Everton 3-3 Liverpool: In game and Post Match Debates

Personally thought it was a fantastic Derby that either side could lay claims to deserving to win and therefore the draw was the fairest result.

Mignolet: This lad deserves immense credit, to come in and replace Reina in the manner he has and the performances he's put in certainly puts him in the running for our player of the season so far.
Flanagan: Quite surprised by the level of praise he's received, I can personally remember 5 individual errors leading to good opportunities for them. Yes he also had some excellent moments and was one of our better defenders, with Skrtel the only other that can really say they played to any standard.
Agger: Thought it was a really poor performance from Danny, many were suggesting beforehand that Sakho should have been playing and I could see the sense in that considering how this pairing have struggled in the past against a big strong forward and it happened again.
Skrtel: Wouldn't say he was great but more the least poor of a very poor defensive display.
Johnson: Shame he went back to being the frustrating player he can be at times, too many mistakes.
Gerrard: First half was the worst half I've seen in living memory from Stevie. Needs to bin the internationals off if this is what we get after it, of course he wont but if he chooses not to I wouldn't play him so close after them. Dead ball deliveries were still excellent though it has to be said.
Lucas: Thought he had an excellent game apart from a few niggling challenges and between him and Mignolet propped up our worst defensive game of the year.
Allen: Didn't really notice him in the game, no real positive contributions and honestly think he blew one of the best opportunities he'll get. In fact I can't see him getting many more. As for the missed chance / pass, inexcusable to miss the target completely.
Coutinho: Not as effective out there simply because he relies on the service of others and that wasn't coming, get him back in the 10 role where he belongs. Was delighted for him to get the goal too, showed excellent composure.
Henderson: Similar to Allen, didn't want the ball, didn't do anything with it when he was forced to have it. It was no surprise to me with Allen and Henderson in the middle that we were getting out muscled any their players were happy to force play into that soft middle.
Suarez: Awesome free-kick, played a very difficult role while being surrounded without support most of the afternoon. Great assist for Coutinho: and ran his bloody socks off while we lumped it up to him.
Moses: Forgettable that he came on.
Sturridge: Well in Danny lad on his goal, I expected him to go on a slump, that will do him the world of good getting another goal and hopefully spur him on again.

What is annoying is when people don't learn from mistakes or at least shows steps to correct them. For a season and a half now we've been a soft touch at set pieces. For a year and a half we've been getting bullied by strong forwards and still it remains the same. That isn't the trait of a top manager, he needs to identify our weaknesses and get rid of them quickly or our stay in the top 4 of this league will soon slip from our grasp.

3 relatively easy games upcoming, we really need all 9 points as on current showing it doesn't look like we'll be getting much from our tougher games this season.

Lukaku wouldn't have gotten the better of this beast

Excellent post Luke.

I thought like you that Skrtel was our best defender, but he really needs to be careful grabbing hold of players in the penalty box especially at corners. Sooner or later a referee will take action. 

Suarez is just amazing. Until this season I had always thought that given the choice I would have picked Torres at his peak before Suarez. I think Suarez is now better than Torres was at his peak.... and I think Suarez may still improve further.

We really need to find a way to beat the better sides. I know that people say if we beat the crap sides we don't need to worry about beating the good sides, but I still believe to challenge for the league we need to start knocking a few top sides back as well as rolling over the poorer ones.

We have played 24 games under Brendan against top 10 sides and won 5 in almost a season and a half. That's top 10 sides not just top 4.... we really should be doing better.

The fact that Mignolet got MOTM above tells you all you need to know about our performance.

The fact that Mignolet got MOTM above tells you all you need to know about our performance.

Is right Stuey.

The MOTM was actually Phil Dowd. I have no Dowd about that.

Excellent post Luke.

I thought like you that Skrtel was our best defender, but he really needs to be careful grabbing hold of players in the penalty box especially at corners. Sooner or later a referee will take action. 

Suarez is just amazing. Until this season I had always thought that given the choice I would have picked Torres at his peak before Suarez. I think Suarez is now better than Torres was at his peak.... and I think Suarez may still improve further.

We really need to find a way to beat the better sides. I know that people say if we beat the crap sides we don't need to worry about beating the good sides, but I still believe to challenge for the league we need to start knocking a few top sides back as well as rolling over the poorer ones.

We have played 24 games under Brendan against top 10 sides and won 5 in almost a season and a half. That's top 10 sides not just top 4.... we really should be doing better.

24 games against the top 10 and won 5, really? I didn't know that and when you compare it with Kenny beating our main rivals sides 9 times in just a year it does put into contrast different levels of "progress". (main rivals included United, City, Everton, Spurs, Arsenal)

Exactly why I still remain far from convinced about Brendan, the proof is on the pitch not in front of a microphone.

