FSG's Most Important Summer?

The argument of "money is killing football"

I never said that.

I have

And it is.. I've never said that it's FSGs fault though

I have

And it is.. I've never said that it's FSGs fault though

Yep.

I'd go almost go as far as saying money has killed football.

Its not the same game as many of us know it.

I don't recall ONE person being underwhelmed when we signed those players at the start of the season. Even Mario carried a lot of
excitement.

In fact it took me until March to see people finally realising Moreno and Markovic are terrible. Dejan Lovren was heralded as the centre back we all dreamed of, especially after his game against Dortmund in pre season.

So no need to talk about hindsight and being underwhelmed. There was mass hysteria about our summer transfers.

Not from most there wasn't... Surprisingly Lovern was a highlight for me actually but in all honesty I thought we only increased our sqaid size as opposed to strengthening our first 11. As for the Mario signing, I couldn't if been more underwhelmed if we'd of resigned Poulson... Shocking signing!and I was shouted down and banned from RAWK for suggesting he was anything other than a great signing ... I called it then and I stand by it now....

Last summer we were by large happy with the signings Rodgers brought in , we were so close to winning the title a few months before on a thread bare squad , so there was nothing to suggest otherwise that we couldn't do it this season with a larger squad  albeit without El Pistolero . Unfortunately it turned out to be the opposite . We're completely disjointed ,  Sterling has his head elsewhere sturridge is made of glass Balotelli is like a headless chicken lovren is sh*t Lallana is injury prone ( when he gets fully fit i believe he'll be the player we need ) .

I think most of our Summer signings will improve next season and if we rectify our terrible striker signings by replacing Borini, Lambert and Balotelli with a couple of quality players I think we will certainly have a better next season. But FSG had better make sure we get those two quality players in. If not it will be more of the same and we will continue to go backwards as a club.

Last summer we were by large happy with the signings Rodgers brought in , we were so close to winning the title a few months before on a thread bare squad , so there was nothing to suggest otherwise that we couldn't do it this season with a larger squad  albeit without El Pistolero . Unfortunately it turned out to be the opposite . We're completely disjointed ,  Sterling has his head elsewhere sturridge is made of glass Balotelli is like a headless chicken lovren is sh*t Lallana is injury prone ( when he gets fully fit i believe he'll be the player we need ) .

That's what tends to happen when new signings come in, people get all excited, start looking up the YouTube clips and genuinly want to give players a chance even when they have reservations.

Then the other side was Rodgers took us so close, people wanted to cut him some slack and were willing to believe he knows what he us doing.

Unfortunately as the season has gone on and injuries have not helped it's looking more likely last season was down to having the best striker on the planet in our side.

I think most of our Summer signings will improve next season and if we rectify our terrible striker signings by replacing Borini, Lambert and Balotelli with a couple of quality players I think we will certainly have a better next season. But FSG had better make sure we get those two quality players in. If not it will be more of the same and we will continue to go backwards as a club.

You mean FSG need to stop Rodgers from having whomever he wants and let the TC decide.

I think most of our Summer signings will improve next season and if we rectify our terrible striker signings by replacing Borini, Lambert and Balotelli with a couple of quality players I think we will certainly have a better next season. But FSG had better make sure we get those two quality players in. If not it will be more of the same and we will continue to go backwards as a club.

The thing is Baz that in the eyes of the owners the club isn't  going backward . the profits are getting healthier and that's the bottom line to them . CL qualification means nothing much money wise if we don't progress far into it and to progress past the group stages they would have to pump more resources into top player acquisitions which means massive wages . that's like a cross to a vampire to them .

You mean FSG need to stop Rodgers from having whomever he wants and let the TC decide.

You know he does not have 100% say right..I mean you do know that the list drawn up for consideration from which to choose has limits on it and some of the players that he might have wanted that were on the list Ayre couldn't close on

Even though we all know this do you really need to lay 100% of every failure on the man just to support your agenda? There is plenty of blame to go around

Saying its getting old and tiring is being kind.

You know he does not have 100% say right..I mean you do know that the list drawn up for consideration from which to choose has limits on it and some of the players that he might have wanted that were on the list Ayre couldn't close on

Even though we all know this do you really need to lay 100% of every failure on the man just to support your agenda? There is plenty of blame to go around

Saying its getting old and tiring is being kind.

You need to realise this is what happens at most clubs. I have just come to the conclusion and evidence backs me that Rodgers has a poor eye for picking a player. He is a good coach and that's what he should stick to imo.

Now do you want to talk about your agenda about coming on here with no knowledge about football.

