Transfers and Scouting

I asked this in another thread but didn't get a bite. I would really benefit from your collective knowledge on this subject where LFC are concerned. I have an idea how it should work in theory, but am somewhat skeptical we actually do this.

Does anyone know in any detail about our scouting network? Do we really have one? It seems like we are limited to buying guys who are or have been right in front of the manager, or maybe known by Zeljko or Peter. Our two biggest signings last year were from England (good signings, mind) and three others from or who have played in Germany, with another from Serbia (I think through Buvac).

If we are not going to be competing for the highest tier players at bank-breaking prices (which I'm OK with), we definitely need to invest in solid, deep-rooted scouting. The message I got from Klopp is that he will be buying first-team players this summer, but are we really searching across at least Europe for the very best opportunities to improve ourselves?

I'd also like to know a bit more about this, so thanks mate.

The temptingly cynical answer to your question is:

Match of the Day highlights and Youtube!

I'm sure its a lot more complicated than that...

All I know about scouting I learned from playing FIFA so take this with a truckload of salt, but I believe you hire Regional scouts that will watch players in their assigned region and then they report back to the club (or manager or transfer committee). Of course the question then becomes how good are the scouts we hire (if we do it that way).

I wonder If Ibe's dad is still a scout for us...

I'd also like to know a bit more about this, so thanks mate.

The temptingly cynical answer to your question is:

Match of the Day highlights and Youtube!

I'm sure its a lot more complicated than that...

I'm starting to fear your half-joking answer may be truer than we'd like. I take it from the lack of responses that nobody on here really knows what LIVERPOOL'S actual scouting setup is.

Fair enough. But I would think one of the journo types who scroll through these threads would find themselves with a much-read story and serious career enhancement for showing the enterprise and work ethic to research and write such a story or stories.

There are so many pieces in each day's paper that basically write themselves "Firmino says Coutinho is keen." "Macca always loved derby matches." "Lineker scored a lot of goals in Mexico" "Gazza xxx xxxx." Here's a subject you read almost nothing about so, how about it journos? Put in the work and educate us about something that is actually rather important to the club's success and future.

I have a suspicion that in this era of agent power, even top clubs have become quite slack in doing their work of scouting talent.

I'm starting to fear your half-joking answer may be truer than we'd like. I take it from the lack of responses that nobody on here really knows what LIVERPOOL'S actual scouting setup is.

Fair enough. But I would think one of the journo types who scroll through these threads would find themselves with a much-read story and serious career enhancement for showing the enterprise and work ethic to research and write such a story or stories.

There are so many pieces in each day's paper that basically write themselves "Firmino says Coutinho is keen." "Macca always loved derby matches." "Lineker scored a lot of goals in Mexico" "Gazza xxx xxxx." Here's a subject you read almost nothing about so, how about it journos? Put in the work and educate us about something that is actually rather important to the club's success and future.

I have a suspicion that in this era of agent power, even top clubs have become quite slack in doing their work of scouting talent.

It's pretty much the same setup every other top club uses.
We have a head scout who compiles player reports from regional scouts, which then go to the manager and the analysis team.
The same as every other bugger.

It's pretty much the same setup every other top club uses.
We have a head scout who compiles player reports from regional scouts, which then go to the manager and the analysis team.
The same as every other bugger.

Are you sure about that? That is what we think it should be. But do you have any idea who these scouts are? Geographically, do you have any idea how they are arranged, how many and in what places? Are there other central or follow-up scouts who go to provide 2nd opinions on prospects ID'd by these regional scouts? I'm all ears if you do and I wouldn't know either way, but I think it's a fair question.

Are you sure about that? That is what we think it should be. But do you have any idea who these scouts are? Geographically, do you have any idea how they are arranged, how many and in what places? Are there other central or follow-up scouts who go to provide 2nd opinions on prospects ID'd by these regional scouts? I'm all ears if you do and I wouldn't know either way, but I think it's a fair question.

