Jordan Henderson (Liverpool -> Al-Ettifaq (5 months) -> Ajax)

Haven't got a clue and quite frankly couldn't care less.

My point is that we have one of the best managers in World football who continues to pick him even though many on here and Twitter would lead you to believe his little better than a Sunday league player.

How do we explain that?

I know it might be a novel idea but strengthening the squad is a pretty good way of progressing a football club.

I have no issue if Fabinho displaces Henderson in the team and we still keep winning unlike the likes of yourself who cry like little girls if certain players are picked or left out even if we keep winning football matches.

Also I'm pretty certain I've never labelled Henderson a 'superstar' just a very good footballer who seems to have the knack of being picked by many managers who don't seem to have got the memo that he's sh*te.

Has there ever been any rumour of another club wanting to poach Henderson from us, in all seriousness if he is as good as some on here think, and surely he must be as all managers pick him, then why no interest from Real Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern, PSG or even another prem club etc? Most of other players are at one time or another linked to other clubs, mostly just rumours of course, but never Jordan.

I think Henderson is by far our most negative midfielder, I could actually see him in a Maureen type neghead team but he is a square peg for a dynamic attack minded team like ours.
 

No fella, it's just the other lads have more sense than to get involved with the likes of you.
An example I am now going to follow.

Not arrogant at all then, I love this way of debating, when pushed for facts just retreat to your safe space and claim you cannot be bothered to discuss it any more, pathetic, would probably get more sense out of your grandson

www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/liverpool-ratings-psg-alisson-henderson-15479071.amp

Jordan Henderson 4

Looked devoid of energy whenever PSG players ran at him, which was costly first half. More of the ball after the break but didn't do enough with said possession.

Now I'm off to the manager thread to moan about how Gomez was moved to full back.

It was a game where Klopp got many things wrong, firstly the midfield was way to negative with Hendo and Milner and secondly why oh why mess with the one great thing we have at the moment, the defence. Gomez is a wonderful CB but at RB he doesn't offer the same outlet as Trent does so we lose a whole flank of attack.

Has there ever been any rumour of another club wanting to poach Henderson from us, in all seriousness if he is as good as some on here think, and surely he must be as all managers pick him, then why no interest from Real Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern, PSG or even another prem club etc? Most of other players are at one time or another linked to other clubs, mostly just rumours of course, but never Jordan.

I think Henderson is by far our most negative midfielder, I could actually see him in a Maureen type neghead team but he is a square peg for a dynamic attack minded team like ours.

I think a few PL clubs are interested in Henderson.... oh wait that's Dean Henderson. My bad.

 

But in the short cameos we've seen of Fabinho in the same position you can see a clear difference between him and Hendo.

He plays a lot more forward balls and is involved in the play a lot further up too.

You are absolutely right. Chelsea at home and Arsenal away (first half), as well as pre-season and the odd cameo when he was subbed on.

You can also clearly see the difference, but not just in possession, but also in movement:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XlFLqOvPIo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dc6GCMtdzPA (sorry, can't find a competitive match from last and this season, but this friendly is similar to his play style from deep)

Then you look at Wijnaldum, another different approach to Fab and Hendo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZsVKsqbD4w

But in the short cameos we've seen of Fabinho in the same position you can see a clear difference between him and Hendo.

He plays a lot more forward balls and is involved in the play a lot further up too.

So why would he instruct two players playing the same role to do pretty much the complete opposite?

There is no question players are coached/managed to abide, play and understand the tactics/system , but then so does every professional player, right? Each player has their own unique way of playing and offer a different skill. Just look at our games in a 433, you can clearly see despite having 3 different #6's , they all play different, but ultimately they play the same system/tactics that Klopp wants them to.

Ideally, I want someone with more positivity that reads the game better from deep.. oh, and a tough tackler too! Someone more comfortable in tight spaces and more prone to initiating attacks, and I believe Fabinho has shown enough on the skill set side to be that guy, however, his lack of game time p roves to be a stumbling block I am also very curious to see what Keita can offer in the lone 6 role.

You are absolutely right. Chelsea at home and Arsenal away (first half), as well as pre-season and the odd cameo when he was subbed on.