You need to realise this is what happens at most clubs. I have just come to the conclusion and evidence backs me that Rodgers has a poor eye for picking a player. He is a good coach and that's what he should stick to imo.

Now do you want to talk about your agenda against the owners?

I have been a Redsox fan for over 30 years now and FSG have given me 3 titles to enjoy after an 80+ year drought so I appreciate them for that; i
would say with a pretty good confidence that I have been "around" with FSG moreso than any other poster on this board.

However I truly believe they are way way over their head and find themselves treading water at best, overwhelmed at worst.

So:

They are what they are...they are not stealing from the club nor do I see any evidence that winning means anything to them.

They allow the club to reinvest the money but the big spends will always be at the expense of selling a "Big Player"

The stadium is being done as promised but I know we will never buy big name talent to push us forward.

We will sell a Torres and buy a Suarez, we will sell a Suarez and buy an Origi...Sell Sterling but we have Ibe...Sell Ibe for some younger talent.

Wage cap will always be there so when our youth "mature" and cost more to hold on to they will be let go for less expensive replacements.

We will go sideways with some years being better than others and vice versa; but if we win it will not be consistent.

In the end we will not catch City/Chelsea/Scum...and now probably Arsenal will be beyond our resources.

They are not Hick/Gillette mk 2. but they are not saviours either.

As PD succinctly puts it they are "Safe", nothing more and nothing less and the evidence so far pretty much backs me on FSG.

No real agenda here, they have owned my baseball team for almost 15 years now and have done very well but the methods they employ in the MLB will not translate to the PL so we will always be "Catching Up"

Zero agenda, they are what they are...they are not stealing from the club nor do I see any evidence that winning means anything to them.

They allow the club to reinvest the money but the big spends will always be at the expense of selling a "Big Player"

The stadium is being done as promised but I know we will never buy big name talent to push us forward.

We will sell a Torres and buy a Suarez, we will sell a Suarez and buy an Origi...Sell Sterling but we have Ibe...Sell Ibe for some younger talent.

Wage cap will always be there so when our youth "mature" and cost more to hold on to they will be let go for less expensive replacements.

We will go sideways with some years being better than others and vice versa; but if we win it will not be consistent.

In the end we will not catch City/Chelsea/Scum...and now probably Arsenal will be beyond our resources.

They are not Hick/Gillette mk 2. but they are not saviours either.

As PD succinctly puts it they are "Safe", nothing more and nothing less and the evidence so far pretty much backs me on FSG.

No real agenda here, they have owned my baseball team for almost 15 years now and have done very well but the methods they employ in the MLB will not translate to the PL so we will always be "Catching Up"

Let's worry about beating the likes of Villa and W-Brom before we get carried away about needing superstars to challenge for the Title.

Let's worry about beating the likes of Villa and W-Brom before we get carried away about needing superstars to challenge for the Title.

Herr Klopp is not going to be our saviour either..when the honeymoon is over and he needs to sell Ibe because he wants 150k/week then he will find himself in the same place.

He might be able to pick players much better than BR and even coach them better, but when those players get good and he has to sell them all off due to wages the rebuild will start again.

Rinse/repeat and then repeat again...almost getting there but just out of grasp.

Winning begins at the top and permeates throughout the club like a wonderful virus it spreads and breeds....while FSG would never turn down winning they are not going to go out of they're way to make it happen.

The rot that was H&G has been cut out of the club with a surgeons knife, however the patient is still in bed and unlikely to be released anytime soon to return to its winning ways.

Herr Klopp is not going to be our saviour either..when the honeymoon is over and he needs to sell Ibe because he wants 150k/week then he will find himself in the same place.

He might be able to pick players much better than BR and even coach them better, but when those players get good and he has to sell them all off due to wages the rebuild will start again.

Rinse/repeat and then repeat again...almost getting there but just out of grasp.

Winning begins at the top and permeates throughout the club like a wonderful virus it spreads and breeds....while FSG would never turn down winning they are not going to go out of they're way to make it happen.

The rot that was H&G has been cut out of the club with a surgeons knife, however the patient is still in bed and unlikely to be released anytime soon to return to its winning ways.

LFC rank 5th in the wages bill table (2013-2014 data). We're behind United, City, Chelsea and Arsenal (all of them are above us for obvious reasons). We spend only ~22 million per year less on wages than Arsenal does (that's two 215kpw contracts). Moreover, LFC's turnover/wage bill ratio is 56,25%, whereas Arsenal's is 55,70%, which means we even spend more of the money we make than Arsenal does.

