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      Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion

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      6stringer
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #690: Feb 05, 2018 09:45:42 am
      I watched the match but was reading on my laptop at the same time.
      How can you possibly read and watch a game of that importance at the same time?

      skamp
      • Forum Emlyn Hughes
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #691: Feb 05, 2018 10:53:17 am
      I'm still livid beyond words. I can't ever remember being quite so angry over a game of footy as I am over this, to the point that my head's still spinning so I might ramble a bit. Forgive me if I do. First of all let's get the Elephant in the room out of the way. It was not a penalty. Neither of them were. First was offside, second was not a foul in a month of Sundays. That's not with the benefit of close up camera shots either, it didn't look remotely like a penalty. For the first one it was as blatant a dive as you're ever going to see. Having already set a precedent for himself by booking Ali for an equally obvious dive, questions need to be asked why he then gave the penalty to Kane.

      For the second penalty, anyone who thinks it did needs to give their head a wobble. In real time it just looked like Lamela dived into Van Dijk. With the benefit of close up camera angles, you can clearly see him going down before contact is even made. Diving aside, if that's a penalty then Football is truly dead because no team is ever going to finish the game with eleven men. It was a pathetic decision, but sadly one not atypical to the increasingly poor standards of refereeing in this country. These pricks need to be wired up so everyone can hear what they say like in Rugby. Like Managers do, they should have to go on television with a post-match interview and justify those decisions. Until they do, it won't change.

      That's why we drew the game. Nonetheless, Poch's comments do have some merit. We were absolutely abject in the second half. A goal was coming for a very long time and only our defenders, including Karius, kept us in the game as long as we where. Our midfield was non-existent to the point that they may as well not have even been on the pitch, they were so poor. To my mind this reinforces the dereliction of duty of all those involved by not reinforcing in the January window. Even in the first half, there was not a shred of creativity in the middle of the park, we got by on aggression alone. If this team is to progress and be successful, both of these aspects of the game are needed. Quite honestly, a midfield of Henderson, Can and Milner is about the weakest midfield I think I've seen us play in a very long time. They absolutely failed time and again to establish any sort of control or exert any pressure on Spurs in the second half.

      Unfortunately that's the problem. This is a draw that feels like a defeat, and for all our failings, not a defeat of our own making. Yes, a win for us would have been a smash and grab but we were cheated out of a win by another outrageous refereeing decision. I would rather Spurs had scored their two goals on their own merits, from open play. It would be more palatable and, given just how good they are, and how well the played in the second half, would hurt a lot less than this does.

      We also need to look at the Striking situation as well. Firmino, Salah and Mane are all well and good but the drop off then to Ings and Solanke is unacceptable for a club with our ambitions. I shudder to think what will happen to our season if we lose one of them. During the first half, we also ran into one of our other main problems this season: lack of clinical finishing. Salah has to go down as one of our best signings of all time, at least on the evidence we have so far, but he's one of three and the other two need to start taking the chances they're presented with as well, of which they do all too infrequently. Again this comes back to the lack of business done in January when everyone else strengthened. Looking to the bench today and I despair at the lack of quality back up we have. We seem to have come full circle under Klopp and it needs addressing this Summer.

      MOTM then. Three contenders. Salah, for dancing through half of Spur team and scoring one of the best goals you're likely to see, a goal that deserved to be the winner. Karius for doing what was needed of him, when it was needed. This is the first time in a very long time I can hand on heart say that our Goalkeeper won us points. But I voted Van Dijk, who looked every inch the £75 million defender we've bought. His commanding presence, his organising of the defence, the guy bossed that back line, a back line that played probably the best game I've seen them play under Klopp.

      So, as much as this is a draw that feels like a defeat, we didn't need to win today, and so a draw still sees us third, above Spurs and Chelsea with plenty of Football still to play, and in all honesty, I'd have taken a point before Kick off, and certainly taken a point halfway through the second half when we were under the kosh. Was a point fair? In the cold light of day, yes it was. I just wish it was a point under better circumstances.
      Good post
      HamannsTheMan
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #692: Feb 05, 2018 11:36:12 am
      We can sit here and discuss who we prefer in the middle of the park out of can, milner, hendo, gini and Ox all we like but the fact is none of them are good enough for Liverpool.

      They all have some positives or strengths to their game but each of them have big weaknesses too. The main one being consistency. They're all inconsistent regardless who is your favourite.

      They all perform at a 6/10 each week. At best a 7. And then occasionally (but rarely) we will see an 8 or a 9 from some of them.

      We badly need a couple of centre mids. Keita is a start. I've seen quite a bit of Keita and I'm convinced he will be a huge success here. He will be delivering 8/9 out of 10 performances each week. So that's one.

      We need another centre mid to come in alongside Keita. A proper defensive midfielder who will give us some bite. Lallana can fill the 10 role, Keita the 8 and then we need a nasty little b***ard playing the 6 for us.

      Can will be off I think. I also think it's time Milner called it a day here and he moves on to play more regular football.

