Paris St Germain 2-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion

With all due respect mate......I’m not sure that scans but I get your drift

  Thought it was DLPM. 

But seriously, I don't see a problem with people criticising Henderson for an inept midfield display. For me the only debate was who was worse - Hendo or Gini? Either way there's problems there against opponents of a high standard which I don't believe they have the capabilities to handle.

Fair enough, and I don't have a problem with criticising him either.
But he gets criticised almost every game, moreso than the others, even when he's by no means the worst performer.
When we play with Gini/Hendo/Milner in the middle, we can lack creativity and forward drive against the better sides, that's not news - Keita was supposed to help with that, but imho he's not shown enough for us yet - so Jürgen still has to go with those 3 in the middle sometimes [plus AOC injured, and I'm not sure Lallana will ever get back to his best form for us] - and out of all of that lot, Hendo gets most stick.
Last night Firmino was awful, and has been poor for quite a while, don't see the same aimed at him for his performances. Don't think Hendo was any worse than Salah yest, though Mane did well.  Gini wasn't great. Don't think Keita added much when he came on. Studge or Shaq had no impact.
But Hendo still gets most airplay.

What the f**k is a DPLM ?! Do you play to many computer games or something ? Zones ?

Henderson was the defending sitting midfielder

Marquinhos was their defending sitting midfielder

Verratti and Di Maria were their attacking creative centre Mids

Gini and Milner were our attacking creative centre Mids

DPLM - Jesus h Christ

Verratti was playing deeper, not as an attacking centre mid. Most of his touches were on their own half.
There was one instance Verratti got the ball between their defenders and made Firmino, arguably one of the best forwards in terms of pressing in the world, look very silly indeed. I imagine Henderson in that situation would have passed it back desperately to someone - anyone, really, even if that person was under pressure - rather than open up space with some technical skill.

Henderson is a good player. But he's definitely replaceable, and there's definite scope for improvement there. I don't get all those heated debates about a player that is anything but exciting, or really deserving of such passion. The debates about him have become even more boring than the player himself.

Imagine we had Verratti in the Henderson role week in week out. Christ I hate all the sh*te Hendo gets but last night the amount of times he played the safe sideways pass or first time pass back to one of the centre halves drove me mad.

It gave PSG time to get back into shape every time. He never drove forward or tried a pass into the feet of Salah or Firmino.

Fair enough, and I don't have a problem with criticising him either.
But he gets criticised almost every game, moreso than the others, even when he's by no means the worst performer.
When we play with Gini/Hendo/Milner in the middle, we can lack creativity and forward drive against the better sides, that's not news - Keita was supposed to help with that, but imho he's not shown enough for us yet - so Jürgen still has to go with those 3 in the middle sometimes [plus AOC injured, and I'm not sure Lallana will ever get back to his best form for us] - and out of all of that lot, Hendo gets most stick.
Last night Firmino was awful, and has been poor for quite a while, don't see the same aimed at him for his performances. Don't think Hendo was any worse than Salah yest, though Mane did well.  Gini wasn't great. Don't think Keita added much when he came on. Studge or Shaq had no impact.
But Hendo still gets most airplay.

Damage had been done by the time the subs came on and PSG had gone full on low block.
It was the first half capitulation from the midfield that caused the damage.

What do you expect Bobby and Salah to do if they are not getting the ball until 2-3 players are on them.

Sick and tired of seeing Hendo or Milner launch a hopeful punt onto Salah’s head 

2nd half was better than the first, but still wasn't great.

Mane had a good 2nd half, as did Robertson. Pretty much all our threat came down their side. Mo disappeared in the 2nd half - mainly down to Gomez and Milner probably under instruction to keep the door shut defensively. Firmino continues to be out of form. Hendo had a good 2nd half, despite no doubt being the usual suspect from many on here. So did VVD. Subs were positive from Jürgen, but only Keita really did much. Gave Allisson MOTM.

