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      Roberto Firmino Player Thread

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      PurpleMonkey
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2100: May 02, 2019 06:33:58 pm
      Or having one of those aforementioned partner with him when Salah or Mane is out or need a break?

      I'd have nothing wrong with that type of alternative. I love Bob as much as anyone, one of my favorite players (if not my favorite) but surely we can't have all of our eggs in his basket...because then if he gets injured or God-forbid decides to move on, we can't be left toothless in attack.


      I would even go as far to say a classic 9 that's good with his head could be more effective than Firmino , especially vs defensive teams seeing how exceptional our full backs (and Hendo) are at crossing the ball. Imagine a player similar to Lewandoski up top. Would certainly give us a different dimension and alternative.
      Swab
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2101: May 02, 2019 06:53:38 pm
      So if Klopp bought a Suarez, Lewandoski, D.Costa, Cavani type 9's, you really think he would have them play a false 9 role like Firmino? That's what you seem to be suggesting. We have seen Firmino, Mane & Salah play higher up as a 9 and work, just like you see Fabinho the DM work. A proper 9 can work, but it would be an alternative.

      And who said anything about replacing Firmino with a proper #9?

      So a player like that would come here to spend most of the season on the bench.
      Right.

      Unless you've been in a coma for the last few years, it's clear that Firmino is integral to the way we play, and it works.

      Stop regurgitating what you read on twatter.
      It's boring and nonsensical.
      PurpleMonkey
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2102: May 02, 2019 07:49:24 pm
      So a player like that would come here to spend most of the season on the bench.
      Right.

      Unless you've been in a coma for the last few years, it's clear that Firmino is integral to the way we play, and it works.

      Stop regurgitating what you read on twatter.
      It's boring and nonsensical.

      By your logic, if we buy a Lewandoski or a Torres in their peak years, they would be spending most of the season on the bench and offer less for the team because they can't play like Firmino.

      An alternative striker can work. We have seen it here and when Klopp was at Dortmund, just like the specialist in Fabinho has worked when the majority didn't expect Klopp to buy that type of player. I bet a DLPM or a playmaker would probably work too, but it all depends on how good the player is. Football is not as linear as you think, and certainly not for Klopp as he has shown this season.
      Swab
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2103: May 02, 2019 09:18:09 pm
      By your logic, if we buy a Lewandoski or a Torres in their peak years, they would be spending most of the season on the bench and offer less for the team because they can't play like Firmino.

      An alternative striker can work. We have seen it here and when Klopp was at Dortmund, just like the specialist in Fabinho has worked when the majority didn't expect Klopp to buy that type of player. I bet a DLPM or a playmaker would probably work too, but it all depends on how good the player is. Football is not as linear as you think, and certainly not for Klopp as he has shown this season.

      By your logic, what has worked so well, and is a system Klopp has built because he is such a huge fan of Firmino should be dismantled and a one dimensional player brought in to replace him.

      Fabinho rotates the 6 (ish) position with other midfielders.
      I can't believe I actually have to explain that.
      Anyone who watches a match, rather than posting on twatter all the way through, knows this.
      It is amazingly clear for anyone to see, if they are actually paying attention.

      I can't believe you don't understand that Klopp values fluidity above fixed positions, and asks his front 3 to rotate and take up different positions, the same as he does with his midfield.

      Like I said, stop repeating bullshit you read on twatter.
      It's 99% nonsense.
      PurpleMonkey
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2104: May 02, 2019 09:57:42 pm
      By your logic, what has worked so well, and is a system Klopp has built because he is such a huge fan of Firmino should be dismantled and a one dimensional player brought in to replace him.

      You do know we have had Salah as the 9 and Firmino as the 10 a few times this season, right? Think about it, if we had Torres or Lewandowski as the 9 instead and Salah on the right... Just think about it, seriously.

      And show me where I want things dismantled and Firmino to be replaced, please do.


      Fabinho rotates the 6 (ish) position with other midfielders.
      I can't believe I actually have to explain that.
      Anyone who watches a match, rather than posting on twatter all the way through, knows this.
      It is amazingly clear for anyone to see, if they are actually paying attention.

      I wouldn't quite say he rotates, but gets cover when he plays aggressive and steps up in which one of our 8's drop in.  Remember, Fabinho is predominately in the 6 area as a DM and is more the specialist player than the 2 #8's or any of our midfielders.

