Jürgen Klopp - Liverpool FC Manager

Some players are that good you don't really have to even hope for the best when they sign, you just know they are brilliant players who if they stay fit will massively improve you. If we signed Suarez back for example, Gareth Bale etc you don't have to be a genius to know they'd make our team better. That's why they'd cost the Earth, because you are buying an absolute cast iron certainty.

Now I've read these last few pages over and over, and I can't see anyone saying these blokes we're apparently going to sign are not good players or good value for money. As pretty much none of us have ever seen them play on a consistent basis, it would be a silly thing to say in any case.

Why are we even getting involved (again) in a Rodgers/Jürgen comparison? I've been told on many occasions that I hold a candle for Rodgers, that I can't "let it go", but the very people who say such things seemingly can't resist bringing him into the equation over and over. EVERY manager buys players, EVERY manager buys players who on the face of it look quite good, but the proof of the pudding is whether or not they actually are good. Now given Rodgers got the sack and we brought in Jürgen Klopp, it's in all our best interests to hope that the new manager is better at buying good players than his predecessor was in conjunction with the committee, otherwise it was pointless sacking the fella in the first place. Equally, I would say that the players who by hook or by crook Rodgers and the committee "assembled" (and it did have kind of a pick and mix feel to it) did just reach two finals in one season, and include the likes of Lovren, Sakho, Can, Clyne, Firmino, Sturridge, Coutinho etc so they aren't all duds, it's just that too many others were.

It's great that we're getting our business done early. It's great that the players look cheap. It's great that they look like they might be quite good too. Surely though it's not being "negative" to say you'll wait and see the fellas play before we get the bunting out, particularly as they're hardly household names.

Personally I can't get past the idea that some of the people who are all excited now will be incredibly deflated if Jürgen actually can't overhaul many of the teams who finished above us while spending very little. People talk about Rodgers "spunking" 300 million quid, but he brought in over 150 million quid in player sales, AND slashed the big earners budget. We ended up spending NET I suppose around 150 million quid in four pre-seasons, which compared to some of the teams above us is peanuts. My fear is that Jürgen ends up copping the blame for not managing to achieve what appears to me to be almost the impossible. Unless we PROPERLY compete in both transfer fees AND WAGES then we are going to need a miracle. The league had one of these this season, they don't come along often.


NOTE: This post is not a defence of Rodgers, it's a defence IN ADVANCE of Jürgen. Don't blame him if he can't overhaul Man Utd, Man City, Tottenham, Arsenal etc with bargain bin buys.

   

So we don't have a transfer committee anymore? I'm so confused.

I've not heard that any of them have left mate, in fact I've not heard anything of them full stop.

From the interviews I've read from those players already signed it's been Jürgen who's made the initial phone call to them so I'm guessing when he said he had 1st say as well as final say, that's what's happened.

They probably still crunch the numbers for JH so they can fill in their timesheets, in the meantime the deal's already been agreed and signed 

Actually thinking about it we've signed 3 players since January and I've not heard mention anything about Ayres Harley being seen around Europe.  Wonder if he's been given the push from those duties and the other guy is doing the deals now? 

NOTE: This post is not a defence of Rodgers, it's a defence IN ADVANCE of Jürgen. Don't blame him if he can't overhaul Man Utd, Man City, Tottenham, Arsenal etc with bargain bin buys.

Weird you bring this up as a stick to beat us positives with Mick.

Isn't it you and S@int that are insisting we'll have an amazing season and definitely finish top 4 if not have a Title challenge even before we bought anyone, wheras we're being a bit more cautious but that's used as another stick to beat us with as we're scared to over predict.

And aren't you one of the ones who hates hypocrisy.

If you read what we're actually saying about the signings it isn't that we think they're going to be amazing or that they're cheap but it's the difference in the approach of targetting our weakest areas and getting, what appears to be on paper, (yes I know the game is played on grass) upgrades in those positions.

After all the proof of the pudding is always in the eating - they could be total duds but at least the days of a scatter gun recruitment process seems to be improving. 

Some players are that good you don't really have to even hope for the best when they sign, you just know they are brilliant players who if they stay fit will massively improve you. If we signed Suarez back for example, Gareth Bale etc you don't have to be a genius to know they'd make our team better. That's why they'd cost the Earth, because you are buying an absolute cast iron certainty.

