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      Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)

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      heimdall
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1886: Apr 26, 2021 05:06:30 pm
      ;D  you really are a piece of work considering all the injuries liverpool had this year any manager would be struggling..  :lmao:

      I'm fairly certain Leicester had even more injuries than us, next excuse?
      brezipool
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1887: Apr 26, 2021 05:09:44 pm
      I really hope you are right, I certainly know we are capable of much better than we are right now and that includes the manager and coaches.

      For sure.
      Swab
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1888: Apr 26, 2021 05:21:33 pm
      Look I guess everyone is entitled to their own opinion, no matter how crazy those ideas are


      Everyone might be entitled to their opinion, but that doesn't mean it has to be respected or taken seriously.

      If someone's opinion is obviously nonsense, they should be called out on it.

      Then again, the person you're talking about is the forum WUM, and he now has a new batch of members as an audience to play to.
      shawspeed
      • Forum Billy Liddell
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1889: Apr 26, 2021 05:29:26 pm
      I actually think that yes Pep could have won with our players, I rate Pep above Jürgen as a manager. Is it easier with a bigger budget of course it is, but lets not kid ourselves Klopp has had plenty of money to spend on players, in fact some of our purchases were far more expensive than Man City's and our squad values are not as different as some think.


      Given that about 15% of our squad value has been sat in the stands this season the available squad value is significantly lower. Once Pep has consistently won trophies managing a team in whatever league that doesn't have the largest budget and most expensive squad then he can have the respect which that would deserve. Jürgen has now done it in two different leagues.
      L4.19Times
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1890: Apr 26, 2021 05:33:51 pm
      Given that about 15% of our squad value has been sat in the stands this season the available squad value is significantly lower. Once Pep has consistently won trophies managing a team in whatever league that doesn't have the largest budget and most expensive squad then he can have the respect which that would deserve. Jürgen has now done it in two different leagues.

      I know right

      It just gives the impression of a spoilt child

      If anyone thinks that the best way to get back on track is to rip the whole thing up and start again then there is no helping them
      red trooper
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1891: Apr 26, 2021 05:37:17 pm
      I do wonder about Jürgen's mind at times, trains the players and treats them well, defends every person and takes all the flak .....and then they don't perform ! Missing decent chances ,poor defending , yes I know the injuries have been severe but it's looking like we need a team rebuild of 4 or 5 players with people like Gini wanting to leave and some players very delicate regarding injury . I think we rebuild ( assuming Jürgen doesn't walk ) and things will work out ok
      Swab
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1892: Apr 26, 2021 05:52:38 pm
      I do wonder about Jürgen's mind at times, trains the players and treats them well, defends every person and takes all the flak .....and then they don't perform ! Missing decent chances ,poor defending , yes I know the injuries have been severe but it's looking like we need a team rebuild of 4 or 5 players with people like Gini wanting to leave and some players very delicate regarding injury . I think we rebuild ( assuming Jürgen doesn't walk ) and things will work out ok

      Sorry to pick out just one part, but Klopp understands that performances fluctuate, that players aren't robots, that they get fatigued, that sometimes they're just not "on it".

      It's like the subs thing: most substitutions are planned before a match, according to various scenarios. It's not done on the fly like it was years ago.
      It's a case of "Player A is fatigued, but can do 30 minutes, so if we can we should rest him, but if we are behind, we may have to bring him on."

      Now having said that, he was pretty abrupt after the Newcastle match, but he was also right. We had more than enough chances to win it, and it's not the first time it's happened this season.
      He went with a very bold, and positive attacking lineup, possibly to get the game wrapped up so he could rest players.
      It didn't work out like that, so he changes options.
      Lallana in Pyjamas
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1893: Apr 26, 2021 05:55:37 pm
      red trooper
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1894: Apr 26, 2021 06:19:53 pm
      Sorry to pick out just one part, but Klopp understands that performances fluctuate, that players aren't robots, that they get fatigued, that sometimes they're just not "on it".

      It's like the subs thing: most substitutions are planned before a match, according to various scenarios. It's not done on the fly like it was years ago.
      It's a case of "Player A is fatigued, but can do 30 minutes, so if we can we should rest him, but if we are behind, we may have to bring him on."

      Now having said that, he was pretty abrupt after the Newcastle match, but he was also right. We had more than enough chances to win it, and it's not the first time it's happened this season.
      He went with a very bold, and positive attacking lineup, possibly to get the game wrapped up so he could rest players.
      It didn't work out like that, so he changes options.

      Point taken 👍
      shawspeed
      • Forum Billy Liddell
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1895: Apr 26, 2021 06:25:33 pm
      I'm fairly certain Leicester had even more injuries than us, next excuse?

      And what have they won this season? How far did they get in Champions League?
      bigbob75
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1896: Apr 26, 2021 06:35:42 pm
      He’ll get us back to normal. A few players he wants and less bad luck with key players for the system he plays and we’ll be back challenging next season. Can’t wait for this one to end though 😫
      tezmac
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1897: Apr 26, 2021 07:30:31 pm
      Got to get his substitutions right taking of Thiago who was running midfield and leaving Mane, Bobby or Gini on was madness, come on Jürgen we need your old self back
      heimdall
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1898: Apr 26, 2021 08:30:53 pm
      heimdall
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1899: Apr 26, 2021 08:32:19 pm
      And what have they won this season? How far did they get in Champions League?