      I can't believe you don't understand that Klopp values fluidity above fixed positions, and asks his front 3 to rotate and take up different positions, the same as he does with his midfield.

      You don't think a striker can do that? Do you think a striker just stays up top and never moves? Have you never watched or played football before? You do know you get strikers working channels or dropping into pockets of space, right? Go watch the likes of Werner, Suarez or Lewandowski etc..... better still, go watch our matches where Salah is our 9.

      Like I said, stop repeating bullshit you read on twatter.
      It's 99% nonsense.

      What am I repeating exactly? I don't have twitter nor do I scour it for football chat. Couple of forums and the odd article is all I read, so please show me what I am repeating.
      Swab
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2105: May 02, 2019 10:48:29 pm
      You do know we have had Salah as the 9 and Firmino as the 10 a few times this season, right? Think about it, if we had Torres or Lewandowski as the 9 instead and Salah on the right... Just think about it, seriously.

      You do know that Mane, Salah, and Firmino are forwards, not what you term "number 9" and that the foundation philosophy is that they move around, they rotate, they take up different positions according to Klopp's system of the player finding himself in a particular space will perform the function of that space
      .Salah, Mane and Firmino, during a match, will all occupy what you like to think is the "9 position".
      I seriously can't believe that someone who bangs on about knowing loads about football can't grasp this, and all you're doing is providing further evidence that you're a spoofer.

      Yet again, you completely miss the point of Klopp's system.


      Quote
      I wouldn't quite say he rotates, but gets cover when he plays aggressive and steps up in which one of our 8's drop in.  Remember, Fabinho is predominately in the 6 area as a DM and is more the specialist player than the 2 #8's or any of our midfielders.
      He rotates, as do all our midfielders.
      It is the foundation of Klopp's system.

      Quote
      You don't think a striker can do that? Do you think a striker just stays up top and never moves? Have you never watched or played football before? You do know you get strikers working channels or dropping into pockets of space, right? Go watch the likes of Werner, Suarez or Lewandowski etc..... better still, go watch our matches where Salah is our 9.

      Firmino knits the attack together.
      He goes, right, left, central, supports, presses, drops deep, plays as an extra midfielder.
      He is the glue that not only binds the attack but links the midfield.
      He is a forward, an attacking midfielder, a wide forward and a link man.
      No, I don't think many players can do that, and I don't think there is a player around that could step straight into the team and do the job as good as him.

      But keep chucking names out, like you understand what those guys do.
      You're bound to get it right if you throw enough names out.
      The stupidity of this is on a par with you insisting that Gerrard and Lampard were "a classic double pivot".


      Quote
      What am I repeating exactly? I don't have twitter nor do I scour it for football chat. Couple of forums and the odd article is all I read, so please show me what I am repeating.

      Bollocks.
      You're so full of sh*t.
      PurpleMonkey
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2106: May 02, 2019 11:42:37 pm
      You do know that Mane, Salah, and Firmino are forwards, not what you term "number 9"

      Where am I calling them 9's? There is a difference between calling them 9's and saying they have played as 9's.

      Yet again, you completely miss the point of Klopp's system.

      No, I understand how fluid we are, but I also acknowledge a striker can offer something different and still be fluid, maybe not so much as if Firmino was in the team, but fluid enough.

      they rotate, they take up different positions according to Klopp's system of the player finding himself in a particular space will perform the function of that space
      .Salah, Mane and Firmino, during a match, will all occupy what you like to think is the "9 position".

      Just like 9's can occupy wide areas or pockets of space and perform the function of that space....like Firmino. Maybe not as good, maybe as good or better in certain areas.

      Firmino knits the attack together.
      He goes, right, left, central, supports, presses, drops deep, plays as an extra midfielder.
      He is the glue that not only binds the attack but links the midfield.
      He is a forward, an attacking midfielder, a wide forward and a link man.
      No, I don't think many players can do that, and I don't think there is a player around that could step straight into the team and do the job as good as him.

      But keep chucking names out, like you understand what those guys do.
      You're bound to get it right if you throw enough names out.

