Is Klopp or the Transfer committee in charge?

I think too much has been made of this TC business.

Agree.

I think you're wrong.
The committee is still the same as it always was.
The difference is when Klopp presents them with a list of "wants", he has a better eye for a player than BR.
Likewise, if the committee show him the players they think will fit his model, he has a greater knowledge base on which to make decisions.
Same with young players.

A good example of this would be Mane, who was rejected by BR, but wanted by Klopp.

It also shows the difference between continental managers, who are used to working in a collegiate way, and British managers who think they should be in charge of everything.

Maybe it is semantics. The way the TC was always explained to me - I don't think that "committee" exists anymore. As I said before, there will and should always be a group of people to help the manager identify, recruit and sign players, in the context of his overall vision for the playing staff.

The TC was quite the bogeyman for the past couple of years, as an extension of animus toward FSG or American owners in general among some supporters. Whatever was or wasn't true about that description before, this close season makes it clear to me at least that such a committee, with such a role, does not exist.

And now we get to see the results and hopefully, the good fruits, of Klopp being given the keys.

Maybe it is semantics. The way the TC was always explained to me - I don't think that "committee" exists anymore. As I said before, there will and should always be a group of people to help the manager identify, recruit and sign players, in the context of his overall vision for the playing staff.

The TC was quite the bogeyman for the past couple of years, as an extension of animus toward FSG or American owners in general among some supporters. Whatever was or wasn't true about that description before, this close season makes it clear to me at least that such a committee, with such a role, does not exist.

And now we get to see the results and hopefully, the good fruits, of Klopp being given the keys.

If it's clear to you, that's all well and good, but I don't think for one second that Mike Gordon has dispensed with the people he's been working with.
Gordon is the nominal "head" of the committee, and it was said that he took over from Ayre to negotiate big transfers as there was something of a disconnect or communication problem that meant we were taking too long, or Ayre was not flexible enough.

I'd put money on pretty much everything being the same, with the only difference being Klopps input.

The whole committee thing has been blown out of proportion anyway, mostly because people just love to play the blame game and want somewhere to point the finger when things don't go as they want them to.

I'd also have a think back to how Klopp answered when he was asked about the "committee" when he first joined us.
He used the exact same words as BR did, in that he has the first and last say on any signings.
Of course many just branded BR a liar.
So to avoid having to say the same thing about Klopp, they now say that the "committee" has been done away with.
It hasn't.
Mike Gordon is still the head, and the others are still doing the same jobs, although Ayre is not dealing with negotiations as much as he was.

The whole committee thing has been blown out of proportion anyway, mostly because people just love to play the blame game and want somewhere to point the finger when things don't go as they want them to.

We definitely agree on this. I also have no reason to think BR is a liar. The results in the end are what didn't work out.

I'm a huge admirer of Klopp's, including before he came to LFC, because of the way he puts together a plan and executes it. But like every other manager, as some English manager humorously once said (was it Big Sam?) "The long-term plan is to win games or get sacked." And in the end that is what will define Klopp's tenure vs. BR's and anyone else's. Hoping for the best.

Thanks for your reasoned arguments. It's nice to disagree with a fellow fan and not feel like I'm being targeted for death. 

I think it's becoming clearer and clearer who is in charge of the purchases but what is suddenly going on with the sales?

Is Ayre on gardening leave or something because we seem to be getting fees we're not used to for our cast offs. I mean this tweet really does hit home:

LFCTS ‏@LFCTS  2h2 hours ago
Liverpool have now received £25m for Jordon Ibe, Brad Smith and Jerome Sinclair this summer who have a combined 21 league starts and 1 goal

In the past it felt like we'd be lucky to get £10m for them combined? I know there's been a bit of super inflation due to the TV deals but still we're doing very well indeed in the selling stakes. Very interesting changes seem to be happening, not sure I agreed with the Benteke stance, I thought £25m+ was a good deal but if the knock on effect is receiving such large fees for players who wont feature then I think Klopp's warchest will just continue to grow. With regards Benteke if we don't use him this season I can still see us getting £20m+ for him next summer so it wont exactly be 'lost' money, just banked.

I think it's becoming clearer and clearer who is in charge of the purchases but what is suddenly going on with the sales?

