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      First Team Squad 21/22

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      PTU
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #46: Aug 14, 2021 06:04:24 am
      But the article is thoughtful and does show how so so many players are set to have a much greater impact on team fortunes this season.

      The bit about Woodburn was really interesting. Hopefully there is some truth there.
      Robby The Z
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #47: Aug 17, 2021 04:44:31 pm
      Doesn't look like Shaq is in first team training. Departure imminent?
      Fabio Aurelio
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #48: Aug 17, 2021 09:17:49 pm
      I think our squad is good enough to win the title, but I do have my concerns


      Here’s my assessment:

      Goalkeepers:
      We have the best goalkeeper in the world imo. Adrian is not reliable but he is capable of making some good saves. I like Kelleher and right now he is my (and it seems Klopp’s) #2. We’re fine in the goalkeeping department.


      Defence:
      In terms of centre back, we have the best set of 4 in the league and probably the world. The only issue is that Matip is injury prone and so is Gomez. Konate has had his injury issues as well. I like Phillips but I think it’s best if he goes. Williams makes sense for 5th choice. I’m happy with our centre back options. We COULD have another injury crisis, but I think we will be alright.


      I think we’re set at left back. I didn’t think Robertson had the best season last year, so Tsimikas should hopefully make him kick back on to his previous level once he returns. Tsimikas had a mostly good game against Norwich imo, and he has the speed and play style to fit in well with our style of play. We also have (an old!) Milner if needed.

      Out of all the positions at the back, I’d say we’re weakest at right back. Trent is amazing and is an automatic starter due to how much influence he has on our play, so it’s going to be difficult to get a good back up when that player knows they aren’t going to play much.

      I’m not a massive fan of Neco Williams but he has had some good performances in the past and hopefully now with him being a bit older he can improve. He’s not going to push Trent though, and our level is going to drop if Trent gets injured and Neco comes in. We will just have to alter our tactics a bit, because there’s very few full backs who can do what Trent does.

      Outside of TAA and Neco, we have Milner and Gomez. Milner is old and full back is usually a young man’s position, but if he has to fill in there I won’t be too worried. Gomez is a good right back but his best position is obviously CB. I worry about Gomez getting injured playing RB, but if we had a big away game and Trent was out, I’d be fine with putting Gomez in at RB.

      The midfield is my biggest worry with this squad. Our starting three is very, very good; perhaps the best in the league. Fab, Hendo, Thiago is a very good midfield. I rate Keita but his injury issues are a big concern. It just hasn’t really worked out so far, but I thought he was excellent against Norwich and I think there’s a section of the fan base that completely ignores the good things when it comes to him.

      After the 4 players I mentioned, there is a drop off. Milner always manages to surprise me. I thought he had a really solid game against Real Madrid in the CL game at Anfield. I think he still has something to offer, but he could get old overnight. Great player to have in the squad though.

      I like Ox and I understand that it’s a good idea to keep him because of the home grown rules, but he’s never found any kind of consistency following his injury against Man City. He at least offers something different to our midfield and is one of the few players in the team who has a good shot from outside the box. I’d love to see him somehow return to the level he was at during his first season, but I don’t have much confidence that he is going to be able to do that. I thought he was poor against Norwich.

      I like Jones and Elliot. Jones gained a lot of experience last season and Elliot has very good passing ability and is really good for his age. Elliot is obviously unproven at this level though. I want to see the young players getting games but I don’t want the manager to have to rely on them too much due to injuries etc.

      Woodburn might get some chances in the league cup etc. I’m not really going to consider him as a serious option right now though.


      I think our main issue in the midfield is that we have injury prone players. Henderson, Keita, and Ox are all known for having had injury issues. Thiago has also had some issues in the past, although getting clamped by Richarlison is pretty much always going to result in an injury.

      Gini was very rarely injured. His engine was also very good. If Henderson and Keita are out, I worry about our pressing ability and stamina in the middle of the park. I know we have Milner, but he’s 35. I would like to see another signing who has similar qualities to Gini and has a good engine. I’m not going to lose too much sleep if we don’t sign another midfielder, but it would give me more confidence.

      A lot of people are against signing Sanches due to his struggles at club level and his injury record, but I think he’s very talented. It would be a risky signing but if Klopp wants him then I will support that decision.

      Nandez is an interesting player who is wanted by Spurs. I have seen him play for Uruguay and I have also caught him a couple of times when watching Serie A. He has a really good engine and is a versatile player who can also fill in at right back. I like what I have seen of him, but I wouldn’t be able to say with confidence whether I believe he’d be able to step up to this level.

      I like Bissouma and it seems that we have had some interest. It looks like he might cost quite a lot though.


      Onto the forward positions:

      We have four great options. I’m very happy with Salah, Mane, Firmino, Jota. There’s a big drop off after that though. I like Shaqiri a lot but he’s doesn’t really fit our 433. He is more of a midfielder who creates chances than he is a forward in a Klopp 433. I think he should go for his own benefit. Elliot is a built in replacement who will have a lot of time to build his game around becoming a CM in Klopp’s system.

      I love what Origi has done for us but he’s unable to push for a starting spot and he’s not a natural fit in this system. I’d sell him if we got a decent fee.

