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      Scouting talk

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      Don77
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2737: May 26, 2023 04:21:22 pm
      Nunez was paid for. 34m for mane ... 17m for neco Williams, 18m for minamino. Total income 69m

      60m upfront for nunez, 4m on ramsay and 5 on carvalho ... and guess what broke even. Sold to buy.

      These fsg apologists are embarrassing
      « Last Edit: May 26, 2023 04:35:22 pm by Don77 »
      ruthcity
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2738: May 26, 2023 04:33:20 pm
      Nunez was paid for. 34m for mane ... 17m for neco Williams, 18m for minamino. Total income 69m

      60m upfront for nunez, 4m on ramsay and 5 on carvalho ... and guess what broke even. Sold to buy.

      These fsg apologists of embarrassing

      If that's the case, go all the way.

      Don't just sell to buy. Don't just target breakeven. If it's player trading, show us how good you are that every year, the club actually makes money from every transfer window trading players!

      If we don't go aggressive on getting the best players, show us your profit on players every season.

      The worst is when you don't make money from player trading and your acquisitions don't do much to strengthen the squad.

      That's FSG now... At least show us some trading gains and we'll be comforted that you're actually trying to make a profit off players than chugging along and not achieving anything on player acquisitions.

      Tell us you bought Mario for £16m and that he's worth £40m and that you actually offload him for £40m and cream off the profit! It looks like FSG can't even do this and we are also not acquiring very aggressively.
      Lallana in Pyjamas
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2739: May 26, 2023 04:59:46 pm
      Nunez was paid for. 34m for mane ... 17m for neco Williams, 18m for minamino. Total income 69m

      60m upfront for nunez, 4m on ramsay and 5 on carvalho ... and guess what broke even. Sold to buy.

      These fsg apologists are embarrassing


      Confirmed Liverpool FC Transfers, Season 2022/23

      Players IN:

      Darwin Nunez – Benfica – £85m
      Fabio Carvalho – Fulham – £7.7m
      Calvin Ramsay – Aberdeen – £6.5m
      Arthur Juventus – Loan
      Cody Gakpo – PSV – £37m

      Spent: £136.2m

      Players OUT:

      Sadio Mane – Bayern Munich – £35.1m
      Neco Williams – Nottingham Forest – £17m
      Takumi Minamino – Monaco – £15.5m
      Ben Davies – Rangers – £4m
      Divock Origi – AC Milan – Free
      Tom Clayton – Swindon – N/A
      Jake Cain – Swindon – N/A

      Received: £71.6m
      andylfcynwa
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2740: May 26, 2023 06:05:19 pm

      Confirmed Liverpool FC Transfers, Season 2022/23

      Players IN:

      Darwin Nunez – Benfica – £85m
      Fabio Carvalho – Fulham – £7.7m
      Calvin Ramsay – Aberdeen – £6.5m
      Arthur Juventus – Loan
      Cody Gakpo – PSV – £37m

      Spent: £136.2m

      Players OUT:

      Sadio Mane – Bayern Munich – £35.1m
      Neco Williams – Nottingham Forest – £17m
      Takumi Minamino – Monaco – £15.5m
      Ben Davies – Rangers – £4m
      Divock Origi – AC Milan – Free
      Tom Clayton – Swindon – N/A
      Jake Cain – Swindon – N/A

      Received: £71.6m

      Haha really if your going down that road put the figures up since they been here then you’ll get a true reflection as usual cherry picking to suit yourself 🤦‍♂️
      Lallana in Pyjamas
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2741: May 26, 2023 06:23:24 pm
      Haha really if your going down that road put the figures up since they been here then you’ll get a true reflection as usual cherry picking to suit yourself 🤦‍♂️

      That was in response to what the poster said about the transfers this season 🤷‍♂️ -


      But since FSG arrived it’s

      5. Liverpool
      Five Biggest Purchases

      1. Virgil van Dijk – £76.2milion
      2. Darwin Nunez – £67.5million
      3. Alisson – £56.3million
      4. Naby Keita – £54million
      5. Fabinho – £40.5million

      Five Biggest Sales

      1. Phillipe Coutinho – £121.5million
      2. Luis Suarez – £75million
      3. Fernando Torres – £50million
      4. Raheem Sterling – £49million
      5. Sadio Mane – £28.8million

      Total Spent: £1.254billion
      Total Sold: £636million

      Total Net Spend: £618millio


      Plus what’s Gakpo cost
      « Last Edit: May 26, 2023 06:40:14 pm by Lallana in Pyjamas »
      IrishRed_IO
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2742: May 26, 2023 06:29:01 pm
      F**k me this thread is depressing!