24 games against the top 10 and won 5, really? I didn't know that and when you compare it with Kenny beating our main rivals sides 9 times in just a year it does put into contrast different levels of "progress". (main rivals included United, City, Everton, Spurs, Arsenal)

Exactly why I still remain far from convinced about Brendan, the proof is on the pitch not in front of a microphone.

To be fair to Brendan our record against the bottom ten under him is fantastic (well nearly). Played 26 - won 18 - drawn 5 and only lost 3 (this season played 6 -  won  5 - drawn 1 - lost 0.)

In my opinion 3 things cost us 2 points yesterday. Agger wasn't match sharp in my eyes too many times he gave people a yard of space, Coutinho is wasted on the wing, he can't control the pace of a game from out there and although i understand he might be put on the wing cause he get's bullied about in CM I still think he needs to play CM and learn to handle himself in there. Finally we don't have any  fast players in centre mid or CB, so any type of through balls on a stretched game like yesterday's game I always feel nervous we'll get punished, fortunately we had Mignolet to save us many times!

24 games against the top 10 and won 5, really? I didn't know that and when you compare it with Kenny beating our main rivals sides 9 times in just a year it does put into contrast different levels of "progress". (main rivals included United, City, Everton, Spurs, Arsenal)

Exactly why I still remain far from convinced about Brendan, the proof is on the pitch not in front of a microphone.

The mind really boggles. It's as if you're quite happy to lose against Bolton, West Brom, Swansea, Wigan but F**k me if we beat the likes of Everton and Arsenal then all is fine and dandy even if we record our worst Premier League season in history. As much as I love him, to try and draw more favourable comparisons to Kenny as a manager than Rodgers is shallow and rose tinted at best.

I think you, me and everyone else knows that in spite of the perennial state of denial some fans live in, we are a lot better off with Brendan Rodgers as our manager than with Kenny at the club.

Best banner ever that! Credit to whoever made it! 

24 games against the top 10 and won 5, really? I didn't know that and when you compare it with Kenny beating our main rivals sides 9 times in just a year it does put into contrast different levels of "progress". (main rivals included United, City, Everton, Spurs, Arsenal)

Exactly why I still remain far from convinced about Brendan, the proof is on the pitch not in front of a microphone.

You are incredibly deluded to think we would be better off with King Kenny in charge. I just can't understand this pathetic and petty criticism. Rodgers is doing a good job at the moment.

The mind really boggles. It's as if you're quite happy to lose against Bolton, West Brom, Swansea, Wigan but f**k me if we beat the likes of Everton and Arsenal then all is fine and dandy even if we record our worst Premier League season in history. As much as I love him, to try and draw more favourable comparisons to Kenny as a manager than Rodgers is shallow and rose tinted at best.

I think you, me and everyone else knows that in spite of the perennial state of denial some fans live in, we are a lot better off with Brendan Rodgers as our manager than with Kenny at the club.

Not quite happy FMS, it's just an easier fix to beat a Bolton, West Brom, Swansea or Wigan. Beating United, Everton, Spurs (less so), City and Arsenal gives me more pleasure though that's for sure. As for the progress that keeps getting mentioned, what progress?! 4 points this year on last, out of the only cup and again floundering when meeting decent teams.

So the mind boggles about this "progress". The team that started against Everton:

                 Mig
Johnson Skrtel Agger Flanagan
          Gerrard Lucas
  Henderson Allen Coutinho
               Suarez

Mig and Allen being Brendan's only contribution to that, excuse me if I don't find that a bit of mind boggler. Criticise Kenny's purchases all you want but at least he stuck by them and showed them the confidence new players need. At this moment in time Brendans has

Bought Allen, dropped him, re-picked and no doubt drop him again.
Bought Alberto, never plays him
Bought Assaidi, never played him
Bought Ilori, never plays him
Loaned Sahin, played him and dropped him
Loaned Moses, played him and dropped him
Loaned Cissokho, played him and dropped him
Bought Sakho, played him and dropped him
Bought Aspas, played him and dropped him (injury maybe but he was getting dropped too)
Bought Borini, bought him and loaned him out

So much progress!

The mind really boggles. It's as if you're quite happy to lose against Bolton, West Brom, Swansea, Wigan but f**k me if we beat the likes of Everton and Arsenal then all is fine and dandy even if we record our worst Premier League season in history. As much as I love him, to try and draw more favourable comparisons to Kenny as a manager than Rodgers is shallow and rose tinted at best.

I think you, me and everyone else knows that in spite of the perennial state of denial some fans live in, we are a lot better off with Brendan Rodgers as our manager than with Kenny at the club.

You are incredibly deluded to think we would be better off with King Kenny in charge. I just can't understand this pathetic and petty criticism. Rodgers is doing a good job at the moment.