      I like Minamino. In the 433, I see him as a false 9 or an inverted LW similar to Coutinho. He could play as a 10 or off the left in a 4231. I don’t see him being utilised as a number 8 in the 433. Perhaps in the odd home game against a smaller team Klopp would consider it. I think Minamino’s a good squad option who could really kick on.


      I wouldn’t mind seeing one more forward player come in. I’d personally lean more towards a pacey winger than a central player. The player should also be under the age of 25. Probably closer to 20 than 25.


      This wraps up my long assessment of the squad. Even if we don’t make any more additions, I think we will win the league as long we don’t have injuries to key players in midfield. Winning it this season would be a real achievement considering the amount of money our rivals have spent. We are also a big threat in the champions league.
      « Last Edit: Aug 17, 2021 09:23:30 pm by Fabio Aurelio »
      Robby The Z
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #49: Aug 18, 2021 12:20:12 pm
      When is the deadline for transfers and squad registration?
      bigbob75
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #50: Aug 18, 2021 01:47:40 pm
      When is the deadline for transfers and squad registration?

      31st August mate.
      bigbob75
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #51: Aug 18, 2021 01:49:38 pm
      And I think last updated squad registration by 20th October
      Robby The Z
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #52: Aug 18, 2021 04:10:08 pm

      Cheers Bob. I reckon it will go down to the wire with some outgoings. I don't expect any more incoming.
      PTU
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #53: Aug 18, 2021 04:23:31 pm
      A lot of people are against signing Sanches due to his struggles at club level and his injury record, but I think he’s very talented. It would be a risky signing but if Klopp wants him then I will support that decision.

      Very good overall assessment of our squad. Just that one thing: Sanches is currently... you guessed it... out injured.  :roll: He has to go under the knife and will be out for around 2 months. So we aren't signing him this transfer window.
      Fabio Aurelio
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #54: Aug 18, 2021 04:55:55 pm
      Very good overall assessment of our squad. Just that one thing: Sanches is currently... you guessed it... out injured.  :roll: He has to go under the knife and will be out for around 2 months. So we aren't signing him this transfer window.
      That’s not a surprise!
      FL Red
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #55: Aug 18, 2021 05:31:47 pm
      Very good overall assessment of our squad. Just that one thing: Sanches is currently... you guessed it... out injured.  :roll: He has to go under the knife and will be out for around 2 months. So we aren't signing him this transfer window.

      That's the problem with injury prone players...they tend to get injured a lot :D
      AlwaysTheKop
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #56: Aug 18, 2021 05:38:37 pm
      I think there is still one more to come yet, and like Jota, will just happen out the blue.
      bigbob75
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #57: Aug 18, 2021 07:54:41 pm
      Cheers Bob. I reckon it will go down to the wire with some outgoings. I don't expect any more incoming.

      I reckon it will go down to the wire also Robby, but got a feeling we’re going to buy Sarr
      brezipool
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #58: Aug 18, 2021 08:10:10 pm
      Squad is looking good, likely we will add 1 or 2 new faces if Origi & Shaq leave soon.

      Richard88
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #59: Aug 19, 2021 04:01:36 am
      I think there is still one more to come yet, and like Jota, will just happen out the blue.
      What position do you think an arrival would play ideally?

      Looking at the squad there's a really good balance in every position and no hugely glaring holes.

      It would of course be nice to add another midfielder, but with Fabinho playing in midfield again he will effectively replace Wijnaldum internally from last years midfield. Klopp undoubtedly has plans for Elliott to play as well, and another body in midfield would block him a bit.

      A midfielder with attacking qualities who can replace Milner/Ox in the squad going forwards would be nice. Currently the pure numbers in midfield aren't bad, though it is likely to become an issue that a few of them are injury prone (Ox, Keita, and Thiago especially). The midfield also lacks a player or two in the 21-25 range which could be an issue with regards to having a smooth succession plan when Henderson/Thiago/Milner/Ox age out.

      ---------------------------- Alisson (28) --------------------------------
      --------------------------- Kelleher (22) -------------------------------
      --------------------------------------------------------------------------
      Trent (22) --- Matip (30) ------- VVD (30) --------- Robertson (27)
      Neco (20) --- Gomez (24) ----- Konate (22) -------- Tsimikas (25)
      --------------- Phillips (24) ----- R. Williams (20) -------------------
      --------------------------------------------------------------------------
      ---------------------------- Fabinho (27) ------------------------------
      ----------------------------- Milner (35) -------------------------------
      --------------------------------------------------------------------------
      -------------- Henderson (31) ------------ Thiago (30) ---------------
      -------------------- Ox (28) ---------------- Keita (26) ----------------
      ------------------ Elliott (18) --------------- Jones (20) ---------------
      ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
      ------ Salah (29) ---------- Firmino (29) ---------- Mane (29) -------
      ----- Shaqiri (29) ----------- Jota (24) ------------- Origi (26) -------
      ----------------------------- Minamino (26) ----------------------------

      The obvious two to exit to make room in the squad, as speculated pretty widely to be available or on the move, are Shaqiri and Origi. Ideally you want your "2nd team"/subs to be in the 21-24 age range with potential, and neither Shaqiri or Origi fulfill that criteria and are on the periphery of the squad.

      Ideally what would happen would be to move Origi and Shaqiri on, and replace them in the squad with a young high-potential forward who isn't quite in their prime yet but would be on the cusp of hitting their prime just as Salah/Firmino/Mane enter the latter half of their new contracts.

