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      Q. LFC Man of the Match v Chelsea?

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      Shamal George
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      49 (42.6%)
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      Total Members Voted: 115

      Voting closed: Aug 18, 2019 10:47:51 pm

      Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion

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      heimdall
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #650: Aug 15, 2019 10:50:39 am
      Brilliant. love the man.

      Great win, cheatski played very well, better than I expected.

      We were disjointed again, can see why klopp made the changes, esp. considering it went to ET.

      Boys will be knackered v southampton, expect changes v them too.

      PS. what a player Bobbi is, makes us tick.

      Perhaps you can explain Kopp's changes to me then, in particular his starting XI because I still don't get it. Why would you not start your strongest XI against a team which has just come off a thrashing by Manure, we completely gifted them that first half, it was nuts. Starting the Ox as a forward was just insane and Milner, as much as I love the guy, just doesn't have it any more, not as a starter any way. I am starting to wonder what exactly Shaq needs to do to get a f**king start in Klopp's team, if I was him I'd be getting fairly pissed off and dejected about it?

      BTW that is not to say that I am not thrilled with the win because I am, but just that it was an extremely weird match tactically and because we starte da weakened team we ended up having to play 120 minutes rather than 90 and a comfortable win.
      stuey
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #651: Aug 15, 2019 10:55:46 am
      Even if VAR got one wrong for a player who was in fact 10 yards onside you’d still be saying they got the decision right or saw something somewhere.

      They didn’t have the the different angles available at the time which is apparently why it wasn’t looked at. There’s no way the ref could have been sure there was contact or not from where she was. So many players dive in that position so you’d think it would be common sense to wait and look at it.
      VAR and the officials fu**ed up, simple as that, sorry to burst your bubble of VAR being flawless.


      If the decision was so clear cut on VAR why did the player embarrassingly dive after after the initial contact, definite f**k up from the ref and all concerned.

      brezipool
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #652: Aug 15, 2019 11:04:54 am
      Perhaps you can explain Kopp's changes to me then, in particular his starting XI because I still don't get it. Why would you not start your strongest XI against a team which has just come off a thrashing by Manure, we completely gifted them that first half, it was nuts. Starting the Ox as a forward was just insane and Milner, as much as I love the guy, just doesn't have it any more, not as a starter any way. I am starting to wonder what exactly Shaq needs to do to get a f**king start in Klopp's team, if I was him I'd be getting fairly pissed off and dejected about it?

      BTW that is not to say that I am not thrilled with the win because I am, but just that it was an extremely weird match tactically and because we starte da weakened team we ended up having to play 120 minutes rather than 90 and a comfortable win.

      All about fitness, and getting guys game time.

      I agree it was a weird match. I said in the tactics thread, I dont think we will see us playing very well for a few games yet. Too many guys at different levels of fitness, pre-season was a shambles for various reasons, klopp has said this.

      But hey, weve won our 1st league game, drew with city, and now won a super cup. Its a not bad start all things considered.

      Southampton team selection going to be interesting, only really have today to recover, then probably light training tmrw. So I expect an even weirder team selection. ;D   luckily after that its a full week till the Arsenal game, and then a week till Burnley.

      brezipool
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #653: Aug 15, 2019 11:06:13 am
      If the decision was so clear cut on VAR why did the player embarrassingly dive after after the initial contact, definite f**k up from the ref and all concerned.



      Was never a penner, dunno what VAR seen, can see why ref gave it in 1st place, but VAR should have seen there was no contact, or very very very little contact, and his 1st touch took the ball out of play, he was never getting a shot off. IMO.
      heimdall
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #654: Aug 15, 2019 11:08:34 am
      All about fitness, and getting guys game time.

      I agree it was a weird match. I said in the tactics thread, I dont think we will see us playing very well for a few games yet. Too many guys at different levels of fitness, pre-season was a shambles for various reasons, klopp has said this.

      But hey, weve won our 1st league game, drew with city, and now won a super cup. Its a not bad start all things considered.

      Southampton team selection going to be interesting, only really have today to recover, then probably light training tmrw. So I expect an even weirder team selection. ;D   luckily after that its a full week till the Arsenal game, and then a week till Burnley.