Now I've read these last few pages over and over, and I can't see anyone saying these blokes we're apparently going to sign are not good players or good value for money. As pretty much none of us have ever seen them play on a consistent basis, it would be a silly thing to say in any case.

Why are we even getting involved (again) in a Rodgers/Jürgen comparison? I've been told on many occasions that I hold a candle for Rodgers, that I can't "let it go", but the very people who say such things seemingly can't resist bringing him into the equation over and over. EVERY manager buys players, EVERY manager buys players who on the face of it look quite good, but the proof of the pudding is whether or not they actually are good. Now given Rodgers got the sack and we brought in Jürgen Klopp, it's in all our best interests to hope that the new manager is better at buying good players than his predecessor was in conjunction with the committee, otherwise it was pointless sacking the fella in the first place. Equally, I would say that the players who by hook or by crook Rodgers and the committee "assembled" (and it did have kind of a pick and mix feel to it) did just reach two finals in one season, and include the likes of Lovren, Sakho, Can, Clyne, Firmino, Sturridge, Coutinho etc so they aren't all duds, it's just that too many others were.

It's great that we're getting our business done early. It's great that the players look cheap. It's great that they look like they might be quite good too. Surely though it's not being "negative" to say you'll wait and see the fellas play before we get the bunting out, particularly as they're hardly household names.

Personally I can't get past the idea that some of the people who are all excited now will be incredibly deflated if Jürgen actually can't overhaul many of the teams who finished above us while spending very little. People talk about Rodgers "spunking" 300 million quid, but he brought in over 150 million quid in player sales, AND slashed the big earners budget. We ended up spending NET I suppose around 150 million quid in four pre-seasons, which compared to some of the teams above us is peanuts. My fear is that Jürgen ends up copping the blame for not managing to achieve what appears to me to be almost the impossible. Unless we PROPERLY compete in both transfer fees AND WAGES then we are going to need a miracle. The league had one of these this season, they don't come along often.


NOTE: This post is not a defence of Rodgers, it's a defence IN ADVANCE of Jürgen. Don't blame him if he can't overhaul Man Utd, Man City, Tottenham, Arsenal etc with bargain bin buys.

 

Noble Bigmick but Jürgen should be judged the same as any other Liverpool manager - we cannot just excuse him a lack of success just because he is Jürgen.

He has come with a world class reputation and we should expect to win the league with him. If Nigel Pearson and Claudio Ranieri can overhaul those teams then so can he.

We need to keep reminding ourselves Leicester have just done what we have been trying to do for decades...win the league.
Attitude and a desire and absolute need to win is what we need as well as the quality of player. We did have it and we were successful but we haven't had that real desire to win for a generation . Money has always been the excuse but now we really know we have been buying some lazy b***ard who see Anfield as a destination in their careers and not somewhere to win things.

Weird you bring this up as a stick to beat us positives with Mick.

Isn't it you and S@int that are insisting we'll have an amazing season and definitely finish top 4 if not have a Title challenge even before we bought anyone, wheras we're being a bit more cautious but that's used as another stick to beat us with as we're scared to over predict.

And aren't you one of the ones who hates hypocrisy.

If you read what we're actually saying about the signings it isn't that we think they're going to be amazing or that they're cheap but it's the difference in the approach of targetting our weakest areas and getting, what appears to be on paper, (yes I know the game is played on grass) upgrades in those positions.

After all the proof of the pudding is always in the eating - they could be total duds but at least the days of a scatter gun recruitment process seems to be improving. 

 No Otherwise, in my case your accusation of hypocrisy would very likely be spot on. Just to be absolutely clear, I think (as I've said so a few times now, don't you remember the "build a statue" debate of a few days ago?) that AT BEST IMHO this season we can hope for a top four "challenge". There is the danger that we won't improve much on our league showing of last season, AND IT WON'T BE THE MANAGERS FAULT. Because, if we don't compete properly in terms of transfer fees and wages we are bang up against it.

I am not criticizing Jürgen for the players he is buying. I am not criticizing supporters for getting excited about the players he is buying. I am simply concerned that AS OF YET, we aren't seemingly about to sign players who everyone accepts is a top player (by everyone I mean in World football, not on here).

