Jürgen Klopp - Liverpool FC Manager

The criticism of Klopp stems in a large from him taking any average team and performing way above average with them, supporters are frustrated because they know that for want of a player or two that we could be up there fighting things out season after season...He is clearly a great manager but also a victim of his own success, who If back by FSG could see us winning the Title with in a season or two

Thats bollxxcks im afraid regardless of the squad size it wasnt working and he had two players sat on the bench who needed to be introduced quicker. If the manager or fans cant see that then we are struggling. He changed it at HT against Stoke but today Im sorry we have missed a trick

Nah he went for the win, his substations were positive and attacking, you'd maybe have a point if he shored up the defence/midfield but he brought on two attack minded midfielders and a striker..

His substitutions weren't all positive. Lallana and Sturridge were obvious, so it was hardly an act of tactical genius, and he should have moved Milner into midfield to replace Wijnaldum and brought Moreno on rather than Gruic. At least then we'd have had some width and pace. He was also late making the changes and not for the first time this season. I wouldn't blame him solely for the draw but he does have to take part responsibility.

It's evident that Klopp has done 'a Rodgers'.

He's got a player who's head and shoulders above anything else in Sturridge, yet refuses to use him. At least with Rodgers he had substandard players mostly foisted upon him. Klopp doesn't have that luxury of an excuse. He's got a quality player he refuses to use to the detriment of the team and it looks as though more than anything it's a bit of a power player by Jürgen.

The team has been crying out for a spark in attack, what with the hapless Origi and ineffective Firmino being given ample time to show how ordinarily inconsistent they both are. Yet, Klopp refuses to use our best striker when we're desperate for something different.

Klopp should be emailing Wenger right now thanking him for the 'get out of jail free card' the Frenchman handed him, because Klopp hasn't shown any adaptability recently and it's cost us to the extent we're moaning at Palace for losing to Citeh and berating Fat Sam, and cheering for L'Arse to do us favours because our own manager and team can't get the job done properly.

Problem is 4th puts us in a playoff and depending on our coefficient, we could have to play a tough team to get in (Sevilla or Dortmund for example). That's how I understand it. So yea, we make CL and could never even make group play, again I could be mistaken, but I believe that's how it could shake out. We really needed to shoot for and finish in 3rd.

Well if we can't even make it to the group stages then we probably should't be there..either way we probably win away next week and then he can just go all out against Boro...wouldn't surprise me in the least if we pull 6 pts to end the season

Nah he went for the win, his substations were positive and attacking, you'd maybe have a point if he shored up the defence/midfield but he brought on two attack minded midfielders and a striker..

Don't know Daz, he brought them on awfully late and to be fair that was pretty much all he had on the bench anyway....either way I'm confident we are in going in the CL and will pull at least 4-6 in our next 2.

Well if we can't even make it to the group stages then we probably should't be there..either way we probably win away next week and then he can just go all out against Boro...wouldn't surprise me in the least if we pull 6 pts to end the season

6 more points may not be enough, but 9 would have been.

Wow, can't believe the "I know better than Klopp" crowd on here. You should all apply to be his assistant and show him how to manage, better still why didn't any of you apply for the top job once Brendan was sacked.

I did.

In doing so, I gave it to them in no uncertain terms that I wanted full control of transfers; and that austerity to transfer budget cuts would have to be confined to the dustbin.

I never got a reply.

