Liverpool 0-0 Swansea: Post Match Sorrows

I suppose, go with a 3 man midfield mate, throw Jay in the middle, let him and Lucas do all the hurrying and harrassing like the little terriers they are and deploy Adam in somewhat deep lying play maker role.

Maybe away from home but at home I'd much prefer Henderson alongside Adam, in front of Lucas. Arguably less defensive but certainly a more creative option (in my opinion).

All three pressing, Lucas defending and Charlie with Jordan both creating and joining in. Either way; a change when change is needed must be the order of the day - irrespective of when it comes. I've used half-time as it's the most obvious time to do so but we should be able to adapt quicker, if required.

We need to do something mate, because if we afford Chelsea and City as much time and space on the ball, they will put us to the sword and I fear that the Tottenham game will not be a freak one off result. I go into every game believing we'll take all 3 points but we've got some work to do on pressing the opposition before we get to those games, because if we allow the likes of Mata and Torres and Silva and Aguero the space we afforded Swansea they will more often than not make us pay for it.

Sometimes no formation changes in the world can help players who don't want to work hard, chase the ball and put movement in off the ball.

Indeed (and maybe it's me that's being naive here) but most times, when a shift has, undoubtedly, been put in (Norwich, Man U and Sunderland) and we still don't win; formation changes will help, in my opinion. I guess if we don't try it we'll never know.

Here's hoping that, in future, all our shift work early on in games can be converted into a nice cushion of goals.

We need to do something mate, because if we afford Chelsea and City as much time and space on the ball, they will put us to the sword and I fear that the Tottenham game will not be a freak one off result. I go into every game believing we'll take all 3 points but we've got some work to do on pressing the opposition before we get to those games, because if we allow the likes of Mata and Torres and Silva and Aguero the space we afforded Swansea they will more often than not make us pay for it.

this. our midfield is too immobile to press all through the game. lucas doing all the chasing and tackling is not enough. mascha had alonso and stevie in front of him, who both put in a shift in tackling and chasing far more than adam and hendo does. so defensive side of our game started much higher up the pitch.

someone mentioned adam doing a lot of running, which says nothing. running non-stop for 90 minutes at a donkey's pace doesn't mean it's effective. we're losing too many battles/balls/tackles in the middle. add to it that the lack of goals, not just from strikers but from midfielders, we get a pitiful return of 14 goals in 11 matches. Chelsea have 11 league goals from their midfield alone this season, city 12, scum 10, spurs 12. only newcastle and arsenal are struggling for goals from midfield around us, but their strikers are more than doing their job.

one other thing that has changed over the past few games is the form of downing. he started the season very impressively but he's been disappearing recently. we need his pace on the left to create a genuine attacking feel. enrique has been brilliant in attacking and johnson too, but we need more from wingers. we went down the middle too often on saturday.

I really fear the city match if there is no change in formation silva is excellent between the lines he would have a field day

We were rubbish satday lets have it right no urgency until Kuyt came on. Our midfield was far too deep for 80 minutes of the game.
Henderson should have been switched to centre & Adam should have gone off he was shocking, slow & clueless. Bellamy should be starting games in front of Carroll atm.
Swansea deserved the 3 points if i'm being honest.

I really fear the city match if there is no change in formation silva is excellent between the lines he would have a field day

The formation is ok for City its probably not ok at home against Norwich.Swansea or UTD the samller teams.

Credit when due: Fans Approval

When our own fans clapped the opposing team off the pitch (nothing wrong with that, an all round appreciation for a good performance) tells us how bad our performance has been. Hope those who performed badly in the last few games read that and KD should throw the papers at them. I think KD needs to start to be ruthless with the non-performers, honeymoon is over and time to perform, otherwise get lost from the club and we get someone else in that is willing to die for the club. Still fuming at our embarassing display.

In essence the same problems we've had for the past few games, just re-appeared. If we had won against Sunderland, Man U and Norwich (home games) instead of the draws, it would have been easier to accept this match as 2 points dropped. The reason why so many are upset is coz we again failed to control the midfield and more importantly didnt take our goal scoring opportunities.

I have no issue with which players are on the field, simply coz the same team has won away and drawn the above home matches with very good performances, yet didnt score many goals...which is where the most concern lies for me.

