Jürgen Klopp - Liverpool FC Manager

Different manager, same owners, same issues.

My main gripe here though is a truly great manager would get better out of whsts at his disposal. So leave aside any off field issues and ask why a supposed top top manager who was a defender in his own playing days just can not coach his players to be better. Why can he not change tactics or formations. Its the same thing all the time. Thats my concern. Hes either not seeing what we are, is seeing but doesnt know how to fix it or sees it knows how to fix  it but wont because ifs admitting his first way was wrong. Any of those options are a weakness.

The board dont prevent him coaching they dont prevent him trying new tactics or systems and they dont stop him dropping players and giving others an opportunity

Did we have the money though ??
How can we truly know that there was a 200mil war chest ?? All we have as proof are melissa rady or whatever her name is and the rest of the club ass kissers spouting about this war chest and Klopp saying that he is happy with the transfer window.

It wasn't just Melissa, it was all Journalists on the local patch. Even Klopp has made it abundantly clear it wasn't an issue of money. People need to stop making excuses. The problems we have are prevalent throughout the entire club, from top to bottom, from owners to players, from recruitment team, to successive managers, all of them are equally culpable for the decline of our once great club.

When almost everyone on here was screaming for Brendan Rodgers' head, I said at the time that changing managers without a total restructuring of the club would achieve nothing. I said that we needed to get better at transfers. Well here we are two years later and facing another struggling season on the back of more transfer mistakes during the Summer. The owners are culpable only so far, others, inlcuding Klopp, need to shoulder their fair share of blame for our problems. As I have said in this thread, as I said at the time, our problems are systemic so our solutions need to be as well.

Different manager, same owners, same issues.

Same goalkeeper

My main gripe here though is a truly great manager would get better out of whsts at his disposal. So leave aside any off field issues and ask why a supposed top top manager who was a defender in his own playing days just can not coach his players to be better. Why can he not change tactics or formations. Its the same thing all the time. Thats my concern. Hes either not seeing what we are, is seeing but doesnt know how to fix it or sees it knows how to fix  it but wont because ifs admitting his first way was wrong. Any of those options are a weakness.

The board dont prevent him coaching they dont prevent him trying new tactics or systems and they dont stop him dropping players and giving others an opportunity

Appreciate what you're saying Bri but those defenders were in place when Klopp arrived, to be brutal you can't polish a turd.

Appreciate what you're saying Bri but those defenders were in place when Klopp arrived, to be brutal you can't polish a turd.

One of the issues is he thinks he can.

I wouldn't.pay 70 quid for a defender either,  seriously why go to all that effort for. VvD if we weren't serious, another myth tha has been left to fester

What effort? Klopp spoke to him, but NO bid was ever made! Therefore no effort was made to sign him!

https://www.thisisanfield.com/2017/10/video-Jürgen-klopp-post-match-press-conference-tottenham-4-1-liverpool/

Advise anyone who is fuming to listen to this when they're calm.

Crystal clear in the moment where he says "you were right, we were wrong" that he has given up on a couple of players in my opinion. Also at the end where he says "it's an open race", that to me is about as clear a sign as "you're not good enough" as any of these players will ever get.

Time to be ruthless with some of them Jürgen, only problem is to truly overhaul some of these I don't think we'll be able to do it until next summer and patience for that, around here, so no doubt throughout plenty of the fan base is probably going to be running very thin by then.

Klop time to address it ?

Mate, this is the same issue 4 windows ago which he has not addressed one bit

I'm talking the result, not the personnel as he can't address that issue until January at the earliest.

It was a bad day at the office, its how Klopp and the players react to it that will define his/their future at the club.

https://www.thisisanfield.com/2017/10/video-Jürgen-klopp-post-match-press-conference-tottenham-4-1-liverpool/

Advise anyone who is fuming to listen to this when they're calm.

Crystal clear in the moment where he says "you were right, we were wrong" that he has given up on a couple of players in my opinion. Also at the end where he says "it's an open race", that to me is about as clear a sign as "you're not good enough" as any of these players will ever get.

Time to be ruthless with some of them Jürgen, only problem is to truly overhaul some of these I don't think we'll be able to do it until next summer and patience for that, around here, so no doubt throughout plenty of the fan base is probably going to be running very thin by then.

Can't say I read like you did Luke

All I heard was 'I don't want to blame individual players' and 'We can fix it.' Did not get any indication big changes are due at Anfield.

Feel for the guy though. Today it was as if reality hit home and hit hard. If today doesn't get Klopp to make changes, I'm not sure what will.

If it were me, Migs and Lovren would never (and I mean never) play for us again. Enough is enough and all that. If Gomez cannot do a better job than Lovren at CB, then I don't know why we keep paying his wages.

Gomez and Matip at CB as a start. After that, we better spend a shedload of money in January or we won’t have a shot in hell of making top 4. This season is already on the brink and it’s not even November. Forget about Lallana and Mane coming back, our problems have always been and are still defensive.

All I heard was 'I don't want to blame individual players' and 'We can fix it.'

Well he said that ... but then he also mentioned Dejan by name a good few times.
Also said if he'd be on the pitch they wouldn't have scored their 1st ... maybe he'll pull on a jersey for the next game

Sack Klopp and bring in Rafa?

Rafa has moved on & we should too, I love the man but I don't think he would entertain managing us again with the current owners & set up..

This is the part in our relationship with Klopp where we ride out the storm together..

Yes. This. All day long.

Sack Klopp and bring in Rafa?

Rafa has moved on & we should too, I love the man but I don't think he would entertain managing us again with the current owners & set up..

