General LFC Transfer rumours/gossip thread

The 'January Transfer Thread' came and went, the only implication was some extra tasks for the mods in setting it up, then taking it down.
I wonder if anyone at the club put in as much effort, doesn't seem like.
Ah well back to the none-specific 'General, Rumours/Gossip' heading thread.

Ibe came back from his loan early.

Ibe came back from his loan early.

Haha and what a ''coup'' that turned out to be, his massive potential has shaded the error of letting him go, like we had reserve in F***ing triplicate.
Also subtly masking the empty January signing free zone in the club accounts, to say nothing of the January Signings Thread just taken down - unused, needless to say.

Haha and what a ''coup'' that turned out to be, his massive potential has shaded the error of letting him go, like we had reserve in F***ing triplicate.
Also subtly masking the empty January signing free zone in the club accounts, to say nothing of the January Signings Thread just taken down - unused, needless to say.

Should have tried for Wisdom and Ilori while we were at it.
At least we've that to "look forward to" in the summer.

I think you're jumping the gun a little calling Ings "a genuinely great player". He looks like a younger more mobile Lambert and could be a decent squad player for a top team. But that's about it. He doesn't look as impressive as Kane and I wouldn't call Kane a genuinely great player either.

A younger more mobile Lambert sounds like a genuinely great player to me 

I honestly think there isn't much between Kane and Ings - one just plays for a more competent team and gets more chances. Also Spurs have an excellent set piece taker in Erikson. Did you know that half of Kane's 14 league goals have come from set pieces? Ings has scored more from open play ( 8 ).

Haha and what a ''coup'' that turned out to be, his massive potential has shaded the error of letting him go, like we had reserve in f**king triplicate.
Also subtly masking the empty January signing free zone in the club accounts, to say nothing of the January Signings Thread just taken down - unused, needless to say.

You didn't watch his early games for Derby then. Yes it was clear he was very talented, but he was also very very raw. He wouldn't have got game time early in our season. The Derby fans to begin with were very annoyed with him. His improvement happened quickly over the course of half a season but the game time he got for Derby was crucial. It was in no way a error to let him go on loan.

He's scored three goals in thirty one appearances this season in a league far easier than ours. That says to me he's not ready, regardless of any international appearances he may have had in the past. Plus it's not like Lukaku is setting the world alight either this season but with thirteen in thirty four I can't see Origi keeping him out for long. What we need is a striker that's ready now. Not ready in three or four years time. One with experience at the highest level and preferably without glass legs. I'm not knocking Origi, lad has potential, but potential is why we have an Academy. Potential doesn't win you titles and cups. Potential gets you embarrassed in the Champions League. I'm sick of potential. I want to see proven for a change.

He plays in a sh*t team mate who get a nose bleed at the thought of attacking play. He is not played in the correct position and now has the Lille fans on his back because they believe he wants to be at LFC, that's understands who wouldn't!

He fits perfectly into our fast paced style of play, give him service and he will score.

I am excited at the thought of him Sturridge and Raheem next year irrespective of if we sign a big name striker. And that's a big IF....

He plays in a sh*t team mate who get a nose bleed at the thought of attacking play. He is not played in the correct position and now has the Lille fans on his back because they believe he wants to be at LFC, that's understands who wouldn't!

He fits perfectly into our fast paced style of play, give him service and he will score.

I am excited at the thought of him Sturridge and Raheem next year irrespective of if we sign a big name striker. And that's a big IF....

I feel the same way. I've watched Origi play a handful of times this season, and from what I've seen, he has everything. He makes runs, he's strong, skillful and very pacey!! I think he'll surprise a lot of people once he joins us and play as a striker.

I'm gonna put a £20 bet down on him or Ings to score 20+ goals next season

Don't think we need to scour the planet to find a goal scoring #9 as I feel we'll be ok with Ings, Sturridge and Origi.

You didn't watch his early games for Derby then. Yes it was clear he was very talented, but he was also very very raw. He wouldn't have got game time early in our season. The Derby fans to begin with were very annoyed with him. His improvement happened quickly over the course of half a season but the game time he got for Derby was crucial. It was in no way a error to let him go on loan.

His time at Derby is irrelevant, his improved performance in the Red shirt is all that counts.
Your conviction about his not staying at Anfield is puzzling to say the least.
What do you base your confidence on?
The concern the club has for it's younger players would be admirable if that was the case, unfortunately financial issues are more affecting than any concern about the player.
His recall from the loan is all the proof needed in demonstrating the faulted decision to let him leave - we do not have the cover in depth to accommodate such measures.