He seemed to spend the whole afternoon remonstrating with the 4th official. What positive does he seek to gain from that? If I were that 4th official yesterday I've have told him where to go.
Our lack of width is painful. We had x2 wide attackers in Coutinho and Firmino who both want to cut it and play centrally as well as a right footed left back. Even if they don't play as wingers those 2 in the 'wide' attacking positions need to be told to just stand on the by-line sometimes and stretch the play a bit. I still find it baffling we didn't address this in Jan knowing Mane was on his travels.
It's getting to a stage with Jürgen where I don't have a clue why he can't see the glaringly obvious. People used to accuse BR of being stubborn when BR was always trying out new shapes and formations this guy Klopp is mind-numbingly rigid and unimaginative at times. You see him in dialogue with his coaches yesterday you wonder what on earth they discuss. The weather? What they're having for dinner?
So fed up of this sh*t we've been watching since Jan. We should not be as wholely dependent on Mane as we appear to be as the performances without him all season long have been hopeless. I'd go as far to say we depend more on Mane than we did on Suarez simply because in a squad of 25 or whatever it is he's the only attacker giving you width whilst we break even in the transfer market. We're a joke

6 more points may not be enough, but 9 would have been.

6 more points and Arsenal can't overtake us.

6 more points and Arsenal can't overtake us.

Quite simple this maths business mate

His substitutions weren't all positive. Lallana and Sturridge were obvious, so it was hardly an act of tactical genius, and he should have moved Milner into midfield to replace Wijnaldum and brought Moreno on rather than Gruic. At least then we'd have had some width and pace. He was also late making the changes and not for the first time this season. I wouldn't blame him solely for the draw but he does have to take part responsibility.

The fact that he plays a midfielder as a left back shows he has no trust in Moreno, Grujic came on and almost got us 3 points.

We don't know what medical advice Klopp is getting in regards to Sturridge and Lallana the latter who probably played more minutes than advised against Watford when returning from injury...

It's evident that Klopp has done 'a Rodgers'.

He's got a player who's head and shoulders above anything else in Sturridge, yet refuses to use him. At least with Rodgers he had substandard players mostly foisted upon him. Klopp doesn't have that luxury of an excuse. He's got a quality player he refuses to use to the detriment of the team and it looks as though more than anything it's a bit of a power player by Jürgen.

The team has been crying out for a spark in attack, what with the hapless Origi and ineffective Firmino being given ample time to show how ordinarily inconsistent they both are. Yet, Klopp refuses to use our best striker when we're desperate for something different.

Klopp should be emailing Wenger right now thanking him for the 'get out of jail free card' the Frenchman handed him, because Klopp hasn't shown any adaptability recently and it's cost us to the extent we're moaning at Palace for losing to Citeh and berating Fat Sam, and cheering for L'Arse to do us favours because our own manager and team can't get the job done properly.

TBH , i'm really worried about next season and i'm struggling to see what is Jurgens plan . He's proving himself to be inflexible and have poor game management.

Also it's looking pretty certain that Henderson , Can , Gini , Lovren , Clyne , Mignolet , Firminho , Origi   are more or less going to be starters next season  and that will just create more of the same problems , poor quality and inconsistency.

If we do get in the CL i think it could be a pretty painful experience and not one to kick us on. Jürgen , you need to get f***in ruthless because 75 % of your team are not up to it and some of your team selections and tactics are not up to it either.  That team you picked yesterday cannot start against West Ham , you're giving these players far too much rope to hang us with.

TBH , i'm really worried about next season and i'm struggling to see what is Jurgens plan . He's proving himself to be inflexible and have poor game management.

Also it's looking pretty certain that Henderson , Can , Gini , Lovren , Clyne , Mignolet , Firminho , Origi   are more or less going to be starters next season  and that will just create more of the same problems , poor quality and inconsistency.

If we do get in the CL i think it could be a pretty painful experience and not one to kick us on. Jürgen , you need to get f***in ruthless because 75 % of your team are not up to it and some of your team selections and tactics are not up to it either.  That team you picked yesterday cannot start against West Ham , you're giving these players far too much rope to hang us with.

@bold

Hard to argue with that.

@bold

Hard to argue with that.

Yep. Can't deny he is currently very predictable.

