Liverpool 3:3 Arsenal. In game and post match debate..

Regarding Henderson

This where I think some people get found out as to what aspects of matches they see or what they want to see from players e.g. a goal.

Henderson made several super runs off the ball last night that had the pass been played when it should have and not delayed that extra second to take another touch or whatever then Henderson was opening Arsenal up. He does some great work but because others around him aren't doing what they should when they should it can appear Jordan isn't up too much.

Surround him with top players and you see how good he is.

We miss him when he's not there. He gets up some peoples noses, but of our current CMs he'd always be first on the teamsheet for me.  He's not captain for nothing.

Regarding Henderson

This where I think some people get found out as to what aspects of matches they see or what they want to see from players e.g. a goal.

Henderson made several super runs off the ball last night that had the pass been played when it should have and not delayed that extra second to take another touch or whatever then Henderson was opening Arsenal up. He does some great work but because others around him aren't doing what they should when they should it can appear Jordan isn't up too much.

Surround him with top players and you see how good he is.

Jordan had a good game last night, no question.

Jordan was surrounded by top players in Brendans second season and he was the one who went unnoticed all season and didn't get much credit. Stevie needed Jordan alongside him though and wouldn't have had the season he did without him there.

Jordan for me is a steady eddy type player and there is nothing wrong with that, every team needs those sort of players, but we definitely need somebody with a bit more about them in midfield IMO. We need more of a presence and a lot more quality in the middle of the park if we want to be contenders.

Regarding Henderson

This where I think some people get found out as to what aspects of matches they see or what they want to see from players e.g. a goal.

Henderson made several super runs off the ball last night that had the pass been played when it should have and not delayed that extra second to take another touch or whatever then Henderson was opening Arsenal up. He does some great work but because others around him aren't doing what they should when they should it can appear Jordan isn't up too much.

Surround him with top players and you see how good he is.

I'll give you that, he's a much better runner than he is ball player - and by that I don't mean playing nicely curled passes out wide that look good for the cameras. His ability on the ball allows him to keep things ticking over. He can't force the play as much, and certainly doesn't have it in his locker to take a man on. He's another midfielder who doesn't score or create enough goals too. He isn't a talisman and as HtM stated, he can't take a game by the scruff of the neck and drive us forward. He's the kind of player to play alongside someone of that calibre but he isn't that calibre himself, by any stretch of the imagination. He's an honest hardworking player, but the fact we were all licking our lips at his return only highlights our lack of quality in midfield.

The spine of our team needs surgery, we've go this Matip bloke all but signed, we need a keeper, a gem of a CM and Sturridge fit - but I think there is more chance of hell freezing over with that last 'need'.

Poll now added.

Between Firmino and Mignolet for me...

I know what Arsenal fans would go for

Between Firmino and Mignolet for me...

I know what arsenal fans would go for

To be fair, not many keepers get two assists in one game.

Poll now added.

I went for Hendo!
Well, when our overlords tell us one thing, we have to rebel

but last night it was not only about the goals it was the leak in our confidence which came from him being between the sticks.

It's alarming isn't it.

Opposition are right up for it the moment Mig gets up to any of his tricks. Whether it's flapping at crosses, waiting a week to kick it out, waiting to kick the ball as it goes out for a corner, letting the ball in almost direct from a corner, sailing a clearance into the stands, or his classic of berating players for his balls up.

He really does have quite a repertoire established and the opposition truly love him, he's their go to guy when they're in need of inspiration. Get a set piece launch it anywhere where he 'should' claim it and feed off the incompetence, watch the confidence drain from our lads and build in theirs. It's been happening for so long now it's almost accepted among our fans when truthfully he should have been replaced long ago. He isn't good enough, he never was and never will be it is that simple.

I went for Hendo!
Well, when our overlords tell us one thing, we have to rebel

hendo was fantastic all game imo, firmino faded a little 2nd half.

but hendo dominated that midfield (alongside can)

Very good MOTM poll.

"Firmino (This is the correct answer BTW)"

hendo was fantastic all game imo, firmino faded a little 2nd half.

but hendo dominated that midfield (alongside can)

Do I presume you just deliberately won't improve the quality of your posts?

Very good MOTM poll.

"Firmino (This is the correct answer BTW)"

I'm here all week.

Thought Henderson played well last night but I often say he is average. Comparing him to past Liverpool midfielders then Jordan isn't fit enough to lace their boots in all honesty. Maybe that's unfair of me to compare him to our greats but its true at the end of the day.

He is very good at being the legs of the midfield doing other peoples donkey work but he isn't good enough to be our main player in the middle and that's what he is right now. We need somebody much better alongside him if we are going to challenge. Somebody who can pass a ball better, tackle better, score more goals, create more goals and so on. Hendo is the perfect player to sit alongside such a player and pick the pieces up and then occasionally chip in when he can. His partnership with Stevie a couple of seasons back was like that when we almost won the league.