      ------ Salah (29) ---------- Firmino (29) ---------- Mane (29) -------
      ----- Minamino (26) --------- Jota (24) ------- New Forward (19-22)

      In terms of who could potentially be moved on from the midfield to make room (either this summer or next), the obvious player would be Ox. He's nearing his 30's and hasn't come close to reaching his best for a long time now due to recurring injuries. Next summer he'll only have one year left on his deal and one would assume that that the club looks to move him on if he doesn't have a very good season.





      « Last Edit: Aug 19, 2021 01:55:00 pm by Richard88 »
      lfc across the water
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #60: Aug 19, 2021 08:46:55 pm
      Quote from PTU
      Playing an international tournament is mentally and physically draining. Especially as each of them is the 'star player' of his country. Even if they don't think they need it, I'd rather we give them a few days to rest afterwards. There's no need to risk injuries down the line for the sake of one game.
      And the good thing is they won't all reach the final, so they'll come back gradually.

      In 2017, our squad was nowhere near as complete as it is now, so I wouldn't use it as reference point. Also, we played a lot more games in January 2017 than we will in 2022.

      There will be the usual amount of games in January across the different competitions. I accept that tournaments are draining, and you would expect Mane and/or Salah to be playing several knockout rounds, but there simply isn't the time for them to rest when we have to play twice a week, as we usually have to at that time of year. So as soon as they are eliminated from the Afcon, they'll be straight back to Liverpool to play in our next game. The last time it happened in January, Mane was back playing for us 3 days after Senegal were eliminated, to stop the rot of 3 home losses in a row. It's not the ideal situation, but there's no alternative.
      Richard88
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #61: Aug 31, 2021 11:09:46 pm
      I thought it would be interesting to compare our squad with the other title contenders to put the lack of activity in this window in some perspective.


      GK: LIV > CHE > MCI > MU

      United have the weakest starter but the best depth. Liverpool have the best goalie in the world. City and Chelsea are pretty even.

      Liverpool      Man City    Chelsea     United
      Alisson           Ederson      Mendy        De Gea
      Kelleher         Steffen        Kepa           Henderson
      Adrian            Carson       Bettinelli     Heaton                                                 



      CB: LIV > MCI > MU > CHE

      City and Liverpool have the best CB groups, but Liverpool get the edge as VVD is the best in the world, and because Konate>Ake. Chelsea's CB's are pretty overrated, and their depth isn't great considering that they play 3 at the back. United falls off pretty hard after Varane/Maguire.

      Liverpool      Man City    Chelsea        United
      Van Dijk          Dias            Christensen   Varane
      Matip              Laporte       Rudiger         Maguire
      Gomez            Stones         T. Silva          Lindelof
      Konate            Ake               Sarr               Bailly
      Phillips            Sandler      Chalobah       P. Jones



      RB: MCI > CHE > LIV > MU

      City and Chelsea probably edge this one as they have better depth than Liverpool, though it feels harsh given that Trent is the best RB in the league when on form.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea        United
      Trent               Walker          Azpilizueta    Wan-Bissaka
      Neco               Cancelo         R. James        Dalot



      LB: LIV > CHE > MU > MCI

      Liverpool easily have the best LB tandem. Chelsea have a better tandem than United but Shaw is arguably better than both Chelsea LB's. Man City have a problem at LB given the Mendy situation.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Robertson      Zinchenko     Alonso       Shaw
      Tsimikas          Mendy          Chilwell      Telles




      DM: CHE > LIV > MCI > MU

      Fabinho is arguably the world's best DM, but given the seasons Kante and Jorginho just had they get the edge. United are way behind in this position.

      Liverpool      Man City         Chelsea     United
      Fabinho          Fernandinho    Kante        McTominay
      Henderson      Rodri                Jorginho    Matic




      CM/AM: MCI > CHE > LIV > MU

      Man City aren't very deep in CM/AM but DeBruyne really tips the scales. Chelsea are looking very strong in this position too. Our options are decent, but so much hinges on fitness and young players developing. United are very top-heavy but arguably the impact of Pogba/Fernandes could have their group rated ahead of Liverpool.

      Liverpool      Man City       Chelsea         United
      Thiago           De Bruyne       Havertz         Pogba
      Keita              Gundogan        Mount          Fernandes
      Ox                  B. Silva              Kovacic         Fred
      Milner                                       Saul              van de Beek
      Jones                                       L-Cheek        Mata
      Elliott                                       Barkley
                                         



      RW LIV > MCI > MU > CHE

      I would give the edge to Liverpool even with weaker depth as Salah is one of the best forwards in the game, but City's depth is much better. Sancho still has to prove himself in the PL.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Salah               Mahrez         Pulisic        Sancho
      Minamino       Foden           Ziyech       Greenwood
                                                                        Lingard




      LW: MCI > MU > LIV > CHE

      City have easily the best LW tandem. I've given Rashford/Martial the edge as Mane hasn't been on form for a while, and Origi is a worse backup. Werner hasn't impressed, at least not yet.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea        United
      Mane              Sterling          Werner         Rashford
      Origi               Grealish          H-Odoi         Martial




