Philippe Coutinho (Liverpool > FC Barcelona)

So in your opinion its the 1 loss that cost us despite Citeh losing more times, remind me please how many Citeh drew compared to us and tell me how it wasn't a factor? From my point of view IF we had beaten Leicester and West Ham instead of drawing then there is no way Citeh would have got enough of a sniff to go on a 14 game charge but it is of course all hypothetical.

As for your point about us struggling against Manure even whilst we had Coutinho you are comparing 2 different things, I want you to consider Coutinho in the side we currently have, not the side we had, if you do that do you still think he couldn't provide that extra option, that extra bit of magic which he did on so many occasions.

I think Countinho could be the missing link in this side but even if not him we need an extra top quality forward because if we go into next season without replacing Sturridge then its a big mistake, that is UNLESS Brewster has the same instant impact as Owen, Fowler and Sterling did

It wasn’t a factor because they beat us! They took 4 points from us, we took 1 from them. Quite simple really.

But there is no point comparing to the side we have now, we have massively changed since his departure, you may as well essentially be saying compare it with adding any player in the world.
Or if you are insistent on comparing that, then why are you not taking into account City having their best player injured for virtually the entire season and assuming they wouldn’t have lost 4 times if they had him available. It’s pointless. We proved we are more than capable of beating United without Coutinho so why is it such a big deal trying to assume we’d have been better off with him? We’d have potentially been playing a completely different system that may have led to us getting beat by the Mancs....again. Like they had our number plenty of times when we had Coutinho before. You are saying I’m comparing two different things whilst you are doing the exact same to suit your own narrative.

You seem quite argumentative about this and I’m just going to end up repeating myself so I’m leaving it there.

We might be better if comes back, we might be worse. Have to wait and see but I would be very, very shocked if we did bring him back.

It wasn’t a factor because they beat us! They took 4 points from us, we took 1 from them. Quite simple really.

But there is no point comparing to the side we have now, we have massively changed since his departure, you may as well essentially be saying compare it with adding any player in the world.
Or if you are insistent on comparing that, then why are you not taking into account City having their best player injured for virtually the entire season and assuming they wouldn’t have lost 4 times if they had him available. It’s pointless. We proved we are more than capable of beating United without Coutinho so why is it such a big deal trying to assume we’d have been better off with him? We’d have potentially been playing a completely different system that may have led to us getting beat by the Mancs....again. Like they had our number plenty of times when we had Coutinho before. You are saying I’m comparing two different things whilst you are doing the exact same to suit your own narrative.

You seem quite argumentative about this and I’m just going to end up repeating myself so I’m leaving it there.

We might be better if comes back, we might be worse. Have to wait and see but I would be very, very shocked if we did bring him back.

Actually they took 5 points off us and we took 2 off them, but whatever way you slice they gained on us by 3points over 2 games. It is not where we lost in my opinion but its very open to interpretations.

Anyway all I am saying is to compete with Citeh on all fronts, including domestic cups, we need more depth (as they illustrated by surviving easily without De Bruyne) and the only weak point we have is our attack, because from time to time they are a bit flat and we don't have an adequate option, hopefully Brewster will fill that role or Origi has been magically transformed into a really good forward rather than just a frustrating player who does fortunately score some vital goals for us. Honestly I love Origi but he drives me mad, he has all the tools to be brilliant but just isn't, so similar to Kuyt and to a lesser extent Borini.

Anyway I agree we are going around and around with this discussion so best to end it.

Him leaving was one of the most important days in Liverpool's history. Without it we wouldn't have bought VVD or Alisson. If Coutinho fan boys want to see what 'world class' is just look at that pair.

And it still doesn't register on the scale like Kenny resigning or Rushie leaving for Juve!!

City beat us by 1 point and we won the CL the trophy they really desire.I would say City are competing with us just as much as the other way round. You can only put 11 players on a pitch and Jürgen did that despite a number of long term injuries to players. Now with a fresh start and possibly a couple of signings we will be stronger again as the lads realise just how good they are. Some players will not improve on last season because they were practically faultless but Fab showed us how good he is going to be Naby started to look really good OX will give us energy and drive Brewster could well be our magic bullet. Losing Moreno and Daniel doesn't really weaken the team or the squad so its all good to go with a few tweaks

City beat us by 1 point and we won the CL the trophy they really desire.I would say City are competing with us just as much as the other way round. You can only put 11 players on a pitch and Jürgen did that despite a number of long term injuries to players. Now with a fresh start and possibly a couple of signings we will be stronger again as the lads realise just how good they are. Some players will not improve on last season because they were practically faultless but Fab showed us how good he is going to be Naby started to look really good OX will give us energy and drive Brewster could well be our magic bullet. Losing Moreno and Daniel doesn't really weaken the team or the squad so its all good to go with a few tweaks

