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      Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread

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      king kenny
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1025: Sep 23, 2020 11:36:54 pm
      I think there’s something you don’t understand. Let me help you. ;D

      Based on an entirely new management style I learnt recently, which is really cutting edge, no one has used it yet, so modern, it’s going to be the next big trend over the next few years, every good manager is going to be doing like this...

      You bring in a Thiago. He walks into the first team. Someone loses his place at Thiago’s benefit. Because Thiago is also human, imperfect. He will have off days. When he does, punish him to the bench. Argue that there’s no one pushing him for the starting role and he’s getting complacent. Support your argument by saying there’s no one on the bench good enough to provide real competition for Thiago. Mention how poor your bench and the disappointing Thiago is. Talk down on your players.

      Then, the grass is always greener on the other side. Praise whichever team that looks infallible including the coaches and the players. Talk up every player outside of your own team as if your team is useless. Because it seems like only other players apart from your team are the solution. Advocate getting rid your bench in attempt to upgrade them to world class first team players. And to keep everyone happy, you’ll implement the buzzword called rotation as the answer. In actual fact, it’s punishment in the name of the great rotation.

      And you’re confident of telling these world class players they’ll be playing only 50% of all matches because you’ll need to keep the other world class lad happy. Or they’ll get to play when you decide to punish the other world class lad.

      Goals and appearance bonuses? This new management style has yet to incorporate it. So I guess the players remuneration will sort itself out automatically. Or you just tell them to suck it up and lose those because you decided to punish them.

      Hope enlightenment to this new unproven management style will help to explain why Gini is no longer important. It’s therefore important that we sell him now to collect back some ££££.

      Oh wait. I think I remember that I found perpetual success of this management style on a simulator. My team was invincible. 100% win rate. Partly because I cheated by not progressing if I dropped a single point.  :aaliverpool2xt1:

       :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:
      heimdall
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1026: Sep 24, 2020 09:06:22 am
      My problem is with "and f**K the club over." He has a contract. He gets paid for the duration of it and so long as he is putting in the work and performing at the standard expected, he's doing no such thing. If a player's contract expires and the club stops paying him a wage, are they screwing the player over? Of course not. Players aren't bought to be sold, they are bought to perform during the time for which they are under contract.

      I don't accept your question. Thiago makes the team better, but that doesn't equal the idea that Gini is no longer important. He still brings value. You are always going about more value, more players to do a job and provide depth and more opportunity to challenge on multiple fronts. Keeping Gini does that.

      If Gini doesn't want to be here THIS year then we're talking about something else, but I've heard no hint of that.


      Any player is an asset to the club, they are not simply employed like you or I. They hold a specific value which can be traded between clubs, therefore if a players contract lapses the club loses that value which can be a significant sum of money, why else do you think clubs constantly renew the contracts of their best players?
      If the club decide to keep Gini despite him refusing a new contract then only Gini will benefit in a years time as he'll be a free agent and get higher wages at the next club but the club will lose any transfer fee, in that regard it could be said that the player is f**king the club over, but it could also be argued that the club is stupid to be letting that happen, especially for a player who I do not see as being crucial any more.

      So let me please ask you again is Gini worth £600k per week to our current team, is he really that important? You have to answer this question please or at least explain why you refuse.
      heimdall
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1027: Sep 24, 2020 09:08:48 am
      That is a really poor, ignorant approach.

      Let's review the definition of "f**k the club over" with an example:

      Player A signs a long-term contract extension and couple months later demands a transfer and refuses to play for the team, going as far as faking injury and force his move.

      Remember him?

      Is that the player we sold for £140m, funding the purchase of Virgil and Allison, remind me how that is f**king the club over exactly? I am talking financial f**king over here, not what us fans think or feel, if  a player runs down their contract then the club loses money, that is never good.
      heimdall
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1028: Sep 24, 2020 09:11:58 am
      I think there’s something you don’t understand. Let me help you. ;D

      Based on an entirely new management style I learnt recently, which is really cutting edge, no one has used it yet, so modern, it’s going to be the next big trend over the next few years, every good manager is going to be doing like this...

      You bring in a Thiago. He walks into the first team. Someone loses his place at Thiago’s benefit. Because Thiago is also human, imperfect. He will have off days. When he does, punish him to the bench. Argue that there’s no one pushing him for the starting role and he’s getting complacent. Support your argument by saying there’s no one on the bench good enough to provide real competition for Thiago. Mention how poor your bench and the disappointing Thiago is. Talk down on your players.