      ST: MU > CHE > LIV > MCI

      This is a tricky one to judge. I would say that it's a tie across the board but to avoid that I would give Ronaldo the edge (though he has a lot to prove at 36 in the PL). Lukaku is a guarantee of 20-25 goals in that Chelsea team so I'll give Chelsea 2nd. I wouldn't trade Firmino/Jota for Jesus/Torres, and it's telling that City wanted to buy Kane as they do lack a natural CF.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Firmino           G. Jesus        Lukaku       Ronaldo
      Jota                  Torres                               Cavani




      With 4 points for "1st place", 3 points for 2nd, 2 points for 3rd, and 1 point for 4th... the teams stack up as follows:

      Liverpool 27
      Man City 24
      Chelsea  22
      United   17

      There you have it folks, Liverpool officially have the best squad in the league. :D
      « Last Edit: Sep 01, 2021 02:30:50 pm by Richard88 »
      srslfc
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #62: Sep 01, 2021 12:24:19 am
      I thought it would be interesting to compare our squad with the other title contenders to put the lack of activity in this window in some perspective.


      GK: LIV > CHE > MCI > MU

      United have the weakest starter but the best depth. Liverpool have the best goalie in the world. City and Chelsea are pretty even.

      Liverpool      Man City    Chelsea     United
      Alisson           Ederson      Mendy        De Gea
      Kelleher         Steffen        Kepa           Henderson
      Adrian            Carson       Bettinelli     Heaton                                                 



      CB: LIV > MCI > MU > CHE

      City and Liverpool have the best CB groups, but Liverpool get the edge as VVD is the best in the world, and because Konate>Ake. Chelsea's CB's are pretty overrated, and their depth isn't great considering that they play 3 at the back. United falls off pretty hard after Varane/Maguire.

      Liverpool      Man City    Chelsea        United
      Van Dijk          Dias            Christensen   Varane
      Matip              Laporte       Rudiger         Maguire
      Gomez            Stones         T. Silva          Lindelof
      Konate            Ake               Sarr               Bailly
      Phillips            Sandler      Chalobah                    P. Jones



      RB: MCI > CHE > LIV > MU

      City and Chelsea probably edge this one as they have better depth than Liverpool, though it feels harsh given that Trent is the best RB in the league when on form.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea        United
      Trent               Walker          Azpilizueta    Wan-Bissaka
      Neco               Cancelo         R. James        Dalot



      LB: LIV > CHE > MU > MCI

      Liverpool easily have the best LB tandem. Chelsea have a better tandem than United but Shaw is arguably better than both Chelsea LB's. Man City have a problem at LB given the Mendy situation.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Robertson      Zinchenko     Alonso       Shaw
      Tsimikas          Mendy          Chilwell      Telles




      DM: CHE > LIV > MCI > MU

      Fabinho is arguably the world's best DM, but given the seasons Kante and Jorginho just had they get the edge. United are way behind in this position.

      Liverpool      Man City         Chelsea     United
      Fabinho          Fernandinho    Kante        McTominay
      Henderson      Rodri                Jorginho    Matic




      CM/AM: MCI > CHE > LIV > MU

      Man City aren't very deep in CM/AM but DeBruyne really tips the scales. Chelsea are looking very strong in this position too. Our options are decent, but so much hinges on fitness and young players developing. United are very top-heavy but arguably the impact of Pogba/Fernandes could have their group rated ahead of Liverpool.

      Liverpool      Man City       Chelsea         United
      Thiago           De Bruyne       Havertz         Pogba
      Keita              Gundogan        Mount          Fernandes
      Ox                  B. Silva              Kovacic         Fred
      Milner                                       Saul              van de Beek
      Jones                                       L-Cheek        Mata
      Elliott                                       Barkley
                                         



      RW LIV > MCI > MU > CHE

      I would give the edge to Liverpool even with weaker depth as Salah is one of the best forwards in the game, but City's depth is much better. Sancho still has to prove himself in the PL.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Salah               Mahrez         Pulisic        Sancho
      Minamino       Foden           Ziyech       Greenwood
                                                                        Lingard




      LW: MCI > MU > LIV > CHE

      City have easily the best LW tandem. I've given Rashford/Martial the edge as Mane hasn't been on form for a while, and Origi is a worse backup. Werner hasn't impressed, at least not yet.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea        United
      Mane              Sterling          Werner         Rashford
      Origi               Grealish          H-Odoi         Martial




      ST: MU > CHE > LIV > MCI

      This is a tricky one to judge. I would say that it's a tie across the board but to avoid that I would give Ronaldo the edge (though he has a lot to prove at 36 in the PL). Lukaku is a guarantee of 20-25 goals in that Chelsea team so I'll give Chelsea 2nd. I wouldn't trade Firmino/Jota for Jesus/Torres, and it's telling that City wanted to buy Kane as they do lack a natural CF.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Firmino           G. Jesus        Lukaku       Ronaldo
      Jota                  Torres                               Cavani




      With 4 points for "1st place", 3 points for 2nd, 2 points for 3rd, and 1 point for 4th... the teams stack up as follows:

      Liverpool 27
      Man City 24
      Chelsea  22
      United   17

      There you have it folks, Liverpool officially have the best squad in the league. :D


      Enjoyed that mate.

      I think this does show we have the depth it's more a matter of keeping some players fit
      Robby The Z
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      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #63: Sep 01, 2021 12:35:17 am
      Origi stays after all. Rhys Williams loaned to Swansea. Nobody sold after Shaq.