      I was also thinking it must be about fitness, but I'd still have started strongest XI in first half and then subbed players off, I think Jürgen fu**ed that up a bit or thought it would be easier than it was, it happens, as long as he learns from it then all good.
      brezipool
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #655: Aug 15, 2019 11:11:13 am
      I was also thinking it must be about fitness, but I'd still have started strongest XI in first half and then subbed players off, I think Jürgen fu**ed that up a bit or thought it would be easier than it was, it happens, as long as he learns from it then all good.

      defo all about fitness, he keeps saying players are not at same level.

      Also some very poor individual performances last night, that happens.
      fields of anny rd
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #656: Aug 15, 2019 11:16:53 am
      Personally I do not rate Gomez at right back if there is a choice not to do it.

      I think Trent should have played but then he cant play every game. I just hope that the move was for that reason rather than tactical.

      What Trent offers us is a lot of threat. 20 assists a season as well as punishing the opposition left back all game and forcing him to stay deeper. Hes good enough defensively with all that in mind.

      So with the move to Gomez there we lose a big weapon in the way we play. You can tell Joe to play high and wide but his footwork and crossing is nothing like what TAA can offer.

      If Trent has been left out with Saturday and beyond in mind, or theres something the club want to protect there then fair enough. Gomez is our next best option out there.

       In the back of my mind though Klopp left Trent out at the Nou Camp last season for tactical reasons after a poor game the game earlier. The forum called for it too.

      He was worried about being solid, but the game presented itself for a player like Trent to hurt them.

      Hes more risk, higher reward is Trent. If he has a poor game or gets caught out too high in a game, I hope Klopp sticks with him because hes vital there IMO. Him and Robbo both are.
      Norfolk Red
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #657: Aug 15, 2019 11:18:14 am
      Was never a penner, dunno what VAR seen, can see why ref gave it in 1st place, but VAR should have seen there was no contact, or very very very little contact, and his 1st touch took the ball out of play, he was never getting a shot off. IMO.

      I agree never a pen. I watched the game on BT Sport and they had a camera angle that VAR haven't got, shows it was a dive.
      I agree with having VAR but surely they should have every angle covered, otherwise what is the point of having it ?
      Anyways, a trophy won, get in.
      Shabs
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #658: Aug 15, 2019 11:25:33 am
      Touching on VAR..

      We had a penalty for handball disallowed & a penalty for a dive awarded, not a good night for the VAR team, I think the refs had a decent game.
      FL Red
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #659: Aug 15, 2019 11:27:30 am
      Touching on VAR..

      We had a penalty for handball disallowed & a penalty for a dive awarded, not a good night for the VAR team, I think the refs had a decent game.

      Refs were good on decisions that didn't involve VAR. They got most every offside call correct if I recall, but you are right, that handball in the box was a clear pen, shouldn't even have been a debate and the dive for the penalty was disgraceful....not sure what they were looking at on the replay.
      brezipool
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #660: Aug 15, 2019 11:39:18 am
      I agree never a pen. I watched the game on BT Sport and they had a camera angle that VAR haven't got, shows it was a dive.
      I agree with having VAR but surely they should have every angle covered, otherwise what is the point of having it ?
      Anyways, a trophy won, get in.

      yea I was watching on BT too, weird that VAR didnt have that angle.
      brezipool
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #661: Aug 15, 2019 11:41:12 am
      Personally I do not rate Gomez at right back if there is a choice not to do it.

      I think Trent should have played but then he cant play every game. I just hope that the move was for that reason rather than tactical.

      What Trent offers us is a lot of threat. 20 assists a season as well as punishing the opposition left back all game and forcing him to stay deeper. Hes good enough defensively with all that in mind.

      So with the move to Gomez there we lose a big weapon in the way we play. You can tell Joe to play high and wide but his footwork and crossing is nothing like what TAA can offer.

      If Trent has been left out with Saturday and beyond in mind, or theres something the club want to protect there then fair enough. Gomez is our next best option out there.

