      JD
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #5: Nov 03, 2008 01:34:05 am
      You're wrong DLS.

      Not all, but in general, it's the season ticket holders who are responsible for the poor Premiership atmosphere.  For some fans, European and Cup games are the only chance of getting to Anfield thanks to the ticketing strategy, and these fans who can't get to every game make much more use of their visit to Anfield.

      You ask what I'd rather see - Wigan or Barcelona?

      How many Barcelona fans do you know who will rub it in your face when United equal our title record?

      To be honest fella I'm more looking forward to going to the West Brom game than Atletico on Tuesday.  And any right minded Liverpool fan should be thinking exactly the same way.

      Liverpool - 18 titles
      United - 17 titles
      dunlop liddell shankly
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #6: Nov 03, 2008 01:39:33 am
      You're talkin' to one of those "right minded Liverpool fans" mate. I, unfortunately, have still yet to see us lift a league title and there was no more importantce to Barce than there was to Wigan for me, but I know many fans who don't think that way. The ones who wake up in the morning and go "ah it's only Wigan today" yet go "Get in, can't wait for the match. Really pumped it's Barce. Can't wait at all, come 7 o'clock I'll be so horse I won't be able to sing during the match but I'll find a way."

      Season ticket holders and non season ticket holders. Both "sets" if you like have those who struggle to get up for a Premiership match but have no difficulty getting up for a midweek European tie.

      I personally think it's a bit harsh to lay all blame on season ticket holders.
      Adryan
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #7: Nov 03, 2008 01:41:51 am
      If the supporters can voice it out during the premiership games like how they do in european nights, any opposition would certainly come to Anfield with goosebumps. It's kinda like a mental play kind of thing.

      I guess JD is right. We have seen Liverpool win the Champions League but I for one don't want United to have 18 titles as us. And afterall, many of us want to see the next ship to dock in Liverpool . = THE PREMIERSHIP.

      The players especially Stevie and Carra would be more than glad to have the fans singing their voices out every game, as they themselves want to complete their medals before they retire.

      But i apologize as i can't be one of those fans at Anfield as i'm not from England.
      redkenny
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #8: Nov 03, 2008 01:42:26 am
      I do agree but not entirely. 

      The alarming lack of support in certain league games might not just come down to season ticket holders. But it does point in that direction if you compare most games that have more of an opportunity for a non season ticket holder.

      Maybe taking away the desperation to get in there and support your team could be the biggest problem.

      I guess there could be a number of season ticket holders who see games as a routine now and that the pre match and post match drinks or journeys are on parr or even better than 'sitting down and watching the match'.

      I've always thought that banking on an annual amount of money of season tickets should not be essential. But that's obviously a priority for the club. And when you think of league cup games against the likes of Crewe and there's empty seats, it makes you wonder.

      But the main thing is. Just because you have a pass for every game and don't have to worry about the stress of getting in to Anfield, it doesn't mean you can see yourself above the ones that do and be annoyed if the irregulars are spoiling you watching the match. Everyone should all be there to support and be as one.
      JD
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #9: Nov 03, 2008 01:44:00 am
      I personally think it's a bit harsh to lay all blame on season ticket holders.

      I'm not saying it's all season ticket holders.

      Just the overwhelming majority.

      Next weekend against West Brom, at half time, I'm going to get my phone out and take some photos of miserable non-singing cu*ts in the Kop and then I'm going to post them on here.

      If anybody else is in a section of Anfield full of people who only open their mouth to slag off our players I'd advise you to do the same. 

      Name and shame.
      dunlop liddell shankly
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #10: Nov 03, 2008 01:48:03 am
      you've misread it there mate, I said "all blame on season ticket holders" rather than "blame on all season ticket holders" (appologies if this sounds arrogant and a bit cuntish, but there's no way of putting it to make it sound any differently)
      JD
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #11: Nov 03, 2008 01:54:47 am

      No I didn't.

