Brendan Rodgers (Liverpool -> Celtic -> Leicester)

I remember Rafa turning guys worth £2m in to £20m simply because he knew what he needed and bought whoever it was, whether they were flashy or brilliant.

Arbeloa and Masch were his best signings and nailed everything good about Rafa. He knew what he needed, plucked Arbeloa from the nothingness of Spain and turned him in to a stalwart.

Mascherano came in on loan and immediately transformed us. From the West Ham ressies to national captain.

With Brendan he's got Coutinho, Sterling and no one else. All these expensive signings and we have F**k all to show for it.

Imagine Rafa having all that money to spend. Multiple £20m+ signings and we'd be chanting his name still and celebrating glory.

Whoever next boss is, and i hope it is soon, it has to be top class. We cant get Gary Monk or someone of that ilk in. To be where we want to be it has to be someone who knows how to get it. Ancelotti would be a bloody perfect signing.

Shocking stat this i must say:

https://twitter.com/MrPrice1979/status/638108449893707780

Shocking stat this i must say:

https://twitter.com/MrPrice1979/status/638108449893707780

The Damning thing about that is, under Rafa even Houllier, if we went behind, you always felt we could get back in to game and get 3 points, under Rodgers that is not the case.

I have had it with Rogers after the WH game any confidence built up in the first few games evaporated into thin air, can anyone believe this won't happen again, take our home games since the MU home game and it don't make pretty reading, I was hoping that those sort of results  was all put behind us but after the week end I now realize it's an inbuilt trait with Rogers it's something that has been a theme again and again. I find myself asking the same question about BR, can he move the club forward to where results like this will not happen or is everything exceptional as Rogers puts it.

When you look at our central midfield options:

Allen
Henderson
Lucas
Milner
Can

the lack of creativity there is startling.

It's part of the reason why I and others were saying Benteke doesn't fit our style because you need width to supply him yet we have no natural width in the side. The commentator stated that we currently have the lowest number of crosses into the box in the entire league, so we have to fix a self created problem. I think you have to pack the midfield with creativity and actually play a more compact game but without exceptional movement up top then no amount of creativity is going to help so Ings would be an option if it didn't then expose our CBs through limited options in midfield.

Without Coutinho, Lallana and Henderson the midfield can't support it as Lucas simply doesn't have the mobility to cover and we don't have the legs in the side to accommodate. It's startling that just a couple of injuries have limited our options so massively.

The more I think about our side and how we would best get the greatest out of the sum of the parts I believe we need to play Teixeira:

              Benteke Ings
    Firmino    Teixeira  Milner
                   Lucas
 Moreno  Sakho   Skrtel  Clyne

Away from home at Old Toilet I don't expect to see this, I expect the 3 CBs to return and our creativity to again look underwhelming. We can either go forward and try to win games accepting our failures in defence or we can attempt to mask them at the expense of all creativity.

Thanks for the considered reply.

Where I would take issue with you is on two premises of your post:

1) Benteke needs crosses otherwise he can't score. This is Tim Sherwood's view and one I disagree with. If you play Benteke through one-on-one he will perform as well as any of our other strikers apart from Sturridge. If you look at a collection of his goals he can score all types. Just because he is such an aerial threat and is a big guy doesn't mean his game is limited to converting crosses. What he does need is service - as demonstrated by Coutinho which has led to him coming close / hitting the woodwork in the three games so far.

2) for the sake of argument, if literally the ONLY way he could score was through crosses his inclusion in the squad would still be valuable since he offers a different option to any of the other strikers we had/have on our books. There's no point buying another version of Sturridge / Origi / Ings / Borini / Balotelli - they should be option and cover enough for playing through the middle.


I would like to see a back line that can press and distribute the ball well to midfield - so Ilori and Sakho in the middle with Lucas as cover in front (if Moreno and Clyne bomb on) with space for Firmino, Couts and Lallana/Markovic (too late!) getting a run together and the rest of the team giving us a solid press.