      Now let's focus on winning.
      billythered
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 9,216 posts | 3816 
      • From Doubters to Champions of the World
      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #64: Sep 01, 2021 04:40:27 am
      I thought it would be interesting to compare our squad with the other title contenders to put the lack of activity in this window in some perspective.


      GK: LIV > CHE > MCI > MU

      United have the weakest starter but the best depth. Liverpool have the best goalie in the world. City and Chelsea are pretty even.

      Liverpool      Man City    Chelsea     United
      Alisson           Ederson      Mendy        De Gea
      Kelleher         Steffen        Kepa           Henderson
      Adrian            Carson       Bettinelli     Heaton                                                 



      CB: LIV > MCI > MU > CHE

      City and Liverpool have the best CB groups, but Liverpool get the edge as VVD is the best in the world, and because Konate>Ake. Chelsea's CB's are pretty overrated, and their depth isn't great considering that they play 3 at the back. United falls off pretty hard after Varane/Maguire.

      Liverpool      Man City    Chelsea        United
      Van Dijk          Dias            Christensen   Varane
      Matip              Laporte       Rudiger         Maguire
      Gomez            Stones         T. Silva          Lindelof
      Konate            Ake               Sarr               Bailly
      Phillips            Sandler      Chalobah                    P. Jones



      RB: MCI > CHE > LIV > MU

      City and Chelsea probably edge this one as they have better depth than Liverpool, though it feels harsh given that Trent is the best RB in the league when on form.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea        United
      Trent               Walker          Azpilizueta    Wan-Bissaka
      Neco               Cancelo         R. James        Dalot



      LB: LIV > CHE > MU > MCI

      Liverpool easily have the best LB tandem. Chelsea have a better tandem than United but Shaw is arguably better than both Chelsea LB's. Man City have a problem at LB given the Mendy situation.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Robertson      Zinchenko     Alonso       Shaw
      Tsimikas          Mendy          Chilwell      Telles




      DM: CHE > LIV > MCI > MU

      Fabinho is arguably the world's best DM, but given the seasons Kante and Jorginho just had they get the edge. United are way behind in this position.

      Liverpool      Man City         Chelsea     United
      Fabinho          Fernandinho    Kante        McTominay
      Henderson      Rodri                Jorginho    Matic




      CM/AM: MCI > CHE > LIV > MU

      Man City aren't very deep in CM/AM but DeBruyne really tips the scales. Chelsea are looking very strong in this position too. Our options are decent, but so much hinges on fitness and young players developing. United are very top-heavy but arguably the impact of Pogba/Fernandes could have their group rated ahead of Liverpool.

      Liverpool      Man City       Chelsea         United
      Thiago           De Bruyne       Havertz         Pogba
      Keita              Gundogan        Mount          Fernandes
      Ox                  B. Silva              Kovacic         Fred
      Milner                                       Saul              van de Beek
      Jones                                       L-Cheek        Mata
      Elliott                                       Barkley
                                         



      RW LIV > MCI > MU > CHE

      I would give the edge to Liverpool even with weaker depth as Salah is one of the best forwards in the game, but City's depth is much better. Sancho still has to prove himself in the PL.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Salah               Mahrez         Pulisic        Sancho
      Minamino       Foden           Ziyech       Greenwood
                                                                        Lingard




      LW: MCI > MU > LIV > CHE

      City have easily the best LW tandem. I've given Rashford/Martial the edge as Mane hasn't been on form for a while, and Origi is a worse backup. Werner hasn't impressed, at least not yet.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea        United
      Mane              Sterling          Werner         Rashford
      Origi               Grealish          H-Odoi         Martial




      ST: MU > CHE > LIV > MCI

      This is a tricky one to judge. I would say that it's a tie across the board but to avoid that I would give Ronaldo the edge (though he has a lot to prove at 36 in the PL). Lukaku is a guarantee of 20-25 goals in that Chelsea team so I'll give Chelsea 2nd. I wouldn't trade Firmino/Jota for Jesus/Torres, and it's telling that City wanted to buy Kane as they do lack a natural CF.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Firmino           G. Jesus        Lukaku       Ronaldo
      Jota                  Torres                               Cavani




      With 4 points for "1st place", 3 points for 2nd, 2 points for 3rd, and 1 point for 4th... the teams stack up as follows:

      Liverpool 27
      Man City 24
      Chelsea  22
      United   17

      There you have it folks, Liverpool officially have the best squad in the league. :D






      That’s a great bit of work right there so thank You for your efforts, interesting reading too, we will all have our own opinions of course as to who is better than whoever,  each club has some very good individuals and every club has their Worldy’s  to be fair to you you won’t be too far away with your judgement’s although having Ronaldo top of the tree when he has played in inferior league’s last few years is somewhat bemusing, and I’m betting Mo would be pissed off if he read it, anyhoo, great effort , and yes maybe we do have the better squad, but I’d prefer to say Hungrier squad, I just feel our boys this season will want it more !!



                                                                                Y  N  W  A
      brezipool
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
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      • 6,546 posts | 841 
      • Mon the Red Machine !
      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #65: Sep 01, 2021 12:21:20 pm
      I thought it would be interesting to compare our squad with the other title contenders to put the lack of activity in this window in some perspective.