      Jesus Christ, Swab!!!!!!  I am talking about an alternative 9, someone like a Lewandoski or a Torres type. Whether someone with potential or established. A player who can offer something different to our attack like what Alcacer offers to Dortmund, like what Giroud offers to Chelsea etc.

      The stupidity of this is on a par with you insisting that Gerrard and Lampard were "a classic double pivot".

      What is it that I am missing to not see the significant difference? There have been so many varied partnerships out there that were considered double pivots, from Khedira & Alonso, Essien & Ramires , Modric & Rakitic, Xavi and Xabi, Masch & Alonso, Gerrard & Lampard, Kante & Drinkwater etc etc

      And yeah, Gerrard and Lampard have played for England in a formation that used a double pivot. I assume you consider a DLPM & DM a classic double pivot ? If so, you lie yet again and as shown, I did not use the word, "classic".

      Gerrard and Lampard were more rotating, one would go and one would stay in a 2 man midfield, therefore considered a double pivot...

      A double pivot is a sitter and a DLP or box to box.

      ... right? Same with Wijnaldum and Fabinho when you said Wijnaldum was more the sitter and Fabinho the more offensive :)

      « Last Edit: May 02, 2019 11:48:46 pm by PurpleMonkey »
      heimdall
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2107: May 03, 2019 09:22:07 am
      So a player like that would come here to spend most of the season on the bench.
      Right.

      Unless you've been in a coma for the last few years, it's clear that Firmino is integral to the way we play, and it works.

      Stop regurgitating what you read on twatter.
      It's boring and nonsensical.

      Ever heard of rotation, you know the kind of thing Citeh do when they have more quality players than they can fit on a pitch at the same time, one player plays one week then another player plays the next, pretty f**king radical I know!
      It is insane that we only have 3 quality attackers when we play 3 attackers every game, we've been ludicrously lucky with injuries tot he forwards all season.
      fields of anny rd
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2108: May 03, 2019 11:06:50 am
      Dont know that we need a 9 but we need another forward who Klopp will play of injury occurs. Sane and Mahrez sit on Citys bench, we can find someone like that to do it here.

      We are good enough to attract a player who wants to have a crack at a club like ours but might not be automatic first choice.

      It doesn't have to be Origi and Sturridge any more. We're better than that now.
      Swab
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2109: May 03, 2019 11:29:31 am
      Where am I calling them 9's? There is a difference between calling them 9's and saying they have played as 9's.

      No, I understand how fluid we are, but I also acknowledge a striker can offer something different and still be fluid, maybe not so much as if Firmino was in the team, but fluid enough.

      Just like 9's can occupy wide areas or pockets of space and perform the function of that space....like Firmino. Maybe not as good, maybe as good or better in certain areas.

      Jesus Christ, Swab!!!!!!  I am talking about an alternative 9, someone like a Lewandoski or a Torres type. Whether someone with potential or established. A player who can offer something different to our attack like what Alcacer offers to Dortmund, like what Giroud offers to Chelsea etc.

      And yeah, Gerrard and Lampard have played for England in a formation that used a double pivot. I assume you consider a DLPM & DM a classic double pivot ? If so, you lie yet again and as shown, I did not use the word, "classic".

      Gerrard and Lampard were more rotating, one would go and one would stay in a 2 man midfield, therefore considered a double pivot...

      ... right? Same with Wijnaldum and Fabinho when you said Wijnaldum was more the sitter and Fabinho the more offensive :)

      What you want, is to replace a player in a system that has scored us more league goals than last season, got us a record points tally, and 2 champs league semi finals.

      This is just more of the "Firmino isn't a proper striker" bullshit from a few years ago.

      You've heard some random pundit say "they need a proper number 9" and you've posted it.
      Simple as that.

      It's bollocks.
      Swab
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2110: May 03, 2019 11:31:45 am
      Dont know that we need a 9 but we need another forward who Klopp will play of injury occurs. Sane and Mahrez sit on Citys bench, we can find someone like that to do it here.

      We are good enough to attract a player who wants to have a crack at a club like ours but might not be automatic first choice.

      It doesn't have to be Origi and Sturridge any more. We're better than that now.

      Yep, we need better backup, or even someone who can play across the frontline so we can rotate/rest.
      heimdall
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2111: May 03, 2019 12:16:16 pm
      Dont know that we need a 9 but we need another forward who Klopp will play of injury occurs. Sane and Mahrez sit on Citys bench, we can find someone like that to do it here.

