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      Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won

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      FATKOPITE10
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #125: Apr 10, 2020 02:07:40 pm
      Excuse my ignorance but what is this blue labour stuff?
      stuey
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #126: Apr 10, 2020 02:14:11 pm
      The far left shredded Corbyn's chances of taking power?

      It wasn't the far left of the party that tried to stage a leadership coup less than a year after he won 60% of the ballot against 3 other candidates. It wasn't the far left who continued in their attacks, including organized resignation letters sent to various media outlets criticizing the party & leadership, after Corbyn won his second leadership contest in the space of a year (with an even higher percentage of the vote)

      It wasn't the far left who publically criticized the party in the run up to two general elections, there were no MPs on the far left who resigned from the party in the run up to a general election and pleaded with the general public to not vote Labour, or in Ian Austin's case, pleaded with the public to vote for Boris Johnson

      It wasn't even the far left who forced the leadership into backing a second referendum, a policy which caused many traditional voters to desert the party.

      This was all mainly the work of the "moderates". It was the likes of Jess Phillips, Wes Streeting and even Starmer himself who were doing all this - The same people who are now calling for "unity"

      So what in your estimation made Corbyn unelectable?
      If as you would have it he was such a glowing PM in waiting why was he forced to resign?

      The truth is Corbyn’s dated socialist ideals were not acceptable to the electorate, as subsequent events confirmed.
      The party needs to wise up and be less dogmatic, the call for unity is no bad shout, the infighting during Corbyn’s tenure was abysmal.

      If I may say as much these comments about our new leader are music to Tory ears.
      Shabs
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #127: Apr 10, 2020 02:38:25 pm
      Excuse my ignorance but what is this blue labour stuff?

      Stuey... 😂
      TameImpala
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #128: Apr 10, 2020 02:41:47 pm
      So what in your estimation made Corbyn unelectable?
      If as you would have it he was such a glowing PM in waiting why was he forced to resign?

      The truth is Corbyn’s dated socialist ideals were not acceptable to the electorate, as subsequent events confirmed.
      The party needs to wise up and be less dogmatic, the call for unity is no bad shout, the infighting during Corbyn’s tenure was abysmal.

      If I may say as much these comments about our new leader are music to Tory ears.

      Corbyn failed to win elections for a few main reasons. One was his past, which was smeared and skewed to the point that the media were portraying him as a foreign enemy as opposed to the leader of HMs opposition. No other party leader in recent history has had such

      Another was the unfortunate timing of his leadership & the fact that it was during a time where politics was dominated by Brexit. The country wanted Brexit and I'm of the opinion that no "centrist" leader could have delivered a GE win during this time as they, like Corbyn was at the end, were not willing to carry out the referendum result

      To say is socialist ideas were dated is a bit of a mad one (especially with a Shankly profile picture!) As I said in one of my previous posts, Labour's policies at both the 2017 & 2019 elections were fairly popular when stood on their own and I'm still unsure what is "dated" about a properly funded health service, high speed broadband & climate change action

      The call for unity is a good shout, but it carries little weight when the people making the shout are the same MPs who spent the last half decade constantly swiping and undermining the party leadership

      And on the subject of the comments being music to Tory ears - The Tories are already delighted with our new leader, George Osborne gave him a glowing reference on Twitter yesterday and spoke incredibly highly of him. Why would a blue blooded Tory and the architect of Austerity speak in such glowing terms about a supposed Labour leader?

      I'll be giving him a chance and I'll still vote for him and more than likely canvass for him when an election comes, but I'm allowed to criticize and hold scepticism against the party leader - are you saying that you never criticized Corbyn during his 5 years in charge?
      Shabs
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #129: Apr 10, 2020 02:58:37 pm
      In these unprecedented times..

      Socialism is bailing out Capitalism again...

      All the handouts we are seeing which Corbyn was offering & was mocked by all quarters claiming there is no magic money tree now seems to be Tory policy...

      &..& even the Tory cu*ts are now singing the praises from the trees of the NHS, it’s staff and all low paid frontline workers, all whom before the election we’re getting tramples on...
      FL Red
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #130: Apr 10, 2020 03:07:57 pm
      In these unprecedented times..