I do wonder sometimes Debs though if I'm honest where the disconnect comes between what I actually type and what people think I'm saying comes from. Your "isn't it you that's saying we'll have an amazing season?" being a classic example, being that it's actually the opposite of what I've been on about for about six months. I think we had the squad THIS SEASON to have done much better in the league IF WE HADN'T DONE SO WELL IN THE CUPS.

It frustrates people when you put disclaimers in posts, but reading yours makes me think it's probably the only way to avoid confusion.

Noble Bigmick but Jürgen should be judged the same as any other Liverpool manager - we cannot just excuse him a lack of success just because he is Jürgen.

He has come with a world class reputation and we should expect to win the league with him. If Nigel Pearson and Claudio Ranieri can overhaul those teams then so can he.

No, I don't agree with the bit in bold I'm afraid. If we judge all Liverpool managers against the Claudio Ranieri at Leicester this season yardstick we'll be sacking our manager every year. I do though agree with the first part of your post, Jürgen should be judged the same as all other Liverpool managers. In all other cases of Liverpool managers who were CNH (credible Non Hodgson) they got three or four years grace without winning a trophy, then they got the bullet. That applied to Benitez, Rodgers etc. Now Jürgen (I feel at least) deserves IMHO four years minimum to try and win trophies. He may even be entitled to more than that as we are these days significantly outgunned in terms of transfer fees and wages we are prepared to pay.

We need to keep reminding ourselves Leicester have just done what we have been trying to do for decades...win the league.
Attitude and a desire and absolute need to win is what we need as well as the quality of player. We did have it and we were successful but we haven't had that real desire to win for a generation . Money has always been the excuse but now we really know we have been buying some lazy b***ard who see Anfield as a destination in their careers and not somewhere to win things.

Amen, exactly.

We need passion, determination and focused players. They need to feel our passion in their veins.

I've not heard that any of them have left mate, in fact I've not heard anything of them full stop.

From the interviews I've read from those players already signed it's been Jürgen who's made the initial phone call to them so I'm guessing when he said he had 1st say as well as final say, that's what's happened.

They probably still crunch the numbers for JH so they can fill in their timesheets, in the meantime the deal's already been agreed and signed 

Actually thinking about it we've signed 3 players since January and I've not heard mention anything about Ayres Harley being seen around Europe.  Wonder if he's been given the push from those duties and the other guy is doing the deals now? 

I think there is quite a bit of money to spend Deb's; my one and only concern would be that Jürgen is so set in his way of doing things in regards to transfers that he will not go out and sign "big players". It's not the Bundsiliga...its the premier league and the competition and cost of players is quite a bit different to what he has dealt with the past decade.

Let's face it, if Jürgen does not want to spend money JWH would probably give him a contract for life...just hope the gaffer is not so set in his ways he would automatically ignore the opportunity to buy big players...that being said without CL this year your not going to go out and get a huge player despite Jürgen's pull.

No Otherwise, in my case your accusation of hypocrisy would very likely be spot on. Just to be absolutely clear, I think (as I've said so a few times now, don't you remember the "build a statue" debate of a few days ago?) that AT BEST IMHO this season we can hope for a top four "challenge". There is the danger that we won't improve much on our league showing of last season, AND IT WON'T BE THE MANAGERS FAULT. Because, if we don't compete properly in terms of transfer fees and wages we are bang up against it.

I am not criticizing Jürgen for the players he is buying. I am not criticizing supporters for getting excited about the players he is buying. I am simply concerned that AS OF YET, we aren't seemingly about to sign players who everyone accepts is a top player (by everyone I mean in World football, not on here).

I do wonder sometimes Debs though if I'm honest where the disconnect comes between what I actually type and what people think I'm saying comes from. Your "isn't it you that's saying we'll have an amazing season?" being a classic example, being that it's actually the opposite of what I've been on about for about six months. I think we had the squad THIS SEASON to have done much better in the league IF WE HADN'T DONE SO WELL IN THE CUPS.

It frustrates people when you put disclaimers in posts, but reading yours makes me think it's probably the only way to avoid confusion.

Actually Mick it's the disclaimers that make your posts even more confusing.  You're all over the place with some of the stuff you post. 

One minute you're saying we should have done better this season just gone but we could challenge for top 4 next season but we probably won't improve on where we finished last season if we don't buy better players???

