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      Q. LFC Man of the Match v West Ham?

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      Voting closed: Feb 08, 2019 09:50:46 pm

      West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion

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      HScRed1
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #925: Feb 05, 2019 07:56:31 am
      One of the stats that can be misleading in my opinion. It measures completed passes.

      Doesn’t - for example - pick up ALL the passes 2-3 feet wrong side of both full backs and the cbs that weren’t intercepted but slowed us down.

      He’s a great player. Big, big part of why we were so pedestrian last night.

      Yeah maybe but I doubt passes back to the CB’s cost us last night and like you say it seems to be a team torpor.
      Scotia
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #926: Feb 05, 2019 08:01:14 am
      Yeah maybe but I doubt passes back to the CB’s cost us last night and like you say it seems to be a team torpor.

      I love the lad - he’s a smashing player - but last night it was him who frustrated me more than the other two. We needed a higher tempo and everything he touched seemed to me to go wrong side and let them get their shape back.

      Oh - and this isn’t aimed at you incidentally - but isn’t it funny how “costly” those passes back to cbs are when Hendo plays them (according to many)......f**k me a few even had him to blame for Alisson’s dribbling f**k up at the King Power.

      We’ll sort out Bournemouth then the world will look different.
      barney73
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #927: Feb 05, 2019 08:05:47 am
      If you think it's gone from 5 points to 3, you can. I see it as increasing from 2 points before ko to 3 atm. Therefore the lead has increased.
      Yes and we're playing terrible from. Start of the tear and feeling pressure in Feb what be like in May. Don't improve 100% city will easily win the league. There favourites again. The fact we only won a league cup in 13 years is putting extra pressure on the club to win silverware. Definitely will not happen unless we are playing at top of our form till end of the season
      barney73
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #928: Feb 05, 2019 08:08:53 am
      Your living in a dream world if you think we're going to turn it all round against Bournemouth. First of all if we pay like we been bournemouth will turn us over just 2 wins in 2019 and playing crap. Firmino and a few need a good kick up the arse to waken them up

      Oh - and this isn’t aimed at you incidentally - but isn’t it funny how “costly” those passes back to cbs are when Hendo plays them (according to many)......f**k me a few even had him to blame for Alisson’s dribbling f**k up at the King Power.

      We’ll sort out Bournemouth then the world will look different.
      Scotia
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #929: Feb 05, 2019 08:11:54 am

      Fancy tidying that up fella since the stuff at the top is yours and not mine?

      We will beat Bournemouth.

      German_Panzer
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #930: Feb 05, 2019 08:19:32 am
      1. This is all on injuries and nobody is to blame. You cannot expect the same level of performance with all these vital guys out: Gomez, Lovren, TAA, Gini, Ox and Hendo. Jürgen did the best with what he has.

      2. Worrying for Daniel that Origi got his chance in front of him or was he injured?

      3. Clyne's loan decision was based on decency. The guy is a good international player and had to swallow to be behind a 20y. old, at some point you gotta give him something back, also to set a sign for other players. You know how the saying goes: how you treat them, they treat you.

      4. One thing is clear: a successful side needs to adress the depth issue. You can see that in today's football it's not so much who can feature the best 11, but who has the best 15 overall. Depth wins championships.

      5. On a positive note: We are still up 3 points and it was always a given that a dry spell will occur. It also means we'll stay in striking distance for a while. If City did lead us by 2 it could be over soon, but as it is we are competitive for the next weeks and a lot can change in that time window.
      HScRed1
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #931: Feb 05, 2019 08:21:53 am
      I love the lad - he’s a smashing player - but last night it was him who frustrated me more than the other two. We needed a higher tempo and everything he touched seemed to me to go wrong side and let them get their shape back.

      Oh - and this isn’t aimed at you incidentally - but isn’t it funny how “costly” those passes back to cbs are when Hendo plays them (according to many)......f**k me a few even had him to blame for Alisson’s dribbling f**k up at the King Power.

      We’ll sort out Bournemouth then the world will look different.

      Biggest issue for me last night was Firmino any time we built up a bit of momentum he turned over the ball.

      Which incidentally meant a counter attack.

      I personally thought Fab was fine. We only had one decent outlet last night in Robbo with Milner showing his age trying to get up and down the flank.
      Salah also like Firmino was so careless with the ball.
      We managed to get the ball consistently up to the front 3 maybe a bit slower than usual bu apart from Mane the other two looked completely off the boil.
      SM
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #932: Feb 05, 2019 08:24:56 am
      Our lightning counter attacks that put the fear into teams is non existent at the moment.

      When we get the chance to break the midfield move it too slowly.

      We have to sort this out soon or we will face more games like this one.
      MIRO
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #933: Feb 05, 2019 08:36:21 am
      We didn't lose.

      Still top with three points ahead.