      Socialism is bailing out Capitalism again...

      All the handouts we are seeing which Corbyn was offering & was mocked by all quarters claiming there is no magic money tree now seems to be Tory policy...

      &..& even the Tory cu*ts are now singing the praises from the trees of the NHS, it’s staff and all low paid frontline workers, all whom before the election we’re getting tramples on...


      To be fair...the only reason governments are "bailing" out people is because the government is mandating the closures that are keeping people out of work. That's not socialism...or actually maybe it is...the government enforcing a mandate on their citizens that forces them into poverty. Sounds a lot like Cuba to me.
      TameImpala
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #131: Apr 10, 2020 03:45:27 pm
      To be fair...the only reason governments are "bailing" out people is because the government is mandating the closures that are keeping people out of work. That's not socialism...or actually maybe it is...the government enforcing a mandate on their citizens that forces them into poverty. Sounds a lot like Cuba to me.

      Ah yes, Cuba. The only country in the history of the world to have any form of poverty
      stuey
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #132: Apr 10, 2020 03:50:54 pm

      Corbyn failed to win elections for a few main reasons. One was his past, which was smeared and skewed to the point that the media were portraying him as a foreign enemy as opposed to the leader of HMs opposition. No other party leader in recent history has had such

      Another was the unfortunate timing of his leadership & the fact that it was during a time where politics was dominated by Brexit. The country wanted Brexit and I'm of the opinion that no "centrist" leader could have delivered a GE win during this time as they, like Corbyn was at the end, were not willing to carry out the referendum result

      To say is socialist ideas were dated is a bit of a mad one (especially with a Shankly profile picture!) As I said in one of my previous posts, Labour's policies at both the 2017 & 2019 elections were fairly popular when stood on their own and I'm still unsure what is "dated" about a properly funded health service, high speed broadband & climate change action

      The call for unity is a good shout, but it carries little weight when the people making the shout are the same MPs who spent the last half decade constantly swiping and undermining the party leadership

      And on the subject of the comments being music to Tory ears - The Tories are already delighted with our new leader, George Osborne gave him a glowing reference on Twitter yesterday and spoke incredibly highly of him. Why would a blue blooded Tory and the architect of Austerity speak in such glowing terms about a supposed Labour leader?

      I'll be giving him a chance and I'll still vote for him and more than likely canvass for him when an election comes, but I'm allowed to criticize and hold scepticism against the party leader - are you saying that you never criticized Corbyn during his 5 years in charge?

      Voted Labour all my life and fully backed Corbyn on his appointment, his performance in the latter part of his tenure when viewed dispassionately could only be criticised, he had no recourse to the character assassination spoken of earlier.
      If he had what was considered a questionable history why the hell was he put in office?
      Surely somebody in the party had some vision and could guarantee Corbyn's record would be a liability in a general election as was proven.

      The NHS and environmental issues are an essential part of any Labour manifesto, as you know the Health Service was set up under a Labour administration by Aneurin Bevan in 1947, it was opposed by the Tories.
      The NHS and the Welfare State are in constant danger under the elitists and to infer that I do not fully support their existence is offensive, to bring Sir Bill Shankly into the equation is grossly offensive.

      The name George Osborne is puke worthy and to refer to an iota of his rhetoric demeans your post.
      Is there the slightest possibility that these Tory bas**rds praise a Labour MP to invoke the wrath of his supporters?
      I believe the term is 'black propoganda'

      « Last Edit: Apr 10, 2020 03:57:37 pm by stuey »
      TameImpala
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #133: Apr 10, 2020 04:02:58 pm
      Voted Labour all my life and fully backed Corbyn on his appointment, his performance in the latter part of his tenure when viewed dispassionately could only be criticised, he had no recourse to the character assassination spoken of earlier.
      If he had what was considered a questionable history why the hell was he put in office?
      Surely somebody in the party had some vision and could guarantee Corbyn's record would be a liability in a general election as was proven.

      The NHS and environmental issues are an essential part of any Labour manifesto, as you know the Health Service was set up under a Labour administration by Aneuran Bevan in 1947, it was opposed by the Tories.
      The NHS and the Welfare State are in constant danger under the elitists and to infer that I do not fully support their existence is offensive, to bring Sir Bill Shankly into the equation is grossly offensive.