      GK: LIV > CHE > MCI > MU

      United have the weakest starter but the best depth. Liverpool have the best goalie in the world. City and Chelsea are pretty even.

      Liverpool      Man City    Chelsea     United
      Alisson           Ederson      Mendy        De Gea
      Kelleher         Steffen        Kepa           Henderson
      Adrian            Carson       Bettinelli     Heaton                                                 



      CB: LIV > MCI > MU > CHE

      City and Liverpool have the best CB groups, but Liverpool get the edge as VVD is the best in the world, and because Konate>Ake. Chelsea's CB's are pretty overrated, and their depth isn't great considering that they play 3 at the back. United falls off pretty hard after Varane/Maguire.

      Liverpool      Man City    Chelsea        United
      Van Dijk          Dias            Christensen   Varane
      Matip              Laporte       Rudiger         Maguire
      Gomez            Stones         T. Silva          Lindelof
      Konate            Ake               Sarr               Bailly
      Phillips            Sandler      Chalobah                    P. Jones



      RB: MCI > CHE > LIV > MU

      City and Chelsea probably edge this one as they have better depth than Liverpool, though it feels harsh given that Trent is the best RB in the league when on form.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea        United
      Trent               Walker          Azpilizueta    Wan-Bissaka
      Neco               Cancelo         R. James        Dalot



      LB: LIV > CHE > MU > MCI

      Liverpool easily have the best LB tandem. Chelsea have a better tandem than United but Shaw is arguably better than both Chelsea LB's. Man City have a problem at LB given the Mendy situation.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Robertson      Zinchenko     Alonso       Shaw
      Tsimikas          Mendy          Chilwell      Telles




      DM: CHE > LIV > MCI > MU

      Fabinho is arguably the world's best DM, but given the seasons Kante and Jorginho just had they get the edge. United are way behind in this position.

      Liverpool      Man City         Chelsea     United
      Fabinho          Fernandinho    Kante        McTominay
      Henderson      Rodri                Jorginho    Matic




      CM/AM: MCI > CHE > LIV > MU

      Man City aren't very deep in CM/AM but DeBruyne really tips the scales. Chelsea are looking very strong in this position too. Our options are decent, but so much hinges on fitness and young players developing. United are very top-heavy but arguably the impact of Pogba/Fernandes could have their group rated ahead of Liverpool.

      Liverpool      Man City       Chelsea         United
      Thiago           De Bruyne       Havertz         Pogba
      Keita              Gundogan        Mount          Fernandes
      Ox                  B. Silva              Kovacic         Fred
      Milner                                       Saul              van de Beek
      Jones                                       L-Cheek        Mata
      Elliott                                       Barkley
                                         



      RW LIV > MCI > MU > CHE

      I would give the edge to Liverpool even with weaker depth as Salah is one of the best forwards in the game, but City's depth is much better. Sancho still has to prove himself in the PL.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Salah               Mahrez         Pulisic        Sancho
      Minamino       Foden           Ziyech       Greenwood
                                                                        Lingard




      LW: MCI > MU > LIV > CHE

      City have easily the best LW tandem. I've given Rashford/Martial the edge as Mane hasn't been on form for a while, and Origi is a worse backup. Werner hasn't impressed, at least not yet.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea        United
      Mane              Sterling          Werner         Rashford
      Origi               Grealish          H-Odoi         Martial




      ST: MU > CHE > LIV > MCI

      This is a tricky one to judge. I would say that it's a tie across the board but to avoid that I would give Ronaldo the edge (though he has a lot to prove at 36 in the PL). Lukaku is a guarantee of 20-25 goals in that Chelsea team so I'll give Chelsea 2nd. I wouldn't trade Firmino/Jota for Jesus/Torres, and it's telling that City wanted to buy Kane as they do lack a natural CF.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Firmino           G. Jesus        Lukaku       Ronaldo
      Jota                  Torres                               Cavani




      With 4 points for "1st place", 3 points for 2nd, 2 points for 3rd, and 1 point for 4th... the teams stack up as follows:

      Liverpool 27
      Man City 24
      Chelsea  22
      United   17

      There you have it folks, Liverpool officially have the best squad in the league. :D


      very good review. well done pal.
      Richard88
      • Forum Jamie Redknapp
      • ***

      • 309 posts | 104 
      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #66: Sep 01, 2021 02:38:48 pm




      That’s a great bit of work right there so thank You for your efforts, interesting reading too, we will all have our own opinions of course as to who is better than whoever,  each club has some very good individuals and every club has their Worldy’s  to be fair to you you won’t be too far away with your judgement’s although having Ronaldo top of the tree when he has played in inferior league’s last few years is somewhat bemusing, and I’m betting Mo would be pissed off if he read it, anyhoo, great effort , and yes maybe we do have the better squad, but I’d prefer to say Hungrier squad, I just feel our boys this season will want it more !!



                                                                                Y  N  W  A
      Thanks for the feedback! It's nice to know that the effort is appreciated :)

      I completely agree that having Ronaldo first in the ST category is a stretch. As mentioned in my comment the striker position was the trickiest to rate. Originally I simply left the striker position out of the ranking by equating all 4 teams options, but then I felt a bit biased for having United's players last on most rankings, so I awarded MU that one out of charity. Either way that didn't affect the final squad ranking.

