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      Reds back in training

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      JD
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      Reds back in training
      May 26, 2020 03:09:45 pm
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #1: May 29, 2020 02:23:30 pm
      Full contact training videos up today. A nice bit with Sadio, Bobby and Mo combining for strikes past living, breathing goalkeepers.
      Boston not la
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #2: Jun 02, 2020 11:32:22 pm
      heimdall
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #3: Jun 03, 2020 10:08:28 am

      Is this meant as a sign of respect to George Floyd or as a protest, if its a protest then what exactly is it a protest about seeing as the police officer has already been charged with murder? I sometimes feel the virtue signallers lose sight of their original argument, much like the "peaceful" protesters in America.

      What happened to George Floyd was absolutely tragic and the police officer has rightly been charged with murder, but from what I have read it seems to be a case of police brutality more than racism. I simply do not believe that the US police forces are institutionally racist. That doesn't mean there aren't some very bad apples, unfortunately you'll find that in all countries, but the facts simply don't back up the racist angle. There are for example far more whites killed by police in the US than blacks, even per capita I think, and of course there are 10's of thousands of BAME police officers on the force.

      I think the only conclusion is that the US is a very violent country and what needs to be addressed is police brutality and methods rather than perceived institutional racism.
      fields of anny rd
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #4: Jun 04, 2020 06:02:58 am
      Is this meant as a sign of respect to George Floyd or as a protest, if its a protest then what exactly is it a protest about seeing as the police officer has already been charged with murder? I sometimes feel the virtue signallers lose sight of their original argument, much like the "peaceful" protesters in America.

      What happened to George Floyd was absolutely tragic and the police officer has rightly been charged with murder, but from what I have read it seems to be a case of police brutality more than racism. I simply do not believe that the US police forces are institutionally racist. That doesn't mean there aren't some very bad apples, unfortunately you'll find that in all countries, but the facts simply don't back up the racist angle. There are for example far more whites killed by police in the US than blacks, even per capita I think, and of course there are 10's of thousands of BAME police officers on the force.

      I think the only conclusion is that the US is a very violent country and what needs to be addressed is police brutality and methods rather than perceived institutional racism.

      I was reading your diatribe and I thought to myself this could only come from you. Scrolled up and there was my confirmation.

      Every statistic you can think of backs up the idea that the police in the USA and here in the UK is institutionally racist.

      In 2019 data of all police killings in the US compiled by Mapping Police Violence, black Americans were nearly three times more likely to die from police than white Americans. Other statistics showed that black Americans were nearly one-and-a-half times more likely to be unarmed before their death.

      Most states’ police forces killed black people at a higher rate per capita than white people, with Illinois, New York and Washington D.C. carrying some of the largest discrepancies by state. D.C., with a black population of nearly 50 percent, had 88 percent of all police killings be against black Americans. That's a discrepancy of over 38 percentage points

      Saying the facts don't back up the racist angle then making up a fact that you only think is right, but is actually completely wrong isn't good enough for this discussion. Your facts are wrong and as such your opinion which you hold based on your fake facts is worthless.
      therealjr
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #5: Jun 04, 2020 07:58:58 am
      Most states’ police forces killed black people at a higher rate per capita than white people, with Illinois, New York and Washington D.C. carrying some of the largest discrepancies by state. D.C., with a black population of nearly 50 percent, had 88 percent of all police killings be against black Americans. That's a discrepancy of over 38 percentage points

      Do you have the stats on the %age split of violent crime committed?
      If I’m sat at home all night whilst you are out committing violent crime you are 100% more likely to be shot by the police than I am.
      Your stat is only relevant if crime is being committed in equal numbers
      heimdall
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #6: Jun 04, 2020 08:08:23 am
      I was reading your diatribe and I thought to myself this could only come from you. Scrolled up and there was my confirmation.

      Every statistic you can think of backs up the idea that the police in the USA and here in the UK is institutionally racist.