      Then, the grass is always greener on the other side. Praise whichever team that looks infallible including the coaches and the players. Talk up every player outside of your own team as if your team is useless. Because it seems like only other players apart from your team are the solution. Advocate getting rid your bench in attempt to upgrade them to world class first team players. And to keep everyone happy, you’ll implement the buzzword called rotation as the answer. In actual fact, it’s punishment in the name of the great rotation.

      And you’re confident of telling these world class players they’ll be playing only 50% of all matches because you’ll need to keep the other world class lad happy. Or they’ll get to play when you decide to punish the other world class lad.

      Goals and appearance bonuses? This new management style has yet to incorporate it. So I guess the players remuneration will sort itself out automatically. Or you just tell them to suck it up and lose those because you decided to punish them.

      Hope enlightenment to this new unproven management style will help to explain why Gini is no longer important. It’s therefore important that we sell him now to collect back some ££££.

      Oh wait. I think I remember that I found perpetual success of this management style on a simulator. My team was invincible. 100% win rate. Partly because I cheated by not progressing if I dropped a single point.  :aaliverpool2xt1:

      Wow people actually finished reading that crap and up ticked it, I dosed off half way through, must try harder Ruth, try to be a bit more concise with your "hilarious" sarcasm, don't waffle.
      LFCexiled
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1029: Sep 24, 2020 09:25:16 am
      I think there’s something you don’t understand. Let me help you. ;D

      Based on an entirely new management style I learnt recently, which is really cutting edge, no one has used it yet, so modern, it’s going to be the next big trend over the next few years, every good manager is going to be doing like this...

      You bring in a Thiago. He walks into the first team. Someone loses his place at Thiago’s benefit. Because Thiago is also human, imperfect. He will have off days. When he does, punish him to the bench. Argue that there’s no one pushing him for the starting role and he’s getting complacent. Support your argument by saying there’s no one on the bench good enough to provide real competition for Thiago. Mention how poor your bench and the disappointing Thiago is. Talk down on your players.

      Then, the grass is always greener on the other side. Praise whichever team that looks infallible including the coaches and the players. Talk up every player outside of your own team as if your team is useless. Because it seems like only other players apart from your team are the solution. Advocate getting rid your bench in attempt to upgrade them to world class first team players. And to keep everyone happy, you’ll implement the buzzword called rotation as the answer. In actual fact, it’s punishment in the name of the great rotation.

      And you’re confident of telling these world class players they’ll be playing only 50% of all matches because you’ll need to keep the other world class lad happy. Or they’ll get to play when you decide to punish the other world class lad.

      Goals and appearance bonuses? This new management style has yet to incorporate it. So I guess the players remuneration will sort itself out automatically. Or you just tell them to suck it up and lose those because you decided to punish them.

      Hope enlightenment to this new unproven management style will help to explain why Gini is no longer important. It’s therefore important that we sell him now to collect back some ££££.

      Oh wait. I think I remember that I found perpetual success of this management style on a simulator. My team was invincible. 100% win rate. Partly because I cheated by not progressing if I dropped a single point.  :aaliverpool2xt1:

      Are you sure you found that management style on a simulator because it sounds very hodgsonesque to me. 😉
      Kopite78
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1030: Sep 24, 2020 09:34:18 am
      Any player is an asset to the club, they are not simply employed like you or I. They hold a specific value which can be traded between clubs, therefore if a players contract lapses the club loses that value which can be a significant sum of money, why else do you think clubs constantly renew the contracts of their best players?
      If the club decide to keep Gini despite him refusing a new contract then only Gini will benefit in a years time as he'll be a free agent and get higher wages at the next club but the club will lose any transfer fee, in that regard it could be said that the player is f**king the club over, but it could also be argued that the club is stupid to be letting that happen, especially for a player who I do not see as being crucial any more.

      So let me please ask you again is Gini worth £600k per week to our current team, is he really that important? You have to answer this question please or at least explain why you refuse.

      But dont you think the choice should come down to the club and or manager?

      What if Barca have only offered 5m? Which is hypothetical but so is your 25m
      Then maybe the club think Gini is worth more to us staying here for this season on the pitch than the offer.

      The manager may think his influence within the group and on the pitch is worth far more than letting him go for a nominal fee now?

      Hes on 75k a week. So that's about 2.5m between now and May when his deal runs out

      Balance on the pitch and within the dressing room in real life is different to cashing in on FM
      JD
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1031: Sep 24, 2020 09:36:26 am
      If he's not signing a new contract it makes sense to let him go.  They end up getting pushed to the periphery of the team and ultimately become a bit of a negative force on the rest of the squad.