      Mo shouldn't be too upset if he reads this either, as he won his RW category. :)
      hoganov
      • LFC Reds Subscriber
      • ******
      • 1,466 posts | 118 
      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #67: Sep 01, 2021 06:07:39 pm
      I thought it would be interesting to compare our squad with the other title contenders to put the lack of activity in this window in some perspective.


      GK: LIV > CHE > MCI > MU

      United have the weakest starter but the best depth. Liverpool have the best goalie in the world. City and Chelsea are pretty even.

      Liverpool      Man City    Chelsea     United
      Alisson           Ederson      Mendy        De Gea
      Kelleher         Steffen        Kepa           Henderson
      Adrian            Carson       Bettinelli     Heaton                                                 



      CB: LIV > MCI > MU > CHE

      City and Liverpool have the best CB groups, but Liverpool get the edge as VVD is the best in the world, and because Konate>Ake. Chelsea's CB's are pretty overrated, and their depth isn't great considering that they play 3 at the back. United falls off pretty hard after Varane/Maguire.

      Liverpool      Man City    Chelsea        United
      Van Dijk          Dias            Christensen   Varane
      Matip              Laporte       Rudiger         Maguire
      Gomez            Stones         T. Silva          Lindelof
      Konate            Ake               Sarr               Bailly
      Phillips            Sandler      Chalobah       P. Jones



      RB: MCI > CHE > LIV > MU

      City and Chelsea probably edge this one as they have better depth than Liverpool, though it feels harsh given that Trent is the best RB in the league when on form.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea        United
      Trent               Walker          Azpilizueta    Wan-Bissaka
      Neco               Cancelo         R. James        Dalot



      LB: LIV > CHE > MU > MCI

      Liverpool easily have the best LB tandem. Chelsea have a better tandem than United but Shaw is arguably better than both Chelsea LB's. Man City have a problem at LB given the Mendy situation.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Robertson      Zinchenko     Alonso       Shaw
      Tsimikas          Mendy          Chilwell      Telles




      DM: CHE > LIV > MCI > MU

      Fabinho is arguably the world's best DM, but given the seasons Kante and Jorginho just had they get the edge. United are way behind in this position.

      Liverpool      Man City         Chelsea     United
      Fabinho          Fernandinho    Kante        McTominay
      Henderson      Rodri                Jorginho    Matic




      CM/AM: MCI > CHE > LIV > MU

      Man City aren't very deep in CM/AM but DeBruyne really tips the scales. Chelsea are looking very strong in this position too. Our options are decent, but so much hinges on fitness and young players developing. United are very top-heavy but arguably the impact of Pogba/Fernandes could have their group rated ahead of Liverpool.

      Liverpool      Man City       Chelsea         United
      Thiago           De Bruyne       Havertz         Pogba
      Keita              Gundogan        Mount          Fernandes
      Ox                  B. Silva              Kovacic         Fred
      Milner                                       Saul              van de Beek
      Jones                                       L-Cheek        Mata
      Elliott                                       Barkley
                                         



      RW LIV > MCI > MU > CHE

      I would give the edge to Liverpool even with weaker depth as Salah is one of the best forwards in the game, but City's depth is much better. Sancho still has to prove himself in the PL.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Salah               Mahrez         Pulisic        Sancho
      Minamino       Foden           Ziyech       Greenwood
                                                                        Lingard




      LW: MCI > MU > LIV > CHE

      City have easily the best LW tandem. I've given Rashford/Martial the edge as Mane hasn't been on form for a while, and Origi is a worse backup. Werner hasn't impressed, at least not yet.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea        United
      Mane              Sterling          Werner         Rashford
      Origi               Grealish          H-Odoi         Martial




      ST: MU > CHE > LIV > MCI

      This is a tricky one to judge. I would say that it's a tie across the board but to avoid that I would give Ronaldo the edge (though he has a lot to prove at 36 in the PL). Lukaku is a guarantee of 20-25 goals in that Chelsea team so I'll give Chelsea 2nd. I wouldn't trade Firmino/Jota for Jesus/Torres, and it's telling that City wanted to buy Kane as they do lack a natural CF.

      Liverpool      Man City      Chelsea     United
      Firmino           G. Jesus        Lukaku       Ronaldo
      Jota                  Torres                               Cavani




      With 4 points for "1st place", 3 points for 2nd, 2 points for 3rd, and 1 point for 4th... the teams stack up as follows:

      Liverpool 27
      Man City 24
      Chelsea  22
      United   17

      There you have it folks, Liverpool officially have the best squad in the league. :D


      Brilliant post mate👍🏻
      Richard88
      • Forum Jamie Redknapp
      • ***

      • 309 posts | 104 
      Re: First Team Squad 21/22
      Reply #68: Sep 01, 2021 11:57:25 pm
      Given where the squad is at in terms of age profile it seems clear that 2022 was always going to be the key summer to regenerate the squad, especially in the forward line given that Salah/Firmino/Mane's contracts all expire in 2023.