I think anyone who thinks FSG will sack Brendan before the end of this season is going to be wrong . I wonder just what the tipping point for FSG is ?.
The whole club is a mess from top to bottom and that means now for over 8 years we have basically been mis-managed.
i used to think Parry and Moores were just a joke but I would have them back in a heart beat.

I think another key factor was that the season we were on fire, Coutinho played in Midfield in a lot of our big wins. He sucks out on the left for the most part, especially when we have a right footed leftback who also always comes inside and No sterling causing problems on the right.

e.g



At the end of the day Lovren, Moreno, Balotelli, Benteke, Lallana, Markovic, Firmino, Borini, and even lambert were all excellent players in their own right. But its not working. for some reason.

He either got it painfully wrong in the transfer market getting players that dont suit 'his' system.

or he needs time to make them work, because at this rate we cant keep buying all these players (international class players mind you) and be sending them out on loan for a season because theyre suddenly rubbish after we spend 22 million on them. Its getting ridiculous. 

How long can you give someone to get it right? How many more players can we buy? I was a strong Rodgers supporter but he doesnt seem to learn, or learn fast enough. We haven't looked good with one up front EVER, unless it was with Suarez. We aren't gonna just stumble on another Suarez so there has to be a new plan. I dont care if its 3-5-2 but these sorts of defeats are unacceptable. We cant be losing 3-0 at home to west ham.

I agree. Key point here is that it is Suarez who made the two up top work as you simply can't leave out a player of his (or Stuirridge's) calibre.

Take a look at Chelsea two summers back.. They needed a boss lad up top and a creative player in the middle to fit their system.. So that's who they signed.

Yes, but equally a couple more summers before that they needed more goals and to tighten up at the back so Abramovich bought them Torres and David Luiz who created sheer havoc in their own special ways.

We were also in for Costa but Chelsea were prepared to go a whole season without a proper striker to wait for him. Fabregas has looked disappointing since about the middle of last season.

1) Benteke needs crosses otherwise he can't score. This is Tim Sherwood's view and one I disagree with. If you play Benteke through one-on-one he will perform as well as any of our other strikers apart from Sturridge. If you look at a collection of his goals he can score all types. Just because he is such an aerial threat and is a big guy doesn't mean his game is limited to converting crosses. What he does need is service - as demonstrated by Coutinho which has led to him coming close / hitting the woodwork in the three games so far.

Slight misunderstanding I think HB, it was that to be a natural fit I believe we'd need to be a team with either width or lots of creativity in and around him. Basically he's not the type of player than can create something out of nothing, he isn't a Suarez or Sturridge in that manner he really does depend on the creativity of others.

2) for the sake of argument, if literally the ONLY way he could score was through crosses his inclusion in the squad would still be valuable since he offers a different option to any of the other strikers we had/have on our books. There's no point buying another version of Sturridge / Origi / Ings / Borini / Balotelli - they should be option and cover enough for playing through the middle.

I accept your point about his value and I have been encouraged by some of Benteke's play. I thought he would look like a fish out of water in our side but his interplay has been better than I expected, however the lack of width or crosses and nobody willing to get alongside or beyond him has made him look an awful lot worse. This was basically the premise of my post, that our team has no cohesion, there's no clear plan for how we want to play and that ties in with so many players playing out of position in our starting XI's.

I'm sure people will suggest teething problems and time to gel with each other (not Henderson and Can's hair) but we've witnessed it before when we've played lone big strikers, the cohesion doesn't exist and they are constantly isolated.

The Damning thing about that is, under Rafa even Houllier, if we went behind, you always felt we could get back in to game and get 3 points, under Rodgers that is not the case.

I still remember a fair few matches from 08-09 season.2 down against city at half time,won the game 3-2.Add a few more such as Boro at home,Scum away and home.Only game i remember where Rodgers came back from behind was Fulham away in 13-14 season.

Just pulled this from another cracking post Jon and it really does sum us up.

You couldn't really highlight it more when we have Raheem Sterling and Markovic playing as wing-backs. Their talent wasted in positions that will only serve to frustrate and underwhelm both fan and player alike. It's been a recurring theme throughout Brendan's tenure that players are played out of position. Now the question would be, is it his fault through not getting the players he wants? I believe the apologists would attempt to sell that story but it doesn't wash for a second, he's also had plenty of what he did want and he's failed to fit them into a coherent unit.

