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      Scouting talk

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      CT_LFC
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5819: Jan 26, 2024 02:40:51 pm
      And even bigger question...do any of the other players move on? It will be interesting to see the pull the club has vs the pull Klopp had.


      Inevitably there will be departures as a new coach will want his stamp on the team.
      FL Red
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5820: Jan 26, 2024 03:14:32 pm

      Inevitably there will be departures as a new coach will want his stamp on the team.

      That's not what I'm talking about but ok.
      rossyred
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5821: Jan 26, 2024 06:18:57 pm
      That's not what I'm talking about but ok.

      Yep be interested to see what Salah does now and also people like Ibou are at risk who other clubs will.sniff around
      FL Red
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5822: Jan 26, 2024 07:16:20 pm
      Yep be interested to see what Salah does now and also people like Ibou are at risk who other clubs will.sniff around

      Didn’t Dom in fact come here because he wanted to work with Jürgen? Believe he said as much in his intro interview.

      Maybe nothing, but you never know.
      Breeding-Reds-In-The-434
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5823: Jan 26, 2024 10:16:31 pm
      If we get De Zerbi, I want him to bring the whole squad of scouts, and maybe a Brighton player or two
      srslfc
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5824: Jan 26, 2024 10:19:17 pm
      Can't see any signings now this winter after today's news.

      Didn't expect any anyway but definitely don't see us buying players with a manager leaving and no Sporting Director in place.

      Might even mean limited movement in the summer as well given we have bigger fish to fry so to speak.
      Rush Goalie
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5825: Jan 27, 2024 10:55:18 am
      You don't half see some sh*te stories...Salah, VVD and Trent to leave ???
      Why would Virg and Trent leave??...Mo I think there's possibilities he'll go, that likelihood went up a bit more yesterday for me, it all depends on a Saudi bid, Mo's hunger for real football and few other things.
      Any out of contract players will leave I'm sure, might give the new manager a couple of options.
      Don77
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5826: Jan 27, 2024 11:08:03 am
      Can't see any signings now this winter after today's news.

      Didn't expect any anyway but definitely don't see us buying players with a manager leaving and no Sporting Director in place.

      Might even mean limited movement in the summer as well given we have bigger fish to fry so to speak.

      This summer is a right off for me. Unless the club sort out a new manager and dof behind closed doors before the end of the season because they need to work hand in hand.

      This summer the first job for the new manager/club will be to get Ali, Trent, Virg, Mo etc tied to new deals. We need to send out a message that it's business as usual.

      In a way this is why pep is the obvious choice ... for a seamless transition. But I don't think that will happen as the club announced they're all going.
      HUYTON RED
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5827: Jan 27, 2024 01:12:21 pm
      Yep be interested to see what Salah does now and also people like Ibou are at risk who other clubs will.sniff around

      Jürgen never wanted Salah.

      He was Edwards pick ;)

      He'll be sound.
      CT_LFC
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5828: Jan 28, 2024 01:47:37 am
      Can't see any signings now this winter after today's news.

      Didn't expect any anyway but definitely don't see us buying players with a manager leaving and no Sporting Director in place.

      Might even mean limited movement in the summer as well given we have bigger fish to fry so to speak.

      Summer will be busy. Whoever is going to take over DOF then coach I expect will be settled (but not communicated) before summer.


      Whoever comes in will need the summer to start shaping the team the way he wants it, plus we will have players like Thiago, Adrian and others that will create open spots needing to be filled before anyone else leaves.
      gazred
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5829: Jan 28, 2024 11:06:59 am
      Summer will be busy. Whoever is going to take over DOF then coach I expect will be settled (but not communicated) before summer.

