Do LFC loan players for the right reasons?

I was reading the recent edition of 'Well Red' magazine and there was an interesting article by Mark Jones questioning the real value of the club loaning players out. He pointed to the likes of Pacheco, Ecclestone, Ayala etc etc, who were loaned out and effectively became forgotten men. Recently, I've been left tearing my hair out at the loan system. Increasingly we seem to be using it as a bargaining chip to offload some high earners, as opposed to pushing for permanent moves, e.g. Cole to West Ham, Reina to Napoli and reports that Skrtel may also go the same direction on loan. Also, there are other reports (that's all they may be) that the club may also look to offload the likes of Sterling and Wisdom to gain experience.

I have no problem loaning players if they are developing and the club want them to gain experience. Where it does piss me off is when the club use it too soon, in an attempt to get players out of the club instead of looking for a sale. In the likes of Reina, a year loan will take him off the wage bill, but it will also drive down any future transfer fee. I think, and it's been said before, the club are being pushed around too easily in the transfer market. If they want a player out, sell. Don't loan. To me there is little point.

Great post mate

Simply no we don't. Loaning Reina for example, we have just signed a very good keeper to compete with Pepe only to then loan Pepe out. Silly. Why not sell him and use the money to get a replacement? We need 2 very good keepers not 1

Talk of loaning out Skrtel, why? Loan Coates out yes he needs games desperately but Martin either plays or gets sold for me you don't loan him out.

The likes of Coady and NGoo should be loaned as they will see little game time here, Flannagan another, but we should look to loaning these lads to championship clubs not league 1 or 2

I also don't agree with loaning the likes of Suso who done well last season and would have come on further this season while becoming more tactically aware of what the manager wants. No I think we completely make an arse of loan deals

If for financial reasons, then John Henry and co will tell you yes, probably Carlos too.

I was reading the recent edition of 'Well Red' magazine and there was an interesting article by Mark Jones questioning the real value of the club loaning players out. He pointed to the likes of Pacheco, Ecclestone, Ayala etc etc, who were loaned out and effectively became forgotten men. Recently, I've been left tearing my hair out at the loan system. Increasingly we seem to be using it as a bargaining chip to offload some high earners, as opposed to pushing for permanent moves, e.g. Cole to West Ham, Reina to Napoli and reports that Skrtel may also go the same direction on loan. Also, there are other reports (that's all they may be) that the club may also look to offload the likes of Sterling and Wisdom to gain experience.

I have no problem loaning players if they are developing and the club want them to gain experience. Where it does piss me off is when the club use it too soon, in an attempt to get players out of the club instead of looking for a sale. In the likes of Reina, a year loan will take him off the wage bill, but it will also drive down any future transfer fee. I think, and it's been said before, the club are being pushed around too easily in the transfer market. If they want a player out, sell. Don't loan. To me there is little point.

Can't add much to what you've put mate, I think you're spot on in a very good post.

It appears this season we loan players to save money.

Great post mate

Simply no we don't. Loaning Reina for example, we have just signed a very good keeper to compete with Pepe only to then loan Pepe out. Silly. Why not sell him and use the money to get a replacement? We need 2 very good keepers not 1

Talk of loaning out Skrtel, why? Loan Coates out yes he needs games desperately but Martin either plays or gets sold for me you don't loan him out.

The likes of Coady and NGoo should be loaned as they will see little game time here, Flannagan another, but we should look to loaning these lads to championship clubs not league 1 or 2

I also don't agree with loaning the likes of Suso who done well last season and would have come on further this season while becoming more tactically aware of what the manager wants. No I think we completely make an arse of loan deals

Couldn't agree more. Especially with the comment of loaning players to League 1 & 2. As for Suso, he needs game time but he developed a lot last season being in and around the team. Another season here will help his tactical awareness and help him develop understanding with other players.

If for financial reasons, then John Henry and co will tell you yes, probably Carlos too.

I'll make clear, wasn't me having a go at John Henry and Co. I am not really a critical person, more one who gives advice. I support them cutting the wage bill but if that detriments the overall feeling in the team, what's the point?

We're absolutely awful in the loan market, totally agree on that.

Look at Chelsea, they sent Lukaku and De Bruyne out to top division clubs where they knew they'd be important and they developed and are now ready to be part of the first team. United did it with Cleverley and Welbeck and Arsenal with Wilshere. These clubs have played the loan market very well.

We pick the wrong clubs for players who should be loaned out or we loan out players who should either remain at the club or be sold.

We're absolutely awful in the loan market, totally agree on that.

Look at Chelsea, they sent Lukaku and De Bruyne out to top division clubs where they knew they'd be important and they developed and are now ready to be part of the first team. United did it with Cleverley and Welbeck and Arsenal with Wilshere. These clubs have played the loan market very well.

We pick the wrong clubs for players who should be loaned out or we loan out players who should either remain at the club or be sold.

See, in their lies a deeper problem. Maybe we don't have sufficient enough talent that other Premier League players would want. Lukaku and De Bruybe had high reputations before loans. Maybe we don't have those kind of players, but that opens a whole new kettle of fish.

I support them cutting the wage bill but if that detriments the overall feeling in the team, what's the point?

See this is where you and me have a difference of opinion Semps but similar in a way.

I  have no problem with FSG 'Freeing up wages on the wage bill' as long as we  can bring in players who are a better calibre of player than the ones going out and wage bill is sustainable, despite what Carlos Qiqabal implies on another thread.

See if we continue to slash the wage bill and bring it down then we will fully cement ourselves as a mid table team which is of no use to the squad, whereas if we 'Free up wages on the wage bill' to make room for a better calibre of player then it will only benefit the squad and  we can aim our aspirations a little higher.