Can for example, the German national coach let slip that Brendan wants to play him in Gerrard's role as the deep lying play maker, yet when he's figured this season he's actually played more as a right sided midfielder. Last season he was a CB or RB, this lad is a talent but we're developing him with no long term plan in mind he's just shoved in wherever there's room or crisis it seems.

That's why it frustrates me to see the likes of Markovic go out on loan, he was one of Europe's absolute best but I feel his confidence is destroyed and that's thanks to being managed by Brendan. Sure he may not have been good enough in the end but his management sure as hell provided him with no platform to showcase his talents and when you're constantly subbed off at half-time is it any wonder you fail to produce when asked?

Gomez a CB or RB comes into our team as a LB, the list goes on and frankly all I see in our team now is a group of players who don't bring out the best in each other, no leadership, very little top quality and far too many mistakes waiting to happen. I've said it a few times now but I'd gladly trade this squad for the one Brendan inherited:

                    Reina
Johnson  Skrtel    Agger    Enrique
                   Lucas
           Henderson Gerrard
    Kuyt                          Rodriguez
                   Suarez

That team could almost win the league in my opinion (cue people ripping into Kenny on the back of that comment), where ours I believe are 5th - 8th place at best. West Ham may have been only one game but the performances in all 4 have finished me completely with Brendan and I really do hope we come to our senses sooner rather than later.

Good post Luke

The more I think and look at the transfers under Rodgers/FSG I struggle to see the sense in so many of them.

Brendan doesn't seem to have a preferred formation that he is buying for, he has played versions of 4-3-3' 4-2-3-1, 3-5-2, 3-4-2-1, 4-4-2, 3-4-1-2... It's baffeling to me let alone a strategy to buy to.

Looking at the players that have been brought in during the last 3 years, discounting for the most part youth signings and the keepers.

Borini
Allen
Assisi
Sabin
Sturridge
Coutinho
Alberto
Ings
Milner
Clyne
Firmino
Be take
Aspas
Toure
Cissokho
Sakho
Lambert
Lallana
Can
Markovic
Lovren
Origi
Manquillo
Moreno
Balotelli
Gomez

That's a lost for 3 years, not a decade or something.. The lack of joined up thinking in the strategy is frightening, some signed by one man, some signed by others, all the time no real system to fit them into.

I'd think the following have suffered due to no real ideal system to fit them into.

Allen
Sahin
Lambert
Lallana
Can
Markovic
Balotelli

Are they good players? Yes all of them are but we haven't brought any of them in my opinion to fill a role in a specific system and they suffer for that.

Some others

Assaidi
Borini
Aspas
Ings
Toure

Not the best players of course, but no team is made up of superstars and had we been playing a set system and these were signed with ideas of roles they can fill within that to do a job for the squad and system they wouldn't have utterly flopped

The likes of Firmino, Benteke etc could go the same way this season as currently we are repeating the same mistakes with them.

Some of the obvious wastes of money I can't understand either.. The Fact we spend nearly 40m on two CBS is an utter waste, even if Brendan didn't ideally target Sakho, at 18m and a cb of his talent he should be able to work with him and improve that situation, get him and Skrtel settled and have Toure and another youngster of whom we have plenty to fill in around them, get them settled as a pair.. Why go out and then spend another 20m on another cb which by default fucks up the spending of the 18m on the previous one when you could have spent that elsewhere, either on wages or a better option/upgrade on a different incomer.

I can't believe some of the players who have come in with seemingly no plan on how to use them, the turnover of the squad in recent years has been criminal.




Just a separate point on the one you made on Gomez, I know I've been absent recently but I have thought all season using him at Left Back isn't a long term solution, not even a short term one.. He's a good lad, I'm impressed but it was clear it wouldn't take long for good managers at this level to look at him and target his side, a right footed cb playing at lb where he constantly has to check his feet and come inside.. It's not really fair on him. He had played what 20 first team games in the championship never in that position and we think that he won't get targeted? Or that the obvious way he can't overlap wide left and we filter everything through Clyne wide right won't become easy to stop? When it's the only outlet

Ah yes fair enough - he definitely isnt the creatve type, we need to find a way to harness his strengths which means intelligent midfielders.