Thats bollxxcks

  succinct and straight to the point, Love it rossy

Thats bollxxcks im afraid regardless of the squad size it wasnt working and he had two players sat on the bench who needed to be introduced quicker. If the manager or fans cant see that then we are struggling. He changed it at HT against Stoke but today Im sorry we have missed a trick

Yeah I see the point you are making, but it has little to do with squad size, and more to do with squad quality... Teams Like City,Chelsea, Utd, and to and extent Arsenal and Spur have players on thier bench who are game changers. We lack that quality, yeah maybe a fit firing on all cylinder Daniel Sturrigde can be regarded as a game changer but City,Chelsea,Utd, have them in all areas of the pitch...

If the manager ask a team to play differently in the second half, he has got to give it time to see how those tactics pan out, and then decide how he will tweak them and in what areas they need tweaking and what players he has on the bench to best achieve that...there has been at least a couple of game were we have struggle in the first half and Klopp has given them a talking to at half time and we have stepped up the level of our performance in the second half... It's not always about changing players, but it really does help to have real game changers on the bench

I think after the missed pen Jürgen was looking more to keeping the one point and is shooting for 74 as a season total which will put us in.

Oh I believe he went for the win but I also believe he should have gone for it sooner saying that we were two brilliant saves away form three points then all of this would be irrelevant,  still one of the poorest games ive witnessed largely in part to Southampton who were a disgrace to their travelling fans .

Sadly Klopp has caught the same disease as Mournino down the road, i.e. do not lose.

We are set up to not lose rather than win. All the players are on the edge. We should have blitz then yesterday in the beginning and see how we go. We could have given them the ball to see what they do and then pounce on them but nothing. We kept passing it sideways.

Klopp has to know that doing the same thing with the same people will give you the same result. Do something different. Play different team, try different players (e.g. TAA instead of Clyne or Grujic instead of Wini). My concern with Klopp is that there is *no* in game changes that I see from him. Yesterday, he should have brought on Lallana/Sturridge at half time. Sub Clyne for TAA.

If the manager ask a team to play differently in the second half, he has got to give it time to see how those tactics pan out, and then decide how he will tweak them and in what areas they need tweaking and what players he has on the bench to best achieve that...there has been at least a couple of game were we have struggle in the first half and Klopp has given them a talking to at half time and we have stepped up the level of our performance in the second half... It's not always about changing players, but it really does help to have real game changers on the bench

The first debatable point here is though, should the team have actually STARTED the way it did? (Formation/players/tempo)

I don't think so. But it did.

This gave us the opportunity to watch paint dry for 45 minutes. The positive was, we didn't concede a sloppy one.

You're right though, I used to notice how we came out in the second half totally different with the same players. Klopp had done his job well at HT I used to think - he did. This effect is no more and I haven't seen it for a while TBH. We came out pretty much the same way as we started the game - pedestrian and predictable.

10 minutes he should have given them to prove their worth, not 25 minutes. His decision making was as slow and lethargic as our game plan. It clearly wasn't working. However, we were given a pen and all bets changed at this point. It really did look like it was going to be the only way we were going to score - except that c**t lurch saved Milner's pen. You could say, Klopp's patients with the lads had almost, almost paid off. It wasn't to be though and IIRC that's when the scramble to get the sub's on happened.

In one respect, he was unlucky. On the other, he wasn't proactive enough beforehand anyway and usually isn't when a game needs changing IMO. He likes to stick with the dice he's rolled. And he usually has to stick with the dice because he's got a Kindergarten bench, of his own making to choose from. Yesterday though, he had two (fit) quality players in Lallana and Sturridge to use, used too late though IMO.

Problem is, we can all see how hopeless Origi is, and we all know how ineffective Firmino can be, as he was again yesterday. Why the f**k hasn't he used Sturridge more? Why didn't he start with Sturridge and at least give him 60 minutes. We hadn't up until yesterday scored a single goal against Southampton this season in 3 attempts. IIRC Sturridge actually figured in one of those down at the Dell. That said, The Blind Society even can see that Sturridge poses way more threat than Origi in front of goal. But Klopp refuses to use him, arguably to the detriment of the team.