You can also clearly see the difference, but not just in possession, but also in movement:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XlFLqOvPIo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dc6GCMtdzPA (sorry, can't find a competitive match from last and this season, but this friendly is similar to his play style from deep)

Then you look at Wijnaldum, another different approach to Fab and Hendo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZsVKsqbD4w

There is no question players are coached/managed to abide, play and understand the tactics/system , but then so does every professional player, right? Each player has their own unique way of playing and offer a different skill. Just look at our games in a 433, you can clearly see despite having 3 different #6's , they all play different, but ultimately they play the same system/tactics that Klopp wants them to.

Ideally, I want someone with more positivity that reads the game better from deep.. oh, and a tough tackler too! Someone more comfortable in tight spaces and more prone to initiating attacks, and I believe Fabinho has shown enough on the skill set side to be that guy, however, his lack of game time p roves to be a stumbling block I am also very curious to see what Keita can offer in the lone 6 role.

Keita won't play a lone 6 role.

Fabinho has obviously not shown enough to the only bloke who matters.
It's not a "stumbling block"; if he had performed well enough to break into the team he would have done so, because what Klopp see's in training matters, something you ignore.

As others have said, he hasn't shown enough in any game yet to be considered a nailed on starter.
He might in the future, but he hasn't yet.
When Henderson is fit and available, he will play the deepest role, unless rotation puts him on the bench, which I expect to see plenty of for all our midfielders this season.

That's the fact of the matter, and all the cherrypicked youtube videos in the world won't change it.

I'd have no problem with Fabinho playing further up, in the 8 (ish) as Klopp said he will, and if he proves to Klopp that he can handle the deeper role better than Henderson I'd have no problem with that either, but so far, the predictions by so many that Henderson would immediately be benched have fallen woefully short of the mark.

Since you seem so fond of youtube video's, I expect you've already seen this but didn't want to post it.
This is the fella you say is bad in tight spaces, has no composure, doesn't pass forwards, isn't "technical", has no vision, and isn't quick.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBiswZiWc-o

Alicia Keys. Of all the musicians in all the world in all the history of recorded music, his favourite artist is Alicia Keys. Let that sink in for a moment. Then stop discussing him.

Alicia Keys. Of all the musicians in all the world in all the history of recorded music, his favourite artist is Alicia Keys. Let that sink in for a moment. Then stop discussing him.

Who gives a F**k what he listens to?

I listen to proper dub reggae sometimes, is that relevant?

And didn't Gerrard get into a bar fight over a phil F***ing collins song.Some kinda sh*te the glee /joy people get moaning about liverpool players.

And didn't Gerrard get into a bar fight over a phil F***ing collins song.Some kinda sh*te the glee /joy people get moaning about liverpool players.

 
I forgot about that.

Of all the things to get in a row over 

Keita won't play a lone 6 role.

Fabinho has obviously not shown enough to the only bloke who matters.
It's not a "stumbling block"; if he had performed well enough to break into the team he would have done so, because what Klopp see's in training matters, something you ignore.

As others have said, he hasn't shown enough in any game yet to be considered a nailed on starter.
He might in the future, but he hasn't yet.
When Henderson is fit and available, he will play the deepest role, unless rotation puts him on the bench, which I expect to see plenty of for all our midfielders this season.

That's the fact of the matter, and all the cherrypicked youtube videos in the world won't change it.

I'd have no problem with Fabinho playing further up, in the 8 (ish) as Klopp said he will, and if he proves to Klopp that he can handle the deeper role better than Henderson I'd have no problem with that either, but so far, the predictions by so many that Henderson would immediately be benched have fallen woefully short of the mark.

Since you seem so fond of youtube video's, I expect you've already seen this but didn't want to post it.
This is the fella you say is bad in tight spaces, has no composure, doesn't pass forwards, isn't "technical", has no vision, and isn't quick.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBiswZiWc-o

Ca I ask a question, if Klopp suddenly starts playing Fabinho in every game now, would you admit you are wrong or just blindly go with whatever Klopp does, even though in your mind you think Henderson is superior?
I'm starting to suspect that you are a bit of a WUM o this issue as whatever evidence you are presented with you just stick to your mantra of "Henderson good, everyone else bad"

And didn't Gerrard get into a bar fight over a phil f**king collins song.Some kinda sh*te the glee /joy people get moaning about liverpool players.