Measured decision making taking second place to the all important wage structure and it's limitations.

His time at Derby is irrelevant, his improved performance in the Red shirt is all that counts.
Your conviction about his not staying at Anfield is puzzling to say the least.
What do you base your confidence on?
The concern the club has for it's younger players would be admirable if that was the case, unfortunately financial issues are more affecting than any concern about the player.
His recall from the loan is all the proof needed in demonstrating the faulted decision to let him leave - we do not have the cover in depth to accommodate such measures.

Measured decision making taking second place to the all important wage structure and it's limitations.

My confidence that it was the right decision to send him on loan is based on watching every game he played at Derby. At the beginning he wasn't good enough for us. By Christmas he was. I think anyone who claims he would have made that rapid change from the bench at Anfield needs a rethink.
Ibe is fantastic now, but he got there because of intelligent loan policy.

Edit: Also you seem to be under the impression that he was sent on loan due to wage structure? If I've read that right, and apologies if you didn't mean that, but that's a mad opinion! He earns nothing in footballing terms.

My confidence that it was the right decision to send him on loan is based on watching every game he played at Derby. At the beginning he wasn't good enough for us. By Christmas he was. I think anyone who claims he would have made that rapid change from the bench at Anfield needs a rethink.
Ibe is fantastic now, but he got there because of intelligent loan policy.

Edit: Also you seem to be under the impression that he was sent on loan due to wage structure? If I've read that right, and apologies if you didn't mean that, but that's a mad opinion! He earns nothing in footballing terms.

Would you care to examine his contract details?
I don't know what reference you use for your ''football terms'' it does sound like JWH & Co speak.

Im not gonna talk about the Besiktas game cause it was a big dissapointment,i will try and focus on something else,like:i read couple of days ago that we are interested in signing Alvaro Morata from Juve,is there any truth in that?

Would you care to examine his contract details?
I don't know what reference you use for your ''football terms'' it does sound like JWH & Co speak.

All the paper talk about his new contract says he is quadrupling it to 25k. They may be wrong on the exact figure of his old contract, but its very likely around that area.

As for "footballing terms" I mean earning 6k a week is a shitload in real life, but in football its not much at all and certainly wouldn't make us send a player on loan to reduce the bill. Its not JWH speak and to suggest so is frankly stupid.

You come off as slightly mad if you think that he was sent on loan to reduce the wage bill as opposed to getting him the experience he needs to develop. Its just tin foil hat sh*te.

You come off as slightly mad if you think that he was sent on loan to reduce the wage bill as opposed to getting him the experience he needs to develop. Its just tin foil hat sh*te.

The wisdom of your words is diluted by last night's humiliation with the manager being unable to select a winning team from a skeleton squad.
''Slightly mad'' is an understatement when games are prioritised through the lack of credible choices due to financial constraints.
''Slightly mad'' goes beyond an understatement with your ridiculous claim that a loan spell at Derby has ''improved'' Ibe.

The skeleton squad translates as:
No credible cover for Coutinho, no credible cover for Henderson, no credible cover for Lucas or Gerrard - all injured or being saved for Citeh on Sunday.

We seem unlikely to get any cover either with the January window having come and gone and JWH's words about his unwillingness to enter a bidding contest or pay more than he thinks enough for a soccer player.
Nothing ''slight'' about any of that madness.

The wisdom of your words is diluted by last night's humiliation with the manager being unable to select a winning team from a skeleton squad.
''Slightly mad'' is an understatement when games are prioritised through the lack of credible choices due to financial constraints.
''Slightly mad'' goes beyond an understatement with your ridiculous claim that a loan spell at Derby has ''improved'' Ibe.

The skeleton squad translates as:
No credible cover for Coutinho, no credible cover for Henderson, no credible cover for Lucas or Gerrard - all injured or being saved for Citeh on Sunday.

We seem unlikely to get any cover either with the January window having come and gone and JWH's words about his unwillingness to enter a bidding contest or pay more than he thinks enough for a soccer player.
Nothing ''slight'' about any of that madness.

But here's the crucial thing; at the beginning of the season he wasn't good enough to be part of the squad. Now he is good enough to start. That's why the loan was good.
Yes, the broader financial criticisms are valid, but to say that we sent Ibe, a 19 year old, out on loan to save money is mad.
We are penny pinchers, but regarding Ibe, this is one area where that criticism doesn't apply. Its obvious to everyone and their aunt that we didn't send Ibe on loan to save money.