We've got that in Coutinho but the others need to step up to the mark - the kind of service we saw Stevie providing to tee up Big Andy at Newcastle when he came on as a sub or the balls he fer to Balotelli.

Thing is though the problem still remains with the midfield - if they areny protecting the back line and they are relyingbon strikers to be creative and make their owb chances the question arisises as to what exactky they are spending their time doing?

Im also still puzzled by how the season is progressing - yes Brendan had lost out to the likes of Bilic, Hughes and Tactics Tim - but so has Wenger (Ozil/Sanchez). Van Gaal (Rooney/Schweinstiger) had lost three in a row to Gary Monk. Morinho (Fabregas/Hazard/Costa) has just lost three times for the first time ever in any league to Alan Pardew.

Alam F***ing Pardew.


What the hell is going on?

Good post Luke

The more I think and look at the transfers under Rodgers/FSG I struggle to see the sense in so many of them.

Brendan doesn't seem to have a preferred formation that he is buying for, he has played versions of 4-3-3' 4-2-3-1, 3-5-2, 3-4-2-1, 4-4-2, 3-4-1-2... It's baffeling to me let alone a strategy to buy to.

Looking at the players that have been brought in during the last 3 years, discounting for the most part youth signings and the keepers.

Borini
Allen
Assisi
Sabin
Sturridge
Coutinho
Alberto
Ings
Milner
Clyne
Firmino
Be take
Aspas
Toure
Cissokho
Sakho
Lambert
Lallana
Can
Markovic
Lovren
Origi
Manquillo
Moreno
Balotelli
Gomez

That's a lost for 3 years, not a decade or something.. The lack of joined up thinking in the strategy is frightening, some signed by one man, some signed by others, all the time no real system to fit them into.

I'd think the following have suffered due to no real ideal system to fit them into.

Allen
Sahin
Lambert
Lallana
Can
Markovic
Balotelli

Are they good players? Yes all of them are but we haven't brought any of them in my opinion to fill a role in a specific system and they suffer for that.

Some others

Assaidi
Borini
Aspas
Ings
Toure

Not the best players of course, but no team is made up of superstars and had we been playing a set system and these were signed with ideas of roles they can fill within that to do a job for the squad and system they wouldn't have utterly flopped

The likes of Firmino, Benteke etc could go the same way this season as currently we are repeating the same mistakes with them.

Some of the obvious wastes of money I can't understand either.. The Fact we spend nearly 40m on two CBS is an utter waste, even if Brendan didn't ideally target Sakho, at 18m and a cb of his talent he should be able to work with him and improve that situation, get him and Skrtel settled and have Toure and another youngster of whom we have plenty to fill in around them, get them settled as a pair.. Why go out and then spend another 20m on another cb which by default fucks up the spending of the 18m on the previous one when you could have spent that elsewhere, either on wages or a better option/upgrade on a different incomer.

I can't believe some of the players who have come in with seemingly no plan on how to use them, the turnover of the squad in recent years has been criminal.




Just a separate point on the one you made on Gomez, I know I've been absent recently but I have thought all season using him at Left Back isn't a long term solution, not even a short term one.. He's a good lad, I'm impressed but it was clear it wouldn't take long for good managers at this level to look at him and target his side, a right footed cb playing at lb where he constantly has to check his feet and come inside.. It's not really fair on him. He had played what 20 first team games in the championship never in that position and we think that he won't get targeted? Or that the obvious way he can't overlap wide left and we filter everything through Clyne wide right won't become easy to stop? When it's the only outlet

Mate, the point of the strategy is not to buy to a "plan".

The problem is that you cant predict which players are coming to market.

When Suarez left, for example, whi do you replace him with? Closest fit would be Tevez or Aguero - neither of whom ate available - or Sanchez - who wanted to play in London.