       In the back of my mind though Klopp left Trent out at the Nou Camp last season for tactical reasons after a poor game the game earlier. The forum called for it too.

      He was worried about being solid, but the game presented itself for a player like Trent to hurt them.

      Hes more risk, higher reward is Trent. If he has a poor game or gets caught out too high in a game, I hope Klopp sticks with him because hes vital there IMO. Him and Robbo both are.

      Klopp is defo using Gomez as cover for Matip & Trent. Just about fitness I think, and there may be the odd game where he wants gomez for better defensive cover.

      Shabs
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #662: Aug 15, 2019 11:51:20 am
      Anyone else notice the 4th ref..?

      Cuneyt Cakir the Turkish fella who seems to be our lucky charm in European football..😉

      Swab
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #663: Aug 15, 2019 12:23:48 pm
      Over the moon. As a younger red  (born in the 90s) I haven’t seen as much success as the lucky bas**rds that were born decades ago so I really enjoyed that one haha. I look forward to seeing Henderson do that little dance he does before lifting the cups again really soon.

      Nowhere near our best again but that’s ok we’re too good not to get back there soon. That Kante is some little player too by the way, 120th minute and he was still buzzing around the pitch!

      If you want our memories you have to take our prostates as well
      Hasty Lover
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #664: Aug 15, 2019 12:33:54 pm
      I think that was a massive win yesterday, keep the momentum going, help to avoid hangover from last seasons success. Would have felt like a kick in the balls to lose it
      ozi_wozzy
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #665: Aug 15, 2019 12:35:05 pm
      Absolutely made up, another trophy in the cabinet. Success breeds success, and the youngsters will hugely benefit from developing the hunger for lifting trophies.

      Am a little concerned about the defence though, Norwich were creating chances and Chelsea create too many chances too easily. Hoping it's just start of season jitters and a regular starting line up will stabilize things.

      Sweet f***ing justice that diving, cheating pr**k missed the penalty to hand it to us. Though Adrian had an excellent game if I'm honest and Mane is firmly our best player now. Mo can learn a bit from his ruthlessness, single-mindedness without being overly selfish. But all three up front look sharp and that fills me with joy.

      Great stuff lads, keep them rolling in  ;)
      stuey
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #666: Aug 15, 2019 01:03:18 pm
      yea I was watching on BT too, weird that VAR didnt have that angle.

      Same as and it was a stone wall dive, did see two hand-balls as well in our pen area.
      Mickred
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #667: Aug 15, 2019 01:32:45 pm
      Absolutely chuffed for Adrian.  Not our best performance by a long shot, but early days for players fitness levels and team cohesion.  lets hope they all recover for Saturday.

      YNWA
      Cad1875
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #668: Aug 15, 2019 01:38:25 pm
      Refs were good on decisions that didn't involve VAR. They got most every offside call correct if I recall, but you are right, that handball in the box was a clear pen, shouldn't even have been a debate and the dive for the penalty was disgraceful....not sure what they were looking at on the replay.


      Was never a penner, dunno what VAR seen, can see why ref gave it in 1st place, but VAR should have seen there was no contact, or very very very little contact, and his 1st touch took the ball out of play, he was never getting a shot off. IMO.

      We played an extra 30 minutes in a furnace because VAR and the ref got it wrong ,FIFA didnt want it overturned to save her and them embarrassment in this worldwide televised showpiece match.

      Come forward 72 hours, Saturday last 25 minutes @ Southampton theres 5 players blowing out their arse, a point or 3 could be at stake, think on to last night , through sheer grit and determination we lost one game last season, last night gender, FIFA`s ego, and extra time that we didnt need to play became another variable in our quest for #19.
      Shabs
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #669: Aug 15, 2019 01:50:46 pm
      Scottbot
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #670: Aug 15, 2019 02:16:43 pm
      Perhaps you can explain Kopp's changes to me then, in particular his starting XI because I still don't get it. Why would you not start your strongest XI against a team which has just come off a thrashing by Manure, we completely gifted them that first half, it was nuts. Starting the Ox as a forward was just insane and Milner, as much as I love the guy, just doesn't have it any more, not as a starter any way. I am starting to wonder what exactly Shaq needs to do to get a f**king start in Klopp's team, if I was him I'd be getting fairly pissed off and dejected about it?