      We are good enough to attract a player who wants to have a crack at a club like ours but might not be automatic first choice.

      It doesn't have to be Origi and Sturridge any more. We're better than that now.

      Sane and Mahrez also start plenty of games, if we buy some more forwards they need to be of equal quality to what we have now, not just more bench warmers like Danny and Divvy. Ideally they'd also be able to offer us some extra options, a big strong forward sikilar to Kane, Drogba, Lukakau (before he became sh*t) would be perfect, but they also have to be able to play well in our normal system, ie good link up play and speed. Although he's not the biggest someone like Zaha would be a pretty good option I think, he seems strong and is certainly quick.
      PurpleMonkey
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2112: May 03, 2019 12:51:07 pm
      What you want, is to replace a player in a system that has scored us more league goals than last season, got us a record points tally, and 2 champs league semi finals.

      This is just more of the "Firmino isn't a proper striker" bullshit from a few years ago.

      You've heard some random pundit say "they need a proper number 9" and you've posted it.
      Simple as that.

      It's bollocks.

      Remember, those pundits know more than you and have access to information you can dream of ;)

      Firmino isn't a natural striker like your Suarez, Defoe, Fowler, Torres, Giroud, D.Costa etc. He is a natural false 9/second striker/#10.  You know it and just being difficult and stubborn... but then again, you think every player has the same level of techincal ability at the highest level.

      Like I said before, we have played with Salah as the 9 and Firmino the 10 and it has worked. And let me remind you again, wanting an alternative is not about wanting to replace Firmino.
      Swab
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2113: May 03, 2019 01:12:24 pm
      Remember, those pundits know more than you and have access to information you can dream of ;)

      Firmino isn't a natural striker like your Suarez, Defoe, Fowler, Torres, Giroud, D.Costa etc. He is a natural false 9/second striker/#10.  You know it and just being difficult and stubborn... but then again, you think every player has the same level of techincal ability at the highest level.

      Like I said before, we have played with Salah as the 9 and Firmino the 10 and it has worked. And let me remind you again, wanting an alternative is not about wanting to replace Firmino.

      No, they don't.
      They have access to TV footage, and that's it, oh and a few OPTA stats that are worthless without context.

      Another tired old cliche comes to the fore in "not a natural striker" as if that isn't just more pundit bullshit, and as I've explained countless times, the 3 forwards rotate during a match, meaning that all 3 of them will be in what you think is the "9 position" at one point.
      None of our forwards play a fixed position.
      They rotate, end of story.

      And again I ask myself, why would anyone want to disrupt a system that has scored so many goals.
      The answer of course, is because a pundit said so.  :roll:

      oh, and FYI, elite players all have similar levels of ability.
      The difference between them is speed of thought, ability to see things quickly, physical differences and more speed of thought.
      I don't expect you to understand this until a pundit says it though.
      « Last Edit: May 03, 2019 01:18:37 pm by Swab »
      heimdall
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2114: May 03, 2019 01:23:04 pm
      No, they don't.
      They have access to TV footage, and that's it, oh and a few OPTA stats that are worthless without context.

      Another tired old cliche comes to the fore in "not a natural striker" as if that isn't just more pundit bullshit, and as I've explained countless times, the 3 forwards rotate during a match, meaning that all 3 of them will be in what you think is the "9 position" at one point.
      None of our forwards play a fixed position.
      They rotate, end of story.

      And again I ask myself, why would anyone want to disrupt a system that has scored so many goals.
      The answer of course, is because a pundit said so.  :roll:

      oh, and FYI, elite players all have similar levels of ability.
      The difference between them is speed of thought, ability to see things quickly, physical differences and more speed of thought.
      I don't expect you to understand this until a pundit says it though.

      So if all the forwards rotate all match how come Bobby has so few goals again then compared to Sadio and Mo??
      Bobby plays a key role in our team as a link man for our two main strikers but I would love for him to score even more goals, same as I would love for our midfielders to score more goals.
      Kopite78
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2115: May 03, 2019 02:01:25 pm
      So if all the forwards rotate all match how come Bobby has so few goals again then compared to Sadio and Mo??
      Bobby plays a key role in our team as a link man for our two main strikers but I would love for him to score even more goals, same as I would love for our midfielders to score more goals.