The main concern is just that we continue to lack our old intensity. Up to the Napoli game we were playing well, but it seemed to knock our confidence a bit, and we haven't really got it back. I also get that Jürgen seems to be trying to get us to vary the tempo more and manage games better, which I actually agree we needed to do, but maybe we are still coming to terms with getting the balance right, and are playing too conservatively now. I'd like to see us getting back that very high tempo start to games - catching teams cold and ruffling their composure with our intense press. Then slow it down as appropriate. We are too pedestrian right now. Hard to tell how much it is tactical, psychological or physical.

Out of interest in what way did Henderson have a good second half, he didn't get sent off again, I guess we can count that as a plus but beyond that I didn't count a single defense splitting pass or forward run linking with the forwards or is that not the role of a midfielder these days?

I don't mind the odd lapse or two, but it does happen a lot with Hendo, however, it also doesn't help with how cautious we have been when using 3 man midfield setup this season.

What I don't understand is, why wouldn't we use the strengths of our midfielders and have them more involved with our attack by playing higher up the pitch and pressing the f**k out of the opposition early on? There is no better industrial midfield in world football when we have Wijnaldum, Hendo and Milner in midfield, so why not have them play on the front foot and to their strengths instead of being cautious?

The faithful fans are restless, there's widespread discontentment on the matter in many forums and getting very serious and Klopp has to be careful, otherwise the tide will turn against him.  What i read at other forums made us looked like angels here. What i read somewhere a source wrote the owners will not sanction another big money move bcos Klopp has bought a number of players but persists with the dead woods.

Damage had been done by the time the subs came on and PSG had gone full on low block.
It was the first half capitulation from the midfield that caused the damage.

What do you expect Bobby and Salah to do if they are not getting the ball until 2-3 players are on them.

Sick and tired of seeing Hendo or Milner launch a hopeful punt onto Salah’s head 

Nail on the head there, the issue we face is there is no creativity in a midfield three of Henderson, Milner and Wijnaldum, 2 of those players are negative and/or immobile (Hendo and Milner) and the third Wigjnaldum seems to be under strict instructions not to run with the ball, because we can all see from Netherlands games that he is capable of doing that.
The fault here is Klopp who seems to have lost his way after Buvac left and be reverting to some sort of ultra negative, dull, playing style just lumping balls up the front three and hoping for a miracle, if we play a poor side it works fine as we can add our full backs to the mix but against good opposition they get pinned back as our midfield is overrun and the forwards are easily frozen out of the game.

in summary BRING BACK BUVAC ore bring in someone who understand how to play attacking football because Jürgen on his own has lost the plot!!!

The faithful fans are restless, there's widespread discontentment on the matter in many forums and getting very serious and Klopp has to be careful, otherwise the tide will turn against him.  What i read at other forums made us looked like angels here. What i read somewhere a source wrote the owners will not sanction another big money move bcos Klopp has bought a number of players but persists with the dead woods.

Which is a fair assessment, it is baffling that after identifying that the midfield needs strengthening and spending a lot of money he sticks with the worst midfielders we have, its really weird. It may well be that if we play Fabinho, Keita and Shaq that it takes a few games for them to settle in properly but when they do we will be a far better team, kind of a one step back to surge forwards type thing.

there's widespread discontentment on the matter in many forums and getting very serious and Klopp has to be careful, otherwise the tide will turn against him.

https://www.lfcreds.com/reds/index.php?action=leaguetable

The faithful fans are restless, there's widespread discontentment on the matter in many forums and getting very serious and Klopp has to be careful, otherwise the tide will turn against him.  What i read at other forums made us looked like angels here. What i read somewhere a source wrote the owners will not sanction another big money move bcos Klopp has bought a number of players but persists with the dead woods.

Sorry but that’s a pile of nonsense

We are unbeaten in the league , we have prob had one really poor performance away at Red Star , were too cautious at Napoli and just beaten by the better team

We are 10 points further on from last season - this point last year we lost 2 games and drew 5 - 16 points lost - sat 6th in the table 13 points behind City , go and check the table out

The overreacting right now is poor - you would think we were struggling bottom half of the table

People need a good slap and a wake up and look at the bigger picture - the reactions after the defeat are childish and pathetic and full of self entitlement

We are progressing as each season goes by

in summary BRING BACK BUVAC ore bring in someone who understand how to play attacking football because Jürgen on his own has lost the plot!!!