See this is where you and me have a difference of opinion Semps but similar in a way.

I  have no problem with FSG 'Freeing up wages on the wage bill' as long as we  can bring in players who are a better calibre of player than the ones going out and wage bill is sustainable, despite what Carlos Qiqabal implies on another thread.

See if we continue to slash the wage bill and bring it down then we will fully cement ourselves as a mid table team which is of no use to the squad, whereas if we 'Free up wages on the wage bill' to make room for a better calibre of player then it will only benefit the squad and  we can aim our aspirations a little higher.

I think we agree, but I just didn't term it well. What I meant to say was by all means sell high earners but these players are usually high earners due to having high reputations. How do they have high reputations? For being good footballers. At the end of the day, they need to be replaced by quality. What I also mean to add is we all know a lot of players took out club for a ride. Although that is thanks largely down to the idiocy of the club. However, and I don't mean to use him all the time, but Cole is the perfect example of a player on ridiculous wages who walked away from the club with a couple of million in his pocket. Point I am getting at is we had high earners of players who didn't deserve it, nor did we need them. We have got rid of most, still one or two are around.

Us loaning players out is like the Germans been sent to the eastern front never to be seen again .

To play devil's advocate...in Skrtel's case, maybe the market for him isn't that good this summer because he didn't play that well and with the prospect of sitting on the bench, the decision was made to loan him to get him playing time and increase demand so we CAN get a better price for him the next one or two windows?

I can actually understand the decision to loan Reina as well as a bit of a concession to him since Barca didn't come in this summer.

I'm ok with Suso going on loan because I don't think he shows enough in the first team to have a dedicated spot even on the bench.

Pacheco....who knows...just think the club doesn't really think he's ever going to work but they are maybe hoping beyond hope that just "one more loan" will do it and he'll come good for us.

I miss anyone?

Jack Robinson loan is a good move IMO as well.

Now if we aren't replacing Skrtel with Papa I see no reason why we should loan him because he would provide good cover at CB.

Although the Reina loan is odd, a lot of the loans completed and rumoured make sense in a weird way. Maximum of 14 players can play a game, our most played 14 last season managed a total of 542 performances between them.  Even if we reach both cup finals, we're looking at 724 starting berths or playing subs, so if we have a core of our team manage similar a amount of games, that only leaves 182 places, probably knocked down further by late time wasting subs and the fact that Rodgers didn't always use all 3 and even if that only occured in a third of games, we have that covered with only 7 more players, going by last years figures.

Although the Reina loan is odd, a lot of the loans completed and rumoured make sense in a weird way. Maximum of 14 players can play a game, our most played 14 last season managed a total of 542 performances between them.  Even if we reach both cup finals, we're looking at 724 starting berths or playing subs, so if we have a core of our team manage similar a amount of games, that only leaves 182 places, probably knocked down further by late time wasting subs and the fact that Rodgers didn't always use all 3 and even if that only occured in a third of games, we have that covered with only 7 more players, going by last years figures.

Which might be a comment on how desperately thin our squad was last season and how little genuine competition for places we had.

My own view is that loan deals should be mainly to give young players experience and possibly to aid in getting players we no longer want or need who we have no chance of selling (Joe Cole) off the books.

Even loaning young players out is problematic as while they are away other youngsters step up and on their return often their place has been taken so the only option is further loans until we can sell them for a song or until their contract is up.

We're absolutely awful in the loan market, totally agree on that.



We pick the wrong clubs for players who should be loaned out or we loan out players who should either remain at the club or be sold.

I think a  perfect example of L.F.C. being taken to the cleaners over loaning a player out would have to be Aquilani.Didn't we get done with him.

I think a  perfect example of L.F.C. being taken to the cleaners over loaning a player out would have to be Aquilani.Didn't we get done with him.

Yes we did Billy - that was a complete farce. He needed to be "get, get gone" not on a working vacation visiting family for 2 years!!

Im not a big fan of the loan system at all, in fact in certain cases I find it a form of cheating.

For example the Adebayor deal to Spurs from City a couple of seasons back, now he went there with City still paying a big chunk of his wages and allowed to play against City's rivals but not themselves. If Spurs couldn't afford his wages then they shouldn't have been able to take him, if he wasn't prepared to take a wage cut then he shouldn't have been able to make the move.

Loans for senior players should be stopped, the loan system as it is should be for letting younger players get away and gain experience, ie Coady and Suso or to help teams lower down the ladder who are struggling financially.. It shouldn't be for players who clubs sign on deals far too big for their abilities or that they don't want anymore and want away to free up a space in their 25 man squad. Better planning should be made when signing players or increasing players contracts.

If don't want a player or the player wants out then one of the parties should swallow that and either reduce the fee or their wage demands to continue their career elsewhere, or else stay and fight for you spot.

Us? We use it poorly, the likes of Coady are great for the loan system but the season loans or Pepe and Skrtel, and Cole, Carroll and Aquilani before shouldn't be allowed.

Which might be a comment on how desperately thin our squad was last season and how little genuine competition for places we had.

Checked a couple of teams and the figures hold, taking into account their may be a few more or less games played, 20-21 man squad cover the vast majority of the total starting berths & playing subs available.

Kind of a yes and no situation, depending on the player. Loaning out Suso, Coady, Robinson are good moves in my opinion. These are all young guys that need to be playing regularly which they won't be able to do here just yet. Just because Pacheco never developed doesn't mean we should stop loaning kids out.

But when it comes to Pepe and (possibly?) Skrtel, it's hard to say. Loaning out Carroll ended up working out for us, especially since we got a much bigger than I thought we were going to get. But there's no guarantee the same can be said of Pepe's loan. If no one comes in for him, we'll be forced to sell him on the cheap to Barca next summer.