      Will reserve judgement until our business is done.
      Don77
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2743: May 26, 2023 09:35:20 pm
      Haha really if your going down that road put the figures up since they been here then you’ll get a true reflection as usual cherry picking to suit yourself 🤦‍♂️

      He's funny this fella. We're on about last summer and he slips in gapko whi signed in the winter. He will be paid for by outgoings.

      Nunez was 60m upfront plus add ons ... none of which he's near reaching.

      Ramsay was 4m upfront and carvalho 5m upfront. Neither will reach their addons and trigger payout.

      We broke even in the summer. These fsg apologists really are embarrassing
      Lallana in Pyjamas
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2744: May 26, 2023 10:20:59 pm
      He's funny this fella. We're on about last summer and he slips in gapko whi signed in the winter. He will be paid for by outgoings.

      Nunez was 60m upfront plus add ons ... none of which he's near reaching.

      Ramsay was 4m upfront and carvalho 5m upfront. Neither will reach their addons and trigger payout.

      We broke even in the summer. These fsg apologists really are embarrassing

      Why do you quote the Mane fee at £35 mil when it’s £27mil up front ?

      https://theathletic.com/4175101/2022/06/21/sadio-mane-joins-bayern-munich-from-liverpool/?amp=1

      You quote the Minamino fee as £18mil when it’s under £13mil up front

      https://www.skysports.com/amp/football/news/11095/12642019/takumi-minamino-monaco-confirm-signing-of-liverpool-forward-in-deal-worth-15-4m

      And even getting the Williams fee wrong

      https://www.skysports.com/amp/football/news/11095/12649850/neco-williams-nottingham-forest-sign-right-back-from-liverpool


      So to try and make your point you use


      Just the initial fee for Nunez and other players we sign

      But use the full transfer fees including add on’s for all the players we sell - 🤔

      andylfcynwa
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2745: May 27, 2023 07:07:56 am
      It comes down to this , you got the fan who thinks we’ve been properly backed , and you’ve got the fans who think we havnt , but in all of this there is one over riding factor
      The table don’t lie .
      Aminegriffy
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2746: May 27, 2023 08:57:57 am
      God damn it they Torygraph article is depressing.
      gazred
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2747: May 27, 2023 10:49:31 am
      It comes down to this , you got the fan who thinks we’ve been properly backed , and you’ve got the fans who think we havnt , but in all of this there is one over riding factor
      The table don’t lie .

      You are correct in saying that the table don't lie. This has been a season where the team has achieved well below our expectations, Jürgen's expectations and their expectations.

      But there are many reasons for that, not just financial backing from the owners. Obviously buying players is important but those players need to be coached to become a team that wins together. There are many examples of owners who backed the team financially and got nothing.

      For some fans the players we could have/should have bought will always be better than the players who we have bought. The current players are human, they will make mistakes, play badly occasionally and have injuries. In some fans imagination we would be much better with player x because he will always be MOM, they will never get injured or make mistakes. They will never miss a penalty against Bournemouth.

      It's been a frustrating season but the reasons are complex and the solution is not just money ( but we do need to spend some money).
      andylfcynwa
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2748: May 27, 2023 11:53:01 am
      You are correct in saying that the table don't lie. This has been a season where the team has achieved well below our expectations, Jürgen's expectations and their expectations.

      But there are many reasons for that, not just financial backing from the owners. Obviously buying players is important but those players need to be coached to become a team that wins together. There are many examples of owners who backed the team financially and got nothing.

      For some fans the players we could have/should have bought will always be better than the players who we have bought. The current players are human, they will make mistakes, play badly occasionally and have injuries. In some fans imagination we would be much better with player x because he will always be MOM, they will never get injured or make mistakes. They will never miss a penalty against Bournemouth.

      It's been a frustrating season but the reasons are complex and the solution is not just money ( but we do need to spend some money).