      The name George Osborne is puke worthy and to refer to an iota of his rhetoric demeans your post.
      Is there the slightest possibility that these Tory bas**rds praise a Labour MP to invoke the wrath of his supporters?
      I believe the term is 'black propoganda.

      I'm not implying you're a Tory or anything mate - I'm more than aware different viewpoints exist in the Labour party and I'm just arguing mine

      On the subject of Osborne - if you compare the Tory reaction to Corbyn's appointment in 2015 - David Cameron stating that he's a threat to our country and national security & the reaction to Starmer's the other day, it seems quite clear who they were more worried about

      How is the Bill Shankly comment offensive? Spare me the faux outrage. You have a photo of a famous socialist as your profile picture and went on to say Corbyn's manifesto was full of outdated socialist policies. I'm still curious as to what these policies where?
      stuey
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #134: Apr 10, 2020 05:52:22 pm
      I'm not implying you're a Tory or anything mate - I'm more than aware different viewpoints exist in the Labour party and I'm just arguing mine

      On the subject of Osborne - if you compare the Tory reaction to Corbyn's appointment in 2015 - David Cameron stating that he's a threat to our country and national security & the reaction to Starmer's the other day, it seems quite clear who they were more worried about

      How is the Bill Shankly comment offensive? Spare me the faux outrage. You have a photo of a famous socialist as your profile picture and went on to say Corbyn's manifesto was full of outdated socialist policies. I'm still curious as to what these policies where?

      I have a picture of a Liverpool legend on my profile who followed the club's tradition in having socialist loyalties, no faux pas outrage whatever more dismay and curiosity as to how you introduce this legendary manager into a discussion about a failed Labour MP.

      I refuse to discuss Tory propaganda being as it is simply a way of undermining the Labour party and causing division.
      TameImpala
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #135: Apr 10, 2020 06:11:57 pm
      I have a picture of a Liverpool legend on my profile who followed the club's tradition in having socialist loyalties, no faux pas outrage whatever more dismay and curiosity as to how you introduce this legendary manager into a discussion about a failed Labour MP.

      I refuse to discuss Tory propaganda being as it is simply a way of undermining the Labour party and causing division.

      "A failed Labour MP" would imply that he failed as a member of parliament, Jeremy Corbyn has represented his constituency for about 3 decades and is consistently reelected with huge majorities

      To be honest mate, if anything was offensive it was you referring to a lifelong socialist & man of the people as a "sir"

      By the way you still haven't stated which of these socialist policies were so outdated and wrong
      « Last Edit: Apr 10, 2020 06:17:54 pm by TameImpala »
      FATKOPITE10
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #136: Apr 10, 2020 06:40:01 pm
      Has keir starmer lost his knighthood. Seems to have disappeared since he took over as Labour leader
      TameImpala
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #137: Apr 10, 2020 07:31:04 pm
      Has keir starmer lost his knighthood. Seems to have disappeared since he took over as Labour leader

      Sir Plank of Wood wants to now just be referred to as "Keir", so that he can be down with the kids.

      Flashbacks of David "Call me Dave" Cameron
      stuey
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #138: Apr 11, 2020 02:14:27 pm
      "A failed Labour MP" would imply that he failed as a member of parliament, Jeremy Corbyn has represented his constituency for about 3 decades and is consistently reelected with huge majorities

      To be honest mate, if anything was offensive it was you referring to a lifelong socialist & man of the people as a "sir"

      By the way you still haven't stated which of these socialist policies were so outdated and wrong

      Perhaps you could contact Sir Kenny Dalglish and his good lady wife concerning your reservations with the honours they were awarded for their selfless Hillsborough and charitable work.
      I did not state that any policies were wrong, inappropriate maybe in this day and age where extremes of socialism are a vote loser, I want a Labour administration as soon as possible, not a leader who sets the party back decades.
      TameImpala
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #139: Apr 12, 2020 12:19:35 am
      Perhaps you could contact Sir Kenny Dalglish and his good lady wife concerning your reservations with the honours they were awarded for their selfless Hillsborough and charitable work.
      I did not state that any policies were wrong, inappropriate maybe in this day and age where extremes of socialism are a vote loser, I want a Labour administration as soon as possible, not a leader who sets the party back decades.