So what do you do? Can you afford to sacrifice a season waiting for the "right" player to be available? This is what Chelsea did with Costa - if they had signed a proper striker in 12/13 they woild have most likely beaten us and City to the title but they held out knowing that they had the financial resources when the time came.

On the other hand you will have some seasons when, say, three world class attacking midfielders are available (and so the likes of Shaqiri end up at Stoke).

The approach here is then to buy (what you think are) quality players and employ a tactically flexible manager to fit them into a system together.

Thats what we have done with Rodgers and therefore switched from a 1433 death-by-football possession based game to playing a 1442 conuterattacking diamond - and then a 1343 and so on.

Rodgers will find a way to integrate the players but it is a process that takes time - time i dont think he has.

But the point of the strategy is not to buy for a fixed "plan" so that you can maximise your chances in the market.

Some cracking posts in here - well constructed and thought provoking.

The two points that have given most food for thought (for me anyhow) are - 1: that we really are rudderless off the field - i.e. no one actually steering us in the direction of this "new philosophy" we were promised, when FSG came [remember John W praising Damien Comolli for providing that, not long before he sacked him?] and 2: no real purpose/direction/plan/philosophy (call it what you want) on the field.

I believe the two have one root cause but can't be arsed banging on, yet again, about business models and investments being more important (to the powers that be) than footballing success.

At the start of this summer I said that, for the first time, I would hold Brendan Rodgers accountable for all transfers and by default, their success, because he had come out of a meeting (job intact) saying that "a comprehensive plan had been agreed" - I'll stand over that. For that reason and that reason alone, I am looking at the four games in splendid isolation from last season.

However, getting back to football and point "2"... the thing which has struck me most is that the style of football which worked well for us has been abandoned. The fast, free-flowing, attacking football has been replaced by insipid, predictable play. The two can not, under any stretch of the imagination, be described as part of the one 'philosophy'; did it even exist or was that bull-sh*t?

We were told, when Mr Tom and Mr John sacked Kenny that it was "Always the plan for Kenny to only do the job until the right young man came along for the long-term" and truth is; that's when the alarm bells started ringing for me. "Always the plan..." yet Kenny was sacked before they even knew if the "right young man" existed or who that "right young man was"? Even more bull-sh*t? Think about it. Anyhow...

Whilst I'll readily stand over my 'promise' - I still can't extract myself from the 'root cause' argument - what came first Reds; the chicken or the egg?

Yeah we can cure a symptom but until we cure the disease this club will never be healthy.

I often reflect on the summer of 2013 and Pepe and Carra's departures. Agger was frozen out through that season.

We lost the only two true defensive organisers in one fail swoop and at the time I really wondered whether we had the depth of quality and experience across the back-line to cope in the Premiership.

We came so close in the following season - but were let down by an inability to defend competently. Not excellently, competently. Now we have Migs in goals with Skrtel and Lovren in the centre and Sakho as the back up.

There's absolutely zero leadership there and despite the clean sheets last year I still think there is no real confidence in Migs when we're under pressure. He doesn't command or direct the defenders and it showed again on Saturday - for me he shares culpability for the first at least.

My point here is not aimed at Migs per se......just the flawed thinking that got us to this place.

All the points PD & Luke make are absolutely bang on

I like the Gaffer, why wouldn't I? He comes across as a nice individual, and I have no reason to personally dislike him.

He's trying to do his best, not his worst. It might just be that he's not good enough to bring back the glory days at Liverpool FC. It's a very difficult job for anyone. Ask Dalglish and Rafa.

I've just lost my faith in him and think it's time to move on. I wanted him gone at the end of season 3 and the Stoke disaster. I cooled down and thought give him until Christmas. But the West Ham defeat brought back all my old fears and reopened the wound. It told me that we've not learned a thing.

But I've changed my mind again (I know, sue me ) and want him to stay until Christmas. And the only thing that's changed my mind is not the Gaffer himself, but his back room staff.

I say, let's give the Gaffer AND Sean O' Driscoll, AND Gary Mac (i.e. the entire backroom staff), time to get their ideas across to the players.