As for the players, anyone who's followed Jurgens career knows he doesn't buy the type of players you think he should/hope he will/hasn't done yet and all of us have been saying so since he arrived.  Plenty have been warning of pending disappointment in who he buys because they probably won't know a damn thing, or very little about them, so why would we then complain and blame Jürgen when he does exactly that??

"AND IT WON'T BE THE MANAGERS FAULT. Because, if we don't compete properly in terms of transfer fees and wages we are bang up against it."

 "I am simply concerned that AS OF YET, we aren't seemingly about to sign players who everyone accepts is a top player (by everyone I mean in World football, not on here).

Time alone will tell if he's going about it the right way and bringing in the right players to improve our chances but we've spent a sh*t tonne of money in recent years and got absolutely nowhere so I'm sure as hell not going to blame him for doing what he knows works for him.

I think there is quite a bit of money to spend Deb's; my one and only concern would be that Jürgen is so set in his way of doing things in regards to transfers that he will not go out and sign "big players". It's not the Bundsiliga...its the premier league and the competition and cost of players is quite a bit different to what he has dealt with the past decade.

Let's face it, if Jürgen does not want to spend money JWH would probably give him a contract for life...just hope the gaffer is not so set in his ways he would automatically ignore the opportunity to buy big players...that being said without CL this year your not going to go out and get a huge player despite Jürgen's pull.

I don't think he is or will mate.  We wouldn't have put together a deal for Gotze if he didn't want to spend on both fees and wages and it's looking likely we'd have to spend around £30m for Dahoud which we appear to still be working on.  We were about to spunk over £30 million for Tex in January until his owners started playing silly beggars and upping the price every 5 minutes and Jürgen pulled the plug.

I don't see Jürgen being the type to fanny about, if he wants something and it's doable he'll do it regardless of costs and he's been told that he'll be backed better than any other manager we've had under these lot. 

Personally I think he's tying up our priority positions quickly and moving onto other improvements once they're sorted.  No point going out buying more strikers/attackers leaving us with no CBs, no MFs, a sh*t goalie and an even worse LB. 

That's so last season 

Weird you bring this up as a stick to beat us positives with Mick.

Isn't it you and S@int that are insisting we'll have an amazing season and definitely finish top 4 if not have a Title challenge even before we bought anyone, wheras we're being a bit more cautious but that's used as another stick to beat us with as we're scared to over predict.

And aren't you one of the ones who hates hypocrisy.

If you read what we're actually saying about the signings it isn't that we think they're going to be amazing or that they're cheap but it's the difference in the approach of targetting our weakest areas and getting, what appears to be on paper, (yes I know the game is played on grass) upgrades in those positions.

After all the proof of the pudding is always in the eating - they could be total duds but at least the days of a scatter gun recruitment process seems to be improving. 

Nah Debs, it is me that is expecting a title challenge not Mick. For me being positive about next season is having the hope that we will actually challenge or even win the league, especially if we bring in some top quality players which again I hope and expect us to do.

Maybe if we do bring in some top quality players, more people would be positive about just what we can achieve next season, and less concerned with celebrating just how little we spent.

Personally I couldn't care less how much (or little) we spend as long as by the end of the transfer window we have a squad capable of making that title challenge, but imo I think we need to be bringing in top quality players rather than bargain bin signings if we are to reach that level.

I have no interest in making FSG happy, I would much prefer they are as miserable as they have made me feel over the past few years as we spend the money required, to buy the quality required ,to make the title challenge required to make me happy.

So I am not going to rub my hands with glee because we have found a cheap option, I couldn't care less about price ...just if they are good enough to help change us from also rans to title challengers.     



 

Actually Mick it's the disclaimers that make your posts even more confusing.  You're all over the place with some of the stuff you post.

One minute you're saying we should have done better this season just gone but we could challenge for top 4 next season but we probably won't improve on where we finished last season if we don't buy better players???

Not really Debs to be honest. It's only "all over the place" if you have a pre-conception of what I'm on about before you read it then don't read it properly. For example if you think that I hate Jürgen and am secretly "sharpening a knife" for him then before you read anything you put your own slant on it, I think that's what's happening here. I've spelled out below what I ACTUALLY think, as opposed to what you think I think. I hope it clears it all up for you once and for all.

1. I don't hate Jürgen Klopp. I actually think he is a world class manager who so far has done an excellent job . Any season in which you reach two major cup finals has to be deemed as an excellent effort in my view.