      Here's the current squad, including their ages:


                                           Alisson (28)
                                          Kelleher (22)
                                           Adrian (34)
                                           Karius (28)
       
      Trent (22)     Matip (30)            VVD (30)             Robertson (27)
      Neco (20)    Gomez (24)         Konate (22)             Tsimikas (25)
                           Phillips (24)           
       
                                         Fabinho (27) 
                                           Milner (35) 
       
                        Henderson (31)              Thiago (30)
                                   Ox (28)                   Keita (26)
                               Elliott (18)                  Jones (20)

             Salah (29)                Firmino (29)                Mane (29)
           Minamino (26)               Jota (24)                   Origi (26)


      The contracts that are expiring in the next two years are as follows:

      2022
      - Adrian
      - Karius
      - Milner
      - Origi

      2023
      - Keita
      - Ox
      - Mane
      - Firmino
      - Salah

      Making some projections from the current squad above to 2023 one could reasonably guess that roughly the following changes will take place:

      Outgoing: Adrian, Karius, Phillips, Neco, Milner, Ox, Origi, and one of Firmino/Mane - lets say Firmino is the one who moves on for the purposes of this exercise.

      Incoming: Pitaluga, van den Berg, Rhys Williams, Bobby Clark, Kaide Gordon, plus an understudy RB, a CM/DM, and a CF.


      That would leave the squad in 2023 as shown below (with ages adjusted for 2023). I've taken the liberty to include a placeholder RB, CM, and CF based on where the holes are that will likely need to be filled.

                                           Alisson (30)
                                          Kelleher (24)
                                          Pitaluga (20)
       
      Trent (24)     Matip (32)            VVD (32)             Robertson (29)
      RB (20-22)  Gomez (26)         Konate (24)             Tsimikas (27)
                         vd Berg (21)        Rhys W. (22)     
       
                                           Fabinho (29) 
                                        Henderson (33)
       
                                  Thiago (32)         Keita (28)                                                                 
                               CM/DM (23-26)      Jones (22)
                                    Elliott (20)          Clark (18)

             Salah (31)               CF (21-24)                Jota (26)           
           Gordon (18)            Minamino (28)         Mane (31)
           

      That squad with just the 3 key additions looks fairly complete, at least on paper, naturally making allowance for improvement from younger players, and assuming players don't fall off a cliff health/form-wise by then.

      Scrutinizing closer by position:

      GK: Alisson will still very much be in his prime and in 2023 he will still have 4 more years on his contract. Kelleher is locked in until 2026. And in Pitaluga there is a young potential long-term Alisson replacement. Zero concerns about this setup.

      CB: Van Dijk should still be in his prime as a CB at that age. Matip in 2023 will only have 1 year left so the club may decide to move him on then, particularly if he can't stay fit until then. Whatever the case in Gomez and Konate the club have two CB's who will be entering their prime years together who are ready-made replacements for Matip and eventually Van Dijk. We look pretty set here for the foreseeable future, with perhaps only a young CB  signing needed if Matip leaves in 2023 (that would ideally be a CB in the 18-22 age bracket like when we signed Gomez and Konate, but then again maybe Sepp van den Berg or Rhys Williams can be that guy).

      RB: Trent has that spot locked down tight long-term. Presumably Neco will want to leave to get more game-time by then, and so I'd envisage that a young understudy will be promoted internally to fill that role (eg. Connor Bradley), or someone external brought in. Whatever the case this is a relatively minor concern in the squad projection.

      LB: There's no need to worry about this position until well beyond 2023 as both Robertson and Tsimikas will still be in their prime in 2023, and they are signed until 2026 and 2025 respectively.

      DM: Fabinho will be in his prime still, and signed until 2026. Henderson will presumably take over the Milner role in the squad and move back to DM more as he ages. Given Henderson's age and the fact that most of the midfielders in the squad above are attacking-oriented it would make sense for a midfield signing to be more defensively-oriented. Such a signing would ideally be in their prime years to bridge the gap age-wise between the 28-33 year olds and the 18-22 year olds.

      CM: As mentioned above there's an age gap between the 18-22 and 28-33 year olds, so it would make sense to add someone in the 24-26 age range to balance the age profile a bit and add someone who is in their prime. By 2023 Elliott and Jones will likely/hopefully have kicked on to become firmly-established regulars, and Bobby Clark will be the same age Elliott is now and hopefully having a similar impact as Elliott is having.

      FWD: And that brings me to the forward line, which features the most fluid positions and is the part of the squad which will be the most interesting to monitor the coming year or two.
      It's quite hard to predict how things will shake out by 2023 given that all three of Salah/Firmino/Mane have only 2 years to run on their contracts, but let's assume that Salah gets extended (there are after all currently rumours of talks) and that one of Firmino/Mane are moved on (which seems plausible as it doesn't seem smart to keep 3 aging forwards on big money). In such a scenario there would be a significant need for a high-end forward - either LW (with Jota/Firmino at CF), or a CF (with Mane/Jota at LW). This should be the signing where the bulk of the transfer budget is spent.
      Depending on how Minamino does this season he may need to be replaced by then as well but that's a lesser concern.
      Gordon seems to be the clubs long-term succession plan at RW and he'll be the same age as Elliott is now by 2023 so I'd anticipate that he'll be penciled in as a full-time member of the first team by 2023.

      All-in-all concerns about the squad aging out too rapidly the next few years seem to be a bit overblown, as the back 5 is set for the foresseable future, and just a couple of really good signings in CM and CF could have the squad looking very healthy long-term as well as short-term, as shown above. Particular emphasis certainly needs to be placed on rejuvenating the forward line with at least one first XI calibre player though.


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