      In 2019 data of all police killings in the US compiled by Mapping Police Violence, black Americans were nearly three times more likely to die from police than white Americans. Other statistics showed that black Americans were nearly one-and-a-half times more likely to be unarmed before their death.

      Most states’ police forces killed black people at a higher rate per capita than white people, with Illinois, New York and Washington D.C. carrying some of the largest discrepancies by state. D.C., with a black population of nearly 50 percent, had 88 percent of all police killings be against black Americans. That's a discrepancy of over 38 percentage points

      Saying the facts don't back up the racist angle then making up a fact that you only think is right, but is actually completely wrong isn't good enough for this discussion. Your facts are wrong and as such your opinion which you hold based on your fake facts is worthless.

      I didn't make up a fact, its just that you and I view the stats differently or perhaps I read/heard some incorrect stats. I'm more than happy to be corrected if I'm wrong but accusing me of making things up is not very helpful to the discussion nor is saying that I went on a diatribe, why not try to have a constructive argument instead of attacking all the time?
      BTW what are the stats for crimes committed by blacks versus white, I think that is needed for context. In my post I didn't say that there was not a big problem in the US, there clearly is a very very big problem, I'm just not convinced that the police force is institutionally racist, I think its a problem of excessive force and some very bad apples, more needs to be done to combat that.

      Teh fundamental point though is that this is a US problem and they have to sort it out themselves, I have absolutely no idea why there are marches in the UK that end up in violence outside Downing Street, what do they hope to achieve, apart from catching Covid-19?
      Harrisimo
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #7: Jun 04, 2020 10:04:16 am
      The issue here is should sport be making gestures or staging photo protests. It's a very tricky area. My own view is sport is sport and as such it should be left to others to make protest gestures.

      Players as individuals have their own right to protest same as any other individuals obviously.
      fields of anny rd
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #8: Jun 04, 2020 10:32:07 am
      The issue here is should sport be making gestures or staging photo protests. It's a very tricky area. My own view is sport is sport and as such it should be left to others to make protest gestures.

      Players as individuals have their own right to protest same as any other individuals obviously.

      Sport has become political though hasnt it already?

      From rainbow laces to kick it out and all the other stuff. The only difference here is that this is a stance that hasnt been agreed by the FAs or Fifa. No harm in that for me.

      Harrisimo
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #9: Jun 04, 2020 11:07:10 am
      Sport has become political though hasnt it already?

      From rainbow laces to kick it out and all the other stuff. The only difference here is that this is a stance that hasnt been agreed by the FAs or Fifa. No harm in that for me.

      No..no harm done and it was with the best of intentions. Maybe yes in relation to "kick it out" it was acceptable. Thanks.
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #10: Jun 04, 2020 04:25:45 pm
      So.....I hear the Reds are back in training.


      Not commenting on any viewpoints expressed above, just saying there are multiple threads on this site for debating politics, culture, society, etc. - can we keep one board or at least a thread or two for just the football?
      clint_call01
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #11: Jun 04, 2020 04:35:36 pm
      I think we are in pre-season because we will play last games two weeks off and start again.
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #12: Jun 04, 2020 04:43:26 pm
      I think we are in pre-season because we will play last games two weeks off and start again.

      Yes. They want to end by final week in July, correct? Charity Shield this season was August 4 and league opener August 9. Do they even need to wait two weeks?

      UEFA is finishing their knockout competitions in August at the same time the preliminary rounds for the 20-21 campaigns go on, is that correct?
      clint_call01
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #13: Jun 04, 2020 05:02:28 pm
      Yes. They want to end by final week in July, correct? Charity Shield this season was August 4 and league opener August 9. Do they even need to wait two weeks?

      UEFA is finishing their knockout competitions in August at the same time the preliminary rounds for the 20-21 campaigns go on, is that correct?


      Players had enough rest this season :D
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #14: Jun 04, 2020 05:05:28 pm
      Players had enough rest this season :D

      Seriously, they are making millions per season, they should be sprinting on and off the park before and after matches.  ;D

      Boston not la
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #15: Jun 04, 2020 11:53:13 pm
      So.....I hear the Reds are back in training.