2. I DO think we really could have had a good go at the league this/last season, with the players we already had. . But, I think we fairly obviously gave up on it as a priority once we really got going on the cups. I think it was the right thing to do as well! . That said, I do wish we'd have tried a smidge harder and got into Europe. Had though we been knocked out of the cups early, I am convinced we would have got into the top four AT LEAST. Here though just to be clear I am talking about last season, the one where Leicester won it by ten points or whatever it was. NOT next season. .

3. NEXT SEASON, AS IN THE ONE COMING UP I think we have our work cut out and IMHO a challenge for the top four would represent a good effort. . The reason for that is, I expect all the teams around us to significantly strengthen their teams with proven top quality players. Not only that, but they now have proven top quality managers as well.

4. I am not "blaming" Jürgen for any of the players he has signed. How could I, I haven't previously heard of any of them? I am absolutely sure he knows what he's doing.

5. I am not "warning of pending disappointment" in the players that he's buying either. Neither am I "complaining" about the players he is buying either. Once again, how could I? I've never heard of them.

6. My concern is that as a club, we are looking like (for whatever reason, I don't actually know the reason but can only speculate) missing out on the second of two expensive signings which the manager clearly wanted. He wanted the Texeira fella (I have no idea how good he is, I've never seen him play) but for whatever reason it didn't happen. He wanted Goetze (my suspicion is that he is a good player, I have actually seen him play) but we probably won't get him either. It just worries me that we don't seem to be able to tie up the high profile big money deals as well as we can the cheap ones. It's not Jurgens fault, it has happened numerous times over the last few seasons . Deals for players such as Willian, Mikkiwhatsisface, Diego Costa etc have fallen through for a number of reasons. While I don't know the reasons, I DO know all of those players would have made us into a better football team.

I hope that clears it all up, I don't know much clearer I can be really.

Every single one of us should be optimistic, hopeful and excited right now, we are in the real early stages of a new manager, a new manager liked and for the most part admired in the game.. Approaching his first summer and about to shape the squad his way.

I'm not one for slagging off the previous manager, not my style but I see little point in comparing potential and new players against ones brought in by another manager in another time, there is a body of evidence as to how previous buys have gone and nothing to judge any potential new comings, whether we have heard of them or not or what they cost.. Not many of us knew Sami Hyppia when he signed, nor Luis Garcia, Alvaro Arbeloa... Or at other clubs, can we honestly say that Dele Ali was going to have the kind of impact he has had stepping up from League one? We can all have wanted here but his ease of stepping up? How many had heard of Luka Modric ( seeing as we are being linked to a Croat) or how many knew the impact that Patrick Viera would have signing for a small fee from Milan's ressie's?

We need to wait and see, with a different manager who may well ignite them as those above were.

Of course they may not have that impact but right now? In Klopp's first summer window with all the possibilities that lay ahead? F**k yeah have a little tingle or its gonna be a long summer ahead

Nah Debs, it is me that is expecting a title challenge not Mick. For me being positive about next season is having the hope that we will actually challenge or even win the league, especially if we bring in some top quality players which again I hope and expect us to do.

Maybe if we do bring in some top quality players, more people would be positive about just what we can achieve next season, and less concerned with celebrating just how little we spent.

Personally I couldn't care less how much (or little) we spend as long as by the end of the transfer window we have a squad capable of making that title challenge, but imo I think we need to be bringing in top quality players rather than bargain bin signings if we are to reach that level.

I have no interest in making FSG happy, I would much prefer they are as miserable as they have made me feel over the past few years as we spend the money required, to buy the quality required ,to make the title challenge required to make me happy.

So I am not going to rub my hands with glee because we have found a cheap option, I couldn't care less about price ...just if they are good enough to help change us from also rans to title challengers.     

We all want us to challenge mate, in fact goddammit we all want to win something and bloody soon.

The difference is you and others think he/we can't do it without top quality players whereas we think he/we can do it with the right players, in the right positions, with the right system, with the right attitude, with the same passion as him. 

That's when they become top quality mate, when they've worked for it here, with us, for us, winning us stuff not what they've done previously and don't have to try anymore.

Nah Debs, it is me that is expecting a title challenge not Mick. For me being positive about next season is having the hope that we will actually challenge or even win the league, especially if we bring in some top quality players which again I hope and expect us to do.