Why would anyone know who the scouts are?
They're pretty much self employed, and get asked to watch and assess local talent.
They're usually people who have been in the game, as players or coaches, and are judged on results and reliability of information.
Their reports are used by the analysis team, and by the manager to make up shortlists of players we might be interested in.
Their work goes on year round.

The same as every other club.
We don't do anything different from anyone else when it gets boiled right down.

Why would anyone know who the scouts are?
They're pretty much self employed, and get asked to watch and assess local talent.
They're usually people who have been in the game, as players or coaches, and are judged on results and reliability of information.
Their reports are used by the analysis team, and by the manager to make up shortlists of players we might be interested in.
Their work goes on year round.

The same as every other club.
We don't do anything different from anyone else when it gets boiled right down.

OK - by way of introduction, I had a business writing about elite player development for 10 years, so I know what a scout is and what a scout is supposed to do. I know typically what a scout's background would be.
Not sure what the point would be of secrecy re who the scouts are (the content of what they are reporting back, yes, but not their identity).

I'm asking about volume, how many regions, how big of an area per region, how exclusive are these scouts to LFC, etc.

I apologize if I am misreading you, but your response makes it seem like you think there is something inherently wrong with my asking these questions. Yes I have some skepticism (about English football scouting more than anything specific to Liverpool - because of some of my own experiences), but I'm not arriving at any conclusions. I think it's a genuine subject of interest and as far as the club's fortunes go, is an important one.

Are you in fact familiar with the club's actual scouting setup?

(fyi, if you think this is me going at the current owners, you know by now I have defended them along with you in forum after forum - this is nothing to do with that).

It's pretty much the same setup every other top club uses.
We have a head scout who compiles player reports from regional scouts, which then go to the manager and the analysis team.
The same as every other bugger.

Yep.

I'd be amazed if a club the size of ours didn't have such a structure.

Just because we don't buy players we don't like doesn't mean we don't have scouting system in place to identify targets.

OK - by way of introduction, I had a business writing about elite player development for 10 years, so I know what a scout is and what a scout is supposed to do. I know typically what a scout's background would be.
Not sure what the point would be of secrecy re who the scouts are (the content of what they are reporting back, yes, but not their identity).

I'm asking about volume, how many regions, how big of an area per region, how exclusive are these scouts to LFC, etc.

I apologize if I am misreading you, but your response makes it seem like you think there is something inherently wrong with my asking these questions. Yes I have some skepticism (about English football scouting more than anything specific to Liverpool - because of some of my own experiences), but I'm not arriving at any conclusions. I think it's a genuine subject of interest and as far as the club's fortunes go, is an important one.

Are you in fact familiar with the club's actual scouting setup?

(fyi, if you think this is me going at the current owners, you know by now I have defended them along with you in forum after forum - this is nothing to do with that).

Mate, if you find it fascinating, then crack on, but for me it's pretty much a non issue.

I'm sure there's plenty of information out there, but honestly, I'm not arsed about it.

Yep.

I'd be amazed if a club the size of ours didn't have such a structure.

Just because we don't buy players we don't like doesn't mean we don't have scouting system in place to identify targets.

Actually a system like what is described would make it LESS likely for a club to buy players it doesn't like.

My concern would be more in getting a decent player who was highly visible, when shopping (scouting) around more vigorously would have found a better one. It can make a significant difference as to our final product each season.

Again, I agree that LFC should have such a setup. But my previous life showed me a number of examples where English clubs were way behind continental clubs in this area (but I have no specific experiences relating to Liverpool on that front).

But as this is a evidently a solitary interest, I will cease cluttering the boards with my questions. Thanks for listening.

Actually a system like what is described would make it LESS likely for a club to buy players it doesn't like.

My concern would be more in getting a decent player who was highly visible, when shopping (scouting) around more vigorously would have found a better one. It can make a significant difference as to our final product each season.