      That leaves the Ox, hendo and gini. I'd keep all three but I think we should be going into next season with all of them as squad players. 

      If we go into next season with those three in our starting 11 then we will continue to fall short. They're just not good enough. They're not top standard. All 3 can play a role within the squad but they shouldn't be starting 11.







      fckmediocrity
      • Forum Billy Liddell
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #693: Feb 05, 2018 11:46:12 am

      For the second penalty, anyone who thinks it did needs to give their head a wobble. In real time it just looked like Lamela dived into Van Dijk. With the benefit of close up camera angles, you can clearly see him going down before contact is even made. Diving aside, if that's a penalty then Football is truly dead because no team is ever going to finish the game with eleven men. It was a pathetic decision, but sadly one not atypical to the increasingly poor standards of refereeing in this country. These pricks need to be wired up so everyone can hear what they say like in Rugby. Like Managers do, they should have to go on television with a post-match interview and justify those decisions. Until they do, it won't change.


      Have you seen the linesman's angle ?

      https://twitter.com/AA_Richards/status/960226097303576576

      I'm sorry but if that's Vertonghen hacking Salah down we would all scream for a penalty.. don't let confirmation bias cloud your judgement  :)
      HScRed1
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #694: Feb 05, 2018 11:53:36 am
      Have you seen the linesman's angle ?

      https://twitter.com/AA_Richards/status/960226097303576576

      I'm sorry but if that's Vertonghen hacking Salah down we would all scream for a penalty.. don't let confirmation bias cloud your judgement  :)

      I think we have seen enough posts from you to confirm your hatred of the club!

      https://twitter.com/timessport/status/960453698630467584
      5timesacharm
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #695: Feb 05, 2018 11:54:38 am
      Have you seen the linesman's angle ?

      https://twitter.com/AA_Richards/status/960226097303576576

      I'm sorry but if that's Vertonghen hacking Salah down we would all scream for a penalty.. don't let confirmation bias cloud your judgement  :)

      Yes and he's already going down before Van Dijk touches him, touches him as a result of the f**ker jumping into him. I suggest you take a look at it in slow motion because your wrong.
      heimdall
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #696: Feb 05, 2018 12:00:07 pm
      Have you seen the linesman's angle ?

      https://twitter.com/AA_Richards/status/960226097303576576

      I'm sorry but if that's Vertonghen hacking Salah down we would all scream for a penalty.. don't let confirmation bias cloud your judgement  :)

      It is a superb dive, truly world class, he makes it look like he got the sh*t kicked out of his leg when in fact there was no contact, this lad should give up football and go over to wrestling if he can sell a move that well!
      fckmediocrity
      • Forum Billy Liddell
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #697: Feb 05, 2018 12:15:21 pm
      I think we have seen enough posts from you to confirm your hatred of the club!

      https://twitter.com/timessport/status/960453698630467584

      So what.. two other referees said there were penalties; and just because I go against the general consensus it doesn't mean I don't love the club but don't worry I'll quit posting here as this forum slowly turns into RAWK xxxxx:action-smiley-065:
      FATKOPITE10
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #698: Feb 05, 2018 12:18:27 pm
      Have you seen the linesman's angle ?

      https://twitter.com/AA_Richards/status/960226097303576576

      I'm sorry but if that's Vertonghen hacking Salah down we would all scream for a penalty.. don't let confirmation bias cloud your judgement  :)

      It's many things but a hack it certainly is not
      Norfolk Red
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #699: Feb 05, 2018 12:20:12 pm
      So what.. two other referees said there were penalties; and just because I go against the general consensus it doesn't mean I don't love the club but don't worry I'll quit posting here as this forum slowly turns into RAWK xxxxx:action-smiley-065:

      Bye bye, and don't slam the door on the way out.
      fields of anny rd
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #700: Feb 05, 2018 12:33:35 pm
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #701: Feb 05, 2018 12:43:39 pm
      Yes and he's already going down before Van Dijk touches him, touches him as a result of the f**ker jumping into him. I suggest you take a look at it in slow motion because your wrong.

      "Van Dijk did not really kick Erik Lamela, the Spurs player just inserted himself between the defender and the ball." - Paul Wilson in The Guardian. That side view video makes it even more clear that it is no penalty. Lamela is not even moving toward the ball. Outrage.

      Theft.
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #702: Feb 05, 2018 12:55:30 pm
      We can sit here and discuss who we prefer in the middle of the park out of can, milner, hendo, gini and Ox all we like but the fact is none of them are good enough for Liverpool.

      They all have some positives or strengths to their game but each of them have big weaknesses too. The main one being consistency. They're all inconsistent regardless who is your favourite.

      They all perform at a 6/10 each week. At best a 7. And then occasionally (but rarely) we will see an 8 or a 9 from some of them.

      We badly need a couple of centre mids. Keita is a start. I've seen quite a bit of Keita and I'm convinced he will be a huge success here. He will be delivering 8/9 out of 10 performances each week. So that's one.