Maybe if we do bring in some top quality players, more people would be positive about just what we can achieve next season, and less concerned with celebrating just how little we spent.

Personally I couldn't care less how much (or little) we spend as long as by the end of the transfer window we have a squad capable of making that title challenge, but imo I think we need to be bringing in top quality players rather than bargain bin signings if we are to reach that level.

I have no interest in making FSG happy, I would much prefer they are as miserable as they have made me feel over the past few years as we spend the money required, to buy the quality required ,to make the title challenge required to make me happy.

So I am not going to rub my hands with glee because we have found a cheap option, I couldn't care less about price ...just if they are good enough to help change us from also rans to title challengers.     



 

I find it hard to believe you actually believe anyone is celebrating the price in any way for FSG's benefit?

The only benefit of the prices I'm happy with is that it should, in theory, give Jürgen more ammunition for the positions he's struggling to fill. I would have thought that much was and is obvious and therefore didn't need saying.

It's become a bit sad where the positivity is twisted to suggest you're celebrating FSG's potential gain, or you're compensating for over criticising Brendan due to reasons you never suggested or whatever other reason people seem to love to infer upon you.

I'm positive because:

We've shown massive improvements this season, while being inconsistent, Jürgen has proven he can get tremendous performances out of players I didn't think were capable of them.

He's shown he can get us creating the most chances in the entire league (at one point) with not even close to the best squad in the league.

He's shown he can get us conceding the least amount of shots on target with not even close to the best defence in the league.

He's shown he can take us to a European Final when at the start of the season it looked like we were more likely we'd be battling it out for survival rather than honours.

Along with that he took us within a coin flip of a domestic cup and has shown signs of taking control over the biggest failure at this club which was the bastardised transfer committee. I glean this information from the fact that all the interviews seem to suggest they've had direct dealings with Jürgen, the targets are all from his or his assistants previous base of knowledge and am therefore confident in making that conclusion.

It does get a bit daft that you have to quantify your positivity though rather than it be inferred that you're not any of the above or future dreamed up utterances.

Ok Mick - I only read up to me having preconceptions.  Not worth reading the rest if that's what you think I'm doing mate.

Well I can't think of any other reason you could get what I'm saying so spectacularly wrong Debs? What you are claiming that I'm saying, and what I'm actually saying are at complete opposite ends of the spectrum, it's really weird. It's like you coming on here and saying that I think Benteke is sh!te or something (I know you're not actually saying that, I'm just using it as an example). When someone comes on and says "but you keep saying we'll challenge for the title next season" when in actual fact I'm saying the opposite and have been doing for months, it's a tricky one to debate to be honest.


At least here though you've admitted you haven't read my post, we're at least making progress in that regard. You'll be accusing me of loving Rafa Benitez with all my heart next, it's just really really strange. (I know you won't really, I'm just using it as an example. Kind of irony. Anyway).

Not really Debs to be honest. It's only "all over the place" if you have a pre-conception of what I'm on about before you read it then don't read it properly. For example if you think that I hate Jürgen and am secretly "sharpening a knife" for him then before you read anything you put your own slant on it, I think that's what's happening here. I've spelled out below what I ACTUALLY think, as opposed to what you think I think. I hope it clears it all up for you once and for all.

1. I don't hate Jürgen Klopp. I actually think he is a world class manager who so far has done an excellent job . Any season in which you reach two major cup finals has to be deemed as an excellent effort in my view.

2. I DO think we really could have had a good go at the league this/last season, with the players we already had. . But, I think we fairly obviously gave up on it as a priority once we really got going on the cups. I think it was the right thing to do as well! . That said, I do wish we'd have tried a smidge harder and got into Europe. Had though we been knocked out of the cups early, I am convinced we would have got into the top four AT LEAST. Here though just to be clear I am talking about last season, the one where Leicester won it by ten points or whatever it was. NOT next season. .

3. NEXT SEASON, AS IN THE ONE COMING UP I think we have our work cut out and IMHO a challenge for the top four would represent a good effort. . The reason for that is, I expect all the teams around us to significantly strengthen their teams with proven top quality players. Not only that, but they now have proven top quality managers as well.

4. I am not "blaming" Jürgen for any of the players he has signed. How could I, I haven't previously heard of any of them? I am absolutely sure he knows what he's doing.

5. I am not "warning of pending disappointment" in the players that he's buying either. Neither am I "complaining" about the players he is buying either. Once again, how could I? I've never heard of them.