      Yeah let's have everyone in the team score 15-20 a season

      Our team is built to get the best out of Mo and Sadio..
      Bobby, the midfield and the full backs are integral in that.. the midfield don't really break beyond the front three to get the numbers that say a Stevie or Lamaprd got in their hay day, they narrow the pitch to allow the full backs space

      If they decide to blam shots from all sorts of angles then  you'd likely find us easily countered on with our full backs so high and the retention on the ball gone

      Bobbys numbers are good to say he's mainly a creative pivot for the rest of the side and a first line of the press.. he's got 43 goals all comps over the last two season which is pretty much one in two

      The essence here is if we brought in a "traditional" number 9 he wouldn't likely be the first line of the press as effectively as Bobby is and because those type are (rightfully so on the right system) selfish would the increase on Bobbys 21.5 a season to maybe 30 a season take away from Mo  and Sadios numbers? (Sadio more this year than last because if you look at Sadio and Bobby over the last two years there's like one goal between them)

      I personally think dropping a "proper number 9" into this side would change the dynamics of it too much and not in a positive way

      Personally I'd prefer we have more better options of the types we have now than have a different option
      We'd be far better off having rotation that suited our current style than a different style
      Swab
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2116: May 03, 2019 02:08:55 pm
      Yeah let's have everyone in the team score 15-20 a season

      Our team is built to get the best out of Mo and Sadio..
      Bobby, the midfield and the full backs are integral in that.. the midfield don't really break beyond the front three to get the numbers that say a Stevie or Lamaprd got in their hay day, they narrow the pitch to allow the full backs space

      If they decide to blam shots from all sorts of angles then  you'd likely find us easily countered on with our full backs so high and the retention on the ball gone

      Bobbys numbers are good to say he's mainly a creative pivot for the rest of the side and a first line of the press.. he's got 43 goals all comps over the last two season which is pretty much one in two

      The essence here is if we brought in a "traditional" number 9 he wouldn't likely be the first line of the press as effectively as Bobby is and because those type are (rightfully so on the right system) selfish would the increase on Bobbys 21.5 a season to maybe 30 a season take away from Mo  and Sadios numbers? (Sadio more this year than last because if you look at Sadio and Bobby over the last two years there's like one goal between them)

      I personally think dropping a "proper number 9" into this side would change the dynamics of it too much and not in a positive way

      Personally I'd prefer we have more better options of the types we have now than have a different option
      We'd be far better off having rotation that suited our current style than a different style

      Exactly.
      Klopp even stated in his presser that "some think we need a number 9 but whatever" (or words to that effect) so it's obvious this whole shitshow is posters just repeating what they've heard pundits say.

      F**k the pundits, trust the gaffer, he knows best what he wants and how to get it.
      PurpleMonkey
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2117: May 03, 2019 03:24:24 pm
      No, they don't.
      They have access to TV footage, and that's it, oh and a few OPTA stats that are worthless without context.

      Still more than we can dream of. Don't forget, they are better qualified with years of experience that you can only dream of, and they get to go watch the games live and have probably watched more live games than you have had hot dinners. Remember how you kept bitching at people for questioning Klopp because they didn't have the information and experience he has? Same should apply to you when you criticise these pundits, you know.

      Another tired old cliche comes to the fore in "not a natural striker" as if that isn't just more pundit bullshit, and as I've explained countless times, the 3 forwards rotate during a match, meaning that all 3 of them will be in what you think is the "9 position" at one point.
      None of our forwards play a fixed position.
      They rotate, end of story.

      Okay, sorry, Firmino can play like Fowler or Owen if asked to, he can also play like Carroll or a Drogba...  :roll:

      Also, why are you so obsessed with bringing fixed positions up? No one has mentioned it but you, and if you actually go watch other games with strikers in their team, you will see they can be fluid. You make it sound like every striker is a Benteke, seriously.

      I swear, I seen the same sh*t about a DM and how Klopp wouldn't go for one.....

      And again I ask myself, why would anyone want to disrupt a system that has scored so many goals.
      The answer of course, is because a pundit said so.