Well said. That's exactly what many worldwide fans are saying now. Why play the trio when it has proven time and again they're hopeless moving forward or defending and against PSG a highly attacking side is simply courting trouble. Jürgen "lost the plot", tell me that 6 moths ago and i will defend Klopp all the way but i think the confidence of many knowledgeable fans out there have eroded badly and it has come to a point where Klopp's tactical knowledge is suspect. Did anyone watch klopp's interview after the game? He looked shell shocked. Well, that appears to me to be the case. PSG is there to he beaten and we have simply asked to be beaten with that midfield trio and tactics. Will the trio minus hendo perform differently under another manager? Yes, i think they would. We saw what Gini can do for Holland while Milner is a workhorse and he will create something along the way. As for hendo, i'm not sure whether there's any turning back for him as he is already so used to the side and backpasses.

Sorry but that’s a pile of nonsense

We are unbeaten in the league , we have prob had one really poor performance away at Red Star , were too cautious at Napoli and just beaten by the better team

We are 10 points further on from last season - this point last year we lost 2 games and drew 5 - 16 points lost - sat 6th in the table 13 points behind City , go and check the table out

The overreacting right now is poor - you would think we were struggling bottom half of the table

People need a good slap and a wake up and look at the bigger picture - the reactions after the defeat are childish and pathetic and full of self entitlement

We are progressing as each season goes by

Sorry but its not an overeaction, we are a fairly boring team to watch at the moment and only being saved by having a fabulous defense. We have now lost 5 away matches in Europe on the bounce, the last three without even putting up a fight, they weren't even close. The worrying thing is that the main problem is that its the manager and his team selection and tactics which are to blame, if we lose or draw against Napoli or fail to win by 2 goals, which is all very possible as he'll almost guaranteed go with his tried and failed trio of Milner Hendo and Gini, then it will be a massive dent to our confidence and I can see us starting to fall back in the league as well.

Sorry but that’s a pile of nonsense

We are unbeaten in the league , we have prob had one really poor performance away at Red Star , were too cautious at Napoli and just beaten by the better team

We are 10 points further on from last season - this point last year we lost 2 games and drew 5 - 16 points lost - sat 6th in the table 13 points behind City , go and check the table out

The overreacting right now is poor - you would think we were struggling bottom half of the table

People need a good slap and a wake up and look at the bigger picture - the reactions after the defeat are childish and pathetic and full of self entitlement

We are progressing as each season goes by

Don't defend something that is undefendable. Did you actually watch all the games closely or that you just watched the highlights or the score?

You have said it yourself  :  red star, napoli psg. Coincidence?

Did you watch klopp's post match interview? He knew he has fecked up big time.

Your opinion and my opinion is not important, read what the majority has to say out there about klopp's tactics plus some pundits. All of them can't be wrong.

 

in summary BRING BACK BUVAC ore bring in someone who understand how to play attacking football because Jürgen on his own has lost the plot!!!

What did we win with Buvac?

We are unbeaten in the league without him, Yes I’m disappointed we lost last night but destiny in still in our own hands at our own F***ing ground, if you have never experienced a European night at Anfiled for such an important game then best buckle up when Nalpoli arrive...

Jeez, some knee jerkers out today..

Klopp lost the plot.. ffs..😡

In a sense we do not have a defined playmaker. Not a lament for the good old Gerrard days but a view that the midfield lacks definition. Doesn't have a clear sense of purpose. Is that down to Henderson not leading from the front or a combination of choping and changing. The fact that maybe Keita or Fabinho haven't stamped their authority, haven't really arrived.

We have lost Coutinho,Can and the OX effectively. The situation is crying out for a leader to emerge, take control and dominate. Lead the team.

Have we got such a player in the squad?

Paul Tompkins has gone into full meltdown, and basically said the ref was bribed.