Is Ayre on gardening leave or something because we seem to be getting fees we're not used to for our cast offs. I mean this tweet really does hit home:

LFCTS ‏@LFCTS  2h2 hours ago
Liverpool have now received £25m for Jordon Ibe, Brad Smith and Jerome Sinclair this summer who have a combined 21 league starts and 1 goal

In the past it felt like we'd be lucky to get £10m for them combined? I know there's been a bit of super inflation due to the TV deals but still we're doing very well indeed in the selling stakes. Very interesting changes seem to be happening, not sure I agreed with the Benteke stance, I thought £25m+ was a good deal but if the knock on effect is receiving such large fees for players who wont feature then I think Klopp's warchest will just continue to grow. With regards Benteke if we don't use him this season I can still see us getting £20m+ for him next summer so it wont exactly be 'lost' money, just banked.

Maybe Jurgens just decided "you want my players?  Then you're going to have to pay for them because they're damn good players that I don't quite have space for at the moment". 

Instead of "here have him, he's crap anyway".

Its Sunday .
Its Deb-or-ah Day !

 

You pronounce the OR.

I think Jürgen will stand ( or fall on the signings that have come in since his appointment) and I do not expect to see him fall.I am sure he would of made it plain that he would have full responsibility for signings in and out of Anfield ,responsibility that any manager worth his salt would demand.

When we see the annual report of how much each club spends on agents, if we ain't near or at the top, as per usual, I'll believe a power shift has occurred.

Its Sunday .
Its Deb-or-ah Day !

 

You pronounce the OR.

Oh yes mate - it gets the full monty when Mum screams it, middle name included but there isn't a F***ing hope in hell in any of you guys getting a whiff of what that is 

Oh yes mate - it gets the full monty when Mum screams it, middle name included but there isn't a f**king hope in hell in any of you guys getting a whiff of what that is 

I forgot the aahhhh as in Bisto !

xxx

I forgot the aahhhh as in Bisto !

xxx

That's the one mate   

We definitely agree on this. I also have no reason to think BR is a liar. The results in the end are what didn't work out.

I'm a huge admirer of Klopp's, including before he came to LFC, because of the way he puts together a plan and executes it. But like every other manager, as some English manager humorously once said (was it Big Sam?) "The long-term plan is to win games or get sacked." And in the end that is what will define Klopp's tenure vs. BR's and anyone else's. Hoping for the best.

Thanks for your reasoned arguments. It's nice to disagree with a fellow fan and not feel like I'm being targeted for death. 

Same here regarding Klopp, and hopefully he can repeat his previous success with us.

With regards to the TC, it seems clear to me (and this is only an opinion) that he has a better eye for a player than BR, and this has helped us hugely.
I see people saying the way we do our business is different, but ever since Gordon took on the role of negotiating transfers last summer, we've seen a big improvement, so it's not really anything new.

At the end of the day, as long as Klopp gets the players he wants, then it's all good, even if it's 2nd or 3rd choice.

Same here regarding Klopp, and hopefully he can repeat his previous success with us.

With regards to the TC, it seems clear to me (and this is only an opinion) that he has a better eye for a player than BR, and this has helped us hugely.
I see people saying the way we do our business is different, but ever since Gordon took on the role of negotiating transfers last summer, we've seen a big improvement, so it's not really anything new.

At the end of the day, as long as Klopp gets the players he wants, then it's all good, even if it's 2nd or 3rd choice.

It seems TPM had a scattergun approach to bring new players in  by quantity.

Each of the incoming players with Klopp on board has a reasoning and justification.


Unlike Box of Frogs , Benteke and others I dont find myself asking Why ?

Oh yes mate - it gets the full monty when Mum screams it, middle name included but there isn't a f**king hope in hell in any of you guys getting a whiff of what that is 

Pretty sure it's Virginia.

It seems TPM had a scattergun approach to bring new players in  by quantity.

Each of the incoming players with Klopp on board has a reasoning and justification.


Unlike Box of Frogs , Benteke and others I dont find myself asking Why ?

I just think it was his inexperience showing, and he has the tendency, like many managers, to go for players he'd already worked with. (Doing it again now with Kolo at Celtic)
Clearly, he's a good coach, but he needs some seasoning, and to learn how to work within a team.
Klopp has the advantage there, because he's always worked in that collegiate kind of environment, I'd also guess that he has a bigger pair than BR and is prepared to put his foot down.
What I mean is, rather than saying "OK, we need someone, so I'll go with the recommendation", Klopp would be more likely to say "Nah, F**k it, we'll wait and get the best fit when we can. In the meantime, I'll make the best of things".

I think it's a small but crucial difference.