      Wtf? Klopp has disrupted the normal system already. Have you not seen us play? Is it so difficult to understand or see that we have at times, played differently to how we normally have under Klopp? Perhaps I should find P.Neville's analysis for him to school you?

      oh, and FYI, elite players all have similar levels of ability.
      The difference between them is speed of thought, ability to see things quickly, physical differences and more speed of thought.
      I don't expect you to understand this until a pundit says it though.

      Just fface it, some players don't have similar levels of ability. Kante and Hendo doesn't have the same as Verratti, Arthur or Pjanic, nor does Lukaku has similar abilities to Rashford etc etc. And by not having similar levels of ability and physicality, they form a different way of playing, and playing to their strengths rather than their weaknesses.

      You fail so much, Swab, seriously.
      PurpleMonkey
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2118: May 03, 2019 03:32:30 pm
      Exactly.
      Klopp even stated in his presser that "some think we need a number 9 but whatever" (or words to that effect) so it's obvious this whole shitshow is posters just repeating what they've heard pundits say.

      F**k the pundits, trust the gaffer, he knows best what he wants and how to get it.

      Yeah let's have everyone in the team score 15-20 a season

      Our team is built to get the best out of Mo and Sadio..
      Bobby, the midfield and the full backs are integral in that.. the midfield don't really break beyond the front three to get the numbers that say a Stevie or Lamaprd got in their hay day, they narrow the pitch to allow the full backs space

      If they decide to blam shots from all sorts of angles then  you'd likely find us easily countered on with our full backs so high and the retention on the ball gone

      Bobbys numbers are good to say he's mainly a creative pivot for the rest of the side and a first line of the press.. he's got 43 goals all comps over the last two season which is pretty much one in two

      The essence here is if we brought in a "traditional" number 9 he wouldn't likely be the first line of the press as effectively as Bobby is and because those type are (rightfully so on the right system) selfish would the increase on Bobbys 21.5 a season to maybe 30 a season take away from Mo  and Sadios numbers? (Sadio more this year than last because if you look at Sadio and Bobby over the last two years there's like one goal between them)

      I personally think dropping a "proper number 9" into this side would change the dynamics of it too much and not in a positive way

      Personally I'd prefer we have more better options of the types we have now than have a different option
      We'd be far better off having rotation that suited our current style than a different style

      It's as simple as this, we have used Firmino as the 10 with a 9 ahead of him and Mane and Shaq/Lallana either side this season. It can work.

      I would prefer a 9, Firmino, Salah and Mane instead of having to bring Shaq or Lallana in.
      Kopite78
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2119: May 03, 2019 03:36:31 pm
      It's as simple as this, we have used Firmino as the 10 with a 9 ahead of him and Mane and Shaq/Lallana either side this season. It can work.

      I would prefer a 9, Firmino, Salah and Mane instead of having to bring Shaq or Lallana in.

      Didn't work that well though, god the moaning on here when he did that was constant and it gives you one  less in the middle of the park

      Could work against your Huddersfields but you'd get over run against  most good sides

      Hence why Klopp prefers a Keita now he's settled at the top of the midfield 3 than a Bobby

      You may prefer it but fortunately the man who picks the side doesn't and prefers Bobby as his main 9
      HScRed1
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2120: May 03, 2019 03:49:04 pm
      Didn't work that well though, god the moaning on here when he did that was constant and it gives you one  less in the middle of the park

      Could work against your Huddersfields but you'd get over run against  most good sides

      Hence why Klopp prefers a Keita now he's settled at the top of the midfield 3 than a Bobby

      You may prefer it but fortunately the man who picks the side doesn't and prefers Bobby as his main 9

      Swab will have you up for that as you don’t know for sure, you are just guessing  ;)
      Swab
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2121: May 03, 2019 05:08:33 pm
      Still more than we can dream of. Don't forget, they are better qualified with years of experience that you can only dream of, and they get to go watch the games live and have probably watched more live games than you have had hot dinners. Remember how you kept bitching at people for questioning Klopp because they didn't have the information and experience he has? Same should apply to you when you criticise these pundits, you know.

       :laugh: Listen to yourself.
      Just because that's where you get your "opinions" from, you think they are the fount of all knowledge.
      Most pundits talk utter sh*te, and only have the job because they're in the lads club.
      Take wednesday, were they even watching the same match?
      All they did was bang on about Barca, and you know why? Because they lack the intelligence to understand what they are seeing, and are not in management for the same reason.

