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      Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion

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      0112358
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #529: Feb 04, 2021 11:50:03 am
      We have one point from the bottom six teams and you claim there is no problem!!!! WOW

      ...because in the long run we look fine. You glued to our latest dry spell but overlook the big picture which looks fine like I prove. Football is an heavily probabilistic game, i.e. few games can be very deceiving. If you don't see that then you are like the owner of a slot machine that wants to close business because some dudes won during the weekend. That happens but it is not a bad sign at all. Therefore your "wisdom" (insanity = doing things over and over again and expect different outcome) is a very dangerous half-truth that is more false than true in life.

      Again, after a sample of 21 games we are 2nd in goals - better than City! How can u mumble about that offense? Defensively we have 25 goals against us which is just average (City has 13), but what do you expect when VVD, Matip and Gomet are out, and even Fabinho and Alisson lately? That are facts and not just gossip or feeling.
      « Last Edit: Feb 04, 2021 11:55:43 am by 0112358 »
      LondonRed83
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #530: Feb 04, 2021 12:01:34 pm
      Would be so Liverpool to beat city on Sunday too
      Tayls
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #531: Feb 04, 2021 12:27:25 pm
      I don't understand this desire to come up with some new tactical plan. You don't throw out what made you the best team in the world over two seasons because of a run of bad games - which can happen to any team, at any time. You certainly try to improve what you do well, work on what you do badly, and try to evolve to become more dynamic and unpredictable, but you don't just say "That's not working anymore, we're starting over" just because you've lost a couple of games.

      In terms of Plan A's and B's, that is exactly why we signed Jota and Thiago instead of a CB in the summer. Jota to provide genuine competition for places, and Thiago to help pick apart low block teams. Why we've not been able to do that is a good subject of debate, but it's not for a lack of trying, or lack of foresight by the management team. The huge risk we took in going in with the 3 CB's + Fabi, was mainly because we wanted to focus on being more dynamic and unpredictable, especially against low block tactics. Why hasn't it worked, is a good question.

      I think we've been spoilt the last two years and have some very high standards that we've not met at all this season, for many different reasons. To an extent, I did think we'd end up losing more games and winning less this season, simply because the standard of 95+ points we've set last two seasons just isn't possible, or at least isn't likely, every season. Teams have sat deep against us for a while now, and we've found ways to win games. For whatever reason, it's not happening this month and we've put in some of our worst performances of the last year or two (although credit to Brighton last night, they were brilliant). That said, given how good we were before, is that really worthy of throwing the baby out with the bathwater? I don't think so, and although the title race may be over now (beat City and that looks a bit different), I think we need some perspective. World class managers and teams don't become sh*t in a month, they're allowed bad runs and bad form, it's football, it happens. As Klopp says, "the ball is round and rolls both ways".

      That said maybe I'm just more optimistic about our future beyond this slump, or less emotionally invested this season, all just feels a bit meh without fans for so long.
      HamannsTheMan
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #532: Feb 04, 2021 12:54:13 pm
      OK so ignore the last 2 paragraphs and lets have a debate on the rest instead of another tedious  ad hominem attack!

      To be honest with you mate, I quite enjoy your posts overall even though you come out with complete and utter tripe from time to time.

      But you know all this victim stuff you constantly post about how everybody attacks you? Have a day off mate. It’s boring.

      If you didn’t post sh*te like ‘I have no faith in klopp’ and ‘klopp is insane’ then maybe people wouldn't quote you and call you out on it.

      How can you call our manager insane and lose faith in him after he took us from seventh to domestic, European and world champions? Do you not realise how much of a tit you look?

      We’re all frustrated with how this season is going and klopp has made plenty of errors which I’ve also stated myself but don’t take him for granted and come out with ludicrous statements. We literally have the best manager/coach in the world.



      skolRED
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #533: Feb 04, 2021 01:01:15 pm
      Next season if spine of team no change just sign Haaland and the world is our!
      Liverpool, Liverpool  :scarf:
      heimdall
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #534: Feb 04, 2021 03:17:13 pm
      ...because in the long run we look fine. You glued to our latest dry spell but overlook the big picture which looks fine like I prove. Football is an heavily probabilistic game, i.e. few games can be very deceiving. If you don't see that then you are like the owner of a slot machine that wants to close business because some dudes won during the weekend. That happens but it is not a bad sign at all. Therefore your "wisdom" (insanity = doing things over and over again and expect different outcome) is a very dangerous half-truth that is more false than true in life.