Edit: I also disagree with the assertion that we have a skeleton squad. We are topping the injury table right now. Of course thats going to result in diminished choices.

Second edit: I didn't spot your claim that Ibe was not improved by his loan spell. Those are the words of someone who didn't watch him there. He has improved so much its unbelievable - a Sterling-esque transformation.

But here's the crucial thing; at the beginning of the season he wasn't good enough to be part of the squad. Now he is good enough to start. That's why the loan was good.
Yes, the broader financial criticisms are valid, but to say that we sent Ibe, a 19 year old, out on loan to save money is mad.
We are penny pinchers, but regarding Ibe, this is one area where that criticism doesn't apply. Its obvious to everyone and their aunt that we didn't send Ibe on loan to save money.


Edit: I also disagree with the assertion that we have a skeleton squad. We are topping the injury table right now. Of course thats going to result in diminished choices.

Second edit: I didn't spot your claim that Ibe was not improved by his loan spell. Those are the words of someone who didn't watch him there. He has improved so much its unbelievable - a Sterling-esque transformation.

We escaped FFP censure by the skin of our teeth, and only because our debt was due to stadium development costs.

This is what makes arguments about wages and transfers nonsensical.

But here's the crucial thing; at the beginning of the season he wasn't good enough to be part of the squad. Now he is good enough to start. That's why the loan was good.

He is good enough now through the injuries to dearth of first choice players, if Derby is so instructive and beneficial to players why doesn't their league status show as much?

Yes, the broader financial criticisms are valid, but to say that we sent Ibe, a 19 year old, out on loan to save money is mad.
We are penny pinchers, but regarding Ibe, this is one area where that criticism doesn't apply. Its obvious to everyone and their aunt that we didn't send Ibe on loan to save money.

JWH & Co are market traders, prudence is an accepted entity of that status.
Whether a ceiling is topped by £5, £50, £500 or £5,000 it is exceeded and the acumen of the management is then under scrutiny, several youth players were loaned out with a not unsubstantial wage saving.

Edit: I also disagree with the assertion that we have a skeleton squad. We are topping the injury table right now. Of course thats going to result in diminished choices.

Would be obliged if you could post said injury table we are topping, as already posted last night's no show was all the proof needed about the meat on the bone of the squad.

He is good enough now through the injuries to dearth of first choice players, if Derby is so instructive and beneficial to players why doesn't their league status show as much?

For starters, they are the best team in the championship (as their 1st place position indicates) and secondly, surely you can see how getting decent playing time is very important a players development? He wasn't good enough at the beginning to get enough minutes here to develop fast enough so we sent him on loan. Don't be dense.

JWH & Co are market traders, prudence is an accepted entity of that status.
Whether a ceiling is topped by £5, £50, £500 or £5,000 it is exceeded and the acumen of the management is then under scrutiny, several youth players were loaned out with a not unsubstantial wage saving.

Actually it is unsubstantial. Given the new contracts that were handed out during the course of the season, and the attempts to hand out more, I am don't think we were actually near what the management imposed wage ceiling is. I don't know about FFP, but that is a different proposition to what you are suggesting.

Would be obliged if you could post said injury table we are topping, as already posted last night's no show was all the proof needed about the meat on the bone of the squad.

No problem.
http://www.physioroom.com/news/english_premier_league/epl_injury_table.php

For starters, they are the best team in the championship (as their 1st place position indicates) and secondly, surely you can see how getting decent playing time is very important a players development? He wasn't good enough at the beginning to get enough minutes here to develop fast enough so we sent him on loan. Don't be dense.

Aah the Championship, are you too dense to realise the instruction from a Championship coach would be inferior to that of an LFC coach??
Their lower league status might be a clue dimmo.

Actually it is unsubstantial. Given the new contracts that were handed out during the course of the season, and the attempts to hand out more, I am don't think we were actually near what the management imposed wage ceiling is. I don't know about FFP, but that is a different proposition to what you are suggesting.

I wasn't suggesting anything at all in connection with FFP and you inferring as much throws some light on your intention.
Actually it is substantial to the tune of several K a week when all the loanees are taken into account.

No problem.
http://www.physioroom.com/news/english_premier_league/epl_injury_table.php

There y'are then.

Aah the Championship, are you too dense to realise the instruction from a Championship coach would be inferior to that of an LFC coach??
Their lower league status might be a clue dimmo.