      That's just a cold hard fact and seen it more times than not with players who are heading for the exit.
      bazspeedman
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1032: Sep 24, 2020 09:49:29 am
      We would be better off selling Gini now and using the money to sign a back up CB so Fab doesn't have to play there unless absolutely necessary.
      heimdall
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1033: Sep 24, 2020 10:01:51 am
      But dont you think the choice should come down to the club and or manager?

      What if Barca have only offered 5m? Which is hypothetical but so is your 25m
      Then maybe the club think Gini is worth more to us staying here for this season on the pitch than the offer.

      The manager may think his influence within the group and on the pitch is worth far more than letting him go for a nominal fee now?

      Hes on 75k a week. So that's about 2.5m between now and May when his deal runs out

      Balance on the pitch and within the dressing room in real life is different to cashing in on FM

      Yes, it of course depends on how much his transfer value is and of course it is the choice of the club, but most reports were suggesting around £20m for Gini which is a big chunk of cash to lose.

      Using your analogy lets say his base salary is £2.5m for the season, if you add to that losing £20m in transfer value then his effective weekly salary becomes £600k which is obviously huge, my question is, is he worth that? If the club thinks so then fine, but it makes no sense to me and personally I would not want to have a player around who doesn't want to accept the contract, it might potentially disrupt the squad as some might take his side and some the club's.
      Keith Singleton
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1034: Sep 24, 2020 10:22:32 am
      Wow people actually finished reading that crap and up ticked it, I dosed off half way through, must try harder Ruth, try to be a bit more concise with your "hilarious" sarcasm, don't waffle.


      Leave Ruth alone, she's sound as a pound.  :) Pick on me instead but wait till I find my dictionary  :lmao:
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1035: Sep 24, 2020 10:36:01 am
      Any player is an asset to the club, they are not simply employed like you or I. They hold a specific value which can be traded between clubs, therefore if a players contract lapses the club loses that value which can be a significant sum of money, why else do you think clubs constantly renew the contracts of their best players?
      If the club decide to keep Gini despite him refusing a new contract then only Gini will benefit in a years time as he'll be a free agent and get higher wages at the next club but the club will lose any transfer fee, in that regard it could be said that the player is f**king the club over, but it could also be argued that the club is stupid to be letting that happen, especially for a player who I do not see as being crucial any more.

      So let me please ask you again is Gini worth £600k per week to our current team, is he really that important? You have to answer this question please or at least explain why you refuse.

      I reject the premise of the question and have already explained why in the post you are answering above. I don't have to answer it. Gini is valuable to us, very valuable to our on-field performance. You are entitled to disagree, but he has been repeatedly selected for a reason.
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1036: Sep 24, 2020 10:38:01 am
      Wow people actually finished reading that crap and up ticked it, I dosed off half way through, must try harder Ruth, try to be a bit more concise with your "hilarious" sarcasm, don't waffle.

      All she did was write what you more or less have been saying in your entire dialogue.

      EDIT - Swab is correct, "monologue."

      « Last Edit: Sep 24, 2020 11:16:17 am by Robby The Z »
      Swab
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1037: Sep 24, 2020 11:12:04 am
      All she did was write what you more or less have been saying in your entire dialogue.

      *monologue.
      CT_LFC
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1038: Sep 24, 2020 02:00:15 pm
      Is that the player we sold for £140m, funding the purchase of Virgil and Allison, remind me how that is f**king the club over exactly? I am talking financial f**king over here, not what us fans think or feel, if  a player runs down their contract then the club loses money, that is never good.

      You live in a really weird world.

      A player who quit on his teammates, coach and everyone is ok because we were able to sucker a desperate Barcelona into a massive fee, but a player who honors his contract with exemplary behavior until the last minute is f**king the team over.

      Real world: 1+1 = 2
      Heimdall's world: 1+1 = apples!
      « Last Edit: Sep 24, 2020 02:05:34 pm by CT_LFC »
      CT_LFC
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1039: Sep 24, 2020 02:04:00 pm
      I reject the premise of the question and have already explained why in the post you are answering above. I don't have to answer it. Gini is valuable to us, very valuable to our on-field performance. You are entitled to disagree, but he has been repeatedly selected for a reason.

      Gini probably has as big a hand print on our recent success as anyone.