      I'm saying that the majority of Season Ticket holders need to have a good look at themselves.  I don't particularly give a sh*t if some of them take offence - because quite frankly some of them need to.

      Of course we get day-trippers - but the amount of effort these 'day-trippers' have to go to - to get a ticket for a Premiership game puts Season Ticket holders to shame.
      redkenny
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #12: Nov 03, 2008 01:57:27 am
      I'm more looking forward to going to the West Brom game than Atletico on Tuesday.

      Same here.
      dunlop liddell shankly
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #13: Nov 03, 2008 01:57:35 am
      Well what's the solution? Give every season ticket holder a test to see if they can sing loud enough? Or just have a free for all for every single Premiership game?
      JD
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #14: Nov 03, 2008 02:03:52 am

      Well what's the solution? Give every season ticket holder a test to see if they can sing loud enough? Or just have a free for all for every single Premiership game?

      I'll tell you something.  If it was a free for all for every Premiership game people would appreciate their ticket much more, and the atmosphere would be far better.

      Will never happen because it doesn't offer commercial stability but that's the way it used to happen - pay on the gate - get there early - and they were the greatest atmosphere's in our clubs history.

      Anyway, there will be some nice pictures in here over the course of the week of some of our miserable fans who don't sing - so we can look forward to that.
      dunlop liddell shankly
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #15: Nov 03, 2008 02:09:06 am
      Pay on the gate was a success, from what me dad's told me. Everyone scrapping for the best spec in the ground, despite ending up thirty yards away from it when the game actually started. We can't do that anymore though, with the seats. Your spec is determined by your seat.

      We could still try a "free for all" method though, because make no mistake the ground would still be a sell out. Maybe then the Kop and Annie Road end with pockets of Kemlyn Road and the Main Stand would be rocking.
      crouchinho
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #16: Nov 03, 2008 03:51:33 am
      I cant say from first hand experiences the atmosphere is dull but its true and its totally backed by what i hear through the speakers. Anfield is a dead, barron ground against the likes of Birmingham, Reading and Fulham last season and its continued again even when we should be buzzing we're on top.

      I see people in the stands at Anfield on a European night screaming their lungs out, singing loud and proud and making Anfield the loudest place in the world but come a few days later against a lesser side and its back to the norm. and we expect a big win. Cant happen.

      Its a worldwide fact that season ticket holders think of a game as, 'oh i got my seat, i can cheer when i feel like it' and those who have to fight for their ticket appreciate it more as it could be the last game they see for a few weeks and if not, months.

      I'm not going to be barbaric and say scrap season tickets all together but there should be less allocation of them. Its a win/win guarantee. Fans who have less money can still get to a game without a season ticket and noise will raise the roof as it should. If they're concern is that fans wont show then no point in a new stadium if demand for tickets arent there. The plus for the wanky yanks is that they'll make more money - season ticket holders get a discounted price over the season but if there is less (season tickets) then they get a few bob times a few thousand over 19 games a season.
      joemack
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #17: Nov 03, 2008 04:12:06 am
      The late great Bill Shankly always said that the noise from the kop was worth a goal, and we do expect more from our fans because of what the kop used to be like. I live in New Zealand now, but I was going on the kop when you had to get to the ground by 1 oclock to get in, and you had to push and shove to get there too, all the while dodging those bleedin great horses. As DLS has stated that whole swaying on the kop has gone now due to the seating, but you can still chant & sing. I've been to a couple of matches the times I've been back, and it wasn't too bad, but we get the games live here on the box, and half the time it seems like the only one sing YNWA is Gerry.

      But you can't force an atmosphere, it's either there or not, and most of that 60's/70's crowd be getting on a bit now won't they!

