Liverpool 1-1 Burnley: In game and Post Match discussion

At least he saved our ass at the end with that clearance and showed more drives going forward than some of our midfielders. Still our best defender by a long mile but I worry that if he has to continue playing alongside Lovren/Klavan he's going turn to sh*t soon enough.

He's a really good defender. Not a great one because as you note, he can't even make Lovren or Klavan good - in fact they probably bring him down to their level.

But he's certainly no Carra or Hyypia. I mean come on, that pair made that boneheaded dunce Skrtel look half decent!

At least he saved our ass at the end with that clearance and showed more drives going forward than some of our midfielders. Still our best defender by a long mile but I worry that if he has to continue playing alongside Lovren/Klavan he's going turn to sh*t soon enough.

He was, by a mile, the best defender on show.

The need to chuck mud his way is as boring as the stick about the bus parkers and the constant stick towards Firmino. Nothing more than people playing with their wooden spoons:

Seven changes to the starting line up didn't really help with loads of short or over hit passes in that first half.
Thought there was a better structure to midfield with Milner and Coutinho moving the ball forward when they received it as opposed to the lazy square balls from Wynaldjn and Henderson.
Burnely are Burnely and they won't change their style, they used to play like that in the 70's..Big man up top with a five man midfield supporting..
They took their chance today and their keeper made some class saves to snatch the point.

Our substitutions were too late in the game, should've been made ten minutes earlier.
Solanke looked good on the ball and was a different style of threat for us which is what we needed.
Unlucky with that chance right at the end, dunno whether he hit the bar or the keeper got a hand to it at the same time but it was so unlucky.

Gonna have to change it all again for both Leicester games which I'm not looking forward to.

What was in that ball?
F***ing helium?

Never seen so many efforts consistently F***ing skyed.

He's a really good defender. Not a great one because as you note, he can't even make Lovren or Klavan good - in fact they probably bring him down to their level.

But he's certainly no Carra or Hyypia. I mean come on, that pair made that boneheaded dunce Skrtel look half decent!

Agreed mate he's a decent defender. Miles behind the best ones we've had over the years and not IMHO the answer to our problems, but decent.

We will learn from this!

We will learn from this!

Hahahaha becoming the new 'Another corner turned' phrase.

When exactly will we learn from this!

Fixed it for ya

Agreed mate he's a decent defender. Miles behind the best ones we've had over the years and not IMHO the answer to our problems, but decent.

Not the answer but nor do I think he's the problem here. With a strong centre back alongside him I think we can see him fulfil his talents here. Just not with Dejan F***ing Lovren.

He was, by a mile, the best defender on show.

The need to chuck mud his way is as boring as the stick about the bus parkers and the constant stick towards Firmino. Nothing more than people playing with their wooden spoons:

No wooden spoons just stating facts just like yourself when you have critisced players . Matip was at fault and has been for a few goals recently. Firminho was poor today end of . Why do people get so precious when someone questions someones ability or performance

Just came back after a 500 mile round trip from Swansea to Liverpool and they dealt up another laughable defensive routine

Studge was...ineffective....Sal ah was great and a great stadium, desperately requiring Clyne back, and Can is better in that role than Henderson, but not by much.

Oh, and congratulations to Burnley for winning the "So that's how you kill an entertaining football match stone dead" award.

G'night all.

Schooled by bus parkers again.

5 league games, 2 wins and dropped points to Watford, humiliated by City and now Burnley. Not good enough.

It looks as though we're going to have similar problems to last year.

Just a note: I see one or two quickly getting their digs in about Sturridge towards those who have been looking to play a recognised striker up front in these kind of games.

Well, I expected a rusty display from Coutinho and even though he was the brightest player on the pitch for us, at times his control, passing and shooting showed that he wasn't fully up to speed as he was blowing away the cob webs.

I wouldn't expect anything different from Sturridge either who completed his first 90 minutes of football in 16 months. Like Coutinho Danny was rusty and it will take way more than 1 full game to get him up to speed. He isn't an impact player, he is one who takes a good few games to get going. Expecting him to do the business when he is frozen out of the team for weeks on end is nothing short of immature in the dig department. Had he have been five-seven games into a solid run I could understand the sly digs coming out for him but after one game that is pure petulance on those who advocate leaving him out.

Once Mane makes way we look much more toothless with Firmino being asked to take up his position on the left, in hindsight perhaps AOC would have carried more threat for us down the left. Also, perhaps Gini could have started or at least replaced  Milner; him and Coutinho would have been a better pairing at the base of the quintet as Gini plays those tighter areas much better and gets ahead of the ball and drives into the heart of their defence.