Even if you consider the point that he clearly is too stubborn to use our best attacker, then there were other things he could have done.

- He could have ordered the tempo be upped. This would have been his best move. One touch passing, zipping it from side to side, shifting their defense for the chance of an opening. It was too easy for their defence to handle. They were comfortable doing it, and the reason you zip the ball about and add tempo to your play is to also physically and mentally tire your opponents. But Southampton, like so many of our opponents this season could have carried on doing that for another four hours and we still wouldn't have scored. We resulted in taking pot shots.

- He could have tried switching our fullbacks where Milner would offer way more quality in threat down the right hand-side than Clyne could. That could have made a big difference.

- He could have dragged Firmino or Origi out wider instead of playing so narrow to offer more width to stretch the them.

- He could have dropped some creativity back into midfield with Coutinho (widening the midfield), and played two up top.

He barely did anything though. If he did do something "tactically" at HT it wasn't noticeable.

So, while your defence of him yesterday is admirable, it's pretty misguided IMO. Klopp as much as the players must bare the brunt for that.

It certainly looks as though our motto is: If Plan A isn't working, carry on trying Plan A

It's evident that Klopp has done 'a Rodgers'.

He's got a player who's head and shoulders above anything else in Sturridge, yet refuses to use him. At least with Rodgers he had substandard players mostly foisted upon him. Klopp doesn't have that luxury of an excuse. He's got a quality player he refuses to use to the detriment of the team and it looks as though more than anything it's a bit of a power player by Jürgen.

The team has been crying out for a spark in attack, what with the hapless Origi and ineffective Firmino being given ample time to show how ordinarily inconsistent they both are. Yet, Klopp refuses to use our best striker when we're desperate for something different.

Klopp should be emailing Wenger right now thanking him for the 'get out of jail free card' the Frenchman handed him, because Klopp hasn't shown any adaptability recently and it's cost us to the extent we're moaning at Palace for losing to Citeh and berating Fat Sam, and cheering for L'Arse to do us favours because our own manager and team can't get the job done properly.

^This.

Waited too long to bring on Lallana and Sturridge. Lallana should have come on at HT and Studge not long after that.

Most agree on this, but I suspect with Lallana getting so much game time in previous week they were being cautious with his game time.

Studger should have started IMO, Origi struggled past few games, and for me makes more of an impact from the bench than studger.

The first debatable point here is though, should the team have actually STARTED the way it did? (Formation/players/tempo)

I don't think so. But it did.

This gave us the opportunity to watch paint dry for 45 minutes. The positive was, we didn't concede a sloppy one.

You're right though, I used to notice how we came out in the second half totally different with the same players. Klopp had done his job well at HT I used to think - he did. This effect is no more and I haven't seen it for a while TBH. We came out pretty much the same way as we started the game - pedestrian and predictable.

10 minutes he should have given them to prove their worth, not 25 minutes. His decision making was as slow and lethargic as our game plan. It clearly wasn't working. However, we were given a pen and all bets changed at this point. It really did look like it was going to be the only way we were going to score - except that c**t lurch saved Milner's pen. You could say, Klopp's patients with the lads had almost, almost paid off. It wasn't to be though and IIRC that's when the scramble to get the sub's on happened.

In one respect, he was unlucky. On the other, he wasn't proactive enough beforehand anyway and usually isn't when a game needs changing IMO. He likes to stick with the dice he's rolled. And he usually has to stick with the dice because he's got a Kindergarten bench, of his own making to choose from. Yesterday though, he had two (fit) quality players in Lallana and Sturridge to use, used too late though IMO.