Was Stevie pro or against Phil Collins?

And didn't Gerrard get into a bar fight over a phil f**king collins song.Some kinda sh*te the glee /joy people get moaning about liverpool players.

I forgot about that.

Of all the things to get in a row over 

.....just another day in Paradise

Keita won't play a lone 6 role.

He may never play as the lone 6 role, but... he may do so as he certainly has the ability , unless you know something we don't?

As others have said, he hasn't shown enough in any game yet to be considered a nailed on starter.

And there are others who think he has shown enough, but I thought other people's opinion didn't matter? Why bring it up when only Klopp's opinion matters only for you? Oh wait, their opinion matters when they side with you?

I'd have no problem with Fabinho playing further up, in the 8 (ish) as Klopp said he will, and if he proves to Klopp that he can handle the deeper role better than Henderson I'd have no problem with that either, but so far, the predictions by so many that Henderson would immediately be benched have fallen woefully short of the mark.

I think you will find that Klopp said he can play 2, 6 and 8, meaning he can play 2, 6 and 8, or another way to look at it, he is comfortable in those areas, but for some reason, you are obsessed with pigeonholing him as an 8 and the more offensive player . It's like us signing Casemiro or Matic and ignoring their strengths and saying they are 8's because Klopp said they can play 2, 6 and 8...

Since you seem so fond of youtube video's, I expect you've already seen this but didn't want to post it.
This is the fella you say is bad in tight spaces, has no composure, doesn't pass forwards, isn't "technical", has no vision, and isn't quick.

I am fond of vs clips as you get a more rounded opinion than compilation clips, but nothing beats watching full matches, right? Something you should consider because obviously you don't.

He hasn't played a lone 6 (ish) role yet.

But more importantly, where did I say he has no composure, doesn't pass forward, isn't technical, has no vision and isn't quick? Please show me? Or are you talking sh*t and lying yet again?

You do understand some players have different levels of ability and fitness, right? Why can't you understand or accept this? You could get a player in the lower leagues more technical than a CL/Prem player, even some more naturally fit.

YNWA skipper..

Who gives a f**k what he listens to?

I listen to proper dub reggae sometimes, is that relevant?

So much anger. I'm not discussing him. His favourite artist is Alicia Keys.

And didn't Gerrard get into a bar fight over a phil f**king collins song.Some kinda sh*te the glee /joy people get moaning about liverpool players.

How exactly did that go?

But if that's the case and he is following Klopps instructions.

Does that mean Gini and Fabinho were told to be more attack minded when playing the exact same position?

If so, why do you think Henderson is instructed not to, could it be that Klopp doesn't rate his creative abilities?

Edit: I'm not even that arsed that he doesn't create much it isn't really his job.

What pisses me off about him is that he very rarely even passes to the attackers to allow them to create.

Many times he adds an unnecessary pass into a build up.

That tweet a page or two back illustrates it perfectly.

He will receive the ball with an attacking option and defensive option.

He will then usually pass to the defensive option who will then pass to the offensive option Henderson should have passed to in the first place.

It’s a well reasoned post and I agree with it (and a fair chunk of the criticism that comes Hendersons’ way) but I don’t understand why:

- A defensive midfielder (and that’s what Henderson is) is criticised for the most part for his failure to make things happen further forward?

- He gets the most criticism in games where we struggle to create whilst our front three get off Scott free, why is that?

- Fabinho got lots of praise in a couple of games for getting forward and being positive with his passing (remember he is also a defensive midfielder) without much attention paid to the defensive part of his game. Then he had an absolute stinker (away at Napoli I think) where he couldn’t get close to anyone, got caught in possession and gave the ball away and generally looked too slow over 5 yards. Funnily enough all things that Henderdon generally does quite well.

Now I’m not Henderson’s biggest fan but midfield is all about balance and Klopp has been playing the Hendo/Milner/Gini combo for much of the season and we can all see how limited it is. They’ve turned in some stinkers but it is always Henderson who gets the lions share of grief no matter that the other two might be poor. You need players like Keita or Ox in there to be able to appreciate the qualities of the three incumbents.

So much anger. I'm not discussing him. His favourite artist is Alicia Keys.

What anger?
Tit.