      Not commenting on any viewpoints expressed above, just saying there are multiple threads on this site for debating politics, culture, society, etc. - can we keep one board or at least a thread or two for just the football?
         

      I posted the photo here cos it was taken at a training session,i posted the same photo in various other threads,didn't comment cos i figured  it was something we as Liverpool fans should all be backing,guess that was wrong?
      heimdall
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #16: Jun 05, 2020 08:24:53 am
         

      I posted the photo here cos it was taken at a training session,i posted the same photo in various other threads,didn't comment cos i figured  it was something we as Liverpool fans should all be backing,guess that was wrong?

      No you're not wrong, I feel deep sympathy for Mr Floyd, I'm sure everyone on here does, what happened to him was absolutely terrible and the police officer was rightly charged with murder.

      My point was just that its more a case of police brutality rather than systemic racism, but something has to be done in the US to combat this, it happens far to often.
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #17: Jun 05, 2020 02:23:52 pm
         

      I posted the photo here cos it was taken at a training session,i posted the same photo in various other threads,didn't comment cos i figured  it was something we as Liverpool fans should all be backing,guess that was wrong?

      No. I have no problem with the photo being posted. It was, as you say, taken during training. No problem with that at all.

      The repeat of the debate I've been hearing nonstop for 10 days in all forums, that's what I was mentioning, and again, not as a statement for or against any view expressed, just asking for our commentary here to be kept to football since those debates are already going on elsewhere on the boards.
      lfc across the water
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #18: Jun 06, 2020 11:59:22 am
      Quote from Robby The Z
      Yes. They want to end by final week in July, correct? Charity Shield this season was August 4 and league opener August 9. Do they even need to wait two weeks?

      UEFA is finishing their knockout competitions in August at the same time the preliminary rounds for the 20-21 campaigns go on, is that correct?

      No it's not. The qualifiers can't start until the current campaigns end. Someone might just need that European Cup spot after winning the UEFA Cup. Which has a knock on effect for everyone else. If it's an English team, obviously we can't face them in the group phase, so we have to face someone else from somewhere else in somewhere else.

      We're probably looking at two months of a break rather then two weeks. The club seasons have to finish, the European season then has to finish, then those in Europe need their break, while the fixture list has to be drawn up. It's more likely to be an October start at the earliest.
      heimdall
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #19: Jun 06, 2020 01:17:05 pm
      No it's not. The qualifiers can't start until the current campaigns end. Someone might just need that European Cup spot after winning the UEFA Cup. Which has a knock on effect for everyone else. If it's an English team, obviously we can't face them in the group phase, so we have to face someone else from somewhere else in somewhere else.

      We're probably looking at two months of a break rather then two weeks. The club seasons have to finish, the European season then has to finish, then those in Europe need their break, while the fixture list has to be drawn up. It's more likely to be an October start at the earliest.

      Why can't the European season finish at the same time as club seasons? Remember that a lot of countries have cancelled their leagues already. I think it will be a fairly short break between this season and next, more like a winter break otherwise players will not need to get up to fitness yet again.
      Boston not la
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #20: Jun 06, 2020 03:57:35 pm
      No you're not wrong, I feel deep sympathy for Mr Floyd, I'm sure everyone on here does, what happened to him was absolutely terrible and the police officer was rightly charged with murder.

      My point was just that its more a case of police brutality rather than systemic racism, but something has to be done in the US to combat this, it happens far to often.
       

      Of course it's systematic racism,the cops are the lowest level of it,the stormtroopers if ya like.If i was black there's no way i'd live here.Any way we're not talking about that any practice games coming up?
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #21: Jun 06, 2020 05:50:09 pm
      No it's not. The qualifiers can't start until the current campaigns end. Someone might just need that European Cup spot after winning the UEFA Cup. Which has a knock on effect for everyone else. If it's an English team, obviously we can't face them in the group phase, so we have to face someone else from somewhere else in somewhere else.