Think we have a different definition of average just then mate. Think work rate, pressing and positioning are underrated qualities for a midfielder. That alone makes him an average player, put his evolving technical game alongside that and we've got a real player on our hands who seems to be getting better. Has to be the first name on the team sheet which means he's well above average (at least in my eyes). But you're right I think a real ball player alongside him would only compliment him and make us better.

wow

If you ever wanted to see somebody go over the top to try and prove themselves right on this forum then this is it.

No surprise that you jumped on the comment here. The fact is his positional play and presence helped create the space needed for the goal. You don't need to be a great manager to understand a basic principle of physics.

Thought Henderson played well last night but I often say he is average. Comparing him to past Liverpool midfielders then Jordan isn't fit enough to lace their boots in all honesty. Maybe that's unfair of me to compare him to our greats but its true at the end of the day.

He is very good at being the legs of the midfield doing other peoples donkey work but he isn't good enough to be our main player in the middle and that's what he is right now. We need somebody much better alongside him if we are going to challenge. Somebody who can pass a ball better, tackle better, score more goals, create more goals and so on. Hendo is the perfect player to sit alongside such a player and pick the pieces up and then occasionally chip in when he can. His partnership with Stevie a couple of seasons back was like that when we almost won the league.

Yep. This.

thumbs up to this

Regarding Henderson

This where I think some people get found out as to what aspects of matches they see or what they want to see from players e.g. a goal.

Henderson made several super runs off the ball last night that had the pass been played when it should have and not delayed that extra second to take another touch or whatever then Henderson was opening Arsenal up. He does some great work but because others around him aren't doing what they should when they should it can appear Jordan isn't up too much.

Surround him with top players and you see how good he is.

Absolutely nailed it.  This guy, when fully fit, is the heartbeat of the team.  Not Coutinho. Not Sturridge. Not Can. Not Lucas. (Not knocking these guys btw).  He was my MOTM, too, and you're right - he's too good for some of his own team mates.  Watched the game again and focused on Hendo, and I was just utterly impressed at what he was doing.  No headline grabbing, just a bloody fine job. 
No idea what pain is in from his plantar fasciitis heel or whatever it is, (I know from experience that's an awful debilitating pain), but please god keep him fit enough to play.  Love the way his reaction to everything and anything is a mighty "Fooooook Offff!!!"

Re Mings.
Yep, we know he's not great, for all the reasons stated, but you can find reasons to blame ANY keeper for almost any goal if you try hard enough.

The goals were compound errors last night by midfielders, defenders and (in 2 cases) Mings himself.  But keep on slating him to B*ggery when we've absolutely no realistic alternative??  Come on.  Have some bl**ding dignity.

Fact is we look like Under-11s when we defend half the time.  Mings is the fall guy but as a team we let those goals in.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/arsenal/12098028/Liverpool-3-Arsenal-3-match-report-Joe-Allen-grabs-last-gasp-equaliser-to-deny-visitors-stretching-lead-at-table-top.html

Short vid showing the stats of the game.

Impressive.

The way both us and Arsenal set up last night was perfect for a game of clean attacking open football from both sides and that's the first time i've seen that at Anfield this season.(maybe the Leicester game apart)
No parking the bus sh*te looking for the counter attack goal or the boring 0-0 just two teams having a right go.
Down the wings, through the middle... It was just great to watch.

Because of that it enabled the players themselves(on both sides) to express themselves and play to their individual strengths which meant that any misplaced passes or bad control of the ball from anyone stood out like a sore thumb..

Games like last night are rare so although we can say we dropped two points we have to admire our fighting spirit and put it to bed and concentrate on Sunday which I feel will be a totally different game..

I spoke to three Arsenal fans today and they all said how gutted they were at conceding in the last minute but all said it was the best game they have seen all season..

Take that fighting spirit in to Sundays game, add a bit more metal to our tackling, give Caulkner a start over Toure and Let's get the 3 points in the bag...

Keep the momentum going..

I said earlier that if we reproduce that form on Sunday, well hammer the mancs.
Then again look what happened last year. They upped the tempo and fired into us and we wilted.
We likely to succumb to those tactics again, or will get the upper hand in the middle of the park.
I'm made up with the performance against Arsenal, apart from some of the inept defending and keepers short comings, but still concerned we can't produce that or better, two games in succession. !

Bobby Firmino is going to tear the Mancs a new arsehole for their old toilet on Sunday!

Voted for Hendo after watching the match in full last night.....he really did put in a shift and most of his crosses an passes were simply outstanding...he never stops running either, we miss that when he's out injured. Stay fit Captain.

We can do these

Big game from Firmino tonight I call man of the match now

Is he winning the poll?