      I'm hoping that the new DOF and manager can have a relatively quiet summer. We have a fairly large squad with quality and a good mix of youth and experience. The summer, IMO should be primarily be about continuity, extending contracts for Virgil, Mo and a few others. I'd be ok giving Matip and even Thiago another season on reduced wages.
      The new manager will probably want to bring in some players but I don't think we should spend big, that didn't work for United or Arsenal.
      alex1995
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5830: Jan 29, 2024 05:17:33 am
      I'm hoping that the new DOF and manager can have a relatively quiet summer. We have a fairly large squad with quality and a good mix of youth and experience. The summer, IMO should be primarily be about continuity, extending contracts for Virgil, Mo and a few others. I'd be ok giving Matip and even Thiago another season on reduced wages.
      The new manager will probably want to bring in some players but I don't think we should spend big, that didn't work for United or Arsenal.


      Thiago and Matip need to leave ASAP. Too many injuries. We won't miss them. They are very good players but we won't miss players who don't play, like we don't miss Keita or Chamberlain. With them gone, we'll buy fresh legs.

      I respect them, particularly Matip but it's time to call it a day.
      ConzS
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5831: Jan 29, 2024 11:03:49 am
      Thiago and Matip need to leave ASAP. Too many injuries. We won't miss them. They are very good players but we won't miss players who don't play, like we don't miss Keita or Chamberlain. With them gone, we'll buy fresh legs.

      I respect them, particularly Matip but it's time to call it a day.
      Bit harsh on Matip, guy has done his cruciate ligament. Historically he’s had injuries yes but the last few years he’s missed very little and made a massive contribution. At times he has been better than Van Dijk.

      As for Thiago, I can’t actually remember a time when he played football for us it feels that long ago.
      alex1995
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5832: Jan 29, 2024 11:42:46 am
      Bit harsh on Matip, guy has done his cruciate ligament. Historically he’s had injuries yes but the last few years he’s missed very little and made a massive contribution. At times he has been better than Van Dijk.

      As for Thiago, I can’t actually remember a time when he played football for us it feels that long ago.

      Have a look at his injury history : https://www.transfermarkt.com/joel-matip/verletzungen/spieler/82105/plus/1

      I can be too harsh, but I don't think I am here.
      ConzS
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5833: Jan 29, 2024 03:55:44 pm
      Have a look at his injury history : https://www.transfermarkt.com/joel-matip/verletzungen/spieler/82105/plus/1

      I can be too harsh, but I don't think I am here.
      Think it proves my point if anything. Aside from his circulate ligament which has not long happened, in the last 2 and a half years he has missed a couple of games with illness and 2 weeks out with a calf injury.

      Seems harsh to mention him in the same breath as Thiago who has had 7 separate injuries in the last 3 seasons and missed about 70 games.
      gazred
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5834: Jan 29, 2024 09:55:11 pm
      Thiago and Matip need to leave ASAP. Too many injuries. We won't miss them. They are very good players but we won't miss players who don't play, like we don't miss Keita or Chamberlain. With them gone, we'll buy fresh legs.

      I respect them, particularly Matip but it's time to call it a day.

      Matip was unlucky to get a serious injury. He should be able to recover and could have a role as an experienced reserve for league and FA cup games. I also think it would be good for squad harmony, so the players know that the club will support them even after a contract ends.
      An extension for Thiago would depend on a few things , mainly him getting fit this season and proving he can play til the end of the season. Also it would depend on the new manager's plans for the team.
      Both players would need to take big wage cuts obviously. As I said, my priority is extending the contracts of Mo, Virgil, Trent and a few others. Matip and Thiago are certainly not my priority, just options.

      Every transfer window a lot of fans get preoccupied with the number of expensive players we buy, I think this could be more intense when the new manager comes in; people will expect the club to back the manager. I think that is risky and could cause problems.
      verde-rubro
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      The-AllMightyReds
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5836: Feb 14, 2024 01:38:57 pm

      Fantastic player, one of my favourite to watch in the league but given his injury record, 60m is a no no.
      ConzS
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5837: Feb 19, 2024 08:07:09 am
      Hopefully we can hold on to Salah for another season at least but I think everyone can agree there is at least a chance he leaves. If so, what are peoples thoughts on:

      - Rafael Leao
      - Khvicha Kvaratskhelia (Had to copy/paste that one)
      - Rodrygo
      - Leroy Sane