      Quite right there are numerous factors , but imho when we were on top we didn’t capitalise and add quality you can’t just run a team into the ground or stand still .
      Lallana in Pyjamas
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2749: May 27, 2023 12:11:35 pm
      It comes down to this , you got the fan who thinks we’ve been properly backed , and you’ve got the fans who think we havnt , but in all of this there is one over riding factor
      The table don’t lie .

      Can you expand on what “properly backed” means ?

      Do you have a figure in your head that points to “properly backed” ?


      And which table ? Is that the one with the £600mil transfer spend Chelsea down on 13th ?
      Breeding-Reds-In-The-434
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2750: May 27, 2023 01:34:31 pm
      A lot of these post belong in the FSG thread. Let's talk about incoming / outgoing transfers in here. Punch FSG and argue with Lyallana in another thread.

      I bet we make our business quick this summer. Excited to see what we do
      PolarBearRed
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2751: May 27, 2023 01:58:24 pm
      Real Madrid are signing hin for 100 million euros. He must've rejected us because if he ends up there for £87 million then questions need to be asked.
      Thing is I agree with you that questions need to be asked about Bellingham. And when I say ''Bellingham'' I mean the whole fiasco that it is/was from top to bottom. The two years of waiting for ''our target'' while casually not doing anything for the midfield, the ''we are saving money for Bellingham'' followed by the ''he's too expensive'' and now potentially, a deal on the verge of being struck by Madrid that I don't have the details of but looks, potentially, more than affordable for a team that saved for 2+ years to get that player. Now that this is said, I don't have the details of that Madrid deal so it might be 87m upfront and a shitload of money in bonuses of all sorts that brings it to an incredibly high number.

      With that said, as stupid as it may sound, I have to agree with the club about pulling out of the Bellingham race. Like I said above, that doesn't mean that they were right about this whole thing or that we shouldn't ask questions. It simply means that they let the problem in midfield get to a point where we need 2 or 3 midfielders to fix the ship and that simply won't happen in the same summer you're buying Bellingham for a ton of money because we have a limited budget.

      So what I'm saying is that we've gone through the Bellingham anger a bit earlier in the year and its not changing anything, he's not coming here. What we need to be focused on right now is this upcoming transfer window where 2 or 3 midfielders are needed and not just any midfielders. We have to be spot on. The sad truth is that those midfielders will have to come in and become starters pretty early in the season which is never ideal because it takes time for players to gel with the others and learn the way we play. So we can't afford for those guys, on top of what I just said, to end up being average players.

      Let's just focus on our window and forget about Bellingham. What's done is done and constantly fighting each other about it won't change anything other than make it harder for us to discuss the actual task at hand.

      shawspeed
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2752: May 27, 2023 03:18:13 pm
      Thing is I agree with you that questions need to be asked about Bellingham. And when I say ''Bellingham'' I mean the whole fiasco that it is/was from top to bottom. The two years of waiting for ''our target'' while casually not doing anything for the midfield, the ''we are saving money for Bellingham'' followed by the ''he's too expensive'' and now potentially, a deal on the verge of being struck by Madrid that I don't have the details of but looks, potentially, more than affordable for a team that saved for 2+ years to get that player. Now that this is said, I don't have the details of that Madrid deal so it might be 87m upfront and a shitload of money in bonuses of all sorts that brings it to an incredibly high number.

      With that said, as stupid as it may sound, I have to agree with the club about pulling out of the Bellingham race. Like I said above, that doesn't mean that they were right about this whole thing or that we shouldn't ask questions. It simply means that they let the problem in midfield get to a point where we need 2 or 3 midfielders to fix the ship and that simply won't happen in the same summer you're buying Bellingham for a ton of money because we have a limited budget.

      So what I'm saying is that we've gone through the Bellingham anger a bit earlier in the year and its not changing anything, he's not coming here. What we need to be focused on right now is this upcoming transfer window where 2 or 3 midfielders are needed and not just any midfielders. We have to be spot on. The sad truth is that those midfielders will have to come in and become starters pretty early in the season which is never ideal because it takes time for players to gel with the others and learn the way we play. So we can't afford for those guys, on top of what I just said, to end up being average players.

      Let's just focus on our window and forget about Bellingham. What's done is done and constantly fighting each other about it won't change anything other than make it harder for us to discuss the actual task at hand.



