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      Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans

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      Scotia
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #552: Sep 16, 2012 09:57:08 am
      It's going to take time and FOAR's comment above regarding more players on managers wavelength is very telling. We continue to look a little toothless with few options up top - but the domination of possession and chances (albeit not gilt-edged) was encouraging.

      Onwards we go
      bigmick
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #553: Sep 16, 2012 11:09:25 am
       I must confess I'm surprised by the negativity on here. I thought we played well, we hit the woodwork twice, they barely had a shot and we absolutely dominated the game from start to finish. Clearly we are far from the finished article, but people "whispering it quietly" after the manager has had four league games in charge doesn't bode well.

       I thought Gerrard was excellent and bossed it in contrast to most on here, Allen wasn't as good as he has been but was OK. Defensively apart from the goal we were solid, while up top we created enough chances to have won it by a couple of goals. Sterling continues to impress and I though both Shelvey and Borini did quite well too. We'd have had a penalty on a different day, and all this against a team who are very hard to play against at Home.

       I think it's reality check time for us at the moment. We've got a squad which is probably at best good enough to finish in the top half, and we've got players such as Downing, Henderson and Carroll who we are going to have to have to  take a monumentous loss on cluttering up the bench/loan system. We've got a talismanic captain who is going to have to re-define the way he plays, and we've got a manager who is trying to instill a completely new sytem. It's going to take more than four matches, or four months even. I'd hope to be playing very good football at some point before the end of the season, but it might even take longer than that.

       Why so long? Well if the manager was given 100 million quid to go out and buy Alonso, Jovatic, Ben Arfa etc etc it would probably take a lot less time. He hasn't been given anything like that kind of money however, infact arguably he hasn't been given any money whatsoever. I absolutely urge fans to look at things hyper realistically and rejoice when we see progress. There are going to be some dark days ahead but equally, given time and support I am convinced that Brendan Rogers will get us to where we can realistically hope to be. 
      what-a-hit-son
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #554: Sep 16, 2012 11:22:12 am
      I was half asleep when watching it yesterday due to the previous night/morning marathon booze session but from what I can remember we should of won the game and inevitably the problems lay in the fact that none of our players can finish a sh*t.

      Really hope Luis will gain confidence and momentum from his goal because his distribution and touch for me is poor at the moment but he is the only one with a goal in him at the moment.

      Thought Stevie carried out the job he was asked well and kept things ticking over and it was no coincidence that we improved in the second half once we got Raheem on the ball.

      Johnno attempt at a tackle for their goal was poor yes but he was MoM for me yesterday.

      Bring on the Mancs!

      I can take the positives from that performance.
      bad boy bubby
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #555: Sep 16, 2012 12:13:55 pm
      Until the players and the manager fully understand each others way of doing things (and for that I think we need more players on the managers wave length brought in in January) this is going to be a very tough season for us.


      I think it's reality check time for us at the moment...

      ... It's going to take more than four matches, or four months even. I'd hope to be playing very good football at some point before the end of the season, but it might even take longer than that.

       Why so long? Well if the manager was given 100 million quid to go out and buy Alonso, Jovatic, Ben Arfa etc etc it would probably take a lot less time. He hasn't been given anything like that kind of money however...

      I've been thinking about 'where we are' (football wise) for quite some while now and, for me, both the above posts are accurate and touch on what I've been thinking; stay with me...

      Brendan has stated (more than once) that the team is the star, not the players. I get exactly what he's saying (something foar touched on) but I don't believe it's wholly true. As such, I believe, we need to fully appreciate it's implications. Think about it... at Swansea Brendan had, by and large, a full compliment of players who knew his system and played it well yet they were still no world beaters.

      If indeed all it takes is players who know the system and are on the same wavelength then Swansea would have finished higher (possibly top four). Whilst I know we will see improvement (as things start to click); in order to take this 'style of play' to the 'next level' there just has to be "better" players signed - not just players who understand a system; in my opinion.

      If we think about it (really think about it), until the players we've got get the system; we can't even expect to get where Swansea were last season. And until we sign "better" players surely we can't take that to the 'next level'. It may be argued that we have a better starting point with (perhaps) a better quality squad but it may also be argued that; without the players Brendan wants and needs - we are having to mend and make do.

      Our squad is seriously bereft of senior players and whilst I love the notion of promoting youth; how many of our young guns are ready to make the step up? If this (promotion of youth) is to be the defining policy then we must be patient as we'll have no other option. If Brendan can, at last, sign one, two or three of the players he wants/needs, in January it may just give us the fillip we need and buy us some time while the 'youth' come through.

      We will get there but (for so many reasons) it needs to be sooner than later. 

      On yesterday's game: I saw an awful lot of positives but the sense of deja vu was most prevalent, sadly.

      I could have been looking at any amount of last season's games. Without the fourth of the four Ps everything else is irrelevant. We all knew that this time last year; we all knew that last January and we all knew it this Summer... join me in hoping that there'll be "value in the January window" this time 'round.  8)
      Tadders
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #556: Sep 16, 2012 12:31:58 pm
      This is going to be a long season. We aren't at the races yet, Borini looks awful to me.
      In fact without Sterling I would be seriously worried.
      BR is doing a good job considering.
      corballyred
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #557: Sep 16, 2012 12:38:56 pm
      Playing 17 years olds regularly is dangerous looked what happened to Owen and Fowler around their mid 20's
      redindian
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #558: Sep 16, 2012 12:43:23 pm
      Playing 17 years olds regularly is dangerous looked what happened to Owen and Fowler around their mid 20's

      More so when you expect them to carry the team on their shoulders. It was worrying when the players looked up to Sterling to provide the creative spark .
      Paisleydalglish
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #559: Sep 16, 2012 12:46:33 pm
      Playing 17 years olds regularly is dangerous looked what happened to Owen and Fowler around their mid 20's

      Look what fun we had watching them until that stage though ..