      Again, after a sample of 21 games we are 2nd in goals - better than City! How can u mumble about that offense? Defensively we have 25 goals against us which is just average (City has 13), but what do you expect when VVD, Matip and Gomet are out, and even Fabinho and Alisson lately? That are facts and not just gossip or feeling.


      I have stated in another thread that we are a very weird team, we are brilliant against teams who play Open football, arguably the best in the world when all players are fully fit etc. We are however F***ing terrible against teams who play Low Block, ie the bottom 6 teams in the league and we do not show any signs of improving in that area, in fact we seem to be getting worse. The reason for that is that far too inflexible rigid tactics and not having the right players. For example in the game yesterday we needed to have much more penetration by our fullbacks and midfield but every time they get near the 16 yard box they stop, that must be through orders, if its a lack of confidence then its even more worrying!
      heimdall
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #535: Feb 04, 2021 03:23:31 pm
      I don't understand this desire to come up with some new tactical plan. You don't throw out what made you the best team in the world over two seasons because of a run of bad games - which can happen to any team, at any time. You certainly try to improve what you do well, work on what you do badly, and try to evolve to become more dynamic and unpredictable, but you don't just say "That's not working anymore, we're starting over" just because you've lost a couple of games.

      In terms of Plan A's and B's, that is exactly why we signed Jota and Thiago instead of a CB in the summer. Jota to provide genuine competition for places, and Thiago to help pick apart low block teams. Why we've not been able to do that is a good subject of debate, but it's not for a lack of trying, or lack of foresight by the management team. The huge risk we took in going in with the 3 CB's + Fabi, was mainly because we wanted to focus on being more dynamic and unpredictable, especially against low block tactics. Why hasn't it worked, is a good question.

      I think we've been spoilt the last two years and have some very high standards that we've not met at all this season, for many different reasons. To an extent, I did think we'd end up losing more games and winning less this season, simply because the standard of 95+ points we've set last two seasons just isn't possible, or at least isn't likely, every season. Teams have sat deep against us for a while now, and we've found ways to win games. For whatever reason, it's not happening this month and we've put in some of our worst performances of the last year or two (although credit to Brighton last night, they were brilliant). That said, given how good we were before, is that really worthy of throwing the baby out with the bathwater? I don't think so, and although the title race may be over now (beat City and that looks a bit different), I think we need some perspective. World class managers and teams don't become sh*t in a month, they're allowed bad runs and bad form, it's football, it happens. As Klopp says, "the ball is round and rolls both ways".

      That said maybe I'm just more optimistic about our future beyond this slump, or less emotionally invested this season, all just feels a bit meh without fans for so long.

      Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different outcome, the very best managers would be changing things but not our Jürgen he's being extremely German about this problem, he's decided on his favourite players and formation and Damn it he'll keep playing them and his system!!
      If you guys remember back to last season there were a hell of a lot of games we won more through good fortune than skill, games where we were down right sh*t, just that we had a brilliant defence and an attacking line which would generate just enough chances over 90 minutes to get at least one goal without looking that convincing, well now the table has turned we are still struggling to create chances, against Low Block, but we are the ones conceding that goal. we have to find a better solution to this problem becomes teams have figured out how to frustrate us and ride their luck.
      AlwaysTheKop
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #536: Feb 04, 2021 03:24:00 pm
      That CT fella been quiet since his point was disproven...
      HScRed1
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #537: Feb 04, 2021 05:01:40 pm
      That CT fella been quiet since his point was disproven...

      Currently being briefed by FSG how to proceed.

      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #538: Feb 04, 2021 05:49:47 pm
      Currently being briefed by FSG how to proceed.



      Hahaha nah don't think he's at the level of jaime kanwar just yet!!
      TheleftpegofRayKennedy
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #539: Feb 05, 2021 12:10:39 am
      Fergie played players on form and tactics no matter if it was Beckham or Jonathan Greening,big names counted for nothing,no way would lower/lesser teams screw them over constantly in a short space of time playing the same tactic like us recently with no plan B.100% agree about a Manc on a Liverpool forum,very odd,i wouldn't waste one second on a manc forum talking about them.