I don't know, so many 'what if's' it's starting to grate that we only seem to have one system, and one game plan. And as usual we give away those goals to teams who can afford to be under the cosh with only 20% of possession to their name and still score.

Using Burnley's result at Chelsea and Tottenham as an excuse for our own failings is akin to lowering expectations. Our job is to get ahead of Spurs and Chelsea, so where they slip up we should be looking to capitalise not be on par, because there will be plenty of games where we will lose or drop more silly points to teams where Spurs and Chelsea in particular will capitalise.

Another disapointing result, and another disappointing performance.

 

Studge needs games to get sharp, but we don't have the luxury.  He plays in a position where you need to produce consistently, regardless of when the opportunity comes along. 

Salah is quickly becoming our most important player. 

We missed Mane, and have been missing Lallana. 

Klavan or Lovren -- pick your poison....  neither are good enough and it's killing us.

From what I've seen, Berto is better than Robbo which begs the question of why he was signed to begin with.... 

Need Mane back asap as at least with him and Mo in the side we have the potential to outscore teams....

Anyone else swap our defence for theirs?

That goal they scored was unfuckingbelievable. What the F**k were Matip, Klavan and Emre F***ing doing?

As for us, we huffed and puffed and couldn't blow the house down, how many times has that happened over the last couple of seasons.

F**k, I know it's F***ing early but I already feel like the Title chance is slipping away.

Maybe though, just maybe,September is our new January from last season, get it the F**k out of the way and come storming home. Just hanging onto anything, really!

Watched it on my phone ( PL's proverbial screw you to fans from Merica)

Just some thoughts.

Salah looked like Salah. Took a lot of chances, some of them before he was set or and other shots he took knowing full well that it would take a gaff from the keeper to get a good result. Still, the man scores goals and is so vital to this team now. Another productive game, Mo. Well done!

Sturg just doesn't seem to fit with what we do. Outside of that flick to Mily all he does is try to create space for himself so he can shoot. After seeing him again today I'm ready for some more Solanke.

Speaking of creating space for self shots lets transition to Coutinho. What's his issue with Robo? All first half he passed on the pass out wide to Andy and tried turning it in. Also, his move is basically figured out by most teams. He is going to hard step ya and get the ball onto his right foot and fire a bullet at the goal. Its hard to stop when its on target, but it was nowhere near CLOSE today. He's rusty and needs time. I hope he is okay, looked hurt coming off. All and all not a good performance though.

The sub timing of Klopp has gone from driving me mad to border line silly. I mean WTH?

Milner looked good today and IMO maybe needs to play a little bit more with this group to get a bigger sample size. I like Can at Jordan's spot better and Mily looks to push the ball up the pitch regularly. His fitness also stands out to me. Its the stuff of legends, dude just doesn't get tired. All in all a good game and deserving of another.

Damn we botched some headers today.

Ox needs to play Tuesday, and not as a sub. 90 +

Sounds like Klopp put the goal mostly on Robo. It was super hard to see all the intricacies of that play and how it broke down. I thought Robo played well defensively but was impatient with the ball in the second half. A lot of that may have been due not getting the ball in the first, but its still no excuse. I hate the idea of Moreno being our first team LB. Unfortunately I feel like its only a matter of time before he reminds Klopp he isn't. We may not see Robo for a month now. Hell it took 5 games to get him back on the pitch after a game in which he was the MOTM. Klopp's dog house any many rooms!

Is Danny Ward just not an option outside of League and FA games?

If you hate our defense with Matip in it, just imagine what you would feel if he wasn't. The dude is playing some damn good football while having to deal with the anxiety of communicating and playing with two fellas that are thicker than a pig sh*t. That ball was going had he not headed it.

In the words Lucas Leiva, UNLUCKYYYYYYYYYYY

Studge needs games to get sharp, but we don't have the luxury.  He plays in a position where you need to produce consistently, regardless of when the opportunity comes along. 

You really cannot be saying Sturridge needs to produce consistently when our usual number nine goes 7-8-9 games without scoring. It defies belief it really does. Had Firmino had have played number nine today certain people wouldn't have been calling his lack of goals out. I mean, he was given a bye for missing a penalty by some because he cried at the end of the game FFS! Instead, had he have played #9  today people would have marvelled Firmino because Salah got onto the score sheet and he was somehow, some-piece of intricate glue that saw our attack get one goal. 