Did you read the BBC article in the other thread, regarding our attacking options, it was quite interesting and highlights just how much flexibility the City team have compared to us. If we lose 2 of our attackers for any extended time period then we are fu**ed, City would hardly be affected, THAT is the major difference between the teams, but instead of strengthening you want to just plough on. Its really a weird attitude.
BTW I hope Brewster will be great for us, but he is a youngster and we cannot rely on him as cover, we need one more top striker in the same way as we needed Allison last summer, it is the final missing piece of the jigsaw.

So Griezemann hasn’t taken his number but some Perez(?) guy has for the up coming tour of Japan. Strange.

Did you read the BBC article in the other thread, regarding our attacking options, it was quite interesting and highlights just how much flexibility the City team have compared to us. If we lose 2 of our attackers for any extended time period then we are fu**ed, City would hardly be affected, THAT is the major difference between the teams, but instead of strengthening you want to just plough on. Its really a weird attitude.
BTW I hope Brewster will be great for us, but he is a youngster and we cannot rely on him as cover, we need one more top striker in the same way as we needed Allison last summer, it is the final missing piece of the jigsaw.

1 point and we won the CL.

1 point and we won the CL.

Its the 1 point I'm focussing on and don't kid yourself to much about the CL. It was wonderful beating Barcelona, a truly magical special night, but it was a night where everything went our way and I do mean everything, it was flattering to us and owed as much to Barca being crap and taking their foot off the gas plus being a bit arrogant after the first leg once as it was us being brilliant.
It certainly does not mean that our second string strikers are good enough for a whole campaign in my opinion, although hopefully Origi now has some new found confidence and Brewster can also burst onto the scene but I think we need ONE more quality established forward to back up Mane and Salah, they will both need more rest throughout the campaign than they did last year, especially Mane.

Its the 1 point I'm focussing on and don't kid yourself to much about the CL. It was wonderful beating Barcelona, a truly magical special night, but it was a night where everything went our way and I do mean everything, it was flattering to us and owed as much to Barca being crap and taking their foot off the gas plus being a bit arrogant after the first leg once as it was us being brilliant.
It certainly does not mean that our second string strikers are good enough for a whole campaign in my opinion, although hopefully Origi now has some new found confidence and Brewster can also burst onto the scene but I think we need ONE more quality established forward to back up Mane and Salah, they will both need more rest throughout the campaign than they did last year, especially Mane.

you would suck the enjoyment out of everything good about last season. "Don't kid yourself about the CL" what the F**k does that mean do you know how many times we have won it on penalties should we now discount them because we only just scraped through.
give your head a wobble FFS. Your message is clear you don't think we are good enough well I disagree we are more than good enough ad will prove it again this season

you would suck the enjoyment out of everything good about last season. "Don't kid yourself about the CL" what the f**k does that mean do you know how many times we have won it on penalties should we now discount them because we only just scraped through.
give your head a wobble FFS. Your message is clear you don't think we are good enough well I disagree we are more than good enough ad will prove it again this season

, selective cut and pasting there, but again failed to address my points, instead falling back to cheap insults, you are becoming more and more of a joke.

BTW here is what I actually said, not sure how I'm sucking the joy out of it:
"don't kid yourself to much about the CL. It was wonderful beating Barcelona, a truly magical special night, but it was a night where everything went our way and I do mean everything, it was flattering to us and owed as much to Barca being crap and taking their foot off the gas plus being a bit arrogant after the first leg as it was us being brilliant."

your the f***in joke most of us are still enjoying the memory of an incredible season one to remember for a lifetime and all you do is decry the efforts and suggest it was all down to luck 30 F***ing premiership wins isn't luck and beating the Champions of France,Germany,Spain and Portugal is again nothing to do with luck. Your like the professor of the subject taught in all the good universities and that is "stating the bleeding obvious". Your a complete bore with one message spend more money but cant even give any detail of who it should be spent on. Fekir went to Betis for less than £20 not £50 or £60 mil to Barca or Real he has gone to BETIS!!!.

your the f***in joke most of us are still enjoying the memory of an incredible season one to remember for a lifetime and all you do is decry the efforts and suggest it was all down to luck 30 f**king premiership wins isn't luck and beating the Champions of France,Germany,Spain and Portugal is again nothing to do with luck. Your like the professor of the subject taught in all the good universities and that is "stating the bleeding obvious". Your a complete bore with one message spend more money but cant even give any detail of who it should be spent on. Fekir went to Betis for less than £20 not £50 or £60 mil to Barca or Real he has gone to BETIS!!!.