      Reasons To Be Cheerful.
      Scotia
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #934: Feb 05, 2019 08:39:18 am
      Biggest issue for me last night was Firmino any time we built up a bit of momentum he turned over the ball.

      Which incidentally meant a counter attack.

      I personally thought Fab was fine. We only had one decent outlet last night in Robbo with Milner showing his age trying to get up and down the flank.
      Salah also like Firmino was so careless with the ball.
      We managed to get the ball consistently up to the front 3 maybe a bit slower than usual bu apart from Mane the other two looked completely off the boil.

      Bobby was poor - agreed.
      bmck
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #935: Feb 05, 2019 08:39:47 am
      Voice of reason.  But we are short of squad quality, and that is likely to derail our ambitions.  When's Trent back?  What a difference that would make.

      Don't get me wrong, agree we were poor on the night and the form of some players and injuries are a concern.
      REALLY could be doing with 3 points against Bournemouth...
      SM
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #936: Feb 05, 2019 08:39:58 am
      We didn't lose.

      Still top with three points ahead.

      Reasons To Be Cheerful.

      Yes were top but come Saturday we wont be.

      There are clear issues at the moment which have to be addressed, we have to start winning immediately and gain some confidence.

      Our attack has to start functioning.
      Scottbot
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #937: Feb 05, 2019 08:45:55 am
      Lallana in Pyjamas
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #938: Feb 05, 2019 08:47:16 am
      When do they present City with the trophy ? Wednesday is it ?
      barney73
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #939: Feb 05, 2019 08:55:11 am
      HOW sick and sad it is that Everton supporters in February say they all be supporting City tomorrow night and United fans saying the same thing when city visit old Trafford. Unbelievable. True fans?? 🙄
      [
      6stringer
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #940: Feb 05, 2019 09:06:57 am
      So much for warm weather training trips to Dubai.
      Half of them have the shits and most of them are playing like they've still got their flip flops on  >:(

      Not quick enough on the counter these last two games.
      It takes us 15 passes to get up to the halfway line these days.

      Teams like West Ham and Leicester put 5 in midfield and just suffocate our front 3, the amount of times I'm seeing Firmino, Mane and Salah retreating back to the halfway line to pick the ball up troubles me.

      Milner is NOT a right back !!

      Not in a good mood today folks !! :f_steam:

      barney73
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #941: Feb 05, 2019 09:16:42 am
      Fancy tidying that up fella since the stuff at the top is yours and not mine?

      We will beat Bournemouth.
      Play like we have recently then no chance.
      waltonl4
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #942: Feb 05, 2019 09:17:22 am
      Not the best performance but still another point on the board towards the title. Maybe people will understand how Hendo provides tempo to the team and how much work Gini does he is like a one man wrecking ball in the middle of the park.
      Everytime I see Naby go off on a run you just know he will lose it and leave us exposed and he did it time after time I kept seeing Robbo having to turn and race back as we had no cover at left back.
      A few niggles to think about but if we can get to 30 games still in the hunt either just in front or just behind will do for me. Let us not forget we are competing against the best football team ever in the EPL .
      Scotia
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #943: Feb 05, 2019 09:27:20 am
      Play like we have recently then no chance.

      Behave.

      We’re the best team in the League.

      Elite performance across 2/3 of a season.

      First blip.

      Get some perspective or your head will explode before Easter.
      heimdall
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #944: Feb 05, 2019 09:29:38 am
      Our lightning counter attacks that put the fear into teams is non existent at the moment.

      When we get the chance to break the midfield move it too slowly.

      We have to sort this out soon or we will face more games like this one.


      This is 100% correct, apart from that spell in December we have been very slow in attack all season, extremely predictable. There have been very few times this season where I've gone WOW, what a great attack we have, whereas with Citeh I think that most times I watch them.
      I said it before the game and I'll say it again, until we get our defence back to full force we need to switch back to the full throttle heavy metal football of last season, no more of this patient build up play bullshit, a number of times yesterday we passed it safely sideways rather than chipping the ball over the top or going for a dynamic pass and turn and run against their defenders, I just worry that Klopp is to stubborn to change things around.

      I also have to be very critical of selling Clyne, which was just a ridiculous decision, and also the jolly to Dubai in the middle of the season, it is clear that something went very wrong over there as the lads have come back in a completely lazy unfocussed frame of mind, I mean every single one of them is worse now than they were before that trip with the exception of Mane.

      I really worry for the rest of this season, if we don't get a win against Bournemouth, then we have Man Utd away followed by Bayern, our season could be more or less fu**ed in a few weeks time, its crunch time and time for Klopp to have a rethink on strategy and start kicking some arse!!
      HamannsTheMan
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #945: Feb 05, 2019 09:30:55 am
      Purposely didn't come on the forum after the Leicester game because I couldn't be bothered giving my take on the game and then being quoted by the usual people who always wear their tinted specs and are unable to see any criticisms or concerns.