      Not watched much of them at all (generally don’t watch football these days if Liverpool aren’t involved) but these are names I hear a lot of.
      srslfc
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5838: Feb 19, 2024 08:24:15 pm
      Hopefully we can hold on to Salah for another season at least but I think everyone can agree there is at least a chance he leaves. If so, what are peoples thoughts on:

      - Rafael Leao
      - Khvicha Kvaratskhelia (Had to copy/paste that one)
      - Rodrygo
      - Leroy Sane

      Not watched much of them at all (generally don’t watch football these days if Liverpool aren’t involved) but these are names I hear a lot of.

      Federico Chiesa

      Jarrod Bowen.
      Diego LFC
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5839: Feb 19, 2024 09:07:26 pm
      Hopefully we can hold on to Salah for another season at least but I think everyone can agree there is at least a chance he leaves. If so, what are peoples thoughts on:

      - Rafael Leao
      - Khvicha Kvaratskhelia (Had to copy/paste that one)
      - Rodrygo
      - Leroy Sane

      Not watched much of them at all (generally don’t watch football these days if Liverpool aren’t involved) but these are names I hear a lot of.

      These are all good players but frankly replacing Salah one-for-one is nearly impossible - not one of those produces goals and assists at the same rate.

      Also, most of those are predominantly left-sided players, Leão and Kvaratskhelia in particular - don't think I've seen them play on the right, though I could be wrong as I don't watch Milan or Napoli that often. Think Sané also played mostly on the left for City, but can also play on the right. Rodrygo is probably the most versatile of the lot, has played wide, central, as a striker, etc.
      Diego LFC
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5840: Feb 19, 2024 09:12:16 pm
      Mohamed Salah is irreplaceable. Let's use data to replace him, anyway.
      Can it be done? Let's find out!

      GRACE ROBERTSON
      23 JAN 2024

      I don’t want to shock anyone here, but Liverpool and Egypt attacker Mohamed Salah is quite good at the football.

      We’re halfway through his seventh season at Anfield and he’s still never had a campaign where you’d say his performances fell below the standard of “one of the Premier League’s best attackers”. Since returning to England’s top flight in 2017, he’s scored 127 non-penalty goals, more than any other player. Harry Kane is in second place with 111, while no one else has more than 100. At the same time, he’s contributed 66 assists and an all-round game that’s transformed this Liverpool side.

      He’s 31 years old right now and, at a time when he might have lost a touch of pace, he’s somehow adding even more to his game. He’s making more progressive passes per 90 than in any previous season without sacrificing his expected goals and assists at all. He’s been absolutely electric. His left-footedness brings so much balance to a Liverpool team otherwise dominated by righties. Perhaps most importantly, he’s world-class at the greatest ability of all: availability. Yes, he’s injured right now, infuriatingly forcing me to rewrite this intro. But that’s his first injury since November 2019 (not including testing positive for Covid). The man is pretty much always fit.

      So he’s always excellent, really important tactically, and never gets injured. Yeah, those players definitely grow on trees. But that shouldn’t deter us, should it? Let’s start by seeing if we can find any straight statistical matches for what Salah can do.

      Let’s start by looking at Salah’s worst output. His lowest non-penalty xG and xG assisted over a season was 0.43 and 0.18 in 2020/21. So we’re going to search for a player in the top five leagues in the past three seasons with at least those stats, having played at least ten 90s worth of minutes. And we’re only going to look at players born in 1997 or later, meaning the oldest among the sample would turn 27 this year. Let’s see who Stathead spits out.