He was completely incompetent, out of his depth, overly influenced by PSG etc but bribed?

Best part of his performance was when he gave Neymar a free kick for kicking the ground and falling over as he was trying to shoot.
Unbelievable.

In a sense we do not have a defined playmaker. Not a lament for the good old Gerrard days but a view that the midfield lacks definition. Doesn't have a clear sense of purpose. Is that down to Henderson not leading from the front or a combination of choping and changing. The fact that maybe Keita or Fabinho haven't stamped their authority, haven't really arrived.

We have lost Coutinho,Can and the OX effectively. The situation is crying out for a leader to emerge, take control and dominate. Lead the team.

Have we got such a player in the squad?

Klopp's system calls for a runner from midfield.
It was Ox last season, and is now supposed to be Keita.
Milner and Wijnaldum have both tried to do it with varying degrees of success, but neither do it consistently.

Paul Tompkins has gone into full meltdown, and basically said the ref was bribed.

He was completely incompetent, out of his depth, overly influenced by PSG etc but bribed?

Best part of his performance was when he gave Neymar a free kick for kicking the ground and falling over as he was trying to shoot.
Unbelievable.

Could be some truth to agree in what Tomkins is saying..I mean trying to give a corner for a pen only to be over ruled by the linesman..& also we should have had a second pen when Silva jumped into Mane...No red for Veratti..One incompetent pr**k that ref..

Would it surprise me the corrupt powers to be are lining up a Man City v PSG oligarchy F**k fest..No..

Im very at ease with our situation in the champions league. 2 reasons

1) If any team in Europe knows how to get a required result in a 1 off big game its us. Anfield on another massive European night...bring it

2) Should we fail to qualify ill take it as the fact is we lost all awsy games. Red star is unforgiveable. Last night we had no shot on target bar the peno. Not good enough

Ill take our scolding if we misd out...And ill console myself with the belief that it will be most likely beneficial to our league challenge

Klopp's system calls for a runner from midfield.
It was Ox last season, and is now supposed to be Keita.
Milner and Wijnaldum have both tried to do it with varying degrees of success, but neither do it consistently.

Well I would say Keita needs to play. Strong player coming from deep and from " in the hole". Our league form has held up but we've been found out, to a degree in Europe. Klopp needs to be bold. Could he even play Keita,Shaq and Gini in midfield. Take the thing by the scruff etc.

Could be some truth to agree in what Tomkins is saying..I mean trying to give a corner for a pen only to be over ruled by the linesman..& also we should have had a second pen when Silva jumped into Mane...No red for Veratti..One incompetent pr**k that ref..

Would it surprise me the corrupt powers to be are lining up a Man City v PSG oligarchy F**k fest..No..

Not for me mate.

I mean the ref was really, really awful, one of the worst I've seen, but bribery?
Maybe I'm being naive here, but I just can't see it, it'd be too difficult to hide.
Tompkins actually came out and said "he'll be driving a Ferrari next week" 

Which is a fair assessment, it is baffling that after identifying that the midfield needs strengthening and spending a lot of money he sticks with the worst midfielders we have, its really weird. It may well be that if we play Fabinho, Keita and Shaq that it takes a few games for them to settle in properly but when they do we will be a far better team, kind of a one step back to surge forwards type thing.

That's exactly what many are saying out there, why use the trio when they have failed miserably before, moreso against a highly skillful PSG. It's just like providing a knife to someone to stick it into us. The more I assess the trio the more I;m led to believe the fault lies with Klopp itself. Take for instance Gini, I don;t think he is a poor player based on what I saw in the Holland game. He can move very deep into the opposition defence and he's simply being instructed not to attack too deep, that's where Salah and Mane lost the support. Fabinho, keita and Shaq, will they fair any worst, no, i don;t think so. How about Milner, is he a poor player? No, i don;t think so either, did Klopp watch his Man City days and make use of his strengths instead of asking him to provide cover for the defence. If Klopp persists with the trio and the defensive tactics, I am afraid we could loose Salah, Mane or Firminho or all 3 altogether comes the end of the season.