      We're probably looking at two months of a break rather then two weeks. The club seasons have to finish, the European season then has to finish, then those in Europe need their break, while the fixture list has to be drawn up. It's more likely to be an October start at the earliest.

      I am familiar with the normal format, but this coming season will not be normal. It will take some major tweaking for sure, but I bet they do not wait until October. And I don't think they will hold up the whole thing so some team from Albania and some team from Malta have a proper break before they play their qualifying round, the first of four or five before the group stages. They will arrange something else - too much money involved. Teams that don't get to participate in those rounds will probably get a little something for their trouble.
      lfc across the water
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #22: Jun 06, 2020 10:59:56 pm
      Quote from Robby The Z
      I am familiar with the normal format, but this coming season will not be normal. It will take some major tweaking for sure, but I bet they do not wait until October. And I don't think they will hold up the whole thing so some team from Albania and some team from Malta have a proper break before they play their qualifying round, the first of four or five before the group stages. They will arrange something else - too much money involved. Teams that don't get to participate in those rounds will probably get a little something for their trouble.

      I said the EPL starting in October next season. Otherwise you're expecting the EPL teams playing in Europe in August to start playing a new EPL season after they go out of Europe with no break. I don't think they will accept that demand, so I can't see the new EPL season starting before October.

      Many winter seasons are now resuming. The EPL will be the last to do so. So the European slots from our league won't all be filled until the end of July, possibly August if the cup winner gets a spot. Some of those spots are just for qualifying rounds as it is. So you can't start playing the new qualifying rounds until all the current competitions are completed. Then there's the City situation thrown in, and how that affects things.

      It's nothing to do with money. The European games simply cannot begin until everyone knows where they stand, how many European slots they have, what qualifying rounds they enter in, and we may not know that until after both of the European competitions for the current season are decided.

      We're fortunate to know where we stand for Europe next season, but many others don't atm.
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #23: Jun 07, 2020 07:05:52 pm
      I said the EPL starting in October next season. Otherwise you're expecting the EPL teams playing in Europe in August to start playing a new EPL season after they go out of Europe with no break. I don't think they will accept that demand, so I can't see the new EPL season starting before October.

      Many winter seasons are now resuming. The EPL will be the last to do so. So the European slots from our league won't all be filled until the end of July, possibly August if the cup winner gets a spot. Some of those spots are just for qualifying rounds as it is. So you can't start playing the new qualifying rounds until all the current competitions are completed. Then there's the City situation thrown in, and how that affects things.

      It's nothing to do with money. The European games simply cannot begin until everyone knows where they stand, how many European slots they have, what qualifying rounds they enter in, and we may not know that until after both of the European competitions for the current season are decided.

      We're fortunate to know where we stand for Europe next season, but many others don't atm.

      The EPL will not wait until October, two full months after finishing this season, so that a small group of teams can play out their remaining UEFA matches. These are typically played concurrently anyway, so why should it be any different?

      I'll grant you the start of the qualifying rounds for the 2020-21 European competitions may need to be pushed back for the current domestic seasons to be completed (qualifiers normally would have begun on June 23!), but this won't affect domestic schedules except for four clubs Europe wide (the finalists). All matches except the final are played midweek anyway (and even that could change for this one season).

      Then the group stage matches for the two Euro competitions will probably have a slightly later start date, but it should all be caught up by the end of the calendar year. Fixture lists will be crowded for sure, but taking a two month break after finishing these final nine matches wouldn't make any sense at all.
      clint_call01
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      Re: Reds back in training
      Reply #24: Jun 08, 2020 06:08:12 am
      I am familiar with the normal format, but this coming season will not be normal. It will take some major tweaking for sure, but I bet they do not wait until October. And I don't think they will hold up the whole thing so some team from Albania and some team from Malta have a proper break before they play their qualifying round, the first of four or five before the group stages. They will arrange something else - too much money involved. Teams that don't get to participate in those rounds will probably get a little something for their trouble.

      In Malta, MFA, ended the league and the first time won it. Floriana was leading the league by only 3 points and had 6 games remaining :/

      I can't wait for us to start the games.

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