      Quote
      Okay, sorry, Firmino can play like Fowler or Owen if asked to, he can also play like Carroll or a Drogba...  :roll:
      Different players have different qualities, and Firmino is one of the most rounded forwards you will see.

      Quote
      Also, why are you so obsessed with bringing fixed positions up? No one has mentioned it but you, and if you actually go watch other games with strikers in their team, you will see they can be fluid. You make it sound like every striker is a Benteke, seriously
      .
      You're the one who keeps banging on about a "traditional 9".
      Was that from Andy f**king Townsend, the arch gimp who just spouts cliches?
      Because that's all you're doing, just repeating pundits because you know f**k all.

      Quote
      I swear, I seen the same sh*t about a DM and how Klopp wouldn't go for one.....
      Fabinho is not a DM, he is by turns, our deepest midfielder, a spare cb, an "8" and cover for fullback.

      Quote
      Wtf? Klopp has disrupted the normal system already. Have you not seen us play? Is it so difficult to understand or see that we have at times, played differently to how we normally have under Klopp? Perhaps I should find P.Neville's analysis for him to school you?
      Horses for courses doesn't change the basic system that has clocked up 91 points so far, got us to the CL semi, and already equalled last seasons league goals tally, with 2 games left.
      Wanting to change all that because some gobs***e pundit thinks we need "a traditional 9" is the ramblings of an empty mind, dependent on others to do your thinking for you.

      Quote
      Just fface it, some players don't have similar levels of ability. Kante and Hendo doesn't have the same as Verratti, Arthur or Pjanic, nor does Lukaku has similar abilities to Rashford etc etc. And by not having similar levels of ability and physicality, they form a different way of playing, and playing to their strengths rather than their weaknesses.

      Ask any pro athlete, and they'll tell you that the single biggest difference between  the elite is in the brain.
      Players have different physical attributes; if Messi was built like Crouch, he wouldn't be able to do half the things he does, even with his speed of thought and ability to remain calm in any situation.

      The fact is that yet again, you haven't got a f**king clue, and have jumped on this "traditional 9" bandwagon because some pundit said it and you thought it sounded clever.

      Try to actually understand what Klopp is saying;
      Quote
      “We needed this kind of player, an offensive player who is quite good in defending as well, because we cannot ignore the quality of Barcelona obviously. But we needed a player between the lines who is good enough to keep the ball and pass the ball.

      I know for people outside it’s easy to say, ‘[You need] another striker’ or whatever. There are different jobs to do on the pitch. Gini did really well.

      “In a game like this, in a really small space, in a completely new position for him – he played it in Holland and he played offensive wing at Newcastle, so he knew about it – he is the player to do it.

      “As a football player you have to be educated in a lot of things and he has this education. So it helped, it was really good.”

      So you can take notice of the pundits who don't have the knowledge or the balls to actually go into management, or you can listen to the bloke who has got us a record points tally, more league goals than last season (in all likelihood) and is widely regarded as one of the best managers in the world, and try to understand why he does what he does.
      PurpleMonkey
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2122: May 03, 2019 07:05:25 pm
      :laugh: Listen to yourself.
      Just because that's where you get your "opinions" from, you think they are the fount of all knowledge.
      Most pundits talk utter sh*te, and only have the job because they're in the lads club.
      Take wednesday, were they even watching the same match?
      All they did was bang on about Barca, and you know why? Because they lack the intelligence to understand what they are seeing, and are not in management for the same reason.

      Pundits do talk utter sh*t, but sometimes sense, just like managers , fans ( Klopp, Rafa, Rodgers etc) and players. But when you give people sh*t for questioning Klopp because they don't have the same info and experience, maybe you should shut the f**k up and stop critising pundits(or anything where you hold less info/experience) because you don't have the same info and experience, right?

      Different players have different qualities, and Firmino is one of the most rounded forwards you will see.

      My point was that you think every player at the highest level has similar ability, therefore, Firmino the most rounded forwards can play as a poacher if needs be according to you.

      Fabinho is not a DM, he is by turns, our deepest midfielder, a spare cb, an "8" and cover for fullback.

