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      A "plan B" begins to emerge from the fog!

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      PastorGeek
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      Re: A "plan B" begins to emerge from the fog!
      Reply #23: May 17, 2017 03:43:03 pm
      The amount of points Jürgen has got out of this team, and outplaying our rivals without a proper striker is phenomenal, excited to see what we can do once he has dipped his toe into the transfer market.

      Not having 'a proper striker' is surely his fault isn't it? We sold (and didn't replace) a proven premier league goal scorer who got 15 goals for relegation fodder. Should he get credit for making our situation worse?
      PastorGeek
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      Re: A "plan B" begins to emerge from the fog!
      Reply #24: May 17, 2017 10:16:14 pm
      Have you stopped to think that maybe "the" or any striker that he wanted was not available? He won't just buy anyone to keep us happy. Looks like he has made the right choice as he will no doubt have more options over the summer window. I don't understand your quote of making our situation worse? he has just got us in a position to play CL and push on?

      it's great that we got into a CL position. I feel like it's there or there about's to what is expected for us as a team tbh.

      I'm just thinking about the possibility that we could have been challenging for the title.

      I'm thinking about what a difference 10+ extra goals from a forward player could have meant to our season. Particularly when Mane was out. Perhaps if we were more willing to try 2 up front earlier. If it would make us a different proposition.

      Also what a difference Sahko would have made in our season. IMO we have voluntarily made our squad weaker and didn't get replacements.

      There is the theory that more 'pragmatic' managers do well in the premier league. Managers that come in and use the tools available and get the best out of the players they have (like Conte), rather than have a system that they stick to and are rigid in their beliefs (like Pep).

      It's just a theory of course. I personally think our season could have been better
      MIRO
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      Re: A "plan B" begins to emerge from the fog!
      Reply #25: May 17, 2017 11:35:04 pm
      So Mick ... put simply .... are you now giving a sh*t about Sunday and qualifying for the CL by coming in 4th?

      Cos you couldn't get excited about it a month ago.
      harrydunn08
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      Re: A "plan B" begins to emerge from the fog!
      Reply #26: May 18, 2017 12:22:18 am
      Nice thread Mick.  There is merit in a lot of what you say, but I'll play devil's advocate:

      finally, belatedly, we appear to have arrived at a potential solution to bus parkers.... we've gotten there in the end and the future looks a lot brighter.

      Lets look at the alterations and how they panned out:

      1. Playing a proper striker.... Danny Sturridge is a PROPER striker, the only one in our squad arguably, and man did it show?....  And it wasn't a surprise that as a team we looked massively more potent, proper strikers do that.

      What his cameo did yesterday though surely is demonstrate once and for all that a PROPER striker or two in the squad is a must, and having one on the pitch if fit equally a given.     

      Yes, we looked more potent with Studge, a natural #9, starting up top than we have in recent weeks.  But if we think back to the first half of the season, we were regularly blowing teams away -- even bus parkers -- and scoring 4+ goals on numerous occasions.  Was the team performance with Studge as the focal point better than we were seeing back in October/November with Firmino as the #9?  For me, we would need to see more evidence than just 1 game to draw this conclusion. 

      As for Phil in midfield, he's a world class player who is capable of playing several positions to a high standard.  I do recall one game earlier in the season (I just can't remember which game) when Coutinho started in a deeper CM role, and was moved to LW at halftime because he wasn't getting any touches near the opposition's penalty area.  The switch helped free Coutinho of his defensive responsibilities and made us more threatening in attack.  I personally agree with you that Phil is naturally suited to a more central role, but sometimes you have to move players around to get the best out of the unit. 
      « Last Edit: May 18, 2017 01:00:16 am by harrydunn08 »
      lfc across the water
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      Re: A "plan B" begins to emerge from the fog!
      Reply #27: May 18, 2017 08:29:46 am
      No Plan B emerged. If it does, it will take longer than one game.