Hmm there is a semblance of a coherent thought there, so let me respond.

I am in no way diminishing our achievement last season, we were and are a fantastic team, a JOY to watch. I did not say we were lucky in our league campaign although we did have our share of good fortune along the way, e.g Spurs late winner and Bitters. I do think the starts aligned for us in the 2nd leg against Barca, I don't say that to take anything away from the lads who were all heroes that night but it really doesn't matter because it was a fantastic match which I ENJOYED massively.

Not sure what you are rambling about Fekir for apart from it illustrates that you were wrong about needing to pay £100m for a player.

As for being a misery, I disagree but likewise there is no point living in the past, I'm sure Jürgen and his staff don't do that, neither did our managers of yesteryear. As soon as one campaign finished they would start planning for the new one, including signing a few players to freshen up the squad and strengthen the team and squad. That is all I want, one top quality striker, now can you explain why you are so against that without resorting to he nonsense about being a bench warmer which clearly doesn't deter any player at Citeh.

NOw you want to deny people the opportunity of enjoying our past glorious history WTF is that all about.
 I doubt very much that the club or Jürgen gives a flying F**k what you want and plans will have been developed for many months about how we would cover Mo and Sadio at the beginning of the season. Buying Naby 12 months before he came here proves how far ahead we plan these days and if Jürgen wants any particular player in any position he will be given the funds to make it happen.
In that respect I trust Jürgen 100% to get things right in the transfer market which at the level we now want to move is blocked by a couple of players waiting for a move i.e Neymar and possibly Bale.

Buying Naby 12 months before he came here proves how far ahead we plan these days

Hang on, that was hardly strategic planning, we had literally no option but to agree the move for a year later if we wanted the player. We were desperate to have him that summer, it was never the intention to plan ahead and bring him here a year later, the only reason it happened is because Leipzig were flatly refusing to let him leave that summer, regardless of how much was offered.

There was no master stroke planning in that deal apart from agreeing to pay a premium on top of what would be his release clause to prevent anyone else from getting him.

Back to Phil...he ain't coming here. He may want to come here, but he burned his bridges long ago and what Klopp told him would happen if he left, literally happened.

Sorry Phil, have fun being an also ran at Barca.

NOw you want to deny people the opportunity of enjoying our past glorious history WTF is that all about.
 I doubt very much that the club or Jürgen gives a flying f**k what you want and plans will have been developed for many months about how we would cover Mo and Sadio at the beginning of the season. Buying Naby 12 months before he came here proves how far ahead we plan these days and if Jürgen wants any particular player in any position he will be given the funds to make it happen.
In that respect I trust Jürgen 100% to get things right in the transfer market which at the level we now want to move is blocked by a couple of players waiting for a move i.e Neymar and possibly Bale.

Hang on, that was hardly strategic planning, we had literally no option but to agree the move for a year later if we wanted the player. We were desperate to have him that summer, it was never the intention to plan ahead and bring him here a year later, the only reason it happened is because Leipzig were flatly refusing to let him leave that summer, regardless of how much was offered.

There was no master stroke planning in that deal apart from agreeing to pay a premium on top of what would be his release clause to prevent anyone else from getting him.

Nailing down a player for the following season isn't planning er ok.

you seem to be confused about most things judging by your weird perfectionist self indulgent musings. The board will be issuing a formal apology to you soon for failing to commit to your requests for not buying the unnamed  players you are so adamant weneed

you seem to be confused about most things judging by your weird perfectionist self indulgent musings. The board will be issuing a formal apology to you soon for failing to commit to your requests for not buying the unnamed  players you are so adamant weneed

no need to be formal, an apology for having to read your posts and try in vain to find some shred of logic would be nice though ;-)

Nailing down a player for the following season isn't planning er ok.

Don't try and twist it like that, you know full well the intention was always to have him arrive that summer.

Apparently off to Bayern on loan? While Munich is a top city it is far from his dream in Barcelona, which i am glad went as horrible as it did. F**k him

https://twitter.com/melissareddy_/status/1163367027790307328?s=21

https://twitter.com/melissareddy_/status/1163367027790307328?s=21

For the cost of the loan, inc wages, Bayern could have made a transfer that suited them long term.
This is a mad saga.

When dream moves turn into nightmares as far as Coutinho is concerned as Barca desperately try to offload him.