      It was magic back then!
      Billy1
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #18: Nov 03, 2008 08:13:27 am
      If it is atmosphere you want then you need the authories to allow standing in the KOP, after that is what made us famous long B4 other clubs started singing songs.You would think in this day and age the club could put in enough safety precautions to stop fans getting injured.I realise this will never happen but it would be nice and very nostalgic. ( I can dream ) ---CANT I ----
      Venison 86
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #19: Nov 03, 2008 10:02:21 am
      Just wondering does anyone know what the split of ticket allocation is
      Season ticket
      PTS
      Away supporters
      online sales
      phone lines etc
      Paul Tomkins
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #20: Nov 03, 2008 10:53:53 am
      I'm not sure it's mainly to do with season ticket holders, although it may play a small part. You could argue that season ticket holders are hardcore fans who know the songs and that anyone else turning up could be a quiet daytripper, so I'm not sure it's the full story.

      I just think the crowd gets up for a big game, and goes to lesser games expecting the team to lift them. It's a different mindset. My first game was against Derby on a Saturday in October 1990. I think we'd won the first 7 games of the season, and I remember the atmosphere was pretty unimpressive for the most part - although there were little bursts of noise that blew me away. Alan Hansen said that by that stage the Kop had grown blase.

      I've been to group stage Champions League matches that have been pretty dead in atmosphere, while I don't recall it being buzzing for knockout games like Benfica and PSV, unless the game got the fans going. If it's Chelsea or Barcelona, there's the knowledge that the fans must turn up and make some noise to help the team, which would be the case at home to any of the big teams if we were in with a chance of the league in April. I do think big European games encourage a different atmosphere, because of the club's famous nights, but evening kick-offs are always more special if it's good opposition.

      What I have noticed since 1990 is that in the lesser games the crowd after half-time is usually totally silent. I swear there used to be more of a buzz once the second half restarted, but it falls quiet within seconds.

      Wimbledon in March 1996 always sticks in my mind. It was the day of the Dunblaine massacre, and the atmosphere was pretty grim, with the away fans numbering about 5. By the time the Reds, who were in the title hunt, had had THREE goals chalked off by the officials, the place was going mental. But it needed the anger about decisions to wake everybody up.

      If Anfield could make a big noise for every game, it'd certainly help. But I think all big teams could say the same.
      JD
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #21: Nov 03, 2008 11:16:35 am
      I'm not sure it's mainly to do with season ticket holders, although it may play a small part. You could argue that season ticket holders are hardcore fans who know the songs and that anyone else turning up could be a quiet daytripper, so I'm not sure it's the full story.

      People without season tickets have to battle against the odds to get a ticket - feel a sense of elation when they nab their ticket - and are far more likely to make the most of what Crouchinho said, could be their last game for a few week or months.

      If Anfield could make a big noise for every game, it'd certainly help. But I think all big teams could say the same.

      I'm sure all big teams would say the same.  The difference is - we know we can do it.
      frizzby5
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      Re: The huge Anfield problem
      Reply #22: Nov 03, 2008 11:36:39 am
      I have just sat and read this thread and agree wholeheartedly with JD, in my opinion fans (not just ours ) have been spoilt with the gauranteed Champions league football for finishing in the top 4, who wouldn't prefer to watch Barca then Wigan ?
      The fact is when it was just the European Cup the only position that mattered to any fan or club was 1st (as Bill Shankly used to say 1st is everything 2nd is nowhere !) you can now even turn up to watch a european game against the likes of Barca and effectively that one result doesnt really matter as long you do well in the rest of the games.
      Paul Tompkins says he's been to European nights where the atmosphere has been dire ! (thats because the result doesn't matter) when its a knock out stage game it's a different issue alltogether !
      If we were fighting for one place in order to qualify for the European cup there would be less european games to spoil the fans with!
      this would gaurantee in my mind higher attendances and better atmosphere at league games regardless of who we were playing !
      I've always been against the champions league, you don't have to be one (champion) in order to participate and although we wouldn't have won in '05 neither would Manure in 99 !
      there would be less money in the game in order to fuel the mega wage packets, as i've said previously it's not just our fans I'm talking about!
      The money that is being thrown about today is soley to fuel the championd league.

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