      We faced a team on their holidays with 8 players out, who let us walk all over them, literally walking the ball into the net at times. And even then, we struggled for 45 minutes to put them away. It's not like that every week, but we've all summer to discover a more concrete, productive, and longer term Plan B.
      littleface
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      Re: A "plan B" begins to emerge from the fog!
      Reply #28: May 18, 2017 04:07:33 pm
      No Plan B emerged. If it does, it will take longer than one game.

      We faced a team on their holidays with 8 players out, who let us walk all over them, literally walking the ball into the net at times. And even then, we struggled for 45 minutes to put them away. It's not like that every week, but we've all summer to discover a more concrete, productive, and longer term Plan B.
      Agree . A plan B for me would have been playing two up front at home against lesser teams and not having two DM's . I honestly think all the changes made on sunday were to do with Firmino being injured.
      Fourbrick
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      Re: A "plan B" begins to emerge from the fog!
      Reply #29: May 18, 2017 07:14:05 pm
      Agree . A plan B for me would have been playing two up front at home against lesser teams and not having two DM's . I honestly think all the changes made on sunday were to do with Firmino being injured.

      Looks like fate forced Jürgen's hand.
      RC9
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      Re: A "plan B" begins to emerge from the fog!
      Reply #30: May 19, 2017 09:31:29 am
      Not sure an plan B has emerged as such. But I do believe the formation we saw at West Ham will be more prominent next season, hopefully with the arrival of another winger/striker.
      MIRO
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      Re: A "plan B" begins to emerge from the fog!
      Reply #31: Jul 22, 2017 11:59:02 am
      RTB number 3: "Much more direct!".

      "We told the boys at half time, much more direct please!" and I think in that moment, at that after match interview, Jürgen began to "get" what is needed to win lots of football matches in the Premiership against bus parkers. If the opposition are going to sit on the edge of their own box and give you the ball back without a murmur, it isn't necessary for us to waste 90 seconds each time passing the ball slowly from side to side before trying a pass in their final third. All the oppo are trying to do is nick the ball off of us while we're building and then break on us, so give them LESS opportunity not more. Ball retention isn't the be all and end all it normally is, because they are quite simply going to give it back to us in any case PROVIDING WE LOSE IT IN THEIR DEFENSIVE THIRD.

      Very significant this. If the opposition insist on sitting on the edge of their own box, lets then play the entire game with the ball in and around their final third. Lets be quicker, bolder, YES more direct if necessary, and lets get the ball in and around their box ALL OF THE TIME. Gegenpresse the second ball, recycle and go again. My guess is pretty quickly teams will not fancy sitting in so deep ( as they don't against Man City, Tottenham and Chelsea) and will feel the need to get their defensive line up the pitch ten paces. We've then got to be a little more careful as they become more dangerous, but we'll find it far easier to break teams down.

      Against bus parkers, go MUCH more direct. Amen Jürgen.,         

      Mo Salah .
      « Last Edit: Jul 22, 2017 12:13:32 pm by MIRO »
      Scottbot
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      Re: A "plan B" begins to emerge from the fog!
      Reply #32: Jul 23, 2017 09:29:28 pm
      I do like the look of Salah on the right and always looking to cut in and get shots away with his stronger left foot. Given we don't appear to be looking for a new centre forward (a mistake in my opinion) we will be needing more goals from the two wide players. I wonder if we will see Mane on the left a bit more this season offering a similar sort of threat from the other side. With Coutinho playing in a slightly deeper role it could be a pretty exciting. I just wish we had similar quality in the CF position because it could be frightening.
      redtiler
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      Re: A "plan B" begins to emerge from the fog!
      Reply #33: Jul 23, 2017 10:01:54 pm
      Stop this people.   This is a fantastic post, with proper insight, and resonable argument, the way it should be and really refreshing
      Thanks lads and lasses

      YNWA
      MIRO
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      Re: A "plan B" begins to emerge from the fog!
      Reply #34: Jul 23, 2017 10:21:09 pm
      Stop this people.   This is a fantastic post, with proper insight, and resonable argument, the way it should be and really refreshing
      Thanks lads and lasses

      YNWA

      Mick needed a bump.

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