We obviously can't directly compete with the rich ones, but that also doesn't mean that we're lightyears behind them.

I have been a Redsox fan for over 30 years now and FSG have given me 3 titles to enjoy after an 80+ year drought so I appreciate them for that; i
would say with a pretty good confidence that I have been "around" with FSG moreso than any other poster on this board.

However I truly believe they are way way over their head and find themselves treading water at best, overwhelmed at worst.

So:

They are what they are...they are not stealing from the club nor do I see any evidence that winning means anything to them.

They allow the club to reinvest the money but the big spends will always be at the expense of selling a "Big Player"

The stadium is being done as promised but I know we will never buy big name talent to push us forward.

We will sell a Torres and buy a Suarez, we will sell a Suarez and buy an Origi...Sell Sterling but we have Ibe...Sell Ibe for some younger talent.

Wage cap will always be there so when our youth "mature" and cost more to hold on to they will be let go for less expensive replacements.

We will go sideways with some years being better than others and vice versa; but if we win it will not be consistent.

In the end we will not catch City/Chelsea/Scum...and now probably Arsenal will be beyond our resources.

They are not Hick/Gillette mk 2. but they are not saviours either.

As PD succinctly puts it they are "Safe", nothing more and nothing less and the evidence so far pretty much backs me on FSG.

No real agenda here, they have owned my baseball team for almost 15 years now and have done very well but the methods they employ in the MLB will not translate to the PL so we will always be "Catching Up"

Well thought out comment Erik and we must acknowledge the fact that the views expressed are borne out of experience.
It must also be appreciated that JWH when he graced the sacred turf at Anfield nearly five years ago and promised to bring the glory days back, had no qualification or indeed right to venture such a premise.

There is no doubt he honestly believed otherwise; he had every confidence in the veracity of his company and comment such as yours about FSG's assets in the US bears out that assertion.
Liverpool FC and indeed the PL are as you rightly point out a different animal, literally a different ball game if you will, to say they are out of their depth even accounting for their years playing the markets and company ownership, is not as ludicrous as it may seem.
FSG have never experienced anything remotely like Liverpool Football Club with it's passion, tradition, history and of course a support ethic unrivalled anywhere in the world, unique is not too strong a word; it is hardly surprising that they had little idea of what they were taking on.

Why then don't FSG sell the asset that is LFC to a body who will promote and invest adequately for the long term good of the club?
They would walk away with a profit and the club would stand a realistic chance of actually bringing back those trophy winning seasons.

spend 40+ mil on one player of the same level of Alexis Sanchez and show us you not only see us as a business but also that you want to actually be at the top winning

So:

They are what they are...they are not stealing from the club nor do I see any evidence that winning means anything to them.

They allow the club to reinvest the money but the big spends will always be at the expense of selling a "Big Player"

The stadium is being done as promised but I know we will never buy big name talent to push us forward.

Wage cap will always be there so when our youth "mature" and cost more to hold on to they will be let go for less expensive replacements.

We will go sideways with some years being better than others and vice versa; but if we win it will not be consistent.

In the end we will not catch City/Chelsea/Scum...and now probably Arsenal will be beyond our resources.

They are not Hick/Gillette mk 2. but they are not saviours either.

No real agenda here, they have owned my baseball team for almost 15 years now and have done very well but the methods they employ in the MLB will not translate to the PL so we will always be "Catching Up"

Well said  Sir. I do really hope that they understand what this club is all about. it's not only about staying afloat but winning trophies. We want to restore the club as one of the world power hosue, sadly FSG is not the one that can realise that  ambition. They simply do not have the financial muscle to do that, hence, it's better that they sell the club, get a decent profit out of it and get someone else in that has the financial muscle to do that.

An article in today's Echo pretty much repeating what I was saying in the Brendan Rodgers thread last night:

Liverpool FC talking point: Reds need 'bona fide' quality to regain goalscoring identity but how much will they have to spend in the summer?

Liverpool's abject defeat to lowly Hull City only served to reinforce what's required at Anfield this summer.

This is a squad crying out for bona fide quality in the final third of the field.

There is a goals crisis which has to be addressed. The mistakes of previous windows have to be addressed if the Reds are going to avoid a repeat of this torrid season and regain their identity as an attacking force.

All last summer Liverpool's hierarchy insisted they weren't going to 'do a Tottenham'.

The Londoners had embarked on a £104million spending spree after the £85million sale of Gareth Bale to Real Madrid in 2013 but squandered much of it on a raft of signings and trailed home sixth.

The warning signs were there but lessons weren't learned. Liverpool did exactly the same.