I don't even know who Alicia Keys is, and I don't really care.

He may never play as the lone 6 role, but... he may do so as he certainly has the ability , unless you know something we don't?

And there are others who think he has shown enough, but I thought other people's opinion didn't matter? Why bring it up when only Klopp's opinion matters only for you? Oh wait, their opinion matters when they side with you?

I think you will find that Klopp said he can play 2, 6 and 8, meaning he can play 2, 6 and 8, or another way to look at it, he is comfortable in those areas, but for some reason, you are obsessed with pigeonholing him as an 8 and the more offensive player . It's like us signing Casemiro or Matic and ignoring their strengths and saying they are 8's because Klopp said they can play 2, 6 and 8...

I am fond of vs clips as you get a more rounded opinion than compilation clips, but nothing beats watching full matches, right? Something you should consider because obviously you don't.

But more importantly, where did I say he has no composure, doesn't pass forward, isn't technical, has no vision and isn't quick? Please show me? Or are you talking sh*t and lying yet again?

You do understand some players have different levels of ability and fitness, right? Why can't you understand or accept this? You could get a player in the lower leagues more technical than a CL/Prem player, even some more naturally fit.

Where's the yawn emoji?

Stop lying and stick to Phil Neville video's, ye gobs***e.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXpRsX51QcY

It’s a well reasoned post and I agree with it (and a fair chunk of the criticism that comes Hendersons’ way) but I don’t understand why:

- A defensive midfielder (and that’s what Henderson is) is criticised for the most part for his failure to make things happen further forward?

- He gets the most criticism in games where we struggle to create whilst our front three get off Scott free, why is that?

- Fabinho got lots of praise in a couple of games for getting forward and being positive with his passing (remember he is also a defensive midfielder) without much attention paid to the defensive part of his game. Then he had an absolute stinker (away at Napoli I think) where he couldn’t get close to anyone, got caught in possession and gave the ball away and generally looked too slow over 5 yards. Funnily enough all things that Henderdon generally does quite well.

Now I’m not Henderson’s biggest fan but midfield is all about balance and Klopp has been playing the Hendo/Milner/Gini combo for much of the season and we can all see how limited it is. They’ve turned in some stinkers but it is always Henderson who gets the lions share of grief no matter that the other two might be poor. You need players like Keita or Ox in there to be able to appreciate the qualities of the three incumbents.

He's played as a defensive midfielder (Fabinho that is) but Klopp stated in an interview he could play 2, 6, 8 so with that in mind and considering he doesn't seem to have quite got used to the pace of the prem yet, I'd be happy enough with him further up the pitch on Sunday.

People use anything as a stick to beat Henderson with, and it's pretty laughable some of the sh*te they come out with, as you say, expecting the deepest midfielder to be the creative one.

I'm pretty sure it's because he's English, because we already have the "he's technically limited" and "he's an industrial player" (yep, not industrious, industrial), and on top of that, he succeeded Gerrard as captain.

I know I keep banging this drum, but without a midfield runner breaking the opposition lines (Ox and Keita, as you say) then we are going to play in a  less exciting way, but as long as we keep grinding out results, I'm not really fussed.

Saying Klopp will lose credibility if he doesn't get rid of Henderson isn't an opinion, it's a fantasy and a load of tripe, with absolutely nothing to back it up.

In order for an opinion to have merit, it has to have a basis in some sort of fact, not some weird anti Henderson daydream that you alone have.

I backed it up with Klopp in similar positions before with Moreno and Mignolet. How is the Henderson situation different?

I backed it up with Klopp in similar positions before with Moreno and Mignolet. How is the Henderson situation different?

You didn't back anything up.

You just posted some weird fantasy scenario.

You've been banging this drum for a while now, clowning on about Klopp's "credibility" being lost if he doesn't do what a few internet gobshites want.
It's utter F***ing fantasy.

Then you tried the angle that Fabinho would be sold if Klopp didn't immediately bin Henderson, using such bullshit terms as "frozen out" to try and provoke a response.

Now you're back onto Klopp's credibility, as if anyone who knows Klopp gives a F**k about what some no mark on an internet forum thinks.

Surely you're not so deluded that you think anyone who matters at the club or in his life actually reads the sh*te you post, are you?