The defensive display against Arsenal was very good, so let's call West Ham nothing more than players taking on board a few new ideas from the backroom staff, and trying to implement them.

I like the Gaffer, why wouldn't I? He comes across as a nice individual, and I have no reason to personally dislike him.

He's trying to do his best, not his worst. It might just be that he's not good enough to bring back the glory days at Liverpool FC. It's a very difficult job for anyone. Ask Dalglish and Rafa.

I've just lost my faith in him and think it's time to move on. I wanted him gone at the end of season 3 and the Stoke disaster. I cooled down and thought give him until Christmas. But the West Ham defeat brought back all my old fears and reopened the wound. It told me that we've not learned a thing.

But I've changed my mind again (I know, sue me ) and want him to stay until Christmas. And the only thing that's changed my mind is not the Gaffer himself, but his back room staff.

I say, let's give the Gaffer AND Sean O' Driscoll, AND Gary Mac (i.e. the entire backroom staff), time to get their ideas across to the players.

The defensive display against Arsenal was very good, so let's call West Ham nothing more than players taking on board a few new ideas from the backroom staff, and trying to implement them.

Got to say i cannot recall any other managers having fans calling for a stay of execution, based on the chance , to give their backroom staff a chance to bed in.

Just when will it be time for Rodgers ,  and Rodgers alone,  to be blamed for what we witness?

HE is the MANAGER. The single most frustrating trait he has IMO, is repeating the same mistakes over and over.

I honestly cannot remember a manager changing formations , during games , as much as this fella. He has all week to work with the players on the game ahead. All week to assess the opposition yet, it all gets torn up on the day. These are the basics of football management .

Also the 4-3-3 formation does not work .It isolates players all over the pitch, and playing a holding midfielder at home to WEST HAM?

When you look at our central midfield options:

Allen
Henderson
Lucas
Milner
Can

the lack of creativity there is startling.

It's one reason I've been a long time advocate of playing Phil in the midfield Luke.

I've just lost my faith in him and think it's time to move on. I wanted him gone at the end of season 3 and the Stoke disaster. I cooled down and thought give him until Christmas. But the West Ham defeat brought back all my old fears and reopened the wound. It told me that we've not learned a thing.

But I've changed my mind again (I know, sue me ) and want him to stay until Christmas. And the only thing that's changed my mind is not the Gaffer himself, but his back room staff.

I say, let's give the Gaffer AND Sean O' Driscoll, AND Gary Mac (i.e. the entire backroom staff), time to get their ideas across to the players.

The defensive display against Arsenal was very good, so let's call West Ham nothing more than players taking on board a few new ideas from the backroom staff, and trying to implement them.

Exactly what i feared and what i've said since losing 3-0 at Old Trafford, that was the time where we could have saved our season by sacking him, and not wasting another 2 years with him at the helm. It's clear as day that he is not ready for a top club, not ready to manage top players, not ready to manage crucial moments in a team's season, you name it. He is a decent manager, suited for a mid-table team like Stoke or West Ham, in no case he is the one to take forward a big club as ours, there are numerous examples of his weird decisions and tactical mistakes that ultimately lead to us not being capable to perform in crucial games (see the FA Cup semifinal, the title-deciding game against Chelsea or against Man Utd at Anfield last season).

He was given enough time and money to build a team that can compete on all levels, the only manager to receive that sort of backing since i can remember, and he failed miserably, with us struggling past the likes of Ludogorets, Besiktas or Basel, let alone top 4 sides.

His signings are abysmal, and him constantly alienating players by playing them in a system that doesn't works or out of position. Not to mention that he lied to us numerous times in his interviews, making our club a laughing stock. Saying he'll play only those who are in top form, but constantly picking liabilities such as Lovren and Lallana who time and time again have buried us.

Don't fool yourselves, this season we produced only 45 minutes of good football, we were lucky against Bournemouth of all sides, even though we played abysmal football, at Stoke we were bailed by a golazo from Coutinho and at Arsenal, again refs helped us with the dissalowed goal. Why we couldn't mantain the rythim from the first half, and turned into a mediocre side in the 2nd is another thing to be looked at.