      BTW that is not to say that I am not thrilled with the win because I am, but just that it was an extremely weird match tactically and because we starte da weakened team we ended up having to play 120 minutes rather than 90 and a comfortable win.

      That’s all a bit dramatic mate, Ox played as winger as a youngster and then for probably his first 5 years as a pro so it’s not like the position is alien to him, he just had a shocker and couldn’t get in the game. Beyond that and keeping Trent in the bench I’m not sure it was a particularly weakened team tbh. As for Chelsea, they played well at the weekend and were very unlucky and in balance of play last night they can count themselves unlucky again. In Kante and Jorginio they had the two best players in the pitch and they have got themselves a player in Pulisic. They will continue to be a very good side. Has for Shaq, he doesn’t seem to be all that high on Klopp’s list, I was a little surprised not to see him sold in the summer and replaced. I would’ve very surprised if he gets a start at Saints on Saturday.
      WeAreMenOfShanklysBest
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #671: Aug 15, 2019 02:20:25 pm
      Touching on VAR..

      We had a penalty for handball disallowed & a penalty for a dive awarded, not a good night for the VAR team, I think the refs had a decent game.

      I read that VAR only gets to see replays from one angle ? Is this true ? If so I really don’t see the point in VAR at all because from the first angle I saw on the telly I said penalty all day but when the camera was reversed to the opposite side of the challenge I then thought what a dive ?? If tight decisions are going to be made off only one angle and slow the game in the process I’d rather the refs just make the calls and scrap VAR
      heimdall
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #672: Aug 15, 2019 02:25:37 pm
      That’s all a bit dramatic mate, Ox played as winger as a youngster and then for probably his first 5 years as a pro so it’s not like the position is alien to him, he just had a shocker and couldn’t get in the game. Beyond that and keeping Trent in the bench I’m not sure it was a particularly weakened team tbh. As for Chelsea, they played well at the weekend and were very unlucky and in balance of play last night they can count themselves unlucky again. In Kante and Jorginio they had the two best players in the pitch and they have got themselves a player in Pulisic. They will continue to be a very good side. Has for Shaq, he doesn’t seem to be all that high on Klopp’s list, I was a little surprised not to see him sold in the summer and replaced. I would’ve very surprised if he gets a start at Saints on Saturday.

      Ox has been injured for a whole year, on that basis its bloody daft to replace Bobby with him in a cup final against a quality team, it just is. Other than that I agree the other players just had a sh*t game and we were pretty lucky to win in the end, but we did and I'm happy with that, but I hope some one got a bollocking for that team selection, even if its Klopp administering a self bollocking. :-)

      Anyway onwards and upwards, hopefully we can find enough fit players for Saturday, luckily we are not playing one of the top teams, but Southampton away is never that easy.
      heimdall
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #673: Aug 15, 2019 02:26:20 pm
      I read that VAR only gets to see replays from one angle ? Is this true ? If so I really don’t see the point in VAR at all because from the first angle I saw on the telly I said penalty all day but when the camera was reversed to the opposite side of the challenge I then thought what a dive ?? If tight decisions are going to be made off only one angle and slow the game in the process I’d rather the refs just make the calls and scrap VAR

      I agree VAR has to have multiple angles and access to all the TV feeds.
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Chelsea 2-2 Liverpool (4-5 pens AET): In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #674: Aug 15, 2019 02:35:11 pm
      Touching on VAR..

      We had a penalty for handball disallowed & a penalty for a dive awarded, not a good night for the VAR team, I think the refs had a decent game.

      Agree on all counts. VAR of course is simply a 2nd opinion with the aid of replay and slow motion. If the camera angles never give a perfectly clear look, then the original call stands and I think that is what happened.

      The only way women refereeing men would be a problem is if they are promoted via different standards than the men. Similarly, if they are given some kind of special treatment re evaluation, VAR reviews etc, that defeats the purpose. We want equality, so let's be equal. Last night I think is a good first step.

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