Rather than replace Barcelona-bound Luis Suarez with a top class marksmen they used that £75million instead to fund a major overhaul of the squad. The £116million they spent went on nine signings, most of whom have struggled to justify their price tags.

In the aftermath of a desperate night at the KC Stadium, Brendan Rodgers spoke about the need for a different approach in the transfer market this summer.

“For supporters, and for players themselves, it is always great if you can get in those marquee players that can really help you,” he said.

“And I think we can see that that's the type, maybe the one or two players, that we need.”

Can Liverpool still attract elite players?

The manager is right. The Reds need quality rather than quantity in order to push on.

The question is do they have the financial muscle and the pulling power to get what they need? And can they really do their shopping in the elite market?

Liverpool's recent past is littered with examples of them trying and failing to land stellar names like Henrikh Mkhitaryan, Diego Costa, Willian and Alexis Sanchez.

Their latest attempts to land top drawer talent this summer won't be helped by their failure to qualify for the Champions League.

Manchester United showed last year that it is still possible to attract stars when you are operating outside Europe's elite but you'll probably have to pay through the nose to get them, like they did to land Radamel Falcao and Angel di Maria.

Just how much Liverpool will have to spend this summer is unclear.

A rough estimate would be around the £35million mark, plus whatever can be generated by off-loading the likes of Mario Balotelli , Fabio Borini, Rickie Lambert , Jose Enrique, Iago Aspas, Luis Alberto and Sebastian Coates.

That kitty could be swelled to the £70million mark. The wage bill will also be heavily reduced by the departures of Steven Gerrard , Glen Johnson and Brad Jones when their contracts expire.

Kopites want to see a show of ambition from the club this summer – proof that the owners are serious about getting back to challenging for the biggest prizes.

This season has proved there is no substitute for quality. And Liverpool desperately need an injection of it.

Yes the manager has his faults, yes he takes a measure of blame for the season's woes but without real quality no one is going to be able to take us to sustained success. This is not just FSG's most important Summer, I believe this is the Club's most important Summer and failure by FSG to back the manager with some quality, experienced signings and a repeat of the last three Summers where potential over experience was the policy will consign our success to the annals of footballing History.

This isn't about the players though.  Yes we've missed having goal scoring strikers but we still have enough good players to play better than we are, he showed that earlier this year but it's his choice to play how we are and that's what's unforgivable for me.

This isn't about the players though.  Yes we've missed having goal scoring strikers but we still have enough good players to play better than we are, he showed that earlier this year but it's his choice to play how we are and that's what's unforgivable for me.

I believe it is. Our problem all season has been a lack of goals and all the formations and tinkering from Rodgers has been with a view to try find them. Put a goal scorer in and most of our problems go away. Sometimes things in Football really are that simple.

I believe it is. Our problem all season has been a lack of goals and all the formations and tinkering from Rodgers has been with a view to try find them. Put a goal scorer in and most of our problems go away. Sometimes things in Football really are that simple.

If that was the case why didn't he stick with Raheem up top or Cou in the false 9 when we were scoring.  Markovic has also played as a striker at previous clubs but never been tried there and how many times has he played with 2 up top when our 1 was so isolated.

He's had options but not used them, so it's not the lack of players but an insistence on playing 433 with a lone striker which has never worked.

Anyone think that with Suarez and Sturridge up front we'd still be struggling this year?

No? Me neither.

So go get another Suarez (close as you can) and either get Studge healthy or supplement him with a like minded player.

It DOES appear to be about players for me anyway.

If that was the case why didn't he stick with Raheem up top or Cou in the false 9 when we were scoring.  Markovic has also played as a striker at previous clubs but never been tried there and how many times has he played with 2 up top when our 1 was so isolated.

He's had options but not used them, so it's not the lack of players but an insistence on playing 433 with a lone striker which has never worked.

That I agree with but that's not what you said. I responded to the suggestion that a lack of mobile forwards that can score goals would have made no difference to our season and it was solely down to the manager with a clear inference that a new manager could turn Lead in to Gold and create a title winning team without an experienced core. This is the entire point, people are suggesting another manager could do this when clearly it's nonsence, knee jerk reactions. As I said, he's not blameless but at the same time he's not a moron and must be doing this for a reason which I would suggest is probably a message to the owners about investing in proper talent rather than giving him cast offs to work with. If so, he's playing a dangerous game because we know how that ended for Rafa. So agree to disagree with me if you wish but don't treat me like an idiot by suggesting another manager could come in and perform miracles without a recognised Striker.