Trending Topics

      Next match: West Ham v LFC [Premier League] Sat 27th Apr @ 12:30 pm
      London Stadium

      Today is the 26th of April and on this date LFC's match record is P24 W15 D7 L2

      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield

      Read 2182 times
      0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
      HUYTON RED
      • Forum Legend - Shankly
      • ******
      • Started Topic

      • 40,177 posts | 8552 
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Nov 02, 2009 11:19:22 am
      The Fink Tank: Rafael Benítez paying for lack of transfer funds at Liverpool
      The Fink Tank: Daniel Finkelstein October 31, 2009

      Life’s a beach ball, and then you die. After the freak goal by Darren Bent brought defeat by Sunderland, one or two pundits wondered if Liverpool fans were too accepting of the injustice. Perhaps, they speculated, the Kop has finally tired of Rafael Benítez. Perhaps they were looking for a chance to get rid of him. And the beach ball provides a chance.

      But if that is what they are thinking, then I believe they are making a mistake.

      Dr Henry Stott, Dr Ian Graham, and Dr Mark Latham have been untangling a tale of two seasons. Liverpool did so well last season, staying in the title race until it was nearly over. But now our progress chart suggests that they are already down to little more than a 3 per cent chance of lifting the trophy. Manchester United have won (in 2002/3, Fink Tank’s first season) after having a 4 per cent chance in mid November. But there is, well, a 97 per cent chance that this won’t happen to Liverpool this season.

      What is going on? And should it be laid at Benítez’s door?

      The simple answer, at least as far as it is possible to answer it this early in the season, is that nothing much is going on. But to see what I mean you have to understand the last campaign.

      A team such as Liverpool begin the season with a range of places they can finish in given their quality. Luck and the variable performance of other sides might change the place the side finish in even if their performance doesn’t vary. So we know the probability that they will finish in a certain place, without, naturally, being able to offer any certainty.

      For this reason, a team has a chance of winning the Barclays Premier League even if they aren’t the best side. The table, in other words, does lie. The best side might be defined as the one that would be the favourite on a neutral ground against any opposition from the Premier League. And you can determine this, as we do, by a model employing a weighted measure of goals and shots on goal.

      The longer the season lasts, the more chance there is that the best team will win the title. But in a 38-game season, reasonably short from a statistical standpoint, even the third and fourth ranked sides have an appreciable chance of winning the title, while still remaining third or fourth best.

      And this, pretty much, is what happened to Liverpool. They started last season ranked in third equal place with Arsenal and with only a 10 per cent chance of winning the title. In the middle of the season their chance peaked at 20 per cent, before dropping off again. In other words, we were always pretty confident that Liverpool wouldn’t win the Premier League.

      Nevertheless, by coming second, Liverpool exceeded our expectations for a team of their quality. And it is not surprising at all that they have dropped back off again this season. Their start to this season is more what we would expect of them.

      So what is behind it? Three things seem worth mentioning. First, they have stayed steady in quality but have changed with their defence getting weaker and their attack getting stronger. They are letting in a large proportion of the shots on goal. They need to put this right.

      Second, Xabi Alonso was, next only to Steven Gerrard, their best player. It was a disaster to lose him to Real Madrid.

      But most importantly — the money. Our figures show that Benítez outperforms the wage bill. Blame the Americans. Not Rafa.



      http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/fink_tank/article6897323.ece
      RedLFCBlood
      • Guest
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #1: Nov 02, 2009 11:24:06 am
      The Fink Tank: Rafael Benítez paying for lack of transfer funds at Liverpool

      But most importantly — the money. Our figures show that Benítez outperforms the wage bill. Blame the Americans. Not Rafa.


      That bit sums it up perfectly.
      whyohwhyohwhy
      • Forum Legend - Paisley
      • *****

      • 11,283 posts | 95 
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #2: Nov 02, 2009 11:25:01 am

      You beat me to it.  Spot on that imo.
      Keith Singleton
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 16,971 posts | 2708 
      • Sir Lewis Hamilton
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #3: Nov 02, 2009 11:44:05 am
      Once again i see more and more negative post :-\. A lot of you still think its Rafa's fault. I think most of the negative posters are thinking with you're hearts instead of your heads. As the most successful English club ( so far  ;D ) obviously you're use to success. When it doesn't happen you want heads to roll. Not winning the League for a while now is putting the club under unwarranted pressure. The problem you have is with Mork & Mindy.. ak the yanks. Until they go, there lies you're problems. Getting rid of Rafa now will not only cost you millions in contract fees ( allegedly )  but also put you back some years. More importantly, i don't think there is anyone on the market, "at the moment" that could do a better job.
      stuey
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 36,005 posts | 3952 
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #4: Nov 02, 2009 12:36:25 pm
      Once again i see more and more negative post :-\. A lot of you still think its Rafa's fault. I think most of the negative posters are thinking with you're hearts instead of your heads. As the most successful English club ( so far  ;D ) obviously you're use to success. When it doesn't happen you want heads to roll. Not winning the League for a while now is putting the club under unwarranted pressure. The problem you have is with Mork & Mindy.. ak the yanks. Until they go, there lies you're problems. Getting rid of Rafa now will not only cost you millions in contract fees ( allegedly )  but also put you back some years. More importantly, i don't think there is anyone on the market, "at the moment" that could do a better job.
      That is the consenus of opinion here Keith the alternatives are just so wide of the mark the only supposition is that the posters are a/genuinely misguided or b/have ulterior motives, in the case of Whelan the latter suggestion would apply considering his affiliation and apparent support for manUre. 
      RedLFCBlood
      • Guest
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #5: Nov 02, 2009 12:47:16 pm
      “He wants to win the European Cup so he can get a job in Europe."
      [/news]

      What can I say his opinion is about as good as his geography, as I'm sure Rafa is coaching in Europe at the minute.