      Oddly enough, I for one really enjoy Keith's perspective and humour.  All part of life's rich pageant! 
      Brings a nice balance to the knee-jerk ranting and narcissism of some of us on here (not you btw!).
      weareliverpool
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #540: Feb 05, 2021 12:46:10 am
      Oddly enough, I for one really enjoy Keith's perspective and humour.  All part of life's rich pageant! 
      Brings a nice balance to the knee-jerk ranting and narcissism of some of us on here (not you btw!).

      Fair enough,just my view.
      0112358
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #541: Feb 05, 2021 06:07:08 am
      I have stated in another thread that we are a very weird team, we are brilliant against teams who play Open football, arguably the best in the world when all players are fully fit etc. We are however f**king terrible against teams who play Low Block, ie the bottom 6 teams in the league and we do not show any signs of improving in that area, in fact we seem to be getting worse. The reason for that is that far too inflexible rigid tactics and not having the right players. For example in the game yesterday we needed to have much more penetration by our fullbacks and midfield but every time they get near the 16 yard box they stop, that must be through orders, if its a lack of confidence then its even more worrying!

      I see where you coming from but you are just a victim of your imagination. Look at 2019 and 2020. We did beat the f*ck out of those low-blocking teams, did we? We did it even at the beginning of the '21 season. Just in the last two months do we struggle and we know precisely why. There's no complaining justified other than over fate that made us injury-riddled weak. It seems you cannot cope with fate, but you obviously need some guilt or blame in hope to change (uncontrolable) things. That's human, but that's also delusional.

      Let Klopp do his work, enjoy the ride - even the ride thru the valley because it will make you feel much better when we're back on top of the mountain and that will be soon because we have all the pieces.
      Keith Singleton
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #542: Feb 05, 2021 09:12:33 am
      Oddly enough, I for one really enjoy Keith's perspective and humour.  All part of life's rich pageant! 
      Brings a nice balance to the knee-jerk ranting and narcissism of some of us on here (not you btw!).


      I just try and take those rose tinted glasses off  a few of the lads that never take them off.  ;D

      Thank You.
      lfc across the water
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #543: Feb 05, 2021 01:56:07 pm
      Quote from srslfc
      I should have clarified that it is mental fatigue I'm talking about. I think we're a bit spent in that regard.

      Agree with this as well by the way.

      I think this side has reached its peak and does need a bit of freshening up. The previous summer should have seen that started and we kind of got away with it and I think we're seeing the impact this has had on this group of players now.

      We just got 2 central defenders. We got 3 new players in the summer, so the squad has been freshened up. But they're not much use when they're injured, or as was the case in this game, sitting in the stand locked up in their masks.

      I struggle to accept tiredness as a reason for results. Jürgen complains about the schedule, as he has done ever since he took the job, but playing twice a week is normal, while travel is an unavoidable part of the game. If you want to succeed at the highest level, you have to be willing to travel. It's a nice complaint to have though. Travelling anywhere is a relative luxury atm, and to some extent, so is actually having work to do. If they want to see what tiredness looks like, go down to the local hospital and watch the medics 12 hour shifts every day, then the same again tomorrow, and the same again the next day, where levels of fatigue is no defence for not doing their job. And run a household while they're at it. That is tiredness.

      Quote from HamannsTheMan
      For the modern game, a club the size of ours who competes in several competitions, you need a big squad consisting of 22 internationals, covering each position. We don’t have that. Not even close.

      I know we can’t compete with city financially but just compare the two squads. They have depth everywhere. It reduces their chances of injuries. Look at Foden this season. He plays one week and then he’s benched the next. Whenever he’s benched, Mahrez comes in for him. But the difference between the two is very little, they’re both quality players and they’re on par with each other.

      We don’t have competition for places. Just look at the state of our bench tonight. You could argue Brighton had a stronger bench than us.

      We have no decent back up keeper and considering our first choice has a habit of missing a dozen games or so every season then this needs addressing. A bit harsh on kelleher because he’s done alright but because alisson misses so many games then we need a proper backup premierleague keeper.