      We need another centre mid to come in alongside Keita. A proper defensive midfielder who will give us some bite. Lallana can fill the 10 role, Keita the 8 and then we need a nasty little b***ard playing the 6 for us.

      Can will be off I think. I also think it's time Milner called it a day here and he moves on to play more regular football.

      That leaves the Ox, hendo and gini. I'd keep all three but I think we should be going into next season with all of them as squad players. 

      If we go into next season with those three in our starting 11 then we will continue to fall short. They're just not good enough. They're not top standard. All 3 can play a role within the squad but they shouldn't be starting 11.

      Agree with this about the midfield players. Keita will replace one of those three. Kind of thinking the biggest money signing will be a midfielder to play alongside or just behind Keita. Then that attacking midfield position will be interesting to see what happens there...not sure exactly what he has planned, but Ox is going to have to really step up his performances to convince that he is the right fit for that role. It'd be great if he can do it, but seeing is believing.

       
      FL Red
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #703: Feb 05, 2018 12:55:50 pm
      That's the only way a small minded team can win anything. Celebrating like they won the title after a complete hose job.

      I'd be embarrassed if our players  (or manager) ever acted like that in that situation. 
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #704: Feb 05, 2018 12:57:24 pm
      So what.. two other referees said there were penalties; and just because I go against the general consensus it doesn't mean I don't love the club but don't worry I'll quit posting here as this forum slowly turns into RAWK xxxxx:action-smiley-065:

      Bye Felicia.
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #705: Feb 05, 2018 01:02:26 pm
      The Echo transcript of the sideline discussion says Moss asks the 4th "have you got anything from TV?"

      Is that allowed?

      (this was for the 1st pen, btw).
      redindian
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #706: Feb 05, 2018 01:09:36 pm
      That's the only way a small minded team can win anything. Celebrating like they won the title after a complete hose job.

      I'd be embarrassed if our players  (or manager) ever acted like that in that situation. 

      It is an important point for them and hence it is understandable. The season before last we celebrated a draw against WBA like we had won the title (although they were different situations)
      ruthcity
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #707: Feb 05, 2018 01:14:11 pm
      The Echo transcript of the sideline discussion says Moss asks the 4th "have you got anything from TV?"

      Is that allowed?

      (this was for the 1st pen, btw).


      Looking for answers there, from another pair of eyes. But we cannot be sure what was told to him. He just gave the pen after that. Question is whether he is allowed to ask another official.
      HamannsTheMan
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #708: Feb 05, 2018 02:28:45 pm
      That's the only way a small minded team can win anything. Celebrating like they won the title after a complete hose job.

      I'd be embarrassed if our players  (or manager) ever acted like that in that situation.

      To be fair though, they deserved atleast a point. They were the better team.

      They were probably celebrating their performance more than anything, not many come to anfield and boss us off the pitch.

      Despite the officials being a gang of cu*ts, it would have been robbery if we got the 3 points yesterday.
      Kopite78
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #709: Feb 05, 2018 02:32:04 pm
      To be fair though, they deserved atleast a point. They were the better team.

      They were probably celebrating their performance more than anything, not many come to anfield and boss us off the pitch.

      Despite the officials being a gang of cu*ts, it would have been robbery if we got the 3 points yesterday.

      Do you really think they bossed us off the park mate?

      I was Anny road end and thought we were the better side first half, they were better second half

      Point the right result for me
      ORCHARD RED
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #710: Feb 05, 2018 03:21:57 pm
      To be fair though, they deserved atleast a point. They were the better team.

      They were probably celebrating their performance more than anything, not many come to anfield and boss us off the pitch.

      Despite the officials being a gang of cu*ts, it would have been robbery if we got the 3 points yesterday.

      Spurs looked like school boys in the first half, totally one sided,  we were unlucky not to be further ahead.
      Second half we invited them onto by sitting back and playing over the top balls to Salah who was man marked by a bigger man.
      I think we did enough for 3 points over all.
      « Last Edit: Feb 05, 2018 03:58:43 pm by ORCHARD RED »
      Magillionare
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #711: Feb 05, 2018 03:49:28 pm
      Have you seen the linesman's angle ?

      https://twitter.com/AA_Richards/status/960226097303576576

      I'm sorry but if that's Vertonghen hacking Salah down we would all scream for a penalty.. don't let confirmation bias cloud your judgement  :)

      Look at Lamela. How many times does he look at the ball. How many times does he look at VvD.

      He waits for VvD to clear the ball and throws himself not at the ball but at VvD.
      bmck
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      Re: Liverpool 2-2 Tottenham Hotspur: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #712: Feb 05, 2018 04:09:51 pm
      Still pissed off with Lamela after that dive.
      Doesn't get any better.
      Can 'maybe' understand how a mistake was made on the day, from a diff angle it looks a peno -- but after seeing replays with better angles, to not admit the mistake afterward, and possibly punish Lamela for the dive ... rubs salt in.

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