      CRK
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 13,604 posts | 361 
      • JFT96 YNWA
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #6: Nov 02, 2009 12:50:36 pm
      Great player. C*nt of an ex-player.

      I assume we never won the league last season because we were too pre-occupied with the CL then too.

      Is he after a managers job? ::)
      Christ
      • Forum Legend - Benitez
      • *****

      • 1,209 posts | 40 
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #7: Nov 02, 2009 12:51:17 pm
      Just a thought for all who thinks Rafa should be shown the door, I'll put Rafa's yearly net spend down in here and you can draw your own conclusions.

      2004 £8.200,000  net spend

      2005 £12,930,000 net spend

      2006 £17.47 million net spend

      2007 £21,955,000 net spend

      2008 £19,650,000 net spend

      2009 Minus £9,750,000 net spend £9,750,000 profit.

      In 5 years Rafa's total spend has been £210,425,000

      In 5 years Rafa has recouped £139,730,000 from player sales

      Giving Rafa a Net spend over 5 years of £70,695,000

      Giving Rafa a Yearly average net spend of £14,139,000

      Not the figures some would have you believe, and is no where near good enough for a manager challenging on all four fronts IMO.

      If you average it over 6 years, which it soon will be..... it will give Rafa a net spend of £11,782,500 per year   ::)

      IMO that highlights why we have seen a high volume of players in and out of the club as Rafa has wheeled and dealed in the bargain basement to generate extra funds so he could build a starting XI that is capable of competing with likes of Chelsea UTD and Arsenal.

      Seeing figures like this helps me to see clearly what side of the fence I'm standing on. What about you ?

      Me too... I always knew which side of the fence, we ain't just gonna lose what we  had over night! last season we were the best team in the premiership FACT & we still finished second, you can say United were the best because they won, but it was an undeserved championship gifted by us! we have had an almighty sh*te start to the season everything that could go wrong has.. Penalty decisions,beach balls,red cards,own goals,defensive errors,injuries! but I'm still optimistic that other teams will eventually be dropping points & we need to get a momentum going. Wednesday is a massive game & we need everyone to show support and not waste time Rafa bashing. We win as a team we lose as a team, we walk through the storm together.. otherwise we are just fickle.
      johnstop
      • Forum Legend - Benitez
      • *****

      • 1,745 posts | 23 
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #8: Nov 02, 2009 12:52:17 pm
      55 people think Rafa should go but so far I havent seen 1 suggestion that doesnt make me fall of my chair laughing.We are in a difficult postion and pointing the finger doesnt help. I know that those who want Rafa to stay are just as unhappy at our current position but feel the best option at present is for Rafa to stay and to get behind the team.Maybe its a bit old fashioned but I still believe in Shankly's holy trinity it worked for nearly 50 years now is not the time to change.
      CRK
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 13,604 posts | 361 
      • JFT96 YNWA
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #9: Nov 02, 2009 12:56:40 pm
      55 people think Rafa should go but so far I havent seen 1 suggestion that doesnt make me fall of my chair laughing.We are in a difficult postion and pointing the finger doesnt help. I know that those who want Rafa to stay are just as unhappy at our current position but feel the best option at present is for Rafa to stay and to get behind the team.Maybe its a bit old fashioned but I still believe in Shankly's holy trinity it worked for nearly 50 years now is not the time to change.

      The idea of not sacking managers was probably lost on them two lying c*nts before they came here.

      Benitez is still here because we let them know we weren't happy last time. We need to continue letting them know what we think because if they thought they could get away with it, they would happily sack Rafa.
      Christ
      • Forum Legend - Benitez
      • *****

      • 1,209 posts | 40 
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #10: Nov 02, 2009 01:02:31 pm
      Oh & Ronnie Whelan what the fook... what should Rafa do, what if Torres gets injured for 2 months.. have you noticed the pattern of ex players/pundits who hate Liverpool Paul Merson coke head,Stan Collymore dogger/woman beater,Andy Grey serial sex pest.. why oh why Ronnie do you wanna join this elite pack of idiots?

      wallbanger
      • Forum Legend - Benitez
      • *****

      • 1,181 posts |
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #11: Nov 02, 2009 01:17:40 pm
      just reading liverpool might have as many as 12 players on sick list.its unfair to for critics to judge him in this situation. cut ther guy some slack
      johnstop
      • Forum Legend - Benitez
      • *****

      • 1,745 posts | 23 
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #12: Nov 02, 2009 01:24:57 pm
      just reading liverpool might have as many as 12 players on sick list.its unfair to for critics to judge him in this situation. cut ther guy some slack
      All the more reason to stop sniping at the team and Manager and get behind the team.
      Terry Macs Perm
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 97 posts |
      • 1977 - what a goal!
      Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #13: Nov 02, 2009 01:31:04 pm
      I have complete belief in Rafa - it is at times like these we show our strength and uniqueness as a club as every piece of unfair criticism levelled at his door will only make us sing his name louder. This is one of the reasons Rafa loves Liverpool - how many other top managers would have stuck with the crap he's had to put up with?!? We must support Rafa.
      JD
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 39,631 posts | 6940 
      Re: Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #14: Nov 02, 2009 02:00:25 pm
      Good article.

      Enjoyed reading it.
      Gow
      • Forum Legend - Paisley
      • *****

      • 13,531 posts | 282 
      Re: Fink Tank: Benitez outperforming at Anfield
      Reply #15: Nov 02, 2009 04:23:09 pm
      Anyone fancy a march up to the ground before the Birmingham game in support of Rafa? ;)

      Quick Reply