      Back to back poor results and back to back poor performances have made me want to say a few things though.

      First things first, I was actually very happy with the starting 11 last night. I've been waiting patiently for months for Keita to start alongside Fabinho without the interference of Henderson, gini or Milner. I thought it was a great opportunity for naby to play in his normal position and to play his own game. I was also happy seeing lallana coming in as the 10, something we've been missing having that attacking midfielder in there.  If we had a fit squad to choose from my midfield three would be fab, Keita and ox so I was very excited to see fab Keita and lallana play.

      Anyway, the game gets under way and we're all over the place. West Ham had a couple of shots from range, two narrowly went wide and one Alisson made a good save on. They ran through us far too easily. Lallana was clearly blowing out his arse and I was very disappointed with Keitas failure to track back and/or put a foot in. Regaining possession is one of his strengths but I didn't see any of that last night.

      We took the lead by default really. Some good play by lallana who played Milner in, How the linesman played Milner on side I'll never know, but he squared it to mane who turned and slotted. Great goal but it was against the run of play really because we had been really sh*t up until then.

      Wasn't too long until West Ham equalised and if were being honest they deserved it. West Ham looked dangerous on set pieces throughout the half so it wasn't a surprise their goal came from one. What has happened to us? We've looked solid at the back all season and now we look a shambles.

      Naby will get the blame for not going with Antonio but looking at the replays, it's clearly robertsons man who doesn't go with him and is ball watching. Naby is also blocked off by his man too so he couldn't have gone with Antonio anyway.

      HT 1-1. Very fortunate to be level at the break and that was one of the worst 45 mins we've seen from us this season.

      Second half begins and I thought we were slightly better but that's not really much of a compliment because we couldn't have gotten any worse. Our play was very lethargic, build up was far too slow and we were too relaxed on the ball.  West Ham were well drilled and made it difficult but there was just no urgency from us at all.

      The game fizzles out without either team really doing enough to win it. Origi could have stole the points with the last kick of the game but other than that we didn't threaten their goal.

      Very poor performance from us and the performance is more concerning than the result for me. Few things to comment on.

      Milner has finally lost his legs. A great professional who has done a superb job over the years tracking wingers both for Man City and when he played left back for us. But he's come up against zaha and Anderson in recent weeks and I know both are quick, but they've dragged Milner all over the place and he was unable to keep up. He's been poor going forward too. I've got a soft spot for Milner and I always do for players like him who always give it their best and wear their heart on their sleeve but he is a problem for us at right back right now.

      The centre halves are a problem too. Van dijk has been poor the last two games but I'm putting that down to his partner, matip.  I prefer matip to Lovren but for somebody of his size, he's just so weak and he's terrible in the air too. We look so feeble on set pieces now and always look like we're going to concede.

      I was wrong about the midfield three. The midfield that started last night was poor. I thought it would have great balance but they were just all over the place. We badly missed gini, and to some extent Henderson because even though I don't rate Henderson as a player, at least he keeps to his position. There was too much space for West Ham last night that Fabinho couldn't handle all by himself, lallana blowing out his arse and Keita struggling to get involved in the first 45 were a big problem for us.

      I don't like criticising the front three because we all know how good they are and how often they win us matches. I thought mane played well and he was the only one who looked bothered at times to me. He ran his socks off last night and he took his goal superbly.  I thought Bobby had a terrible game though, I lost count how many times he lost possession. It was one of the worst games I've seen him play.  Salah was also poor but even when he has a poor game he still nearly scores one or two.

      We will drop down to second now because let's be honest, city will smash Everton tomorrow, so it's a new kind of pressure to experience. It will be tough for the lads to lead for so long to go back to second so we will soon see if this squad of players have what it takes mentally.

      If the wheels fall off now then you've got to ask why Clyne was allowed to leave and why no other players were brought in in January. But anyway, jurgen needs to make a couple of changes for the Bournemouth game and go back to basics. The pressure we've put ourselves under now is huge because all of our fixtures have now become must wins.

      Come on reds sort it out.

      heimdall
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #946: Feb 05, 2019 09:35:57 am
      Behave.

      We’re the best team in the League.

      Elite performance across 2/3 of a season.

      First blip.

      Get some perspective or your head will explode before Easter.