I suppose it is a case of which it is easier to fix, a team that wins against the top sides but can't beat the poorer teams, or a team that beats the poorer teams but can't beat the top teams.

For me the reason we are more successful against the bottom sides under Brendan is simple.... Coutinho and Sturridge. Why we aren't as successful against the better sides like under Kenny ..... don't ask me

Not quite happy FMS, it's just an easier fix to beat a Bolton, West Brom, Swansea or Wigan. Beating United, Everton, Spurs (less so), City and Arsenal gives me more pleasure though that's for sure. As for the progress that keeps getting mentioned, what progress?! 4 points this year on last, out of the only cup and again floundering when meeting decent teams.

So the mind boggles about this "progress". The team that started against Everton:

                 Mig
Johnson Skrtel Agger Flanagan
          Gerrard Lucas
  Henderson Allen Coutinho
               Suarez

Mig and Allen being Brendan's only contribution to that, excuse me if I don't find that a bit of mind boggler. Criticise Kenny's purchases all you want but at least he stuck by them and showed them the confidence new players need. At this moment in time Brendans has

Bought Allen, dropped him, re-picked and no doubt drop him again.
Bought Alberto, never plays him
Bought Assaidi, never played him
Bought Ilori, never plays him
Loaned Sahin, played him and dropped him
Loaned Moses, played him and dropped him
Loaned Cissokho, played him and dropped him
Bought Sakho, played him and dropped him
Bought Aspas, played him and dropped him (injury maybe but he was getting dropped too)
Bought Borini, bought him and loaned him out

So much progress!

Wasn't coutinho a brendan signing? ah yes he was.

I just think you're an idiot sucking king kennys meat pipe just because his past. His latest stint was not as succesful as brendans reign will be.

Wasn't coutinho a brendan signing? ah yes he was.

I just think you're an idiot sucking king kennys meat pipe just because his past. His latest stint was not as succesful as brendans reign will be.

Yes he was, you're right.

My point about his signings still stands and 3 players is hardly a massive impact after 3 windows.

As for your childish remark, no I just still have a problem with those that say he's doing a "brilliant" job based on the facts. To be doing a brilliant job he'd have to have solved our defensive problems to some extent. He'd have to have shown some capability in beating teams we consider our peers or he'd have to have delivered some success to the club. So far this "brilliant" job is based on staring at a league table that has us 4 points from top and 4 points from 9th.

Oh just a point on Coutinho, he recently gave a lot of credit to Rafa for him signing for us, I suggested at the time that someone had said he was actually recommended to us from Rafa but don't let cloud the issue on his "brilliant" job.

l said few times on here, lf will got one mildfield who has pace and physical power, in january we win more against most teams, and would won against bitters lf got one in summer

Not quite happy FMS, it's just an easier fix to beat a Bolton, West Brom, Swansea or Wigan. Beating United, Everton, Spurs (less so), City and Arsenal gives me more pleasure though that's for sure. As for the progress that keeps getting mentioned, what progress?! 4 points this year on last, out of the only cup and again floundering when meeting decent teams.

So the mind boggles about this "progress". The team that started against Everton:

                 Mig
Johnson Skrtel Agger Flanagan
          Gerrard Lucas
  Henderson Allen Coutinho
               Suarez

Mig and Allen being Brendan's only contribution to that, excuse me if I don't find that a bit of mind boggler. Criticise Kenny's purchases all you want but at least he stuck by them and showed them the confidence new players need. At this moment in time Brendans has

Bought Allen, dropped him, re-picked and no doubt drop him again.
Bought Alberto, never plays him
Bought Assaidi, never played him
Bought Ilori, never plays him
Loaned Sahin, played him and dropped him
Loaned Moses, played him and dropped him
Loaned Cissokho, played him and dropped him
Bought Sakho, played him and dropped him
Bought Aspas, played him and dropped him (injury maybe but he was getting dropped too)
Bought Borini, bought him and loaned him out

So much progress!

Hmmm. So it seems time, space and matter only commenced at 12.45pm yesterday afternoon. History as we know it BEGAN with the Merseyside derby! Someone alert Professor Brian Cox, Stephen Hawking and all the rest this is BIG news! Apparently the players listed have no contribution in the past, present or future with Liverpool FC. Can't help but think there's a couple of Higgs Bosons in your analysis as well that also go by the scientific term of a Sturridge particle and a Coutinho particle. We must strive to discover! Defying questions of progress and indeed questions of science dear Luke!

But seriously, let's just measure our progress at the end of the season eh? Let's put away our mythical supposedly 'legitimate' tables that is not the table we normally look at and decide at the end of the season. Perhaps we will get even better, perhaps it will all go tits up like it did in 2011/2012? Who knows - let's just not judge now. Last season we made progress on account of finishing with 9 more points than the previous. That's the only table that matters - the one on May 11th 2014, not your fabled but bizarre constant use of a corresponding fixtures table. And that same table in May this year showed good progress. This season we are in a good position at the moment to build upon that and progress even further but it's important we convert this basis into progress. I suspect you want to change course when we are on the correct route which is just foolish and somewhat shortsighted IMO.