In the upcoming matches, we will be faced with "superior" midfielders, so our conversion of scoring chances becomes very important. This is what needs to be addressed urgently.
Either we get Andy, Dirk, Craig and Luis to sharpen up dramatically, or we need to consider another striker in the transfer window.

These lost points will come back to haunt us at end of season, so Kenny needs to act Now!

Well done Swansea, but if Andy took his chance... it would have been a totally different game.   

The formation is ok for City its probably not ok at home against Norwich.   Swansea or  UTD the smaller teams.

 

Reading through these posts is great. Some very humourous lines, some very angry, a few extremely serious and the occasional nutter. All voicing their opinions on players, tactics, strategies, subs, committment, and nearly every one seems to have a different solution to our current plight.

Our home form this season has reaped one point less, that at the same stage under Woy last season. Well I have my own opinion, and it is just an opinion, on why we are where we are.

We just don't have the quality in center Mid that we should have. Average tackling, not tracking back quick enough, losing possesion cheaply, committing to many fouls, indecisive when under pressure, no finesse, no guile, no creativity. Pulling our own players out of position to cover to often, Yeah thats Charlie. Sorry if it offends anyone, just my opinion, but no better now than he was at Rangers, where he couldn't hold down a first team place. Fired off a few decent 40 yd passes for Blackpool and a couple of long range goals and we buy him.

With all the top clubs fighting for his services, we are obviously very honoured. My arse. Henderson, boy amongst men. Will improve in time perhaps but certainly not top drawer. Ask yourselves, would either of these really walk into the first team automaticly at say, Everton, Stoke, Newcastle, Villa,  Naaahhh. Possibly Leiscester, Swindon or Brighton. I'll suport the Reds till I die but what the F**k are we doing buying this standard of player as automatic choices in our first team?

Just watched the game now. Johnson had no support from Hendo on the right, actually it should be the other way round, but everytime Glen went forward he was waiting for Hendo to go on the overlap but instead he had to try and take two defenders on. We are struggling to get good balls into the box and Enrique and Downing could have done better with their deliveries. I still insist that IMO when we play the likes of Norwich and Swansea we can play a 3-5-2 and push them back. Flat performance, movement not good enough, nor was the passing and the team looked frustrated with no creativity and until we get a world class midfielder it is not going to change. Long way to go but also not much time to improve to keep in touch of that top four place. Voted Glen as MOTM although there was not much to choose from. I really would like to see Jay Spearing in there at the moment and we need Stevie back ASAP.

I thought Glen had a good game, especially considering he had the whole right flank to defend/attack, as Henderson drifted so far inside, even Kuyt didn't offer much more protection or a better outlet ball for him. 

Just reading back through the post match parts of this thread.  Even straight after the final whistle - amongst the usual knee-jerking there are some really good well thought out posts from quite a number of users (apologies some of your good points get missed because people are too busy bickering).

The 4-4-2 clearly doesn't work as well when it is Lucas and Adam.  It would look a lot better if you had Lucas and Gerrard.  Adam does get bypassed a lot and doesn't pressure players as much on the ball - 4-4-2 only works if one of the midfielders is a real box-to-box dynamic player.  Adam isn't that.  He isn't a ball carrier - he's a receive and release it player.  I do agree with a lot of posters that Adam is only likely to work for us in midfield if he is part of a three rather than a two.

In no way am I comparing Adam to Alonso, but Alonso always looked much better when he had a Mascherano next to him and a Gerrard in there as well to offer some form of protection.

The problem with that scenario is that you just can't see Carroll playing much (unlikely to get picked as the forward often over Luis), and while Suarez is a fantastic footballer - can he get all the goals himself?

It's a really tricky problem.  I think for 4-4-2 you have to have much better players than you can get away with - with our more recent traditional 4-2-3-1.

With Chelsea up next I'd hope Gerrard is back.  If he isn't then 4-4-2 with Adam in the middle is likely to be a mistake.

Really watched the game again and again.

Nothing wrong with the line-up. Another bad day really. Their goal-keeper had a very good game.

All the Charlie Adam attacks are really over the top, he didn't have a bad game. Wished we had someone that will work well with Suarez though to further unlock their defence; say a fit Gerrard.

Suarez also needs to grow in confidence.

Teams use to come to Anfield afraid of facing Liverpool FC at home. We use to complain of teams packing the bus, now teams come to Anfield and actually take the game to us! WTF? We need to get fear-factor back at Anfield.