      The simple search produced the following 23 names:

      Victor Boniface
      Matheus Cunha
      Bamba Dieng
      Artem Dovbyk
      Breel Embolo
      João Félix
      Erling Haaland (three times)
      Nicolas Jackson
      Gabriel Jesus
      Khvicha Kvaratskhelia
      Mohamed Bayo
      Ademola Lookman
      Donyell Malen
      Lautaro Martínez
      Kylian Mbappé (three times)
      Bryan Mbeumo
      Terem Moffi
      Christopher Nkunku (twice)
      Darwin Núñez (twice)
      Loïs Openda
      Rodrygo
      Marcus Thuram
      Ferrán Torres

      Darwin Núñez already plays for Liverpool, so he’s not much use here. Then there are the four players already at Premier League Rich Seven clubs: Erling Haaland, Nicolas Jackson, Gabriel Jesus and Christopher Nkunku. They’re not going to Liverpool. Nor is Kylian Mbappé, whatever spurious internet rumours may tell you, or Rodrygo. We’re down to 16 names.

      As you might have noticed, quite a few players here are out-and-out strikers, who might be great, but they’re not really what we’re looking for (Victor Boniface, Bamba Dieng, Artem Dovbyk, Mohamed Bayo, Lautaro Martínez, Terem Moffi and Marcus Thuram). Then we get to maybe the biggest problem: of the nine names left, eight are right-footed (Matheus Cunha, Breel Embolo, João Félix, Khvicha Kvaratskhelia, Ademola Lookman, Donyell Malen, Loïs Openda and Ferrán Torres). Salah’s left-footedness is very important to Liverpool’s attack.

      Which means we have just one name left. For a direct statistical replacement, the player Liverpool should sign if they sell Salah is….

      *drum roll*

      BRYAN MBEUMO.

      I can sense the Liverpool fans booing me from across the internet.

      In all fairness, Mbeumo has been good for Brentford. He’s showing good signs of progress at age 24, fits the tactical role as a left-footed right winger bursting into space, and has two years left on his contract this summer. He’s had a few years of xG underperformance that, if you can be confident will not keep plaguing him, probably reduce his transfer fee a bit. Liverpool have done very well in the past signing players from Premier League clubs outside the elite, and Mbeumo would fit the model as another one of these. If you want a poor man’s Salah, he might be ideal.

      But is he the real thing? Of course not. Guys, you’re still trying to replace Salah. I told you we can’t do it, and we can’t do it. Now, what we might be able to do is recreate him. Recreate him in the aggregate.

      I think we can break what Salah does for Liverpool into three core areas: goals, creativity, and left-footedness. Goals are obviously pretty straightforward to measure He’s scored 10 non-penalty strikes in the league this season from 9.4 xG. Over his entire time at Anfield, he averages out 0.57 non-penalty goals per 90, and he’s on the pitch for about 34 league 90s, so we’re looking at 19 goals per season (yes, I know he takes the penalties as well, but someone else can do that). That’s the number of goals we have to find.

      Let’s assume the player in question will be able to play about 80% of the available minutes. That means they need to be producing a little over 0.6 non-penalty goals per 90. We’ll use xG because it’s more predictive. We’re also not looking for out-and-out strikers. Again, they must have been born in 1997 or later, and we’re subtracting those Liverpool have no realistic chance of signing. Here’s who FBRef spits out either this season:

      Arnaut Danjuma
      Bamba Dieng
      Ansu Fati
      Moise Kean
      Samu Omorodion
      Loïs Openda (twice)
      Marcus Thuram (twice)

      I’ve been a little more generous with the definition of “striker” this time. Someone like Thuram tends to play as a nine now, but he’s been effective out wide in the past. Friend of the newsletter and very smart football knower Mohamed Mohamed has been banging the Thuram drum for over six years now, so that would be exciting. Openda has really looked the part for RB Leipzig as he did for Lens and would certainly be interesting, though likely not cheap. I don’t think the other players have shown the kind of consistency over several years that we’re looking for.

      If Liverpool signed a right-footer to replace Salah, I think they’re committing to starting Harvey Elliott as the right-sided central midfielder every week. His inclination to drift out wide as a left-footed playmaker would provide the balance that Salah automatically offers with his left foot. I like Elliott a lot, but I understand why you might not want to do that. And in terms of creativity, Liverpool are probably maxed out in terms of what they’re getting elsewhere from Dominik Szoboszlai, Curtis Jones and Trent Alexander-Arnold. I think it would be very difficult to carry a forward who didn’t offer as much creativity as Salah without making the team worse.