      The performance he had in that 2nd half against Barcelona is for the ages. If not for those 2 goals, guess what, there is no CL trophy, which means there is no Super Cup and no Club World Cup.

      ruthcity
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1040: Sep 24, 2020 04:13:38 pm
      Are you sure you found that management style on a simulator because it sounds very hodgsonesque to me. 😉

      :lmao:

      I'm pretty sure some football management expert wrote a manual on this. I just happened to have read about this management style recently. It's so cutting edge that I won't be surprised at least one of us would claim to be the one who wrote it, although most of us wouldn't...

      I think I applied this management style to a simulator and the results were great. It kind of validated this method in some way. However, the simulator found world class players to be unhappy playing 50% of the time. But the manual said we should expect players to be happy being rotated (maybe my simulator has a bug). And if world class players don't join you for this reason, it's their own fault because they lack ambition.

      Last but the most important thing, the manager who adopts this system is never ever at fault. It's always someone else. I found it to be quite an interesting bulletproof, whip-based management system.

      While most of us interested readers do not judge nor condemn this system, I do realise that people raise a lot of questions (which is normal since it pushes the envelope), largely to gather more answers and to test the soundness of the system and to understand more. Hopefully a version two of the manual can address any inconsistencies raised by interested readers. Maybe that's why no manager has used this method extensively yet. I'll shall keep everyone updated should there be any updates to this unique management style.

      Sorry for sidetrack. Let's return to Gini Wijnaldum.
      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1041: Sep 27, 2020 11:49:02 am
      I would say sell him to 45 to 50 mil pound to Barca as we have Alcantara now. He just doesn't do enough in forward position. When he came he was doing a bit of things despite it seems he has complete stopped doing those things since a long while. He is so predictable as well whenever we play big teams. When he is having a bad day from the start, you'll know the whole games outcome as well! He is mentally not strong enough, nor have the capability to make things happen ENOUGH for the front three as we've seen this outcome so so many times!

       Just sell him to Barca! Nor his style of play and way of scoring goals were smart enough! He does miss sitters as well... I always thought he wasn't smart enough to be a Liverpool player! End of!

      Or keep both!
      Kopite78
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1042: Sep 27, 2020 04:48:08 pm
      Something i've noticed way way obvious about Wijnaldum and Hendo is that when they are having a bad day, our performance and results against other side ain't be that impactful as Man City or it was somewhat or quite an embarassing performance from us, overall or from start to finish!
      l
       Infact too many players in the team feels bad, Adrian, Arnold, Gomez, Robertson, Henderson, Wijnaldum(how bad he is feeling from the start, if we are not winning the game, the outcome will be too obvious!), Milner, Salah, Firmino(one of the most who feels too too bad in the team and will always have a bad game! Doesn't have the instinct, conviction of brazilian, really!)

       I think especially the central midfield players should have been more mature physically and mentally because it's them on the pitch who has the most work to do that is coming up and down! Wingers doesn't not naturally have to do that than them!

       I also think the fact that Klopp gives our central midfield way way lesser importance than some other departments on the pitch that's what makes us as a team overall like an unfinished article, no doubt!

       I don't think Klopp is honeslty like that, i don't think neither he has forgotten how his "invincible Dortmund side" used to be in all sides of the game! I and we expect him to take those steps without and without hesitation at Liverpool as well!

       All the time Wijnaldum feels bad and espcecially him from the start then you know how the whole game will end up!

       Firmino also is another example, how rattled he'll always be throughout most games of the campaign!

       Take a bit of note, Jürgen, what's mostly the most important side of them game and what we expected MORE from it! There are things that are so obvious and too obvious to see and why it's not working that way as well or at all!

       But the way the central midfielders feel bad at Liverpool, that's why we are not conquerors enough!

      🙃

      To be honest it's a miracle we managed to stay up last year..
      An achievement in itself
      Scottbot
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1043: Sep 28, 2020 10:56:36 pm
      Get the lad signed up for 4 more years. He was excellent tonight and has started the season strongly. Love the quality and competition we have in the side now.
      « Last Edit: Sep 29, 2020 07:02:14 am by Scottbot »
      AussieRed
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      Re: Georginio Wijnaldum Player Thread
      Reply #1044: Sep 29, 2020 11:18:33 am
      Get the lad signed up for 4 more years. He was excellent tonight and has started the season strongly. Love the quality and competition we have in the side now.

      Also mate, did you see his beaming smiles on all the goals, especially Jota's? Doesn't look like he wants out to me.

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