      They weren't in the CL, they will ne next year though. They were in the Europa league until quite recently though and they are in an FA Cup final, they went further in the League cup as well.
      L4.19Times
      • Forum Roger Hunt
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1900: Apr 26, 2021 08:38:31 pm
      They weren't in the CL, they will ne next year though. They were in the Europa league until quite recently though and they are in an FA Cup final, they went further in the League cup as well.

      And they’ve got a manager who failed to do what Jürgen did when he was here

      They’d also drag their nut sacks over broken glass to ever have Jürgen manage there
      Norfolk Red
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1901: Apr 26, 2021 08:41:59 pm
      They weren't in the CL, they will ne next year though. They were in the Europa league until quite recently though and they are in an FA Cup final, they went further in the League cup as well.

      So what did they win for going further in the league cup then ?
      heimdall
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1902: Apr 26, 2021 08:43:17 pm
      And they’ve got a manager who failed to do what Jürgen did when he was here

      A Manager can't survive on past success, however fantastic it was, just ask Maureen. A manager or player is only judged on how good they are in the current season and by any objective measure Klopp has been very average this season, same as Mane and Bobby, actually Mane and Bobby have been bloody awful this season, certainly this year so far.

      Look I really hope Klopp can reinvigorate the team, but I think its more than just a few missing players, its tactics which are being countered by relegation teams, its poor team selections and subs, its just not right at the moment and normally when that happens only a change of manager can change your fortunes, and that gives me no pleasure to say, but I'm just being honest and stating my opinion.
      L4.19Times
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1903: Apr 26, 2021 08:45:01 pm
      A Manager can't survive on past success, however fantastic it was, just ask Maureen. A manager or player is only judged on how good they are in the current season and by any objective measure Klopp has been very average this season, same as Mane and Bobby, actually Mane and Bobby have been bloody awful this season, certainly this year so far.

      Look I really hope Klopp can reinvigorate the team, but I think its more than just a few missing players, its tactics which are being countered by relegation teams, its poor team selections and subs, its just not right at the moment and normally when that happens only a change of manager can change your fortunes, and that gives me no pleasure to say, but I'm just being honest and stating my opinion.

      And we’re all being honest and saying your opinion is utter F***ing nonsense
      heimdall
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1904: Apr 26, 2021 08:45:07 pm
      So what did they win for going further in the league cup then ?

      What a silly question, I could equally ask what did we win this season? Leicester has a very good chance of winning the FA Cup and they have an even better chance of securing CL football for next season, I'd call that a good season as opposed to ours.
      heimdall
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1905: Apr 26, 2021 08:48:03 pm
      And we’re all being honest and saying your opinion is utter ducking nonsense

      Yes ok, but I'd prefer if you could expand on that a bit, for example do you honestly think Klopp has earned his money this calendar year, has he done a good enough job in your opinion? BTW its not all down to no fans and missing 2 defenders, a Great manager would adapt to that, ask any relegation manager, they typically suffer far more injuries to a much weaker squad than we have. I'm not suggesting they are better per se but they are more adaptable, that's what I miss with Klopp.
      LondonRed83
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1906: Apr 26, 2021 08:48:55 pm
      A Manager can't survive on past success, however fantastic it was, just ask Maureen. A manager or player is only judged on how good they are in the current season and by any objective measure Klopp has been very average this season, same as Mane and Bobby, actually Mane and Bobby have been bloody awful this season, certainly this year so far.

      Look I really hope Klopp can reinvigorate the team, but I think its more than just a few missing players, its tactics which are being countered by relegation teams, its poor team selections and subs, its just not right at the moment and normally when that happens only a change of manager can change your fortunes, and that gives me no pleasure to say, but I'm just being honest and stating my opinion.

      Past success, it was less than a season ago for F**k sake
      -LFC-
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1907: Apr 26, 2021 09:21:26 pm
      Heimdall has a tendency to reach a broader and more damning conclusion than circumstances really permit.

      You don’t have to mix in what I think are some fairly legitimate questions about the way this season has gone with views about ‘top managers’’, Jürgen lacking ‘adaptability’ in his ‘thinking’ or comparisons with Pep where no true comparison exists.

      You don’t need to start reaching for these absurd statements to justify a fair criticism of some of the manager’s decisions about team selection or subs; the failure to properly replace Lovren; the lack of leadership shown by some of the less senior members of the team; and the way the side has frankly capitulated in the face of a challenge.

      Despite the injuries, the pandemic and other circumstances - some more personal, which are perhaps more difficult to weigh - I think we would all still have expected the team to show a much greater sense of resolution and togetherness to put it right, and to do so swiftly, not to stumble and stagger our way through a season, at times hinting that we might be back, only to lose any chance of actually winning anything and to be at risk of ceding our place in next season’s CL.

      That is the shock for me above all else and I don’t think it’s unreasonable that the manager and players take their share of the blame. They will though because you don’t win a league and European cup without feeling a corresponding sense of disappointment when the challenge fades so badly.

      Most of the improvement will consist in injured players returning and signing one or two more this summer but at the same time there do need to be a few heads bashed together, some players told to pull their socks up or f*ck off, and yes, crucially we have to regain the sense of resilience and fortitude that has been the hallmark of our success.
      shawspeed
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      Re: Jürgen Klopp - LFC Manager (Part 2)
      Reply #1908: Apr 26, 2021 09:27:49 pm
      erm that actually backed up my claim, thanks. ;D

      It really didn't 1029 days lost vs 680.

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