Swansea deserved the 3 points if i'm being honest.

Something i always find funny. Even after we played a shocker, we still ended up with more possession overall, still had more shots, still had more of the better chances in the game. So why does Swansea deserve the 3 points? Eh, we certainly didn't exactly deserve them either, but they didn't put in a performance that i would say says they deserved all three. Draw was a fair reflection of the game IMO, us being disjointed but still having chances, them having some good play as well.

This international break has definitely come at the right time, for once. Might do the players some good to refocus a little over the time, so performances like this can be banished to memory as "one of those rebuilding games we had in the past"

Still in shock at how terrible a second half we came out with, though.

We just don't have the suitable players to play 4-4-2. The defence is okay. Lucas does all the defending himself because Downing, Adam and Henderson aren't being a great help in that department. Henderson and Downing are not beating their man enough for supposedly "wingers". Downing has been below par and needs a kick up his arse. Henderson, understable as he is playing out of position but I don't know why Kenny insists on playing him there! Adam is great when we're going forward but much of a liability when we've not got the ball.

What worries me is, this game was one of Suarez's relatively quiet games and it looks as though we cannot play when he's not at the top of his game and that's the last thing I want to see here because I don't want us to be dependant on him.

If we're going to play 4-4-2, it should be Henderson/Spearing (Gerrard unfit) beside Lucas and maybe Johnson/Bellamy takes up the wings (not much of a choice do we). If not, it's going to be 4-3-3 with Adam, Lucas and Downing/Henderson/Spearing in the middle with Suarez/Carroll/Maxi/Kuyt up top.

I do think long term that we need to move away from playing 4-4-2 all the time. Maybe a 4-3-3 with Lucas, Adam and Gerrard in midfield with Bellamy, Suarez out wide in support of Carroll, Luiz played most of his Ajx career in a similar role.

I agree that the 4-4-2 hasn't been the greatest attack and suggesting all sorts of changes is well and good but, does anybody really think Mr.Dalglish is adventurous/inventive enough to experiment with alternative formations?

I have been guilty of being critical of the gaffer, this is not an attack on the management, however, from what I have seen so far I am not sure he is willing to experiment with 3-5-2 or 4-3-3, as much as I agree we need something different to shake things up, but I can't see it happening.

Perhaps creating some genuine competition for places by dropping one or two players might give them the kick up the backside they appear to need sometimes.

 Just one point I'd make on the 4-4-2. Like all formations and positions in football, there's 4-4-2 and there's 4-4-2 and much depends on the players who are playing in the system. It's players which make it work nine times out of ten, not blackboards and theoritical planning.

 Many people have said the 4-4-2 worked better with Alonso in there rather than Adam. A couple of points on that. Firstly Alonso is a different class player to Adam (I think even Adam himself would admit that) so therefore it's no surprise. Secondly, just like Adam, Alonso very rarely went properly forward which was/is rare for a creative midfielder. The difference however is that Alonso had Gerrard/Torres ripping defences up for erse paper in front of him, whereas Adam has Suarez and Carroll trying to find a method, but not scoring anywhere near so many goals between them.

 Things aren't always the way they look in football, watching it over many years teaches you that. The problem normally has a symptom which lies at its root cause. Right now, given our misfiring in front of goal we cannot afford to have midfielders who never score. We had the best part of four playing on Saturday, Alonso fantastic player though he is never really had to cope with that problem.   

We may set up as 4-4-2 at kick off but what formation is it when the two full backs are deep in the opponenents half.The modern football team have a fluid formation and I think people get too hung up on formations. Against Swansea and others we lacked  quality as a team not any individual picking out players all the time who come in for stick is just wrong. Adam gets stick for not being Alonso,Henderson for not being Gerrard and Carrol for not being an in form Torres. We are where we are and Kenny is building a side,the squad is better and maybe the difference is down to one player not being at his  best or even available. A fit and healthy Stevie would transform any team lets hope he can do it again for us or maybe the Cheque book will have to come out again.

Right now, given our misfiring in front of goal we cannot afford to have midfielders who never score.

Or even get forward.  If you play 4-4-2 like we are - you can't afford to have a midfielder who doesn't want to get anywhere near the penalty box.

Or even get forward.  If you play 4-4-2 like we are - you can't afford to have a midfielder who doesn't want to get anywhere near the penalty box.

Could really use Aquilani at this stage.