      Let's not look for a potential moan that's 8 years away
      corballyred
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #560: Sep 16, 2012 12:46:57 pm
      Love the impact Sterling is made but cant be playing him regularly, its not fair on the lad, his body is still developing, we dont want him regularly out with injuries come his mid 20's
      corballyred
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #561: Sep 16, 2012 12:48:18 pm
      Look what fun we had watching them until that stage though ..

      Let's not look for a potential moan that's 8 years away

      Are you serious you'd risk his long term career for the short term
      srslfc
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #562: Sep 16, 2012 12:48:33 pm
      Look what fun we had watching them until that stage though ..

      Let's not look for a potential moan that's 8 years away

      Agree although I still see the next game as an ideal opportunity just to take Raheem out of the spotlight for a while.

      Assaidi, Pacheco, Downing and Suso can all okay there on Thursday night.
      Paisleydalglish
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #563: Sep 16, 2012 12:49:26 pm
      Are you serious you'd risk his long term career for the short term

      I'd rather not moan about everything and trust the manager will look after him.. It's 4 games not 4 years
      Paisleydalglish
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #564: Sep 16, 2012 12:50:48 pm
      Agree although I still see the next game as an ideal opportunity just to take Raheem out of the spotlight for a while.

      Assaidi, Pacheco, Downing and Suso can all okay there on Thursday night.

      I wouldn't play him Thursday Si no...

      I personally with our lack of a squad wouldn't include Stevie or Luis either..

      Blood the rest the the kids in the Europa
      srslfc
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #565: Sep 16, 2012 12:51:12 pm
      I'd rather not moan about everything and trust the manager will look after him.. It's 4 games not 4 years

      Also Brendan's not stupid and has already talked about taking it slowly with Raheem.

      At his age I'd want to be playing every game but there will be plenty of opportunities to leave him out over the next month or so.
      corballyred
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #566: Sep 16, 2012 12:51:55 pm
      I'd rather not moan about everything and trust the manager will look after him.. It's 4 games not 4 years

      Sorry Evans was forced into playing Fowler and Owen, Rodgers to looks like being forced into playing Sterling due to lack of options. Playing a 17 year old regularly risks effecting his long term career, it happened with both Fowler and Owen and I dont know how anyone can ignore it.

      Probably would have heard the exact same off people back then
      Paisleydalglish
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #567: Sep 16, 2012 12:55:40 pm
      Sorry Evans was forced into playing Fowler and Owen, Rodgers to looks like being forced into playing Sterling due to lack of options. Playing a 17 year old regularly risks effecting his long term career, it happened with both Fowler and Owen and I dont know how anyone can ignore it.

      Probably would have heard the exact same off people back then

      Football as a sport is getting younger.

      While I agree with the sentiment Corb I don't agree moaning now after 4 games... The lad needs to feel involved, get a few games under his belt, kick on and then be rested at the right times..

      If he plays the full 90 of every game this season then I'll agree.. I don't think he will and think the manager will rotate at the right time.
      corballyred
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #568: Sep 16, 2012 12:58:19 pm
      Football as a sport is getting younger.

      While I agree with the sentiment Corb I don't agree moaning now after 4 games... The lad needs to feel involved, get a few games under his belt, kick on and then be rested at the right times..

      If he plays the full 90 of every game this season then I'll agree.. I don't think he will and think the manager will rotate at the right time.


      Jaysus i know im the forum number 1 hate figure but F**k me i make a simple observation which anyone with a clue about football knows from history and you jump down my throat. I cant win with some people
      Paisleydalglish
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #569: Sep 16, 2012 01:00:45 pm
      Jaysus i know im the forum number 1 hate figure but f**k me i make a simple observation which anyone with a clue about football knows from history and you jump down my throat. I cant win with some people

      Well done on your observation


      I wasn't jumping down your throat I was trying to chat with you about something.

      I won't bother in future.






      Anyway.

      Thought he was excellent yesterday though..
      Swab
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #570: Sep 16, 2012 01:09:07 pm
      Thinking about the match after watching it again, I think we are pretty near to "clicking" with the players becoming more and more used to BR's system.

      It's pretty clear to see how he is getting to advance in stages, with the end result being waves of attack.
      Now we just have to be able to finish those attacks off. Easier said than done, I know.
      Arrie
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #571: Sep 16, 2012 01:10:07 pm
      Expect much more of the same.  Bottom line is if you have no goalscorers, well, unsurprisingly, you don't score goals.  The mess up over the transfer window will continue to cost us at least until Jan at which point we may well be well out of any running for anything league wise.

      Obviously events this week make the game pale into insignificance somewhat.  But disappointing nonetheless.
      Tadders
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #572: Sep 16, 2012 01:12:41 pm
      Watching again, its not surprising we dont win many games. Teams normally need 1 or 2 chances to score against us, and normaly score with their first real threat - whereas we need about 15-20 to score 1.
      corballyred
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #573: Sep 16, 2012 01:16:05 pm
      Well done on your observation


      I wasn't jumping down your throat I was trying to chat with you about something.

      I won't bother in future.






      Anyway.

      Thought he was excellent yesterday though..

      I dont want a well done or to be accused of moaning as I'm the easy target on here
      bad boy bubby
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      Re: Sunderland 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Groans
      Reply #574: Sep 16, 2012 01:28:37 pm

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