I find it really tough to come In to match threads after a loss or a draw because the scope and scale of criticism is always so immense. I pretty much can't contribute to be honest. We had a terrific thread a few days ago to recall our favourite derby moments and yesterday's game was up there with the best of them. You only have to look at the chances that followed Sturridge's equaliser, i think there must have been another 4-5 in just FOUR minutes of injury time! Absolutely fantastic game of football, end to end stuff, full hearted performance from everyplayer on the park, Everton were terrific and so were we. It took a lot of character to bounce back and grab a point after their 3rd, I really didn't think we would do it but were still sitting in 2nd spot.

The only point I'd like to make as far our set pieces go is to ask why our best header of a ball (Skrtel) isn't marking their best header of a ball (Lukaku) at corners? It's a real head scratcher for me.

This season we are in a good position at the moment to build upon that and progress even further but it's important we convert this basis into progress.

What? I don't know about Brian Cox when reading that; think more along the lines of Jade Goody/Joey Essex.

No "but seriously": if the only table which matters is the final table; how do you know that we're in a "good position"? 

What? I don't know about Brian Cox when reading that; think more along the lines of Jade Goody/Joey Essex.

No "but seriously": if the only table which matters is the final table; how do you know that we're in a "good position"? 

Yeah alright - messy sentence. Don't know what I was thinking. I fully believe we're in a good position at the moment. Good squad, fit players, decent points tally so far. Something to build on surely? Depends whether we do or not. Of course I'm not going to measure it with some pseudo intellectual tables. It's all in what I personally perceive.

I find it really tough to come In to match threads after a loss or a draw because the scope and scale of criticism is always so immense. I pretty much can't contribute to be honest. We had a terrific thread a few days ago to recall our favourite derby moments and yesterday's game was up there with the best of them. You only have to look at the chances that followed Sturridge's equaliser, i think there must have been another 4-5 in just FOUR minutes of injury time! Absolutely fantastic game of football, end to end stuff, full hearted performance from everyplayer on the park, Everton were terrific and so were we. It took a lot of character to bounce back and grab a point after their 3rd, I really didn't think we would do it but were still sitting in 2nd spot.

The only point I'd like to make as far our set pieces go is to ask why our best header of a ball (Skrtel) isn't marking their best header of a ball (Lukaku) at corners? It's a real head scratcher for me.

If I was a neutral supporter I would agree that it was a fantastic game. End to end stuff, loads of chances etc etc. However I am not a neutral supporter, so when I see defending as poor as ours was yesterday I don't think "great that will make it a fantastic game".... I think what the F**k are we doing.

When I see a player kick Suarez and not get sent off, I don't think that it makes for a better game.... I think what the F**k was the ref doing.

Yes there has probably been some over-reaction, but I see it as 2 points dropped in a game we could and should have won (with decent defending) rather than a point won.

I worry that we seem to fall back on the same tactics every time we are pressurize. We stop playing through midfield and just lump the ball up field in the hope that Suarez can produce a miracle.

Exciting game that I am sure everyone enjoyed BUT I would have preferred a less exciting game that we won 3-1 .... but maybe that's just me?

 

Hmmm. So it seems time, space and matter only commenced at 12.45pm yesterday afternoon. History as we know it BEGAN with the Merseyside derby! Someone alert Professor Brian Cox, Stephen Hawking and all the rest this is BIG news! Apparently the players listed have no contribution in the past, present or future with Liverpool FC. Can't help but think there's a couple of Higgs Bosons in your analysis as well that also go by the scientific term of a Sturridge particle and a Coutinho particle. We must strive to discover! Defying questions of progress and indeed questions of science dear Luke!

But seriously, let's just measure our progress at the end of the season eh? Let's put away our mythical supposedly 'legitimate' tables that is not the table we normally look at and decide at the end of the season. Perhaps we will get even better, perhaps it will all go tits up like it did in 2011/2012? Who knows - let's just not judge now. Last season we made progress on account of finishing with 9 more points than the previous. That's the only table that matters - the one on May 11th 2014, not your fabled but bizarre constant use of a corresponding fixtures table. And that same table in May this year showed good progress. This season we are in a good position at the moment to build upon that and progress even further but it's important we convert this basis into progress. I suspect you want to change course when we are on the correct route which is just foolish and somewhat shortsighted IMO.

What a load of crap.

No I don't want to change course, I've explained what I have issue with, the "brilliant" tag for a job that is looking ordinary and I suggest you stop assuming choices for others, it makes you look like a fool.