6. My concern is that as a club, we are looking like (for whatever reason, I don't actually know the reason but can only speculate) missing out on the second of two expensive signings which the manager clearly wanted. He wanted the Texeira fella (I have no idea how good he is, I've never seen him play) but for whatever reason it didn't happen. He wanted Goetze (my suspicion is that he is a good player, I have actually seen him play) but we probably won't get him either. It just worries me that we don't seem to be able to tie up the high profile big money deals as well as we can the cheap ones. It's not Jurgens fault, it has happened numerous times over the last few seasons . Deals for players such as Willian, Mikkiwhatsisface, Diego Costa etc have fallen through for a number of reasons. While I don't know the reasons, I DO know all of those players would have made us into a better football team.

I hope that clears it all up, I don't know much clearer I can be really.

Only read as far as the me having preconceptions Mick, no point reading the rest if that's what you think.

I find it hard to believe you actually believe anyone is celebrating the price in any way for FSG's benefit?

The only benefit of the prices I'm happy with is that it should, in theory, give Jürgen more ammunition for the positions he's struggling to fill. I would have thought that much was and is obvious and therefore didn't need saying.

It's become a bit sad where the positivity is twisted to suggest you're celebrating FSG's potential gain, or you're compensating for over criticising Brendan due to reasons you never suggested or whatever other reason people seem to love to infer upon you.

I'm positive because:

We've shown massive improvements this season, while being inconsistent, Jürgen has proven he can get tremendous performances out of players I didn't think were capable of them.

He's shown he can get us creating the most chances in the entire league (at one point) with not even close to the best squad in the league.

He's shown he can get us conceding the least amount of shots on target with not even close to the best defence in the league.

He's shown he can take us to a European Final when at the start of the season it looked like we were more likely we'd be battling it out for survival rather than honours.

Along with that he took us within a coin flip of a domestic cup and has shown signs of taking control over the biggest failure at this club which was the bastardised transfer committee. I glean this information from the fact that all the interviews seem to suggest they've had direct dealings with Jürgen, the targets are all from his or his assistants previous base of knowledge and am therefore confident in making that conclusion.

It does get a bit daft that you have to quantify your positivity though rather than it be inferred that you're not any of the above or future dreamed up utterances.

Just to be clear Luke on what I'm saying with regards your (good) post before anyone misconstrues/invents a point of view for me.

I've no problem with people feeling positive, good luck to em!

I've no problem with any of the players we're buying, Jürgen knows what he's doing and I hope they turn out to be brilliant.

I think that with a coouple of additions (which we're already making) we'll be a better team next season than we are this.


These though are my concerns/worries.

I think the teams which finished above us will spend shedoads of money in an effort to improve. there is a danger that although we  get better, it's not by enough to catch up.

Some of the teams above us now have World class managers which will also make them improve.

When Jürgen identifies expensive players on big wages, we haven't so far managed to sign one. It's a mistake MADE BY IAN AYRE AND THE OWNERS many times over the years and it's hurt us.     

We all want us to challenge mate, in fact goddammit we all want to win something and bloody soon.

The difference is you and others think he/we can't do it without top quality players whereas we think he/we can do it with the right players, in the right positions, with the right system, with the right attitude, with the same passion as him. 

That's when they become top quality mate, when they've worked for it here, with us, for us, winning us stuff not what they've done previously and don't have to try anymore.

This is probably the biggest difference between us Debs, I think Klopp is a World class manager, not a World class magician.

I expect Klopp to get the best out of the players at his disposal, the better the players the more he will be able to get out of them. I expect him to develop a system that brings the best out of our players not turn water into wine, or why bother buying any new players, just stick with the crap we have and wait till he waves his wand.

I think Klopp will make us a better side, I think he will bring in the quality we need to become a top side but I don't think he will do that with bargain basement signings.

Just my opinion     


 

Only read as far as the me having preconceptions Mick, no point reading the rest if that's what you think.

That post was made, then I answered it and it then reappears BELOW my answer. Weird/spooky.

but I don't think he will do that with bargain basement signings.

But you said earlier you didn't care how much they cost?

Paranoia is starting to set in now.

Am I just being totally obtuse or are people contradicting themselves everytime they post??

I feel I'm going round the bleeding twist trying to understand what people are saying