Again, I agree that LFC should have such a setup. But my previous life showed me a number of examples where English clubs were way behind continental clubs in this area (but I have no specific experiences relating to Liverpool on that front).

But as this is a evidently a solitary interest, I will cease cluttering the boards with my questions. Thanks for listening.

Just to clarify Robby I was talking about the structure Swab mentioned in his post

Just to clarify Robby I was talking about the structure Swab mentioned in his post

Yes, me too. The better we scout prospects, the more likely we will know what we are getting and stand less of a chance to bring someone in and then wonder what happened when he's not up to standard. I've seen it before (at many clubs) where a signing is based on a single performance, a highlight video or mostly just a  network of agents and coaches "working together" to keep their own pockets lined, with the team benefit a secondary issue NOT saying WE do that, but as with anything else, there are degrees of quality/excellence and I would hope our performance in this area is among the best.

We do seem to make good use of the network of scouts around the South coast. 😊

That aside: it used to be the case [way back] that 'regional', grass roots, scouts were used primarily to scout kids. With another tier attending lower league games. The kids got an invite for trial; lower league players got watched by coaches and managers.

With technology now the world really is a small place and you can guarantee that if one scout, in say Brazil, has 'found' a gem; many more know about him. I guess it then becomes a case of how we go about securing their services.

Who is able to move fastest to offer that attractive deal?

Just a thought but maybe we are sometimes guilty of analysing a scouted player too much. Applying a formula here; running them through a software program there or using just one cost to ability algorithm too many? 🤔

Maybe, just maybe, we should trust the 'scout' more and offer the kid the Dele, [bad pun intended] it takes to sign him, a.s.a.p. 😁

We do seem to make good use of the network of scouts around the South coast. 😊

That aside: it used to be the case [way back] that 'regional', grass roots, scouts were used primarily to scout kids. With another tier attending lower league games. The kids got an invite for trial; lower league players got watched by coaches and managers.

With technology now the world really is a small place and you can guarantee that if one scout, in say Brazil, has 'found' a gem; many more know about him. I guess it then becomes a case of how we go about securing their services.

Who is able to move fastest to offer that attractive deal?

Just a thought but maybe we are sometimes guilty of analysing a scouted player too much. Applying a formula here; running them through a software program there or using just one cost to ability algorithm too many? 🤔

Maybe, just maybe, we should trust the 'scout' more and offer the kid the Dele, [bad pun intended] it takes to sign him, a.s.a.p. 😁

Is there some rule now about a kid only being able to sign a youth contract for a club within X miles of his home, or something like that?

Is there some rule now about a kid only being able to sign a youth contract for a club within X miles of his home, or something like that?

If there is then that can be worked around so easily, just move house .

If there is then that can be worked around so easily, just move house .

Yeah, I've known of some rather miraculous job opportunities (and moves) popping up for American parents of youth prospects signing with a UK club.

Is there some rule now about a kid only being able to sign a youth contract for a club within X miles of his home, or something like that?

Not that I'm aware of Robby but I'm not aware of much to be fair.😊

by the look of our transfers - it doesn't seem like we have much of a scouting team

we buy players from southampton a year or two after they were already available

we also buy players who are totally hopeless from abroad - ie moreno

by the look of our transfers - it doesn't seem like we have much of a scouting team

we buy players from southampton a year or two after they were already available

we also buy players who are totally hopeless from abroad - ie moreno

Yeah and guys, like Firmino, Coutinho, Can, Matip, Origi......Useless feckers.

by the look of our transfers - it doesn't seem like we have much of a scouting team

we buy players from southampton a year or two after they were already available

we also buy players who are totally hopeless from abroad - ie moreno

There isn't a club in the world that gets every transfer right.
That's a fact.

Why are some people so willing and seemingly keen to slag off every part of the club at every opportunity?

Yeah and guys, like Firmino, Coutinho, Can, Matip, Origi......Useless feckers.

What south the rest? 😁