Problem is, we can all see how hopeless Origi is, and we all know how ineffective Firmino can be, as he was again yesterday. Why the f**k hasn't he used Sturridge more? Why didn't he start with Sturridge and at least give him 60 minutes. We hadn't up until yesterday scored a single goal against Southampton this season in 3 attempts. IIRC Sturridge actually figured in one of those down at the Dell. That said, The Blind Society even can see that Sturridge poses way more threat than Origi in front of goal. But Klopp refuses to use him, arguably to the detriment of the team.

Even if you consider the point that he clearly is too stubborn to use our best attacker, then there were other things he could have done.

- He could have ordered the tempo be upped. This would have been his best move. One touch passing, zipping it from side to side, shifting their defense for the chance of an opening. It was too easy for their defence to handle. They were comfortable doing it, and the reason you zip the ball about and add tempo to your play is to also physically and mentally tire your opponents. But Southampton, like so many of our opponents this season could have carried on doing that for another four hours and we still wouldn't have scored. We resulted in taking pot shots.

- He could have tried switching our fullbacks where Milner would offer way more quality in threat down the right hand-side than Clyne could. That could have made a big difference.

- He could have dragged Firmino or Origi out wider instead of playing so narrow to offer more width to stretch the them.

- He could have dropped some creativity back into midfield with Coutinho (widening the midfield), and played two up top.

He barely did anything though. If he did do something "tactically" at HT it wasn't noticeable.

So, while your defence of him yesterday is admirable, it's pretty misguided IMO. Klopp as much as the players must bare the brunt for that.

It certainly looks as though our motto is: If Plan A isn't working, carry on trying Plan A

There is so many things he could have done (You eluded to a few) I personally would have moved Origi out to the right and played Bobby through the middle... think the thing with Sturridge is that he (a) lack match fitness and sharpness (b) lacks the physicality of Origi... Having said that you need to play competitively to gain that sharpness and fitness, and you don't have to be physical to beat players...Klopp can be very ridged in his thinking...

Remember when i use to play American Football back in Reading, (We were being coach by and played with a Americans from The Greenham Common Airbase) remember saying to one of them after a serious rant by Dave (his face would turn deep red) "Why does Dave get so mad...?" To which Mike replied " He is frustrated, he is asking you to do the times that his eight year old does without think, and he can understand why all of you find it so hard to do"...Maybe Klopp can understand why the team can not play the way he wants them to, and it slows his ability to react, and not make the changes he should when he should... 

just saying It is a possibility

succinct and straight to the point, Love it rossy

Yeah I see the point you are making, but it has little to do with squad size, and more to do with squad quality... Teams Like City,Chelsea, Utd, and to and extent Arsenal and Spur have players on thier bench who are game changers. We lack that quality, yeah maybe a fit firing on all cylinder Daniel Sturrigde can be regarded as a game changer but City,Chelsea,Utd, have them in all areas of the pitch...

If the manager ask a team to play differently in the second half, he has got to give it time to see how those tactics pan out, and then decide how he will tweak them and in what areas they need tweaking and what players he has on the bench to best achieve that...there has been at least a couple of game were we have struggle in the first half and Klopp has given them a talking to at half time and we have stepped up the level of our performance in the second half... It's not always about changing players, but it really does help to have real game changers on the bench

Ha Ha sorry about my outburst a little too much to drink . I get your point just think he left it to late and its not the first time. Not many options I agree but pretty sure Origi wont start and Firmino pushed central

Lets be honest here, the quality/fitness of our depth meant there wasn't a lot Klopp could really do, had he shuffled his pack & lost he'd have been really under scrutiny, a case of damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.

Stats wise we hammered Southampton, but it wasn't a case of we had them pegged back, that was their tactics, 2 banks of four on the 18 yard line and let us have the ball in front of that, they rarely ventured over the half way line until around 70 minutes and the introduction of long.

They done a containment job on us, much like we used to see from Rafa away in Europe, that was it, don't think any one was particularly at fault, when teams set up like that, you have to take one of the minimal chances you get, we simply didn't.