      Fabinho is a DM and playing more or less a DM role for us, just like Hendo did in which you said he has been playing the DM role when people called him out for his lack of support to our attacking players, so what has changed for you not to think Fabinho is playing a DM role? Or do you simply not see him as a DM player, but more a utility player? If so, being 5th choice CB and 4th(?) choice RB doesn't neglect the fact that he is best played in the 6 role as a DM which is considered his speciality... by pretty much everyone except you.

      Horses for courses doesn't change the basic system that has clocked up 91 points so far, got us to the CL semi, and already equalled last seasons league goals tally, with 2 games left.
      Wanting to change all that because some gobs***e pundit thinks we need "a traditional 9" is the ramblings of an empty mind, dependent on others to do your thinking for you.

      Seriously, which gobs***e pundit is saying this? Please link me because I haven't seen any saying we should go for a 9. The irony of it all, It is you who is wasting your time watching these pundits you hate so much.

      Ask any pro athlete, and they'll tell you that the single biggest difference between  the elite is in the brain.
      Players have different physical attributes; if Messi was built like Crouch, he wouldn't be able to do half the things he does, even with his speed of thought and ability to remain calm in any situation.

      I am not talking about the brain, and Balotelli is a fine example, but I don't know wtf you even bring that up? You just can't seem to accept that players have different levels of ability, some similar , some not. Look at your Kante and Masch, similar size to your Pjanic, Verratti and Arthur, all with that elite brain, yet they don't play like them. Maybe ask yourself why? Or do you think they can if asked to? ;)

      Try to actually understand what Klopp is saying;

      Quote from: Klopp
      “We needed this kind of player, an offensive player who is quite good in defending as well, because we cannot ignore the quality of Barcelona obviously. But we needed a player between the lines who is good enough to keep the ball and pass the ball.

      “I know for people outside it’s easy to say, ‘[You need] another striker’ or whatever. There are different jobs to do on the pitch. Gini did really well.

      “In a game like this, in a really small space, in a completely new position for him – he played it in Holland and he played offensive wing at Newcastle, so he knew about it – he is the player to do it.

      “As a football player you have to be educated in a lot of things and he has this education. So it helped, it was really good.”

      I understand what he is saying about the Barca match, and I was for Wijnaldum as the false 9 vs Barca. We created enough chances to win the game, my wanting a striker has nothing to do with the tactics we started with, but when you are behind, when you are  looking to score a goal, when Firmino isn't working as the false 9, this is where your alternative can come in and bring in something different, a player more clinical in and around the box. And I bet my life, if Klopp had Aguero or a peak Sturridge, he'd be playing one of them instead of Wijnaldum.

      Klopp has used Salah as the 9, he has used a 9 at Dortmund. Klopp has shown it can work.. FACT.
      fields of anny rd
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2123: May 03, 2019 10:51:39 pm
      A lot of muddying the waters going on. We dont need a 9, but if we had one that wouldn't be the worst thing in the world.

      Preferably we would look at bringing in a player who like the current front 3 can play to a high standard anywhere along that front line.

      But at this stage it would be nice if we could turn to somebody who is a level above the backup we have now.

      I wouldn't advocate blowing the whole budget on that position but I trust in Klopp and his team to find that player who will allow us rest and rotate the front 3 more and then also be able to play 4 or 5 in a row if injury occurs for less than 40 million.
      Scottbot
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      Re: Roberto Firmino Player Thread
      Reply #2124: May 04, 2019 07:34:36 am
      A lot of muddying the waters going on. We dont need a 9, but if we had one that wouldn't be the worst thing in the world.

      Preferably we would look at bringing in a player who like the current front 3 can play to a high standard anywhere along that front line.

      But at this stage it would be nice if we could turn to somebody who is a level above the backup we have now.

      I wouldn't advocate blowing the whole budget on that position but I trust in Klopp and his team to find that player who will allow us rest and rotate the front 3 more and then also be able to play 4 or 5 in a row if injury occurs for less than 40 million.

      Been thinking the same for a couple of years mate. Never understood why we didn’t buy Aubsmeyang 18 months ago because he would have been perfect. We deffo need a player who can plug into either of those front three positions. Also I think they are very high in Brewster so fingers crossed he can stay fit.

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