      Problem is when our targets (although that should probably be singular) decides to go elsewhere we've not had credible alternatives. Melo on deadline day is not it and reeks or either arrogance or ineptitude in our transfer department.
      CT_LFC
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2753: May 27, 2023 03:21:49 pm
      Thing is I agree with you that questions need to be asked about Bellingham. And when I say ''Bellingham'' I mean the whole fiasco that it is/was from top to bottom. The two years of waiting for ''our target'' while casually not doing anything for the midfield, the ''we are saving money for Bellingham'' followed by the ''he's too expensive'' and now potentially, a deal on the verge of being struck by Madrid that I don't have the details of but looks, potentially, more than affordable for a team that saved for 2+ years to get that player. Now that this is said, I don't have the details of that Madrid deal so it might be 87m upfront and a shitload of money in bonuses of all sorts that brings it to an incredibly high number.

      With that said, as stupid as it may sound, I have to agree with the club about pulling out of the Bellingham race. Like I said above, that doesn't mean that they were right about this whole thing or that we shouldn't ask questions. It simply means that they let the problem in midfield get to a point where we need 2 or 3 midfielders to fix the ship and that simply won't happen in the same summer you're buying Bellingham for a ton of money because we have a limited budget.

      So what I'm saying is that we've gone through the Bellingham anger a bit earlier in the year and its not changing anything, he's not coming here. What we need to be focused on right now is this upcoming transfer window where 2 or 3 midfielders are needed and not just any midfielders. We have to be spot on. The sad truth is that those midfielders will have to come in and become starters pretty early in the season which is never ideal because it takes time for players to gel with the others and learn the way we play. So we can't afford for those guys, on top of what I just said, to end up being average players.

      Let's just focus on our window and forget about Bellingham. What's done is done and constantly fighting each other about it won't change anything other than make it harder for us to discuss the actual task at hand.

      Transfer fees aren’t the only factor. Haaland went for even less than that, but it’s the wages and bonuses that made that transfer.
      Aminegriffy
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2754: May 27, 2023 03:26:19 pm
      Watching Gravenberch right now. He doesn't seem ready at all.
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2755: May 27, 2023 03:27:03 pm
      A lot of these post belong in the FSG thread. Let's talk about incoming / outgoing transfers in here. Punch FSG and argue with Lyallana in another thread.

      I bet we make our business quick this summer. Excited to see what we do

      I hope you are right about doing our business quick, not because what I want, I want now, but because in a  Klopp team, having a full preseason to get integrated with the team, the system, etc., is vitally important (probably this is true with every team but Jürgen is always talking about the sheer importance of training to get the team ready). That gives us just over 30 days to get anybody in or out.

      But Jürgen just made a comment that it might take time. You do want the transfer people to be careful with the club's money. A few million here or there on a fees (both in and out) can add up over time - it is important.
      andylfcynwa
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2756: May 27, 2023 03:27:36 pm
      Can you expand on what “properly backed” means ?

      Do you have a figure in your head that points to “properly backed” ?


      And which table ? Is that the one with the £600mil transfer spend Chelsea down on 13th ?
      I couldn’t give a flying Fck where Chelsea finish no interest in them whatsoever, , I only care where we finish , as for the rest it’s fckin pointless debating it with you ,
      Robby The Z
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2757: May 27, 2023 03:28:52 pm
      So about a left-sided center back, is that meant to be a first choice player for the coming season, or a longer term replacement for somebody named Virgil?

      Who do you all think are the most serious prospects to come in this summer at center back?
      Longy-Shops
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2758: May 27, 2023 03:29:37 pm
      Problem is when our targets (although that should probably be singular) decides to go elsewhere we've not had credible alternatives. Melo on deadline day is not it and reeks or either arrogance or ineptitude in our transfer department.
      Bellingham has never been "Too expensive"...just more expensive than the club were happy to pay. If a can of beans is 90p and you've only got 89p then that's an example of too expensive....FSG have more than enough funds to have secured the player. Perhaps there was no point putting a bid in as they knew he was determined to go to Madrid?...whatever...we move on
      CT_LFC
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #2759: May 27, 2023 03:30:08 pm


      And which table ? Is that the one with the £600mil transfer spend Chelsea down on 13th ?

      Clearly Chelsea owners didn’t back the coaches enough because if they had they wouldn’t be that far down the table since net spend is the only determinant of future success.  ;D

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