What is noticeable is that Sturridge will get off more shots in a game and increase his chances of scoring - which is what he did today. But unfortunately he didn't score. If he can keep getting into those scoring positions at the right time, and knock on the door I can forgive him occasionally when he doesn't find the net. Add onto the fact it was his first league start for months he shouldn't be burdened with sole responsibility of scoring. I mean, usually our goals don't come from one focal point in attack, they're supposed to come from all angles of our infamous attack. Yet, today funnily enough it all comes back down to Sturridge once he is shoehorned back into the team.

I'm not even sure the system works well with Sturridge, but Sturridge hasn't had the luxury or playing with Mane and Salah for an extended period in the team. I'm sure he could link up well with Mane but I don't see him doing all that tenacious running like Firmino does. So, Sturridge ends up in the same kind of system with invisible Bobby by his left, it's hardly his fault that whenever he steps up into the team the players around him are downgraded. He would have been better paired off with Solanke but that's too outside the box for Jürgen.

Seven changes to the starting line up didn't really help with loads of short or over hit passes in that first half.
Thought there was a better structure to midfield with Milner and Coutinho moving the ball forward when they received it as opposed to the lazy square balls from Wynaldjn and Henderson.
Burnely are Burnely and they won't change their style, they used to play like that in the 70's..Big man up top with a five man midfield supporting..
They took their chance today and their keeper made some class saves to snatch the point.

Our substitutions were too late in the game, should've been made ten minutes earlier.
Solanke looked good on the ball and was a different style of threat for us which is what we needed.
Unlucky with that chance right at the end, dunno whether he hit the bar or the keeper got a hand to it at the same time but it was so unlucky.

Gonna have to change it all again for both Leicester games which I'm not looking forward to.

Have to admit, there's been little consistency for any back 4/5

I wait for the line-up and think to myself, who's starting with Matip today, and who's at RB.

The goal pretty much summed our defence under Jürgen and Rodgers before him. You can afford blame to an individual player but the entire unit were at fault. TAA is weak going for the first ball, he doesn't really attack it, The same applies for Matip with the 2nd ball, Klavan is ball watching and drifts across offering neither a challenge for the ball or any cover and then Robertson is also ball watching when he could and should have been marking the player who scores the goal.

How long has it been since our back four were properly drilled in the principles of defending? I suspect it has been several years and it shows up regularly in our play.

The worry for me is that Klopp laments our failure to score more goals, and he has a pointbecause plenty of chances were created but why does he not lament the ease at which they scored? It happens too often, we concede goals off the back of one or two chances. We are SO soft back there. Keeper, back four, DM, the whole thing. Until he fixes it we'll amount to anything more than a top four challenge. There is enough offensive talent in this team to enable a back to basics approach where the focus is on a stronger defence, more cover and keeping a clean sheet. That needs to be the mentality for me.

Saw the Burnley goal on MOTD. Same ol. For me the guy got a run on TAA, so reckon it's up to the CBs to win the 2nd ball. It's just a high dropping ball, you'd expect a big CB to out muscle/jump the forward there, Matip moreso than Klavan.
For arguments sake, does Sakho win that ball? For me he does. That type of defender. Not trying to cause trouble here btw

Burnley had a strategy - hit long to TAA and win the second ball.

Yes TAA could (should) have done better and Robbo could (should) perhaps have got across quicker. But they could both do that and we still lose that goal - never a guarantee of a fullback winning an aerial and in Robbo's case even IF he's sucked in he's 2nd favourite for that ball and risking leaving a man at the back.

So however you look at it it's the The Three Stooges (on this occasion Ragnar and Joel) that's causing us the pain again.

Again - regrettably - I think we're gonna have to focus on our finishing because I don't think that those players have the mentality to overcome that fragility based on all available evidence.

That second ball needs to be anticipated and won - ideally by Matip.

Agreed, but we fail to win that first ball which is lumped toward our defenders. Start there I say.

Can't see these defensive issues being sorted.  And Burnley didn't even do a lot going forward. 

So while the main story from yesterday is not taking more than 1 of our 35 chances, the fact is that better teams will score plenty of goals against us and that's why we won't win anything this season.

Also - what is the point of our record transfer signing Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain?  2 minutes against Sevilla.  15 here. Seems to have brought the Arsenal curse with him.

Lallana injured, Henderson and Wijnaldum on the bench, Can starting as a number 6, and Milner gets a game before record signing Ox?