This is the part in our relationship with Klopp where we ride out the storm together..

I should hope no one on here is one of those morons on Twitter calling for Klopp's head. I guarantee sacking him would not solve our problems, only exacerbate them.

Nothing certain in VVD being allowed leave jn Jan and then joining us.

I also think no 1 man in the world will solve our problems

fu**ed if he doesn't wanna join us because it's him or bust

Nothing certain in VVD being allowed leave jn Jan and then joining us.

I also think no 1 man in the world will solve our problems

See that’s the bit I struggle with Brian.

No one man will solve our problems.......but one new manager will(?!).......and the cycle perpetuates.

Klopp isn’t THE problem.

Can't say I read like you did Luke

All I heard was 'I don't want to blame individual players' and 'We can fix it.' Did not get any indication big changes are due at Anfield.

Feel for the guy though. Today it was as if reality hit home and hit hard. If today doesn't get Klopp to make changes, I'm not sure what will.

If it were me, Migs and Lovren would never (and I mean never) play for us again. Enough is enough and all that. If Gomez cannot do a better job than Lovren at CB, then I don't know why we keep paying his wages.

Fair enough mate, on the quotes I mentioned there was a look of acceptance to me. A resignation that he's tried to deflect and absorb for his players for long enough, a "time to face the facts" moment in my opinion.

I heard all the rest, but the delivery of these two phrases was with a much more pronounced emphasis, not just that he wanted to make a point, he wanted to make it very clearly and those points to be heard.

Firstly, it was to the defenders, you've been told you were sh*te all season, I've defended you to the hilt, today you gave me nothing to defend you with. Not one moment to cling to, not one thing where I dare suggest it was even luck, you were sh*te!

Secondly the gauntlet was thrown down to the entire squad, this week is a long week of training, time to win your place in the team because not one of you earned the right to be given that position. I, 100%, have no doubt today was a watershed for Jürgen and some of these players, points of no return have without doubt been reached.

Fair enough mate, on the quotes I mentioned there was a look of acceptance to me. A resignation that he's tried to deflect and absorb for his players for long enough, a "time to face the facts" moment in my opinion.

I heard all the rest, but the delivery of these two phrases was with a much more pronounced emphasis, not just that he wanted to make a point, he wanted to make it very clearly and those points to be heard.

Firstly, it was to the defenders, you've been told you were sh*te all season, I've defended you to the hilt, today you gave me nothing to defend you with. Not one moment to cling to, not one thing where I dare suggest it was even luck, you were sh*te!

Secondly the gauntlet was thrown down to the entire squad, this week is a long week of training, time to win your place in the team because not one of you earned the right to be given that position. I, 100%, have no doubt today was a watershed for Jürgen and some of these players, points of no return have without doubt been reached.

Klopp gave the contracts to Mignolet and Lovren. We can wrap it up any way we choose but the blame lays solely at the gaffers door for persevering with these and other inadequete players for to long

Thank F**k a journalist finally asked Jürgen why he was laughing in defeat. Self deprecating or not I hate it.
As I have said before as well, please Jürgen if we win 3-0 next time out shake the players hands, clap the crowd and get down the tunnel. This bear hug, high 5 routine for doing exactly what we should be doing has worn thin

Klopp gave the contracts to Mignolet and Lovren. We can wrap it up any way we choose but the blame lays solely at the gaffers door for persevering with these and other inadequete players for to long

Without doubt, I'm not sure where you're thinking I'm not including Jürgen in this blame though. He is completely accountable for Mignolet now, I was dumbfounded when he gave him a 5 year contract, thought he was keeping him on as cover for Karius, with that in mind I was 'ok' with it. Not really happy, but as a back-up keeper I could live with Mignolet but as a starter he should never have been bought and every window that passes where he is kept as the starting keeper is a terrible mistake, I can be no clearer with that.

As for Lovren, I think this one is a lot less obvious because I feel that Lovren would look brilliant in training, so on this decision I can understand much more easily. Harder to say after today, but at the start of the season if you'd told me Lovren was the 3rd choice CB I would have been happy enough with that.

What effort? Klopp spoke to him, but NO bid was ever made! Therefore no effort was made to sign him!

So talking to him was just a ruse then? 

Without doubt, I'm not sure where you're thinking I'm not including Jürgen in this blame though. He is completely accountable for Mignolet now, I was dumbfounded when he gave him a 5 year contract, thought he was keeping him on as cover for Karius, with that in mind I was 'ok' with it. Not really happy, but as a back-up keeper I could live with Mignolet but as a starter he should never have been bought and every window that passes where he is kept as the starting keeper is a terrible mistake, I can be no clearer with that.

As for Lovren, I think this one is a lot less obvious because I feel that Lovren would look brilliant in training, so on this decision I can understand much more easily. Harder to say after today, but at the start of the season if you'd told me Lovren was the 3rd choice CB I would have been happy enough with that.

No wasnt argueing your point just adding to  your point. There is a point of no return though and I think both have reached it. That first goal not one but two errors of Judgement from Lovren and then Migolet racing off his line when simply no need just shows to me no matter how you look in training that they simply cannot manage it in a big game .

See that’s the bit I struggle with Brian.

No one man will solve our problems.......but one new manager will(?!).......and the cycle perpetuates.

Klopp isn’t THE problem.

At what point does he become the problem thought? Obviously I blame the guys higher up the ladder, but IF Jürgen doesn't makes the necessary improvements to personnel (which are glaringly obvious) then he must take the flack.

So talking to him was just a ruse then? 

Talking to him was F***ing stupid! Klopp probably wanted him, but the price was too high!