      As we’ve established, Salah is doing more creative work than ever this season. I think that’s been a big part of Liverpool’s resurgence this season, and important in transitioning from a selfless false nine like Roberto Firmino to Núñez, a much more individualistic player, up top. He’s providing 5.13 progressive passes per 90 and 3.58 progressive carries. Let’s loosen it up a touch and go for at least five passes and three carries. This time, let’s only look for attackers who hit those stats, within the same age range as before, and we’ll limit ourselves to left footers. Let’s see what comes up.

      Charles De Ketelaere
      Harvey Elliott
      Romain Faivre
      Nicolás González
      Ilan Kebbal
      Iván Martín
      Michael Olise
      Rodri (not that one, the one at Betis)
      Matías Soulé

      It’s good news that Liverpool already have a player turning up in both searches. Between them, Elliott and Núñez could fill the things Salah does. It’s just a problem that he already does them in addition to what those players bring. Another interesting player was Cole Palmer. I removed him from the list because he has a contract running until the heat death of the universe, he’s surely near the bottom of the list of players Chelsea might sell, and Liverpool are probably one of the clubs Todd Boehly et al would least like to sell to. But if anything were to change after such a disappointing season for the club, I’d seriously think about making an offer.

      Matías Soulé is certainly getting a lot of excitement right now. The aforementioned Mohamed Mohamed was pretty sold on his talent, though voiced some concerns about whether he’d suit English football. Soulé isn’t a hugely explosive player and would offer much more of a creative role to support others running into space. But his body isn’t finished maturing at age 20, and to do what he’s already doing in Serie A at midtable Frosinone is really impressive, so he might be worth at least looking into. He is owned by Juventus, but who knows what their finances might mean in terms of keeping young players?

      Michael Olise is a boring but logical choice. He can definitely handle the Premier League and has shown decent, if not elite, playmaking skills on an uninspiring Crystal Palace team. We’re seeing him take on more attacking responsibility this season, with more shots, more xG and more goals, without a decline in his creativity. It’s a small sample size but, at 22 years old, he might be improving his game in important ways. Palace showed last summer that they didn’t need to sell when Chelsea started sniffing around, but will it make more sense this summer, if a bid comes in early? The club’s largest shareholder, John Textor, is exploring selling his 45% stake, and who knows how that uncertainty will affect transfer dealings?

      If a player like Olise or Soulé were to come in on the right, Liverpool would need to get more goals from elsewhere. Luis Díaz hasn’t been sparkling over the past twelve months, so simultaneously upgrading at left wing could ease the burden. And should Liverpool be getting more goals from midfield? Dominik Szoboszlai has scored just twice in the league this season, with no other midfielder getting more than that. Szoboszlai is taking fewer shots from really dangerous locations at Anfield than he did at RB Leipzig, presumably because he’s playing a slightly deeper role. There’s an option to push him a bit further forward and make this team more of a 4-2-3-1 instead of a 4-3-3, which could again help spread the burden of losing Salah.

      This is all really hypothetical. We don’t even know if Salah will be leaving or not, though I think it’s certainly something Liverpool should be thinking about. We do know that there isn’t another Salah sitting around for the Reds to scoop up, and some more creative thinking is required to replace him. Whatever happens this summer, Liverpool will have to move on from him sooner or later. The important thing is to understand how to replace what the team does with him in the side, rather than simply replacing him. You can’t replace a player like Salah but, yes, you can recreate him in the aggregate.

      https://www.graceonfootball.com/p/mohamed-salah-is-irreplaceable-lets
      PastorGeek
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      Re: Scouting talk
      Reply #5841: Apr 01, 2024 04:42:57 am
      https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/manchester-united-joao-gomes-transfer-32407602

      Michael Edwards has the chance to do one of the funniest things in Football during the Summer Transfer Window.

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