No. I am saying that him getting more minutes there is more valuable in his instruction. Not that Derby has better training. This was made clear in my post. Pretty plainly. Please read what I say if you wish to have civil conversation. If you keep demonstrating a lack of reading comprehension then this is not worthwhile.

I wasn't suggesting anything at all in connection with FFP and you inferring as much throws some light on your intention.
Actually it is substantial to the tune of several K a week when all the loanees are taken into account.

I know you weren't saying that. Hence why I said it was different proposition. Respond to the argument I did make please instead of using red herrings. When I say that something is not relevant, it normally means that I think it is not relevant and therefore does not shine any light on my intentions.
As for adding up; not nearly to the tune of what we have shown we are willing to increase the wage budget to.

There y'are then.

Exactly. We don't have a thin squad. Just exceptionally unfortunate with injuries.


Honestly, the general source of your discontent is not unjustified. Just in this particular instance you are egregiously off base. It is not a sane suggestion to say that our youth players on loan were sent out for wage reasons rather than experience.

Edit: Im also sick of people like you insinuating that everyone who suggests that not all decisions made by the club are about the bottom line have some sort of "intention". I am a fan of Liverpool Football Club and I recognize the club made the right call for Liverpool and the right call for Ibe by sending him on loan and it has nothing to do with cash.

The argument that Ibe didn't improve at Derby is ridiculous. However (and correct me if I'm wrong mate) I don't think that's necessarily what Stuey is saying? I think he's saying that our coaches should have seen this promise and kept him all season, and I agree in a way. But it would have been a big risk to throw him into the Premiership right away, playing against that Southampton side, playing against that City team with Fernando, Toure and Kompany that made our men look like boys... I don't think it would have done Ibe any good... Playing against Championship teams, not to say that it's not a 'high' standard of football there, but you get my drift, it's easier to do well there than against the real top teams. So it's six and half a dozen for me. Could we have done with him earlier? Yea sure. Would he have been as impactful then, especially considering that we didn't start using the position he's playing in now until much later in the season...probably not.

So yea, part of me saying 'Damn how did our coaches not spot this talent' and another part is saying 'What a shout sending him to Derby, say what you want about McLaren but the man's a good coach at club level'. Overall I'm just happy that we have him now

The argument that Ibe didn't improve at Derby is ridiculous. However (and correct me if I'm wrong mate) I don't think that's necessarily what Stuey is saying? I think he's saying that our coaches should have seen this promise and kept him all season, and I agree in a way. But it would have been a big risk to throw him into the Premiership right away, playing against that Southampton side, playing against that City team with Fernando, Toure and Kompany that made our men look like boys... I don't think it would have done Ibe any good... Playing against Championship teams, not to say that it's not a 'high' standard of football there, but you get my drift, it's easier to do well there than against the real top teams. So it's six and half a dozen for me. Could we have done with him earlier? Yea sure. Would he have been as impactful then, especially considering that we didn't start using the position he's playing in now until much later in the season...probably not.

So yea, part of me saying 'Damn how did our coaches not spot this talent' and another part is saying 'What a shout sending him to Derby, say what you want about McLaren but the man's a good coach at club level'. Overall I'm just happy that we have him now

He did make the claim that the loan didn't improve Ibe

''Slightly mad'' goes beyond an understatement with your ridiculous claim that a loan spell at Derby has ''improved'' Ibe.

He also is saying that we sent him out to save money, which is blatantly absurd. I actually hold Stuey in high esteem, but he is clearly wrong here.

I remain unconvinced that Ibe was loaned out for his, the club's and the general good of the team.
Subsequent events coincidently prove otherwise.
He is no longer there because of misjudgement concerning player back-up, or the lack of.
How many of our rivals carry on in a similar fashion yet are faced with the same FFP rules we are, apparently LFC are the only team it affects.

Finally in spite of the accolades to Derby County and their coaching staff they are a league below us, the obvious assumption is any coaching would be of a similar mark.

The nonsense over the Suarez fee and the potential acquired with the monies instead of a like for like replacement, the failure to get a striker for the injury prone Sturridge, no viable replacement for SG - the list goes on and on;  in spite of which you would have us believe on this occasion the best interests of Ibe were paramount unlike all the other F**k ups where economics  took precedent.
 

We escaped FFP censure by the skin of our teeth, and only because our debt was due to stadium development costs.

This is what makes arguments about wages and transfers nonsensical.

I'd seen the report was in, I've not had chance to peruse it myself.  I heard rumours we had sailed close to the wind during this summers expenditure, was this rumour true then?