      Latest bit of news on the Unity brigade

      https://twitter.com/TheMendozaWoman/status/1249064862388494338?s=19
      Shabs
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #140: Apr 12, 2020 12:40:41 am

      The Blairites & the false anti Semitic brigade are a f**king disgrace..Tory enablers..

      Blue Labour alright..
      fields of anny rd
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #141: Apr 12, 2020 08:12:11 am
      I did not state that any policies were wrong, inappropriate maybe in this day and age where extremes of socialism are a vote loser, I want a Labour administration as soon as possible, not a leader who sets the party back decades.


      Any point in having a labour government in charge if they have to push through policies that pander to the likes of Murdoch like Blair did?

      Its not a labour government people should be seeking it's a government that can deliver on social justice. The world it seems prefers these big egotistical right wing leader types at the moment but when it is ready for real change I want labour to be a party on the left rather than centre.
      stuey
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #142: Apr 12, 2020 10:24:23 am
      Any point in having a labour government in charge if they have to push through policies that pander to the likes of Murdoch like Blair did?

      Blair served three terms of office as PM, he was doing something right!
      "Blair pandering to the monster Murdoch" is an anthem of the hard left designed to undermine any attempt to make Labour a feasible governing contender.

       
      Quote
      Its not a labour government people should be seeking it's a government that can deliver on social justice. The world it seems prefers these big egotistical right wing leader types at the moment but when it is ready for real change I want labour to be a party on the left rather than centre.

      A Labour administration that can withstand the black propaganda and bullshit from the elite and govern without self-destructive, past their sell by date policies is what is wanted; although judging by some comments here that scenario seems a distant prospect.
      « Last Edit: Apr 12, 2020 11:21:10 am by stuey »
      stuey
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #143: Apr 12, 2020 10:45:24 am
      Shabs
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #144: Apr 12, 2020 11:35:23 am
      TameImpala
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #145: Apr 12, 2020 11:51:50 am
      ???
      You do seem to confuse my agenda.

      How's that confusing? You've been stating the last few days that all of Labour's recent downfall is due to socialist policies and the far left

      The link is proof of electrical sabotage from those on the center / right of the party.
      TameImpala
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #146: Apr 12, 2020 11:57:55 am
      Any point in having a labour government in charge if they have to push through policies that pander to the likes of Murdoch like Blair did?
      .

      Definitely still worth it, Blair obviously shifted the party to the right but there were no food banks or people dying on hospital trolleys when he was in charge.

      New Labour get a lot of stick from those of us on the left but they were still a world apart from the current gang of chancers in charge
      stuey
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #147: Apr 12, 2020 01:12:11 pm
      How's that confusing? You've been stating the last few days that all of Labour's recent downfall is due to socialist policies and the far left

      As pointed out you misinterpreted perhaps intentionally so for your own agenda, my comment about a Labour defeat in the general election..
      Where have I made any reference to Labour’s policies per se being the reason for Corbyn’s defeat?
      I stated that the presentation of certain policies was faulted, if I had demonised all of the manifesto I would not be on this forum disputing your assertion that I am politically naive.



      TameImpala
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #148: Apr 12, 2020 01:24:53 pm
      As pointed out you misinterpreted perhaps intentionally so for your own agenda, my comment about a Labour defeat in the general election..
      Where have I made any reference to Labour’s policies per se being the reason for Corbyn’s defeat?
      I stated that the presentation of certain policies was faulted, if I had demonised all of the manifesto I would not be on this forum disputing your assertion that I am politically naive.

      "The policies were a gift to the Tories"

      "The far left shredded all chances of Corbyn gaining power"
      althebest1
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      Re: Post 2020 General Election - Conservatives won
      Reply #149: Apr 12, 2020 03:03:23 pm
      Definitely still worth it, Blair obviously shifted the party to the right but there were no food banks or people dying on hospital trolleys when he was in charge.

      New Labour get a lot of stick from those of us on the left but they were still a world apart from the current gang of chancers in charge

      https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/tony-blair-not-order-hillsborough-9658130

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