      In midfield we have plenty of options. Fabinho, Hendo, gini, milner, ox, Thiago, Jones. Normally that would be enough to get us through the season and there’s enough quality there too but Thiago and ox have both had lengthy times in the medical room and Fabinho and Hendo have played at the back.

      So for a season where we’ve been hammered with injuries it’s been evident that our squad is 1. Short of players and 2. Not good enough anyway.

      We have a PL standard keeper, who played in this game, and his superb performance was the only highlight of an awful night. I presume Alisson will play the next game, as long as he can stand up straight, but if he isn't 100% ready, why put him through it? Whoever is in goal will still have a lot of work to do. Kelleher has been exceptional for us this season and may be somewhere else in the league next year, as he's too good to be sitting here getting splinters on the bench for long.

      There's not a lot to say about the game itself, but hopefully it is the last we see of the Hendo in central defence experiment. Fabinho is on the way back and we have new centre backs available, so use them. Jota should be back by the Fulham game at the latest.

      6 weeks ago, we were 6 points clear and they were saying the league was won. Now we're nearer to 6th place and they're saying the league is done. There's nobody out there atm with any consistency apart from City, who have enjoyed the benefits of a very generous fixture list. For us, the immediate focus is to win the next game, and it will be a totally different game to this one. If we win the next two games, then we're one point behind City and we'll see what happens from there. They're about to begin a run of games against proper opposition who have firepower and will ask questions of them. 

      We have 48 points left to play for, obviously we need some breaks but if we win the next one, there's still plenty of time to turn this around. But the first thing we need to do, is believe.
      bmck
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      • YNWA
      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #544: Feb 05, 2021 02:42:44 pm
      Klopp on tonight's game:
      ...for me the team looked tonight – and it’s long ago we looked like this – fatigued, mentally fatigued and that leads to not the best legs as well. It was a tough week and today we were not fresh enough, that means then [not] good enough to break the formation of Brighton. ...

      Sorry, but personally do NOT buy the tiredness line at all.
      We didn't look tired against Spuds and WH, and won those games pretty comfortably, scoring a few in each.

      Yes we have injuries at the back, so are missing guys from the middle who would improve us there.
      But the teams playing us at home are not really putting us under sustained pressure at the back - like, I don't even think we're getting as exposed as we might if teams actually came with an intent to attack, rather than defend.
      So, we have a lot of the ball, but just can't fecking score !!

      Burnley were sh*te, that was the worst of the recent home results imho, not being able to score and then have those useless fuckers nick a goal. F**k that was dire. Least Brighton looked a bit dangerous [I know, Brighton].

      Main problems for the home games for me are the form of the forwards, missing Jota, rest of team [apart from front 3] not chipping in enough goals, and having a planB:
      Bobs form has been like a yoyo, Mo is getting goals but missing a bunch of chances though can't be too hard on Mo, and even Mane is having a dip - when the bus is parked in home games and the opposition crowd the box, the interplay needs to be so precise, and its not.
      In the first third of the season, Jota was coming on in games where we were struggling to break teams down and was getting some important goals - he was brilliant, best of the front 4 imho for a while - we've really missed his pace and clinical finishing.
      VVD, Matip, Fab, Hendo used to chip in with important goals - and we're missing those putting more pressure on the front 3 to score - not sure if Nat/Rhys/Thiago/Milly/Shaq etc have scored, Gini's got a few - didn't google it. But doesn't feel like we've got many outside Bob/Mo/Mane/Jota

      In general play, we don't seem to be changing things up much in these games. Subs come on, but do the same things. Side to side across the middle, over to the FBs, cross it into a crowded box, big lumps head it out/clear, we go again. Too predictable.
      Can see forwards making runs when CBs/CMs are deep, but they're either not trying the pass, or hitting it too long. Surely we could try that more, it only needs to work once. 
      And on the few times guys take a pop from just outside the box, it just looks like they're desperate/not hitting it with any conviction, miles over/wide, not even making the keepers, who are sometimes sh*te, work. One of the things I'd hope they are practicing in training is that.
      We could also work on set pieces, our free kicks/corners etc, have been pretty crap, not sure much has come from them in recent home games.

      Make the keeper work more - we have had quite a few chances in a lot of games, but are not even hitting the target with them, its unreal.