The problem also resides with the owners who are proving time and time again that they don't have any notion about football, even from a financial point of view. You're investing over 100 mil on players you either send on loan or sell on much lower fees, how do they think they'll recoup the money invested in them ? Wouldn't be a much better solution signing 1 world-class player with a bigger wage, than wasting the same money on 3 piss-poor players who would waste your money and will not help the team. With a world-class player you have more chances of securing top 4 football and in this way attract more money into the club and also more top players would be willing to join you.

The time for changing the gaffer is long overdue, and by backing the current one we're just prolonging the agony our club is in.

75% of us wanted him gone.

Many of that 75% were willing to give him a chance to prove us wrong.

It looks like he is going to make it difficult to keep us onside.

As I said at the weekend one game of this season, I understand those who link it to the last campaign, is a little hasty to judge but I think the mancs game will tell us an awful lot about the manager and if he truly has learned lessons or is just bluffing his way through.

The time for changing the gaffer is long overdue, and by backing the current one we're just prolonging the agony our club is in.

The time for changing the gaffer is not four games in to a season. That Ship has sailed and like him or not, we have to wait until next Summer before we see change. That gives him the chance to prove his doubters wrong (his detractors like you will never be convinced even if he wins the league). The onus is on him to prove he can learn from past mistakes, put aside his pride and do what's best for the club when it comes to player selection. The last thing we need as a club is vitriol from the stands each and every match. For better or for worse, he's our manager for the season, we need to publicly get behind him and the team, even if in private we feel otherwise.

No excuses for that shocking performance on the weekend. And it's not surprising where the discussion is heading after such a sh*te defeat. For some its the opportunity they've been waiting for to re-open the 'Rodgers out' debate, for others its perhaps a matter of questioning where we're heading and what we are doing.

I'm in the latter category, because to tear-up new coaching appointments (new team ethic etc.), new players coming in just to get rid of Rodgers, after let's face it - 90 minutes of football this season is illogical. Look, the performance was worrying but I've seen people now throw in the wins against Bournemouth and Stoke as added ammunition. You can't even get lucky anymore and get 3pts without people insinuating it isn't good enough - this beggars belief. You show me a team who hasn't hadn't luck in order to win, and I'll show you a slim fat person.

We were ordinary at the beginning of 'that' season 2 years ago, and scraped some 1 nil wins then. We've been ordinary, dogged at the Emirates, and awful Sat'day. This talk has been sparked off the back of that loss. Much sense has been spoken, I agree we look like we don't have any plan or pathway to best exploit our players' ability. It is concerning! But I think Rodgers only has to jig the attacking line-up (play two up top, not sure I'd start that away at the Mancs though) for something to click.

The pressure is obviously on for him, and I've never seen Anfield empty that quickly prior to 5-10 mins before the final whistle. The writing will be on the wall soon enough I fear. However, given the fickleness of fans, a run of results will no doubt stem the ebb and flows of these discussions. And while we're aware there are fans waiting to pounce at every loss, there are fans who looking on ominously in the hope that something may click and set us off into gear.

Given that, Rodgers is now in the last chance saloon with most, he wanted Benteke, he got him. Now, he has the unenviable task of making our 'system' that was fast flowing football, fit Benteke's game. He's got his new coaches, he's gotten what he wanted - more results like that against West f**king Ham will have to see him die on his sword.

I hope he can get this Liverpool act together quickly - for the good of our team/club.

For me BR is a manager in the Mourinho mould. He uses psychology more than tactics. Mourinho never stays more than 3 years (apart from being sacked in his 4th year at chelsea) because he loses momentum as his players have been rung dry emotionally. BR too was never a tactician, he like Mourinho uses a simple philosophy and tries to impart it to players. Mourinho's is counter attack with every players working defensively. BR 'used' possession as his 'elixir' but it didn't work so now he has to regain the faith of his players and make them believe in something else. He was never a tactician and he is not someone to go more than 3 years with and once momentum is gone you definitely cut your ties.