      We most certainly are not the best team at the moment, in the last 2 games we've been very lucky to get any points at all. You have to look at current form rather than the league position, we are starting to slip really badly. Even in the games which Citeh lost they were still competing and you could argue a bit unlucky not to draw or even win whereas we are scraping a win or a draw at the moment, there have not been enough games this season where we have completely bossed the game and its a worry. Our style of play is far to slow and it works if you have a rock solid defence but we don't and won't for the rest of the season. IN fact our defence is currently back to last seasons level, pre Virgil!
      « Last Edit: Feb 05, 2019 09:40:34 am by heimdall »
      Diego LFC
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #947: Feb 05, 2019 09:41:48 am
      Yeah yeah yeah, this team has issues, this team isn't perfect, the last two games were not great. Thank you for pointing it out. But if you want to act as if you're "just being realistic" by telling us the obvious, then what about getting a bit of perspective? Truth is the vast majority of LFC fans are acting like sad, "scarred for life" entitled tw*ts who, despite never having been in this situation before, keep mentioning past failures instead of trying to focus on what we've been doing different - and realise we've never been in this position before, and being positive here is not just wishful thinking.

      In the last 27 years or so we've been runners-up 3 times. In 2001/02, we last had the lead in the 17th round - that is, mid-December, and never recovered. By the 25th round (where we are now), we were 4th. Until very late in the season, the title race was actually between Arsenal and Man Utd; we only got ourselves in between them in the final weeks. But hey, Neil from Dublin writes on twitter that he still has nightmares about how we "bottled under pressure" with Houllier. Such a nightmare. He can hardly sleep.

      In 2008/09, we held a single point lead for about 4 weeks and lost it by the 21st round. By the 25th, we were 5 points behind the leaders. By the 27th, we would be 10 points behind and later would celebrate late goals that kept the distance in 4 points as that awoke our hopes. But Garreth from St Helens writes in the BBC comments section that he still can't get over the way we "crumbled under pressure" with Rafa.

      In 2013/14, we were 4th by now and would hold a lead for two rounds after an unlikely 11-wins run that would end abruptly. The run was always unlikely to continue and extend to a 14-wins run, which is what we would have needed for the title. But Jack from Melbourne writes on Facebook that he can't bear watching our games for fear it's "happening again" just like 2014.

      From 1992 to 2001 we never truly got very close. Same for 2003 to 2008, 2010 to 2013, 2015 up until last season. So this is it, about 27 seasons and in only three we had slightly familiar circumstances which are not truly that similar.

      This season, we got the lead in the 16th round of the Premier League. We've held to it for 9 rounds so far which already is without precedent and I have every faith that come the end of the 26th, we'll have beaten Bournemouth and will still be top as well. It's only natural that this won't be an easy ride and any team will suffer with the amount of injures we have had recently. It sure as hell isn't because of a backup right back I had almost forgotten existed or because of a single player you may want to pick as the scapegoat.

      Then you got the same people who told us that there was no way Man City would lose points to Newcastle or Crystal Palace saying with total certainty that they'll beat not just Everton but also Chelsea. If your way of coping with anxiety is by always thinking of the worst case scenario then go ahead, do it, but I'll reserve myself the right to think you're all acting as self-pitying panicky little girls. Grow some balls, have some faith. Change that defeatist mentality you're using as a way to protect your oh-so-hurt feelings because you think "we've been here before", when in fact we haven't.

      Look, I know whatever is written on a football forum won't impact on how our players perform, but the issue for me is that this same mentality is found around nearly the whole fan base everywhere, including the nervousness and anxiety that is palpable in the stadium. We've got a team that has got us to where not any other has done before.  IKIT.
      « Last Edit: Feb 05, 2019 09:46:06 am by Diego LFC »
      +12
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      waltonl4
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #948: Feb 05, 2019 09:43:38 am
      with the midfield we had out last night and no Trent or Joe in the team maybe a draw was actually a good result in the scheme of things.

      I am not at all impressed with the usual condemnation of the team and Klopp by the usual experts who seem to thing they have a right to fill a page of crap and then expect everyone to read it..that aint happening.
      We are top of the league with a 3 point gap having not really played that well since we lost the solid back line but everywhere I checked this morning we are still top of the League and the best City can do is match our points tally tomorrow night but  they have played one game more.
      I will be more than happy to win the league by 1 point.
      Scotia
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      Re: West Ham United 1-1 Liverpool: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #949: Feb 05, 2019 09:47:25 am
      We most certainly are not the best team at the moment, in the last 2 games we've been very lucky to get any points at all. You have to look at current form rather than the league position, we are starting to slip really badly. Even in the games which Citeh lost they were still competing and you could argue a bit unlucky not to draw or even win whereas we are scraping a win or a draw at the moment, there have not been enough games this season where we have completely bossed the game and its a worry, our style of play is far to slow and it works if you have a rock solid defence but we don't and won't for the rest of the season. IN fact our defence is currently back to last seasons level, pre Virgil!

      Table says we are.

      5 pts better than City since November

      OR

      4 points worse since Jan.......

      Each to their own - not telling you how to react / fret or whatever Heimy. I’m just not minded to lose my sh*t at this point.

      We’re having an unbelievable league season.

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