      We've CBs to come in, injured players to come back, the season is not over yet. But we need to find a way to beat bus parkers at Anfield, cause teams can see how to get points there. Loosing against Brighton was bad with everyone round us winning, but lot of twists left you'd think.
      We have the best manager in the world who has had ridiculous injury problems to contend with - know he won't be giving up any time soon.
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #545: Feb 05, 2021 02:48:47 pm
      Sorry, but personally do NOT buy the tiredness line at all.
      We didn't look tired against Spuds and WH, and won those games pretty comfortably, scoring a few in each.

      Yes we have injuries at the back, so are missing guys from the middle who would improve us there.
      But the teams playing us at home are not really putting us under sustained pressure at the back - like, I don't even think we're getting as exposed as we might if teams actually came with an intent to attack, rather than defend.
      So, we have a lot of the ball, but just can't fecking score !!

      Burnley were sh*te, that was the worst of the recent home results imho, not being able to score and then have those useless fuckers nick a goal. F**k that was dire. Least Brighton looked a bit dangerous [I know, Brighton].

      Main problems for the home games for me are the form of the forwards, missing Jota, rest of team [apart from front 3] not chipping in enough goals, and having a planB:
      Bobs form has been like a yoyo, Mo is getting goals but missing a bunch of chances though can't be too hard on Mo, and even Mane is having a dip - when the bus is parked in home games and the opposition crowd the box, the interplay needs to be so precise, and its not.
      In the first third of the season, Jota was coming on in games where we were struggling to break teams down and was getting some important goals - he was brilliant, best of the front 4 imho for a while - we've really missed his pace and clinical finishing.
      VVD, Matip, Fab, Hendo used to chip in with important goals - and we're missing those putting more pressure on the front 3 to score - not sure if Nat/Rhys/Thiago/Milly/Shaq etc have scored, Gini's got a few - didn't google it. But doesn't feel like we've got many outside Bob/Mo/Mane/Jota

      In general play, we don't seem to be changing things up much in these games. Subs come on, but do the same things. Side to side across the middle, over to the FBs, cross it into a crowded box, big lumps head it out/clear, we go again. Too predictable.
      Can see forwards making runs when CBs/CMs are deep, but they're either not trying the pass, or hitting it too long. Surely we could try that more, it only needs to work once. 
      And on the few times guys take a pop from just outside the box, it just looks like they're desperate/not hitting it with any conviction, miles over/wide, not even making the keepers, who are sometimes sh*te, work. One of the things I'd hope they are practicing in training is that.
      We could also work on set pieces, our free kicks/corners etc, have been pretty crap, not sure much has come from them in recent home games.

      Make the keeper work more - we have had quite a few chances in a lot of games, but are not even hitting the target with them, its unreal.

      We've CBs to come in, injured players to come back, the season is not over yet. But we need to find a way to beat bus parkers at Anfield, cause teams can see how to get points there. Loosing against Brighton was bad with everyone round us winning, but lot of twists left you'd think.
      We have the best manager in the world who has had ridiculous injury problems to contend with - know he won't be giving up any time soon.

      You make a lot of good observations here, but I'll disagree on one point, and agree with Jürgen, the team DID look tired against Brighton. Is that accumulation due to the fixture list, I don't know, but Bobby, Robbo, Gini, Hendo, Thiago in particular looked well off the pace, mentally and physically.  As I've said elsewhere, I don't think we've ever been able to build up the fitness base that Jürgen typically wants for players to run all out in game after game.

      I think this and your points can both be true.
      verde-rubro
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #546: Feb 05, 2021 07:31:25 pm
      why is Gini mad at Maupay, what was said?
      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #547: Feb 06, 2021 12:42:06 pm
      why is Gini mad at Maupay, what was said?

      If Maupay called him a "shithouse" he'd be right!!
      lfc across the water
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      Re: Liverpool 0-1 Brighton & Hove Albion: In game and Post Match discussion
      Reply #548: Feb 07, 2021 07:08:26 pm
      Quote from lfc across the water
      We have a PL standard keeper, who played in this game, and his superb performance was the only highlight of an awful night. I presume Alisson will play the next game, as long as he can stand up straight, but if he isn't 100% ready, why put him through it? Whoever is in goal will still have a lot of work to do.

      You saw it here first.

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